Who did god sacrifice his son to?

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
He was killed and died like any man.
Believe the true scriptures which also say God raised him up again.
What is of the minds and mouths of men cannot improve on what God has given us.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,06:34)

Hi BD, He was killed and died like any man. Believe the true scriptures which also say God raised him up again. What is of the minds and mouths of men cannot improve on what God has given us.

What happened to Phillip after he baptized the eunich? Once you understand that you will get the idea of what I am trying to explain to you.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
Your explanations would carry more weight if scripture agreed with you.
Phillip did not die then but the anointed Son of God was crucified and raised from the dead.
You cannot follow your own imagination and write doctrines that will be relevant in any way compared with holy scripture.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,07:32)

Hi BD, Your explanations would carry more weight if scripture agreed with you. Phillip did not die then but the anointed Son of God was crucified and raised from the dead. You cannot follow your own imagination and write doctrines that will be relevant in any way compared with holy scripture.

So Philip was taken away by God Alive and appeared somewhere far from there, right?

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
Right.
So if scripture says Jesus died by crucifixion and was raised how does this relate?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,08:04)

Hi BD, Right. So if scripture says Jesus died by crucifixion and was raised how does this relate?

Obviously to the eunich he had witnessed something so amazing he probably thought Philip was God or was taken up to heaven.

You believe that Philip was caught up by God but you find it impossible to believe that God saved Jesus although it appeared he was crucified.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
You know the thoughts of folk?
We go by what scripture says and not our own imaginations or the imagined thoughts of others.

[942767]

Quote (bodhitharta @ July 31 2009,08:45)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,08:04) Hi BD, Right. So if scripture says Jesus died by crucifixion and was raised how does this relate? Obviously to the eunich he had witnessed something so amazing he probably thought Philip was God or was taken up to heaven. You believe that Philip was caught up by God but you find it impossible to believe that God saved Jesus although it appeared he was crucified.

Hi BD:

This is what the scripture states:

Quote

Act 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing. Act 8:40 But Philip was found at Azotus: and passing through he preached in all the cities, till he came to Caesarea.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,09:06)

Hi BD, You know the thoughts of folk? We go by what scripture says and not our own imaginations or the imagined thoughts of others.

Then why do you expect the Jews to accept Jesus when their scriptures did not show clearly that he was the one, they were awaiting a mighty warrior that would rule and conquer. They thought Jesus acting out of his imagination.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
We don't.
They didn't.
Will you listen?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,13:30)

Hi BD, We don't. They didn't. Will you listen?

Will you speak truth?

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
No need to.
God has spoken.
Man cannot live but by every word from the mouth of our God.

Your offerings are man's

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,13:37)

Hi BD, No need to. God has spoken. Man cannot live but by every word from the mouth of our God. Your offerings are man's

Have you spoken to God?

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
He spoke to us in many ways and recently through His Son.[heb1]

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,14:14)

Hi BD, He spoke to us in many ways and recently through His Son.[heb1]

And even more recently through Muhammad.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
Who is he?
No mention of him or this words in the sacred scriptures.

[Lightenup]

Quote (bodhitharta @ July 30 2009,11:22)

Quote (Lightenup @ July 30 2009,22:50) Quote (bodhitharta @ July 29 2009,23:12) Quote (Lightenup @ July 30 2009,14:55) Quote (bodhitharta @ July 29 2009,22:34) Quote (Lightenup @ July 30 2009,09:03) Quote (bodhitharta @ July 29 2009,15:20) Quote (Lightenup @ July 30 2009,04:36) Hi Bo, The scriptures do not show a connection between the scapegoat and Jesus.  Scriptures never say that Jesus is the scapegoat.  From what I can tell regarding the scapegoat, there is also a goat that dies.  There wasn't a scapegoat without another being killed.  Perhaps both represent what Jesus did and you are just looking at the goat that was released.  I understand the presentation of the two goats to show a blood sacrifice which provides for a full remission of sins which will not be remembered.  The two goats present a complete picture. Please respond to this verse and then Strong's definition of the word “slain.” Re 13:8 – All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain. Slain is Strongs# 4969 Sphazo to slay, slaughter, butcher to put to death by violence mortally wounded Blessings, Kathi You should read that sentence again. I know what slain means and I didn't say that no one died on the cross I said Jesus didn't die on the cross. Just like Abrahams son didn't get sacrificed because God provided a substitute. Do you think God could provide a substiture for Isaac and not provide one for Jesus? Why do you think God stopped the sacrifice of Isaac? Don't you understand that was a foretelling of the mystery of Christ being saved by God because Isaac was obedient unto death and yet God spared him. Bo, So you agree that someone died on the cross…who was the lamb that was slain?  Can you show us with scripture? Also, Do I think that God would provide a substitute for Isaac and not for Jesus…Yes, because Isaac wasn't destined to die as a sacrifice, Jesus was. Kathi Where is the prophecy that the Messiah would be crucified and die for Israel? Bo, Here is your prophecy: Isa 53:7-12 7 He was oppressed and He was afflicted, Yet He did not open His mouth; Like a lamb that is led to slaughter, And like a sheep that is silent before its shearers, So He did not open His mouth. 8 By oppression and judgment He was taken away; And as for His generation, who considered That He was cut off out of the land of the living For the transgression of my people, to whom the stroke was due? 9 His grave was assigned with wicked men, Yet He was with a rich man in His death, Because He had done no violence, Nor was there any deceit in His mouth. 10 But the Lord was pleased To crush Him, putting Him to grief; If He would render Himself as a guilt offering, He will see His offspring, He will prolong His days, And the good pleasure of the Lord will prosper in His hand. 11 As a result of the anguish of His soul, He will see it and be satisfied; By His knowledge the Righteous One, My Servant, will justify the many, As He will bear their iniquities. 12 Therefore, I will allot Him a portion with the great, And He will divide the booty with the strong; Because He poured out Himself to death, And was numbered with the transgressors; Yet He Himself bore the sin of many, And interceded for the transgressors. NASU BTW, why did you not answer my questions? God bless, Kathi How do you assume that is about Jesus? How was Jesus oppressed? Does Jesus have offspring? Jesus was never silent he spoke when they came to get him he spoke in private to Pontious Pilate he spoke on his way to the cross to the women and he even spoke on the cross according to the scriptures. 3He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not. This does not sound like Jesus, he was accepted of men and wildly popular so much so that he threatened the current system. He was esteemed greatl! Bo, This is not an assumption.  The NT clears up any confusion: Acts 8:32-37 32 Now the passage of Scripture which he was reading was this: “HE WAS LED AS A SHEEP TO SLAUGHTER; AND AS A LAMB BEFORE ITS SHEARER IS SILENT, SO HE DOES NOT OPEN HIS MOUTH. 33 “IN HUMILIATION HIS JUDGMENT WAS TAKEN AWAY; WHO WILL RELATE HIS GENERATION? FOR HIS LIFE IS REMOVED FROM THE EARTH.” 34 The eunuch answered Philip and said, “Please tell me, of whom does the prophet say this? Of himself or of someone else?” 35 Then Philip opened his mouth, and beginning from this Scripture he preached Jesus to him. 36 As they went along the road they came to some water; and the eunuch said, “Look! Water! What prevents me from being baptized?” 37 [And Philip said, “If you believe with all your heart, you may.” And he answered and said, “I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.”] NASU Do you see? Blessings Bo, Kathi It says “His judgement” was taken away and of course his life was removed from the earth because God raised him up to himself. What it doesn't say that he preached to the eunich is that Jesus died for his sins and was raised from the dead. Even if he had preached that Jesus died on a cross it would simply mean that is what he believed to be true at the time. Why is it hard for you to believe that as a mystery unfolds surprises occur. For instance those waiting for the Messiah in Judaism there is no second coming so that would be a suprise and therefor they don't accept the first coming of Jesus because there Messiah was to come and rule the first time.

Hi Bo,
If what you say is so then Isaiah is a false prophet since you believe just part of his prophecy is true.  Remember that a prophet doesn't speak his words but God's words.  Isaiah couldn't have spoken from his point of view since he was speaking prophecy which is God's word not Isaiah's word not to me
ntion that Isaiah had not seen any of that happen at the time he had written it.  Do you think that God doesn't know when someone is dead and when someone isn't?

So, the way I see it is:
You asked where a prophecy of Christ's death was.
I showed you.
You asked if it is assumption to apply that to Christ.
I proved to you that it applied to Christ.
You imply that the prophet Isaiah's prophecy is written from Isaiah's point of view and not truly a prophecy even though the event hadn't happened during Isaiah's life.

You ask why it is hard for me to believe that as a mystery unfolds surprises occur? I do believe that there are many things that are not known but I believe that you have been shown clearly that Jesus shed His blood and died over and over according to scriptures and witnesses.  Why are you fighting this so hard Bo?  You admit that someone died on the cross.

Kathi

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2009,14:50)

Hi BD, Who is he? No mention of him or this words in the sacred scriptures.

Jesus is not mentioned in the Torah is he?

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
You should have been with him on the way to Emmaeus.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
Peter knew of the words of Moses describing him as the great prophet and the Son is shown in ps2 and pr 30.

He is the expected Messiah.

[Author]

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