And is “in the air” where Enoch and Elijah have been dwelling all this time?How about the souls of men who have died under the altar?  Are they not in the same heaven as God is in, according to the context?  Are they not told to wait until more of their brethren are killed like they were killed?

I know that Paul mentions “the third heaven” in scripture.But how do you give a flat “NO” answer to the question of this thread, and only much later start to distinguish the heavens from each other? Nick, do/will men ever go to ANY OF THE HEAVENS?

Quote (bodhitharta @ April 28 2012,16:46)I HAD MADE A MASSIVE REPLTY TO THIS POST, WHAT HAPPENED TO IT?I feel for you on that one, Asana. Back when I did the long debates, I once spent FIVE HOURS researching and posting a response, just for it to completely disappear. Talk about frustrating! I'm sorry that happened to you.

I don't really know if there is a difference between “existing in the form of God” and “partaking in divine nature”.Some of us will become “like Jesus” and “brothers of Jesus” and “joint heirs of God with Jesus”.  But then we know that Jesus is the firstborn, and will always have “double” the rest of the children (according to Jewish custom).It…[Read more]

I'm sorry Nick.  All this time I was under the impression that we were discussing whether or not those who have lived on earth as men ever go to “heaven”.It seems to me that your stance was “NOT A CHANCE”.But now I've come to find out that your stance is really, “Well, perhaps they go to A CERTAIN heaven, but not the one you guys meant!”  Am I u…[Read more]

Quote (Ed J @ April 29 2012,13:28)4) That goes without saying. Yes, of course, two wills, two entities.Hallelujah! We agree again.Tell me who these two entities with separate wills were, one of whom was sent down from heaven by the other one.

Ed,Didn't you just say that JESUS came down from heaven?Since you did, we agree; meaning there is no reason for me to play the “my spirit is me” games yet again, right?If you agree that JESUS came down from heaven, not to do HIS will, but instead to do the will of He who sent him, then we are in agreement.If, on the other hand, you think it was…[Read more]

The word “christ”, in and of itself, refers to one that God anointed. The very fact that Jesus is the CHRIST OF GOD means he is “the anointed one of God”.What you ask is like me saying, “The steak has been FLAME BROILED until medium rare”, and then you ask me where it says there was HEAT added to the steak. The fact the steak was FLAME broiled…[Read more]

Which number did you pick, Ed?

Quote (Ed J @ April 29 2012,12:13)3) Both Jesus and the “HolySpirit” came down from heaven.Thank you.  This is what I've been saying all along.  There is no need to discuss your misconceptions, like the Holy Spirit OF God being the God it is the Holy Spirit OF.The scriptural fact is that whoever “came down from heaven” had a different will than t…[Read more]

Quote (Ed J @ April 29 2012,11:22)Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 30 2012,02:27)Okay Ed,Also, let's see where your claim takes us in this verse:John 6:38 (King James Version)For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.Ed, (1)WHO came down from heaven?  (2)If it was God, then why did God come, (3)NOT to do His…[Read more]

Quote (jammin @ April 29 2012,11:18)ok you agree that Christ and the father have the same nature, God.I agreed that Jesus and his God have the same nature of “spirit being”.”God” is a person, jammin. You refer to HIM as a kind of species, of which Jesus is one.But if you insist on delegating a “species” to Jehovah, the that species would be…[Read more]

Your understanding arrives at the same problem in John 6:38 as Ed's does, jammin.If the one who came down from heaven was God Himself, then how is it that God Himself has a DIFFERENT will than God Himself? Don't you see that whoever came down from heaven had HIS OWN will, which apparently differed from the will of the One who sent him?

Quote (jammin @ April 29 2012,10:52)you agree that you and your father have the same nature, MAN.do you also agree that christ and his father have the same nature, GOD? yes or no?Yes, I agree that since my father is a man, I am also a man.And yes, I agree that since Jesus' Father is a spirit being, Jesus is also a spirit being.

Quote (Ed J @ April 29 2012,10:45)This is the thread to which the discussion does belong; agreed?The three associated verses (below) establish the matter.“At the mouth of three witnesses,   shall the matter be established.” (Deut 19:15)1) Acts 10:38 …..for God was with (in more term “IN”) him. 2) 2Cor 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, 3)…[Read more]

Quote (jammin @ April 29 2012,10:32)he is a Man by nature. what is the problem with that mike? the father is a God but not a godjammin,I think you're finally getting it! Yes, Jehovah is a god and Jesus is a god. But we cap the “G” for the god who is the Most High God. That makes Jehovah, as the Most High God, the only “God” (with a capped “G”),…[Read more]

Right on, Kerwin.What happened to Enoch is clearly distinguished as something OTHER THAN what happened to all those who “died”.It is similar with Elijah:Kings 2:1When the LORD was about to take Elijah up to heaven in a whirlwind, Elijah and Elisha were on their way from Gilgal. Kings 2:11 As they were walking along and talking together, suddenly a…[Read more]

Ed many times just grabs any old scripture out of the Bible and tries to make it apply to the current discussion, whether it really does or not.

Quote (jammin @ April 29 2012,10:11)wht else mike? that is incompletepls give the complete answer of the questionIf YOU would like to add to my answer, then do so jammin.  How am I to know what answer you're looking for.  Should I add that the nature of man is to have 10 fingers and 10 toes?  Or 2 eyes?  Or 1 heart?What answer is it you're loo…[Read more]

Quote (Ed J @ April 29 2012,09:58)Besides, this it the thread you should address my post in.Then WHY did you post it in the OTHER THREAD?   Pick one thread, Ed, and I will address your post.  Would you like me to address it HERE, or THERE?Quote (Ed J @ April 29 2012,09:58)What do you say about God being IN Jesus?Do I need to refer you back to t…[Read more]