Quote (Pastry @ May 22 2011,13:01)Quote (t8 @ May 22 2011,10:56)Possessing divinity is not meant to be taken that one has existed for all eternity. After all, we can partake of divine nature and even though we have eternal life, we still had a beginning and I don't see how that can ever change.t8 Almighty God is divine.  What does that mean?  He i…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ May 23 2011,20:58)Shimmer – I don't like the systems other TMBs use where the like/dislike tally counts toward a reputation profile for the members. The members who espouse popular doctrines or who have likable personailities tend to build impressive profiles. But I think you can easily fall into the trap of wanting to appeal to…[Read more]

Possessing divinity is not meant to be taken that one has existed for all eternity. After all, we can partake of divine nature and even though we have eternal life, we still had a beginning and I don't see how that can ever change.

Quote (Is 1:18 @ May 20 2011,17:00)Yeah I know, it's contentious though and in my opinion doesn't quite fit. I can see why you would want it to though.I don't want it to. I am open to it because it seems quite possible. Why would I want it to? The truth is to precious to dictate what I want it to be.Perhaps that is the strongest reason the Trinity…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ May 20 2011,16:47)t8 (and Paul you might be interested in this too),Good post, the early church fathers and many Christian commentaries consider Prov 8 to be speaking about the Son of God also.  It is probably speaking about wisdom as found in the Son and not wisdom as the Son.John Wesley wrote this:8:1Wisdom – It is a great…[Read more]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ May 21 2011,02:23)T8……….I do believe Jesus, it's your misunderstanding of what Jesus was meaning there thats the problem Brother. The issue was, the Pharisees were using Abraham as a place of their position with GOD and Jesus was telling them he Was in Place before Abraham was. Brother why can't you understand…[Read more]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ May 20 2011,00:53)Irene………….So much posting and not a Single “Specific” text saying “JESUS PREEXISTED HIS BERTH ON THIS EARTH” as a sentinel being of any kind.  Pooling hundreds if not thousands of scriptures and forcing them to say what they in fact do not say, is exactly what your fellow preexistence trinitarians…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ May 20 2011,14:22)Quote (t8 @ May 20 2011,13:47)The logos as an attribute of God is brought forth (like wisdom).22 “The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, before his deeds of old;23 I was appointed from eternity, from the beginning, before the world began. 24 When there were no oceans, I was given birth, when there…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ May 20 2011,15:10)Quote (david @ May 20 2011,14:09)–Then, in the beginning (of physical creation,) through his Son, He created the heavens and the earth, everything physical.There is nothing here that contradicts itself.LOL. Time is “physical” David.Some say that time is an illusion, others think time and space is the fourth…[Read more]

Quote (david @ May 20 2011,14:12)Well, have you noticed that time seems to move much quicker the older you become? When you are 5, everything is new, and time seems to pass slowly. And soon the years are flying by. i think that is what that is talking about.When you are 2, one year is half your life.When you are 40, it is one fortieth of your…[Read more]

The logos as an attribute of God is brought forth (like wisdom).22 “The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, before his deeds of old;23 I was appointed from eternity, from the beginning, before the world began. 24 When there were no oceans, I was given birth, when there were no springs abounding with water; 25 before the mountains were…[Read more]

Tatian (165 A.D)”And by His simple will the Word sprang forth, and the Word, not coming forth in vain, became the firstbegotten work of the Father.”This is pretty much how the early fathers describe the Word who is Christ. I could quote a number of other writers pre-nicean who said something similar.Of course this doesn't make it right, but my…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ May 20 2011,13:11)Quote (t8 @ May 20 2011,13:07)Quote (Is 1:18 @ May 20 2011,10:52)An outworking of Einstein's general theory of relativity is that time, space and matter are inter-related and any one component cannot exist without the other. So when Yeshua brought “all things” into existence (Jn 1:3, Col 1:16, Heb 1:2, 10 etc…[Read more]

For good reason Is 1:18. I tried to tell you many times that things cropped up that I had to take care of that was more important than even HN , but you and WJ refused to listen and were unreasonable in your judgement and reaction. In fact your behaviour was not in line with the fruit of the Spirit.But I suspect that you guys resorted to your bad…[Read more]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ May 20 2011,10:52)An outworking of Einstein's general theory of relativity is that time, space and matter are inter-related and any one component cannot exist without the other. So when Yeshua brought “all things” into existence (Jn 1:3, Col 1:16, Heb 1:2, 10 etc etc) that would include time (i.e time began at the creation of all…[Read more]

Istari, did God create the angels?If not, how did they come to be?

No probs.Take your time.

It is amazing how being stubborn rather than being open to the truth in one's doctrine has the same affect as being unintelligent.God does hand people over to foolishness if they pursue it.

Quote (Baker @ April 14 2011,09:47)I just can't for the world understand to ignore all these Scriptures, and either reason them away, or ignore them all together….For the same reason an Atheist can look up to the heavens and say there is no God.At the end of the day, it is not about proof or proof verses, but what people want to believe. Not all…[Read more]

WJ, are you going to call God “Them” instead of “Him” in order to show faith in your own doctrine and to speak English correctly?If not, why not?