Good post Mike. The question that begs to be answered by you is whether or not the Son has the same nature as His Father, a nature that is not foreign to the Father, but the same nature…a nature that always existed and not a new and different nature, like the angels and mankind had.Kathi

Bumped for Mike.

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 02 2010,15:50)Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 02 2010,15:20)WJ, do you admit that the 'second person of the trinity doctrine' was at one time, before the ages, not a separate person to the Father?Of course not. He was always with the Father before the ages or time which means he was eternally with the Father as Calvin puts…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 02 2010,15:47)Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 02 2010,15:20)Isn't a better question what the original disciples of John thought John was saying?  Ignatius used the term ''unbegotten God'' and ''begotten God.''  That should be sufficient to say that one self-existed and one did not self-exist but was made to exist by the s…[Read more]

WJ said:Quote I can readily accept that the Father viewed Jesus as the Begotten Son of God from eternity. The question is did the Trinitarians believe that meant there was a point back in eternity that Jesus was “begotten” or “literrally born” as having a beginning.Isn't a better question what the original disciples of John thought John was…[Read more]

Quote Chapter XVII.—The Christians are refused Polycarp’s body.But when the adversary of the race of the righteous, the envious, malicious, and wicked one, perceived the impressive463463 Literally, “greatness.” nature of his martyrdom, and the blameless life he had led from the beginning, and how he was now crowned with the wreath of immorta…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 01 2010,19:00)JA,When you say God is spiritSpirit here is a body type, one without flesh and bones. imoLuke 24:3939 “See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.” NASUThis helps further explain:Ignatius speaks of a passible body and a impa…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 01 2010,18:12)Mike, mine says – “Yes, God loved the world so muchthat he gave his only Son,so that everyone who believes in him, may not be lost,”Book of Wisdom – http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/r/rsv/rsv-idx?type=DIV1&byte=3905445Hi Shimmer,Here are several translations of John 3:16:John 3:16NET ©For this is the way 1 God…[Read more]

JA,When you say God is spiritSpirit here is a body type, one without flesh and bones. imoLuke 24:3939 “See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.” NASU

JA,What do you think the Son was before He came into being?

Mike,But don't you believe that Jesus was literally created by God, not begotten. Was Adam 'yalad' by God, I don't think so. Were the angels begotten or created? What do you think is the difference between how the angels came into being and how the Son came into being?Thanks,Kathi

Quote (JustAskin @ July 31 2010,10:58)Hi Edj,So when I said to Mike that I had Begotten him as “Spiritual Brother” does that mean I gave birth to him, and to KarMarie as “Spiritual Sister”?Surely there are Scripturally intelligent people in this forum who can see past Earthly views…Always think in the Spirit when talking about Spiritual things -…[Read more]

Bump for Davidbfun

Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ July 27 2010,17:22)Kathi said:Quote I especially can relate to C.S. Lewis here:According to C.S. Lewis, “To beget is to become the father of: to create is to make. And the difference is this. When you beget, you beget something of the same kind as yourself. But when you make, you make something of a different kind from…[Read more]

Hi Mark,Wow, I am so sorry that you are dealing with so many hard things. You have been wounded by others that have also been wounded by the enemy. It is not God that is wounding you, it is the enemy. God has a plan to battle that enemy and in fact, He already has won that battle. We now wear Jesus as our righteousness and our job is to…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 27 2010,21:53)Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 28 2010,12:28)YepThis is what happens when the light is turned on. They just start making accusations for they have no defence to the truth.Not at all a new thing, this is what they accused Jesus of in his day.WJYou know what WJ?I have watched you and Jack double team so many…[Read more]

A protestant pastor on begetting: Quote What the language of the Nicene Creed wanted to say was that the Son is God just as the Father is God. It was intended to assert an equality of being. And for that what was needed was a language other than the language of making. What we beget is like ourselves. What we make is not; it is the product of our…[Read more]

Keith,Death is of the flesh, not the spirit. Christ's flesh died but did not decay and was resurrected and joined once again with His Spirit.Yes, I have been born again.

Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ July 27 2010,16:32)Quote (Lightenup @ July 28 2010,07:55)Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ July 27 2010,10:59)Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 28 2010,02:38)KathiQuote (Lightenup @ July 26 2010,18:47)He didn't say the I and the Father “am” one.No that would be improper english.But he did say I and the Father “are one” not “are one” in…[Read more]

Here is a little answer to Islam regarding the begotten Son.  It seems that WJ and Roo would side with the Islam' s here.Quote Begetting and Self-sufficiencyThis is a self-contradiction due to confusion of terms.10:68They say : “Allah hath begotten a son!” Glory be to Him! He is self-sufficient! His are all things in heaven and on earth! No…[Read more]