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[Berean]

@DT
I give up on talking to you anymore.

Goodbye

I don’t want to waste any more time with you.

[Berean]

 

 

@DT

Do you believe that “Sunday keepers” are “under the banner of Satan,” are “apostates,” are “Babylon,” or are the “daughters of Babylon”?

Me

No, not all of them.

 

You

Do you believe that Sabbath observance is the great wall of separation between God’s true remnant people and the deceived and lost world?

me

yes

Biblical texts

Rev. 12:17] And the dragon (Satan through the Roman Empire) was wroth with the woman (the faithful church), and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, those who keep the commandments of God and have 👉the testimony of Jesus Christ.👈

It is “the little horn” (Dan. 7) or the “sea beast” inspired by the Dragon/papal Rome that “thinks to change times and laws.”

Daniel 7:25: And he shall speak great words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and think👉 to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

4] And they worshipped the dragon, who had given authority to the beast; and they worshipped the beast, saying, “Who is like the beast? Who can fight with him?” (Rev. 13)

But God tells us through
Isaiah 8:20. To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Jeremiah 31:33
But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My law in their minds and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

This is God’s purpose: that His law be in our hearts.

What will happen if people OBSTINATES against God’s law, and especially His Holy Day? WILL GOD STILL TOLERATE THIS WITHOUT DOING ANYTHING?

It is time for thee, LORD, to work: for they have made void thy law (ps.119:126)

Rev.17:13] These (nations) have one mind, and shall give their power and strength 👉unto the beast.
[14] These shall make war with the Lamb (Christ) and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him are called, and chosen, and faithful.

Rev. 14:12] Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

 

If you really want to know a lot more and less disjointed continue to see Wieland’s books on Daniel and Revelation.

🙏

[Berean]

@DT

Well, I conclude that you consider obedience to God’s commandments unimportant.
That’s serious.

[Berean]

@DT

YOU

Jer. 46:27-28; Ps. 136:22; Luke 1:54. ALSO: Given the Christian view that Jesus is God, is God his own servant?

me

27] But do not be afraid, O my servant Jacob, and do not be dismayed, O Israel! For, behold, I will save you from a far country, and your descendants from the land of their captivity. Jacob will return and rest and be at peace, and no one will make him afraid.
[28] Do not be afraid, O my servant Jacob, says the Lord, for I am with you; I will utterly destroy all the nations to which I have driven you. Yet I will not utterly destroy you, but I will punish you in due measure, but I will not leave you completely unpunished.

Psalm 136:22
22] It is an inheritance for his servant Israel, for his mercy endures forever.

Luke 1:54] He has helped his servant Israel, in remembrance of his mercy.

These texts speak to us of Jacob/Israel and  NOT of Jesus, that’s clear.

God is not his own servant.

BUT YES, JESUS ​​IS GOD BECAUSE HE INHERITED THE DIVINE NATURE OF GOD HIS FATHER, BUT WE CANNOT SAY THAT HE IS GOD IN PERSONALITY. HE IS GOD IN NATURE, BUT NOT IN PERSON. (John 1:1)
AND HE WAS MADE FLESH (John 1:14)
And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
[5] 👉One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
[6]👉 One God and Father of all, who 👉is above all, and 👉through all, 👉and in you all.(Eph.4:4)

 

Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
[6] Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
[7] But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
[8] And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

🙏

[Berean]

@DT

You
Other references to Israel as God’s servant include Jer. 30:10 (note that in Jeremiah 30:17, the servant Israel is considered by the nations as an outcast, abandoned by God, as in Isaiah 53:4)

me

Jeremiah 30:10
10] Therefore do not fear, my servant Jacob, says the Lord; and do not be dismayed, Israel! For, behold, I will save you from a far country, and your descendants from the land of their captivity. And Jacob shall return and rest and be at peace, and no one shall make him afraid.

v. 17. 17] For I will heal you and bind up your wounds, says the Lord; because they called you the Forsaken One, saying, ‘This is Zion, whom no one seeks.’

Isaiah 53:4
Surely he has borne our griefs and carried our sorrows; yet we have made him esteem him stricken, stricken of God and afflicted.

In verse 10, it is indeed Jacob, Israel, as in verse 17, but
you cannot compare Jer. 30:17 with Isaiah 53:4.

Look at the context of Jer. 30:17.

From verse 11 onward

11] For I am with you, says the Lord, to save you. Though I utterly cut off all the nations among whom I have scattered you, I will not utterly destroy you; but I will chasten you in due measure, and I will not leave you entirely unpunished.

WHY???

[12] For thus says the Lord: Your wound is incurable, and your wound is grievous.
[13] No one pleads your cause, and you can be bound up; you have no remedy.
[ 14 ] All your lovers have forgotten you; they no longer seek you;

👉 For I have struck you like an enemy, like a cruel man, because of the multitude

👉 BECAUSE OF THE MULTITUDE OF YOUR INIQUITIES, because your sins have multiplied.
[ 15 ] Why do you cry out because of your affliction? Your pain is incurable, 👉 Because of the multitude of your iniquities; it is because 👉 your sins have multiplied that 👉 I have done these things to you.

CAN YOU COMPARE SUCH A SERVANT JACOB/ISRAEL WITH THE SERVANT OF ISAIAH 53:4???

On the one hand (Jer. 30:17) we have a servant rejected by the nations and punished by God because of his sins.

And on the other hand (Isaiah 53:4) we have the bearer of our sorrows, our griefs, and of course our sins (v. 11).
[11] He will see the travail of his soul and be satisfied; by his knowledge 👉my righteous servant will justify many, f👉or he will bear their iniquities.👈

This cannot be said of Israel, impossible!

🙏

[Berean]

 

#SabbathTruth​, #FaithOverTradition​
Have you ever wondered why so many churches avoid talking about the true Sabbath? In this eye-opening 39-minute motivational speech, Billy Graham boldly reveals the deep-rooted fears and traditions that keep the truth hidden. This message isn’t about religion—it’s about a relationship with God and the courage to walk in full obedience. If you’ve been hungry for deeper spiritual truth and clarity in your walk with Christ, this speech will challenge you to break free from religious confusion and align your life with God’s Word. Stay till the end—you may discover the key to a new level of faith, purpose, and freedom.

 

[Berean]

@DT

Verse 5 should lead you to a reasonable conclusion.

5] And now, says the Lord, who formed me from the womb,

To be his servant,

To turn Jacob to himself:

Though Israel be not gathered, I will be glorified before the Lord, and my God will be my strength.

IF JACOB/ISRAEL IS THE SERVANT HERE,
HOW CAN HE TURN HIMSELF BACK TO THE LORD???

THERE IS A BIG PROBLEM HERE.

THERE I BELIEVE THAT ONLY JESUS ​​CAN BE THIS SERVANT
AND NOT ISRAEL, WHO MUST BE TURNED BACK TO YHWH

[Berean]

@DT

You

 

52:13 “Behold, My servant will prosper.” Israel in the singular is called G-d’s servant throughout Isaiah, both explicitly (Isa. 41:8-9; 44:1-2; 45:4; 48:20; 49:3)…

 

Me

 

TEXTS FROM ISRAEL THE SERVANT WITH WHICH I AGREE

Isaiah 41:8 ] But you, Israel, are my servant, Jacob whom I have chosen, the seed of Abraham, my friend.
[ 9 ] You whom I took from the ends of the earth, whom I called from among its princes, and to whom I said, ‘You are my servant; I have chosen you, and I will not reject you.’
[ 10 ] Do not be afraid, for I am with you; do not be dismayed, for I am your God; I will strengthen you, I will help you, I will uphold you with the right hand of my righteousness.

Isaiah 44
[ 1 ] Now therefore, hear, O Jacob my servant, and Israel whom I have chosen. [2] Thus says the Lord, who made you and formed you from the womb, and who will help you: Do not be afraid, Jacob my servant, and you, Jeshurun, whom I have chosen.
[3] For I will pour water on the thirsty, and streams on the dry ground; I will pour my spirit on your descendants, and my blessing on your offspring.

Isa. 45:4] For the sake of Jacob my servant, and Israel my chosen, I have called you by your name; I have surnamed you, though you do not know me.
[5] I am the Lord, and there is no other; there is no God besides me. I have girded you, though you do not know me.

Isa. 48:20. 20 ] Come out of Babylon, flee from the Chaldeans, proclaim these things with a voice of song, tell them, recount them to the ends of the earth! Say: The Lord has redeemed his servant Jacob.

 

Regarding Isaiah 49:3, I do not agree that it refers to Israel although the word Israel must be written.

If you read vv. 1-5, you will understand that this cannot be the case.

Isa. 49
[1] Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The LORD hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name.
[2] And he hath made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand hath he hid me, and made me a polished shaft; in his quiver hath he hid me;
[3] And said unto me, Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.
[4] Then I said, I have labored in vain, I have spent my strength for nothing, and in vain: yet surely my judgment is with the LORD, and my work with my God.
[5] And now, saith the LORD that formed me from the womb to be his servant, 👉 to bring Jacob again to him, 👉Though Israel be not gathered, yet shall I be glorious in the eyes of the LORD, and my God shall be my strength.

Read this link (even in part) and you will understand

https://www.logos.com/grow/min-servant-isaiah-49/

TO BE CONTINUED LATER

🙏

[Berean]

@DT

He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
[4] Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
[5] But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities:

👉THE CHATISEMENT OF OUR PEACE WAS UPON HIM👈 ; and with his stripes we are healed.

 

 

YES, THE PUNISHMENT THAT GIVES US PEACE WAS UPON HIM ON THE CROSS OF GOLGOTHA.

HE SUFFERED THE PUNISHMENT THAT ADAM AND EVE AND THE ENTIRE ADAMIC RACE WAS TO SUFFER.

THE ONLY WAY NOT TO BENEFIT FROM THIS GRACE IS TO RESIST THIS GIFT OF GOD IN JESUS ​​CHRIST.

YES, WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR OUR ACTIONS AND WE CANNOT MAKE OURSELVES PLEASANT BEFORE GOD BY OUR REPENTANCE AND OUR GOOD DEEDS ALONE..ONLY THE MERITS OF CHRIST’S SHED BLOOD MAKE OUR REPENTANCE AND OUR GOOD DEEDS PLEASANT BEFORE GOD.

The entire Old Testament teaches us this, with the rituals of the sanctuary .

The daily sacrifice and all other animal and plant sacrifices, not to mention the festivals, represent Christ’s sacrifice and his ministry.

There is much to study and reflect on in this chapter, which is, in fact, the foundation of the New Testament.

[Berean]

@ DT

you

Read Exodus 32:30-35, where Moses was about to take the sins of the people and God said NO; they would be responsible for what they had done against God and inflicted a plague on them.

me

Just because God refused Moses to take the sins of the people upon himself does not mean that God, through His Son, could not.

If Adam and Eve survived FOLLOWING THEIR SIN IN EDEN, IT IS BECAUSE GOD ACTIVATED HIS PLAN OF SALVATION.
GOD COULD HAVE DESTROYED THEM IMMEDIATELY, BUT DID NOT, CONTRARY TO THE WARNING GIVEN: “for in the day that thou eatest thereof, thou shalt surely die.”

Certainly, Adam and Eve experienced death, but it was not final/eternal death (no return to life).

So, for me, this means that God took upon Himself, through His Son, the sins of Adam and Eve, forgave them, and gave them a second chance. In this way, this second chance was given to all of humanity.

Therefore, there are two deaths: death through sleep and death without return to life.

And therefore, although we are responsible for our actions and we reap what we have sown, God has chosen to show us grace through His Son, Jesus Christ.

It is up to us to consider this gift of mercy from God and His Son and choose whether or not to respond.

Christ chose, out of love for us, to bear the sins of the world in order to deliver us from them and give us life in Him.

But when He returns to seek His children and bring them to the Father, He will no longer be the bearer of sins; these will be transferred to the head of the goat Azazeel: SATAN, the first instigator/responsible for evil in the universe.

Rev.21

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
[8] And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
[9] And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
[10] And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are,…

 

 

 

[Berean]

@ DT

You say

If the last week of the “70 week” prophecy is about the Jesus’ death, please explain why this prophecy isn’t a focus in the NT. The only time the name Daniel is mentioned is in the Jesus’ dialogue when he’s speaking about the destruction of the Temple……

 

 

 

 

Me

 

 

 

 

Jesus referred to Daniel 9 without naming him in Mark 1:14, 15.

14] Now after John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,
[15] And saying, 👉The time is fulfilled,👈 and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

The time is fulfilled,…

The only “time” prophecy concerning Christ and his ministry in the book of Daniel is the prophecy of the 2300 evenings and mornings (2300 literal years) mentioned in Daniel 8:14.

Daniel 8:14] And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; 👉then shall the sanctuary be cleansed

The 70 weeks (490 literal years) are the beginning of this long prophecy of 2,300 years.
(Daniel’s time until the time of the cleansing of the sanctuary)

Daniel 8:16] And I heard a man’s voice between the banks of Ulai, who called, and said, Gabriel, make this man to understand the vision. [17] So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: 👉for at the time of the end 👈 shall be the vision (the purification of the sanctuary)

19] And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be👉 in the last end of the indignation: for at 👉the time appointed the end shall be.👈

Daniel 8:26] And the vision of 👉the evening and the morning 👈which was told is true: wherefore shut thou up the vision; for it shall be 👉for many days.

You

When the Jesus speaks of his death he never references the 70 weeks being about him. No one after his death mentions this being a fulfillment of Daniel.

Me

Paul refers to the time concerning the coming of Christ

Gal.4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law

Eph. 1:10   That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him

 

You

It would seem, from the mouth of the Jesus, he was warning them about the destruction of the Temple and NOT his death.

Me

Yes

The disciples needed to be warned so they could escape death when the Romans came to destroy Jerusalem and the temple, as mentioned in Daniel 9:26.
👉And after three score and two weeks, the Messiah shall be cut off, but not for himself: 👉and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary👈

👉As mentioned above, the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple would come AFTER THE DEATH OF THE MESSIAH.

And it is the consequence of the killing of Christ by those HE CAME TO SAVE.

🙏

 

[Berean]

If you would only take the time to read about Daniel 9 (the 70 weeks and the context) in Pastor Wieland’s book, you would understand something unique in the world and which goes hand in hand with the story.

🙏

[Berean]

 

@ DT

Comme je l’ai déjà dit, je ne perdais pas mon temps…

Me

Ok

If you don’t want to do what I tell you, then do what you want.
But I won’t waste my time trying to convince you about Daniel 9 OR ANYTHING ELSE BECAUSE YOU’RE NOT WILLING TO LEARN ANYWAY.
APPROPRIATELY YOU’VE FOUND YOUR WAY
YOU DON’T REALLY WANT TO KNOW ANYTHING ELSE.

[Berean]

Daniel chapter 9 is discussed in Pastor Wieland’s book, Chapter 9.
Read and you will see.

[Berean]

@ DT

YOU

Since you believe the last week is a future event, please provide the passage where G-d paused this prophecy and pushed it off thousands of years into the future.

ME

I never said I believed in this false doctrine initiated by the Jesuits and which has spread widely in Protestantism.
So how can you say such a thing without knowing?
So put your prejudices aside and go to chapter 9 of the book of Daniel, and you will be surprised to discover that the SDA does not believe in this Futurist heresy.

For Isaiah 14:12

12] How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

Who is Lucifer but the one who became the devil, Satan, because of his rebellion against God.

Would you deny the existence of Satan and his demons?

 

[Berean]

@DT

Daniel and Revelation are 2 complementary Books .

It is URGENT FOR YOU AND YOUR FAMILY THAT YOU BECOME AWARE OF THESE PROPHECIES (DANIEL AND REVELATION but not only….)

 

With these two books by Pastor Wieland you have something to quench your thirst for truth.

👇

https://maranathamedia.com/download/view/gospel-daniel-wieland

https://maranathamedia.com/download/view/gospel-revelation-wieland

[Berean]

@DT

You ….You’re going to have to be a little more specific; an article on Catholicism, the Seventh-day Adventist Church, or something you wrote?

….

You seem to have an extremely negative stance toward Catholics and constantly point out the religion’s flaws. How do you follow this “official” statement?

me

A considerable portion of the Book of Revelation warns God’s servants against papal Rome, against the wine (doctrines) of the wrath of her fornication (illicit relations with the kings of the earth).

And another angel followed, saying, “Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.” (Revelation 14:8)

Rev. 17:1 ] And one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls came and talked with me, saying, “Come, I will show you the judgment of the great harlot who sits on many waters.

[ 2 ] With whom👉 the kings of the earth committed fornication,👈 and 👉the inhabitants of the earth 👉were made drunk with the wine of her fornication.👈

3 ] He carried me away in the spirit into a wilderness. And I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet-colored beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
[ 4 ] And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet color, and adorned with gold, precious stones, and pearls. She had in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the filthiness of her fornication.
[5] And on her forehead was a name written: MYSTERY: BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
[6] And I saw the woman drunk with the blood of the saints and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus. And when I saw her, I was amazed with great wonder.

[THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS: ROME AND THOSE WHO FOLLOW ITS DOCTRINES]

15] And he said to me, The waters which you saw, where the harlot sits, are peoples, multitudes, nations, and languages.

Rev.17:18 ] And the woman whom you saw is that great city, which reigns over the kings of the earth.

 

…..

 

 

 

 

[Berean]

Show me a particular article that shocks you or that you find unfair.

[Berean]

Let me tell you, you’re giving a very bad review on this forum.
Don’t continue wasting your time and that of others; time is too precious.

[Berean]

Hi proclaimer

you
The word ‘mixed’ is the word ‘arab’ in Aramaic.

me

mixte

6151

Arabic

(Aramaic) corresponding to “Arabic” (6148); mélange: to mingle, to blend.

Arabic
6148
primitive root; to braid, that is, to intermix; technically, to barter; also or to give as security (as a kind of exchange): to pledge, (oneself) mix, to mingle, to mortgage, to occupy, to pledge, to stand surety, to undertake.

Proclaimer

This has nothing to do with Arabs or the Ottoman Empire.

YOU
“One leg of Rome became the western nations of Europe, perhaps the 10 kings. The other leg continued for another 1000 years as an empire and was eventually conquered by the Ottomans.”

me

What does Daniel say about the fourth empire?

40] And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: for as much as iron breaketh into pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break into pieces and bruise.

Here in verse 40, I don’t see any explanation for the two legs, saying: this leg represents this and the other leg represents that.

But rather, the strength of this fourth kingdom is highlighted:

“STRONG AS IRON” for as much as iron breaketh into pieces and subdueth all things…
….break into pieces and bruise.

For now, you need to keep this in mind, because here in Daniel 2, this is what is written about the fourth kingdom before its “divided” state.

You’ll have to go to Daniel 7 to learn more… but…
Let’s not get ahead of ourselves.

Review “iron and clay” and its “biblical” meaning before we see Daniel 7, if you wish.

[Author]

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