Worship God the Father only?

[david]

1. The only true God, Jehovah (Yahweh)
2. Jesus, as a God.
3. The holy spirit, which isn't even a person.

So that makes…..2, or 3 if you count non-persons.

I'm speaking for them, of course.

[Is 1:18]

The One true God, YHWH.

[Worshipping Jesus]

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It seems”as well as” is the commonest use. I agree the Son must be honoured as well as the Father he is a vessel for.

NH

LOL

The word “even as”  is interpreted 1 time in the bible “as well as”.

Kathos

1) according as

a) just as, even as

b) in proportion as, in the degree that

2) since, seeing that, agreeably to the fact that

3) when, after that

AV – as 138, even as 36, according as 4, when 1, according to 1,
    how 1, as well as

And here is the scripture.

Acts 10:47
Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?[/B}

My to what extremes we go to take away from honouring Jesus as he should be.

As God, One with the Father and Holy Spirit!

[david]

Many would say “Jesus.”

Yet you say Yahweh.

I count two.

[Is 1:18]

Quote (david @ Jan. 20 2007,08:29)

Many would say “Jesus.” Yet you say Yahweh. I count two.

He he…yes David, how very salient of you – Yahshua and His Father are two distinct persons….you are quite correct. Nevertheless both are explicity identified as YHWH and all the divine attributes are applied to each…etc etc.

[NickHassan]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Jan. 20 2007,08:28)

Quote It seems”as well as” is the commonest use. I agree the Son must be honoured as well as the Father he is a vessel for. NH LOL The word “even as”  is interpreted 1 time in the bible “as well as”. Kathos 1) according as a) just as, even as b) in proportion as, in the degree that 2) since, seeing that, agreeably to the fact that 3) when, after that AV – as 138, even as 36, according as 4, when 1, according to 1,     how 1, as well as And here is the scripture. Acts 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?[/B} My to what extremes we go to take away from honouring Jesus as he should be. As God, One with the Father and Holy Spirit!

Hi W,
God is the father of Jesus and we worship Him in Spirit and truth. Should we rather worship all who are called gods?

[Is 1:18]

We should not worship false gods, No. But Yahshua is not one of these….

Anyone disagree?

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
Yes.
For US there is ONE GOD the Father.
So I would not be being true to scripture if I was to worship His Son or any other godly being.
That would be polytheism and anathema for US.

[Worshipping Jesus]

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Hi W, God is the father of Jesus and we worship Him in Spirit and truth. Should we rather worship all who are called gods?

NH

If the Father says so!

[Is 1:18]

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We should not worship false gods, No. But Yahshua is not one of these…. Anyone disagree?

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 20 2007,09:28)

Hi Is 1.18, Yes. For US there is ONE GOD the Father. So I would not be being true to scripture if I was to worship His Son or any other godly being. That would be polytheism and anathema for US.

So Yahshua should not be worshipped because He is a false god?!?!?

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
It has little or nothing to do with who or what is worshipped.
Men make gods from stone and wood. Men worship themselves and angels. They worship food and sex. Worshipping angels does not make angels become divine.

Col 2.18
” 18Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind,”

But FOR US there is ONE GOD, THE FATHER.
This verse applies to you because you have been reborn into Christ have you not?
If you have there is one God for you, the Father.

Leave dead theology to dead theologians.
“Let the dead bury the dead”

[david]

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He he…yes David

You always confuse me for a second in your use of “he he.”

I believe it's taken from tee-hee (a giggle sound) and therefore might be clearer if you spelt it “hee hee.”

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We should not worship false gods, No. But Yahshua is not one of these…. Anyone disagree?

You're right. We should not worship false gods.
And you're right that Yahshua isn't a false god. The word “god” truly fits him in every way. So he isn't a false god.
But nowhere are we told to worship him. And nor does the fact that he's not a false god make him the Almighty, the only true God.

Is 1:18, I'd like your take on the word God, or actually the Hebrew and Greek words. What are their meanings?

[david]

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So Yahshua should not be worshipped because He is a false god?!?!?

I think Jesus shouldn't be worshiped because no where are we specifically told to worship Jesus. Jesus said to worship his Father. We're told to honour him, respect him, obey him, etc.

[david]

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But FOR US there is ONE GOD, THE FATHER.

Nick, you've said this a couple times. Perhaps more importantly, for the matter we are discussing, for Jesus, there is only one true God. Repeately, we are told in scriptures that Jesus has a God.
In relation to Jesus, Jehovah is God.
In relation to us, they both can be called Gods and they both are deserving of that word being applied.

But when looking at the relationship between the two of them: One Father, one Son, one who has a God, and one who is the God of the other, it becomes more clear who is without question worthy of worship. Who did Jesus say to worship?

[Worshipping Jesus]

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You're right.  We should not worship false gods. And you're right that Yahshua isn't a false god.  The word “god” truly fits him in every way.  So he isn't a false god. But nowhere are we told to worship him.  And nor does the fact that he's not a false god make him the Almighty, the only true God. Is 1:18, I'd like your take on the word God, or actually the Hebrew and Greek words.  What are their meanings?

David

I Jn 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

Rev 5:
9 And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation;
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
11 And I beheld, and I heard the voice of many angels round about the throne and the beasts and the elders: and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands;
12 Saying with a loud voice, Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honour, and glory, and blessing.
13 And every creature which is in heaven, and on the earth, and under the earth, and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, heard I saying, Blessing, and honour, and glory, and power, be unto him that sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb for ever and ever.
14 And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four and twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.

I suppose you are gonna bring up the word Proskeneo, but remember what ever is going on toward the One who sits on the throne is also going on toward the Lamb.

Now if you can show me in the verses where something different is happening to the Lamb, fine.

Besides, since the Father is Jesus God, then why isnt he joining in with the rest of us praising the Father.

And if you want to say Jesus was never worshipped because of the meaning of the word Proskeneo, then you have to say there is no example of worhipping the Father either!

Also David if you believe Jesus is a God but not the true God, then that is Polytheism.

[NickHassan]

Hi david,
If FOR US there is only one God, the Father, then it is very clear there is only ONE WE WORSHIP,
for who would suggest WE should worship he who is not FOR US even our God?

[david]

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I suppose you are gonna bring up the word Proskeneo, but remember what ever is going on toward the One who sits on the throne is also going on toward the Lamb. Now if you can show me in the verses where something different is happening to the Lamb, fine.

What are you basing the last half of the first sentence on?

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I Jn 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

Haven't you noticed that it's odd that all the scriptures like this can be taken in more than one way? This verse is speaking of the true one and of Jesus. They aren't the same because Jesus is called the son of the true one here. This whole verse and the ones before it center on who the true one is, and yes, Jesus is mentioned in the verse, but not as the true one, but as the one who gave us an understanding of the true one.

Haven't you noticed that all of the scriptures you use are like this?

There are many scriptures that without question say the Father or Jehovah is the only true God. Then, there's this scripture, which apparently, if you ignore logic, can be taken more than one way.

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Also David if you believe Jesus is a God but not the true God, then that is Polytheism.

Do you know what God means?
I believe what the Bible says.
Why don't you tell us what polytheism is. Isn't it the “worhip of or belief in more than one god”?

Question: Since the angels are rightfully called gods, or “mighty ones” and since you believe in them, would that make you a polytheist?

[Is 1:18]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 20 2007,09:28)

Hi Is 1.18, Yes. For US there is ONE GOD the Father. So I would not be being true to scripture if I was to worship His Son or any other godly being. That would be polytheism and anathema for US.

No polytheism is believing in more than one godly (divine) being……

Only one godly being – God.

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
True worshippers worship the Father, not a trinity God.

[Worshipping Jesus]

David

You say….

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Haven't you noticed that it's odd that all the scriptures like this can be taken in more than one way?  This verse is speaking of the true one and of Jesus.  They aren't the same because Jesus is called the son of the true one here.  This whole verse and the ones before it center on who the true one is, and yes, Jesus is mentioned in the verse, but not as the true one, but as the one who gave us an understanding of the true one. Haven't you noticed that all of the scriptures you use are like this? There are many scriptures that without question say the Father or Jehovah is the only true God.  Then, there's this scripture, which apparently, if you ignore logic, can be taken more than one way.

So what are you saying David that I should leave my interpretation and follow your interpretation.

The scripture is clear, but of course you want to read into it what you want.

I Jn 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

This verse mentions the Son of God twice and says we are in him this is the true God and Eternal life which John mentions in ch 1:1,2 of this Epistle.

How clear is that?

You say…

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Do you know what God means?   I believe what the Bible says.   Why don't you tell us what polytheism is.  Isn't it the “worhip of or belief in more than one god”? Question: Since the angels are rightfully called gods, or “mighty ones” and since you believe in them, would that make you a polytheist?

No. Because I dont call them Gods do you?

“To us there is only One God”, sound familliar?

Do you serve them like Jesus. Do you call them your Lord and master.

If you dont then there is a difference in your meaning Jesus is a God.

Is he a God to you?

If he isnt then why do you call him a God?

If he is then that is Polotheism.

Or unless you believe he is the true God one with the Father and the Holy Spirit.

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