Where is Jesus in the Old Testament?

Many argue that Jesus is not mentioned in the Old Testament. Of course many religious Jews believe this to be the case because they do not believe he is the prophecied messiah. But there are also others who are not religious Jews who believe the Old Testament scriptures never mention or allude to Jesus being the messiah. Is this correct? Did the New Testament writers get a little too creative when they claim that Jesus fulfilled prophecies in the scriptures? Let’s take a look.

There is no argument that the New Testament contains gospels, letters, and teachings centred around the theme that Jesus is the Messiah. And we know that the Old Testament talks about the Messiah. But is there enough evidence to link this messiah to Jesus. Is there proof that he fulfilled the prophecies of the coming messiah as written in the Old Testament?

Yes indeed. There are Old Testament scriptures and prophecies that only Jesus of Nazareth has fulfilled. While his name is not mentioned for obvious reasons, Jesus Christ is certainly the only person in history to fulfil the prophecies and scriptures that we will look at.

Isaiah 51

This verse of the suffering messiah clearly speaks of Jesus. If you asked anybody who this verse is talking about, there is no doubt that the average person on the street would say it was Jesus. Even if you asked the average Jew this question, they too would say it is Jesus (Yeshua). Below is a video that proves this statement.

Next, we take a closer look at this chapter. While it seems to clearly point to Jesus Christ, some argue that it is talking about Israel. This is the go to interpretation for those who deny Jesus. Let’s imagine this is true and draw some conclusions from this interpretation to see if it makes any kind of sense. Listed below are the points this chapter makes that do not fit at all with Israel. The list comprises of 4 sentences with the word ‘Israel’ added in to see if it makes any sense. Following on from that, are the actual words of Isaiah 51.

  1. Israel has no beauty or majesty to attract us to him;
  2. Israel took up our pain,  bore our suffering, pierced for our transgressions, and by Israel’s wounds we are healed;
  3. Israel was assigned a grave with the wicked,  and with the rich in his death, though Israel had done no violence;
  4. Israel poured out his life as an offering for sin and will justify many,  and bear their iniquities.

1. Who has believed our message
    and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?
2 He grew up before him like a tender shoot,
    and like a root out of dry ground.
He had no beauty or majesty to attract us to him,
    nothing in his appearance that we should desire him.
3 He was despised and rejected by mankind,
    a man of suffering, and familiar with pain.
Like one from whom people hide their faces
    he was despised, and we held him in low esteem.
4 Surely he took up our pain
    and bore our suffering,
yet we considered him punished by God,
    stricken by him, and afflicted.
5 But he was pierced for our transgressions,
    he was crushed for our iniquities;
the punishment that brought us peace was on him,
    and by his wounds we are healed.
6 We all, like sheep, have gone astray,
    each of us has turned to our own way;
and the Lord has laid on him
    the iniquity of us all.
7 He was oppressed and afflicted,
    yet he did not open his mouth;
he was led like a lamb to the slaughter,
    and as a sheep before its shearers is silent,
    so he did not open his mouth.
8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away.
    Yet who of his generation protested?
For he was cut off from the land of the living;
    for the transgression of my people he was punished.
9 He was assigned a grave with the wicked,
    and with the rich in his death,
though he had done no violence,
    nor was any deceit in his mouth.
10 Yet it was the Lord’s will to crush him and cause him to suffer,
    and though the Lord makes his life an offering for sin,
he will see his offspring and prolong his days,
    and the will of the Lord will prosper in his hand.
11 After he has suffered,
    he will see the light of life and be satisfied;
by his knowledge my righteous servant will justify many,
    and he will bear their iniquities.
12 Therefore I will give him a portion among the great,
    and he will divide the spoils with the strong,
because he poured out his life unto death,
    and was numbered with the transgressors.
For he bore the sin of many,
    and made intercession for the transgressors.

If you are fair and unbiased, it seems that Isaiah 51 is talking about Jesus. Further, Israel doesn’t seem to fit in this verse. While somethings could fit, points like suffering and dying for the sins of humanity doesn’t fit with Israel in the slightest.


Psalm 22

Just before Jesus died on the cross for humanities sins, he quoted Psalm 22:1. It is important to know that it was a practice to quote a scripture and the hearers recite the rest of the scripture. It was a good way to remember the scriptures. Jesus quoted the first verse in that Psalm so that the hearers might understand what was happening before their eyes. See Matthew 27:46:

About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, “Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?”
(which means “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”).

Now look at Psalm 22:

My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?
Why are you so far from saving me,
so far from my cries of anguish?
2 My God, I cry out by day, but you do not answer,
by night, but I find no rest.
3 Yet you are enthroned as the Holy One;
you are the one Israel praises.
4 In you our ancestors put their trust;
they trusted and you delivered them.
5 To you they cried out and were saved;
in you they trusted and were not put to shame.
6 But I am a worm and not a man,
scorned by everyone, despised by the people.
7 All who see me mock me;
they hurl insults, shaking their heads.
8 “He trusts in the Lord,” they say,
    “let the Lord rescue him.
Let him deliver him,
    since he delights in him.”
9 Yet you brought me out of the womb;
you made me trust in you, even at my mother’s breast.
10 From birth I was cast on you;
from my mother’s womb you have been my God.
11 Do not be far from me,
for trouble is near
and there is no one to help.
12 Many bulls surround me;
strong bulls of Bashan encircle me.
13 Roaring lions that tear their prey
open their mouths wide against me.
14 I am poured out like water,
    and all my bones are out of joint.
My heart has turned to wax;
it has melted within me.
15 My mouth is dried up like a potsherd,
and my tongue sticks to the roof of my mouth;
you lay me in the dust of death.
16 Dogs surround me,
    a pack of villains encircles me;
    they pierce my hands and my feet.
17 All my bones are on display;
people stare and gloat over me.
18 They divide my clothes among them
    and cast lots for my garment.

If you look at the above scripture and particularly the verses that are bolded, you will see that they are a very apt description for the death of Jesus. Let’s read what John wrote regarding the time just after the death of Jesus. It spells out some of the prophecies that were fulfilled.

John 19

31 Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jewish leaders did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down.
32 The soldiers therefore came and broke the legs of the first man who had been crucified with Jesus, and then those of the other.
33 But when they came to Jesus and found that he was already dead, they did not break his legs.
34 Instead, one of the soldiers pierced Jesus’ side with a spear, bringing a sudden flow of blood and water.
35 The man who saw it has given testimony, and his testimony is true. He knows that he tells the truth, and he testifies so that you also may believe.
36 These things happened so that the scripture would be fulfilled: “Not one of his bones will be broken,”
37 and, as another scripture says, “They will look on the one they have pierced.”

The New Testament writers certainly believed that Jesus fulfilled Old Testament scripture. If you do not believe this to be the case, then ask yourself who in history has fulfilled these. If you are rational about it, you would at least have to admit that Jesus was the lead contender. In fact the only contender to date.


Daniel 3

In the Book of Daniel, it appears that the Son of God makes an appearance with three men who have been cast alive into a furnace. A fourth person appears who King Nebuchadnezzar says “the fourth looks like a son of the gods.” In other words, if the gods had a son, then this was him. Of course, there is but one Almighty God, and yes he does have a son. It is possible that this fourth person is an angel, but throughout the Old Testament an appearance of the Angel of the LORD is frequent. Many say that this is Jesus Christ before he came in the flesh, but others say it cannot be him as the Son of God was never an angel. This view does have a lot of merit though. Let’s address it by first reading Daniel 3:15-25.

15 Now when you hear the sound of the horn, flute, zither, lyre, harp, pipe and all kinds of music, if you are ready to fall down and worship the image I made, very good. But if you do not worship it, you will be thrown immediately into a blazing furnace. Then what god will be able to rescue you from my hand?” 16 Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego replied to him, “King Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to defend ourselves before you in this matter. 17 If we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God we serve is able to deliver us from it, and he will deliver us[c] from Your Majesty’s hand. 18 But even if he does not, we want you to know, Your Majesty, that we will not serve your gods or worship the image of gold you have set up.” 19 Then Nebuchadnezzar was furious with Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, and his attitude toward them changed. He ordered the furnace heated seven times hotter than usual 20 and commanded some of the strongest soldiers in his army to tie up Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego and throw them into the blazing furnace. 21 So these men, wearing their robes, trousers, turbans and other clothes, were bound and thrown into the blazing furnace. 22 The king’s command was so urgent and the furnace so hot that the flames of the fire killed the soldiers who took up Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, 23 and these three men, firmly tied, fell into the blazing furnace. 24 Then King Nebuchadnezzar leaped to his feet in amazement and asked his advisers, “Weren’t there three men that we tied up and threw into the fire?” They replied, “Certainly, Your Majesty.” 25 He said, “Look! I see four men walking around in the fire, unbound and unharmed, and the fourth looks like a son of the gods.”

The word Angel is found throughout the Old Testament. It usually refers to heavenly creature who delivers a message from God to humans. However, it can also refer to humans as they can be messengers too. Thus, angel or messenger can be applied to many kinds of being if they are a messenger of God. So this answers the concern that Jesus is not an angel. He actually is an angel or messenger, but not the usual messenger which are usually heavenly cherubs etc.

But there is a also a specific angel called: ‘The Angel of the LORD’ who appears numerous times in the Old Testament, but never in the New Testament. One reason for this could be that this messenger is none other than Jesus Christ before coming in the flesh and who would deny that Jesus is the main Messenger of God?

If this is him, then you would expect no appearances of this messenger during the time Jesus was alive on Earth and this is the case. It is also interesting to note that persons who saw this messenger as recorded in the Old Testament often said that they have seen God even though God himself is invisible. How do we make sense of this? Well in Colossians 1:15-16 we read:

The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. For in Him all things were created, things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities. All things were created through Him and for Him.

Colossians certainly fits with Jesus being the Angel of the LORD in the sense that there is no double up of them appearing at the same time and the fact that Jesus Christ is the exact image of the invisible God in bodily form whiches matches the description of seeing God. Let’s read more about the Angel of the LORD to see if this could be the identity of Jesus before he was born into this world.

To be continued.

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  • #312945
    Ed J
    Participant

    Quote (t8 @ Sep. 15 2012,12:26)

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 11 2012,18:41)
    Hi Mike,

    1) The Angels took them to wife.                            Mary was not God's wife. He obviously planted the seed of Jesus
        This implies Angelic intercourse.                         (or just the “Y” chromosome needed to be male) by other means.

    2) No clue. Wait a minute, Jesus resurrected body may be identical to theirs?     …just a thought?

    3) This seems to be the case regardless of point #2.

    God bless
    Ed J


    Edj. The Book of Enoch which has the complete record for what happened says that these angels also sinned against animals in the same way. Real intercourse or genetic engineering? Or perhaps just a fiction.

    That book says that they sinned against birds, animals and reptiles. Perhaps that's what dinosaurs were. As their offspring are known to be giants and the purpose of the flood was to destroy these creatures of which are now fossilized by some major catastrophe.


    Hi T8,

    Why would the bible say that they took them to wife,
    and they saw that they were fair if it was not for sex?
    I have no doubt there was animal DNA manipulation. but
    that does NOT preclude the words of Scripture now does it?

    God bless
    Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
    http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

    #312956
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 16 2012,04:53)

    Quote (t8 @ Sep. 15 2012,12:26)

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 11 2012,18:41)
    Hi Mike,

    1) The Angels took them to wife.                            Mary was not God's wife. He obviously planted the seed of Jesus
        This implies Angelic intercourse.                         (or just the “Y” chromosome needed to be male) by other means.

    2) No clue. Wait a minute, Jesus resurrected body may be identical to theirs?     …just a thought?

    3) This seems to be the case regardless of point #2.

    God bless
    Ed J


    Edj. The Book of Enoch which has the complete record for what happened says that these angels also sinned against animals in the same way. Real intercourse or genetic engineering? Or perhaps just a fiction.

    That book says that they sinned against birds, animals and reptiles. Perhaps that's what dinosaurs were. As their offspring are known to be giants and the purpose of the flood was to destroy these creatures of which are now fossilized by some major catastrophe.


    Hi T8,

    Why would the bible say that they took them to wife,
    and they saw that they were fair if it was not for sex?
    I have no doubt there was animal DNA manipulation. but
    that does NOT preclude the words of Scripture now does it?

    God bless
    Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
    http://www.holycitybiblecode.org


    edj

    Quote
    but
    that does NOT preclude the words of Scripture now does it?

    wen was the written word of God made ??? before or after the flood ???

    #312960
    Ed J
    Participant

    Hi Pierre,

    Do you mean  “when was the word of God written?”  ?
    Or do you mean  “when was “The Word” created?”  ?
    You apply different meanings to both, right?   :D

    God bless
    Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
    http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

    #312984
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    Quote (t8 @ Sep. 15 2012,12:19)

    Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 14 2012,13:08)
    Mike …..A soul is the whole being not just part of it.  

    …………………..gene


    gene. We have come to expect from you a disagreement on nearly every major part of scripture.

    Your view suggests that the souls under the altar around the time of the fifth seal were complete persons with bodies. Yet they are told to rest a little longer. So are there a whole lot of beds under the altar?


    T8……So take up the challenge of the Scriptures i quoted then and enlighten us. It's not me you are disagreeing with T8 it those Scripture i quoted to you all and yet not one of you even address them Why is that T8, seems your my mind is set to disagree with not only what i say, but what the Lord our GOD has said also, so is it not really your mind that is denying God and his words. Another thing why do you go on the offensive here a slander me because i post directly quoted scriptures are you now my judge.

    I could say the same things to you and others here but i chose not to, why is it that many Preexistences and Trinitarian always seem to indulge in character assignation to try to make themselves appear right.

    Just commit on the scriptures i “quoted” and leave the rest of your deformation of my character out, if you can.

    peace and love to you and yours………………………………gene

    #312989
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 14 2012,19:26)
    If what you believe Jesus meant doesn't agree with the LORD our and his God words , then who are you going to believe.


    Gene,

    I simply quoted the words of Jesus.  I can't see any other way to understand those words than the way I currently understand them.  Nor was I aware that those words supposedly contradict the words of God.  Perhaps you could post JUST ONE scripture in which you think God's words contradict what Jesus said in Matthew 10:28.  

    Before you do, remember that the word “soul” not only refers to the “inner being” of a human, but sometimes refers to “life” in general, and other times to the complete being.

    Here are the definitions of “soul”:
    1) breath
      1a) the breath of life
         1a1) the vital force which animates the body and shows itself
    in breathing
            1a1a) of animals
            1a1b) of men
      1b) life
      1c) that in which there is life
         1c1) a living being, a living soul

    2) the soul
      2a) the seat of the feelings, desires, affections, aversions
    (our heart, soul etc.)
      2b) the (human) soul in so far as it is constituted that by
    the right use of the aids offered it by God it can attain
    its highest end and secure eternal blessedness, the soul
    regarded as a moral being designed for everlasting life
      2c) the soul as an essence which differs from the body and is not
    dissolved by death (distinguished from other parts of the body)

    So remember those many definitions before you post your ONE scripture.  Remember that if God said, “men are seeking your soul”, it would be the use of soul that means “life” – and would not contradict Jesus' statement that men cannot kill the soul.  Because in Jesus' statement, the meaning is the LAST one listed in the definitions.  (It is also the LAST definition meant when it is said that Rachel's soul departed.)

    #312990
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 15 2012,04:53)
    Hi T8,

    Why would the bible say that they took them to wife,
    and they saw that they were fair if it was not for sex?


    Why would these things mean the angels had flesh?  Is human flesh the ONLY thing that can penetrate a woman?

    This whole discussion stems from Kerwin's unscriptural belief that angels are comprised of “a different kind of flesh” – like some “heavenly flesh” or something.

    Do you agree with him, Ed?

    #312994
    Ed J
    Participant

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 16 2012,03:02)

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 15 2012,04:53)
    Hi T8,

    Why would the bible say that they took them to wife,
    and they saw that they were fair if it was not for sex?


    Why would these things mean the angels had flesh?  Is human flesh the ONLY thing that can penetrate a woman?

    This whole discussion stems from Kerwin's unscriptural belief that angels are comprised of “a different kind of flesh” – like some “heavenly flesh” or something.

    Do you agree with him, Ed?


    Hi Mike,

    I would assume the flesh the Angels had was the same as
    the flesh Jesus had in the resurrection because of Mark 12:25.
    Is this Kerwin's position or Your's or just mine alone (of us three)?

    Mark 12:25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry,
    nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.

    God bless
    Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
    http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

    #313005
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    What part of Mark 12:25 speaks of anyone having flesh? And what scripture ANYWHERE speaks of angels having flesh?

    #313033
    Ed J
    Participant

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 16 2012,03:39)
    What part of Mark 12:25 speaks of anyone having flesh?  And what scripture ANYWHERE speaks of angels having flesh?


    Hi Mike,

    It is implied in Gen.6:2 and again in Jude 1:6-7.

    God bless
    Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
    http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

    #313042
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    No it's not. God impregnated Mary. Is it “implied” that God manifested flesh to do so? ???

    #313050
    Ed J
    Participant

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 16 2012,05:41)
    God impregnated Mary.  Is it “implied” that God manifested flesh to do so?  ???


    Hi Mike,

    Usually I understand your posts.
    But can you explain this one to me?  ???

    God bless
    Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
    http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

    #313069
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    To all….Not one of you has yet to address the three scriptures I posted in Ezk , why is that? Is it because it proves you wrong about us not being resurrected with physical bodies and and proves the soul that is living has a body. There is no scripture that say we still are living after we die no not even one. In fact scripture say the soul that sins “It” shall DIE.

     Scripture also say all have sinned and come short of th glory of God. So some here go to revelations and quote about the souls under the alter speaking, but as usual neglect the fact that that book was “signified” better said “SYMBOLIZED” which means you can not take it literally in all places. The souls are people who have died in the faith and are memorialized by God,  for their sacrifices of their lives. The alter of God is where sacrifices are made and they are under that alter “symbolically ” speaking they are not “LITERIALLY” there. but are in memory befor GOD for their sacrifices they have made.  

    Simple straight forward scripture spoken by GOD himself and yet not one of You seem to believe it or you would commit on them, but no just ignore them and then cast out dispersions of all kinds .

    I still maintain a Soul is just the way God made it in the first
    Place , he took dust from the earth and formed a man and he breath air into his nostrils and that earthly man became a living Soul, no “MYSTERY RELIGIOUS” speculation about it, its just that simple a soul is the “COMPLETE BEING” and if he or she is alive they are “LIVING SOULS” And of the are dead they are DEAD SOULS.

    We are not alive when we die in any form we are totally dependent on God to be restored back to life. Notice also what God said in the end “and “Then” shall they “KNOW” I AM THE LORD , Why? Because they will absolutely know they were dead without hope of ANY KIND OF life at all and that ONLY GOD COULD HAVE RESTORED Back their Life, BY HIS OWN POWER ALONE. .  IMO

    Peace and love to you all………………..gene

    #313078
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 15 2012,14:59)
    Not one of you has yet to address the three scriptures I posted in Ezk………….


    Gene,

    I don't read every post you make here. Why not post that one scripture for us, and we'll evaluate whether or not it says what you claim it does.

    #313080
    mikeboll64
    Blocked

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 15 2012,13:02)

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 16 2012,05:41)
    God impregnated Mary.  Is it “implied” that God manifested flesh to do so?  ???


    Hi Mike,

    Usually I understand your posts.
    But can you explain this one to me?  ???

    God bless
    Ed J


    Nevermind, Ed. If YOU want to believe that angels manifested flesh, then believe it. Just know that this belief isn't actually taught in scripture. Neither is Kerwin's belief that there exists such a thing as “heavenly flesh” or whatever.

    #313108
    terraricca
    Participant

    Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 16 2012,07:28)

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 16 2012,04:53)

    Quote (t8 @ Sep. 15 2012,12:26)

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 11 2012,18:41)
    Hi Mike,

    1) The Angels took them to wife.                            Mary was not God's wife. He obviously planted the seed of Jesus
        This implies Angelic intercourse.                         (or just the “Y” chromosome needed to be male) by other means.

    2) No clue. Wait a minute, Jesus resurrected body may be identical to theirs?     …just a thought?

    3) This seems to be the case regardless of point #2.

    God bless
    Ed J


    Edj. The Book of Enoch which has the complete record for what happened says that these angels also sinned against animals in the same way. Real intercourse or genetic engineering? Or perhaps just a fiction.

    That book says that they sinned against birds, animals and reptiles. Perhaps that's what dinosaurs were. As their offspring are known to be giants and the purpose of the flood was to destroy these creatures of which are now fossilized by some major catastrophe.


    Hi T8,

    Why would the bible say that they took them to wife,
    and they saw that they were fair if it was not for sex?
    I have no doubt there was animal DNA manipulation. but
    that does NOT preclude the words of Scripture now does it?

    God bless
    Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
    http://www.holycitybiblecode.org


    edj

    Quote
    but
    that does NOT preclude the words of Scripture now does it?

    wen was the written word of God made ??? before or after the flood ???


    ED

    Quote
    but
    that does NOT preclude the words of Scripture now does it?

    WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THIS ???

    #313115
    Ed J
    Participant

    preclude: Prevent from happening; make impossible.

    That means one does not cancel the other.

    #313160
    kerwin
    Participant

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 16 2012,04:34)

    Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 15 2012,13:02)

    Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 16 2012,05:41)
    God impregnated Mary.  Is it “implied” that God manifested flesh to do so?  ???


    Hi Mike,

    Usually I understand your posts.
    But can you explain this one to me?  ???

    God bless
    Ed J


    Nevermind, Ed.  If YOU want to believe that angels manifested flesh, then believe it.  Just know that this belief isn't actually taught in scripture.  Neither is Kerwin's belief that there exists such a thing as “heavenly flesh” or whatever.


    Mike,

    You are mistaken as the flesh of both Adam and Eve were not the same before God cursed them to return to the dust. There is the flesh that God created and then there is the flesh that is the result of sin. The two types of flesh are not the same but each is as Jehovah appointed.

    As for angels they passed the same tests Jesus put forth to show they were not spirits; and yet you continue to claim that both Jesus and the angels are spirits.

    The only spirit body I know of in Scripture; is the body of a ghost; and I am told that believers will not be found that naked after the resurrection.

    #313185
    terraricca
    Participant

    k

    Quote
    You are mistaken as the flesh of both Adam and Eve were not the same before God cursed them to return to the dust. There is the flesh that God created and then there is the flesh that is the result of sin. The two types of flesh are not the same but each is as Jehovah appointed.

    were do you get this ??? are we not the descendant of Adam and Eve ??? and their flesh and ours is the same flesh ,but we are born with their sin and curse ,but it was not the flesh that was cursed right ???

    or was it because of their flesh that they were cursed or sin ???

    Dt 9:4 After the LORD your God has driven them out before you, do not say to yourself, “The LORD has brought me here to take possession of this land because of my righteousness.” No, it is on account of the wickedness of these nations that the LORD is going to drive them out before you.

    NOW IF YOU CAN PROVE WHAT YOU SAY ABOUT THE FLESH OF ADAM NOT BEING THE SAME THAN OURS ,SHOW ME THE SCRIPTURE, S, TO ME MEN FLESH HIS MEN FLESH ANY MEN ,

    AND UNDERSTAND THAT CORRUPTION IS DONE FIRST WITH THE HEART AND MIND THEN EXECUTED WITH THE FLESH ,SO THAT IT IS THE SOUL INSIDE THE FLESH THAT SINS NOT THE FLESH ,THE FLESH HIS THE TOOL BY WITCH THE SIN IS MADE THROUGH.
    THIS IS WHY SCRPTURES SAYS THE SOUL THAT SINS IS THE SOUL THAT DIES .

    #313186
    terraricca
    Participant

    K

    Quote
    As for angels they passed the same tests Jesus put forth to show they were not spirits

    WHAT THE TEST IN THE FLESH THAT CHRIST PASTED AS TO DO WITH THE ANGELS ,THE TEST IS FOR MEN,

    HOW COULD THE ANGEL PAST THAT TEST ??? THEY SEE GOD OR ARE IN THE PRESENCE OF GOD EVERY DAY ,

    ANGELS ARE OF THE HEAVEN ,MEN ARE OF THE EARTH ARE STILL IN DOUBTS ON THIS ???

    #313188
    terraricca
    Participant

    K

    Quote
    The only spirit body I know of in Scripture; is the body of a ghost; and I am told that believers will not be found that naked after the resurrection.

    this understanding is related to your knowledge of scriptures ,what seems limited

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