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Well explained Mike.
The father is a spirit;He is the Lord of host.
His host are spirit creatures.
Why would He stick to flesh if he can create spirit creatures?I can not see why God would create his cherubs of flesh.
A creature that can walk through walls, can not be defined as flesh.There is the carnal;and there is the spiritual.
If one believes that Jesus is coming again in the flesh.
He is only making room for the false prophet;for he will be flesh.wakeup.
Wakeup………Jesus after the resurrection walked through the Door where the disciples were with his flesh body, and He also said he was not a Spirit because Spirits do not have flesh and bone as you see I have. Should we limit the power of God working in and through a flesh body?
peace and love to you and yours………………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ May 08 2014,22:38) Wakeup………Jesus after the resurrection walked through the Door where the disciples were with his flesh body, and He also said he was not a Spirit because Spirits do not have flesh and bone as you see I have. Should we limit the power of God working in and through a flesh body? peace and love to you and yours………………………………….gene
Hi GeneB.No, not walked throught the door in his flesh body.
There is none of this in scripture.
He just appeared to them in his flesh body.
They did not have to open the door for him to get out of the room.
He just disappeared.As I said before,He appeared in flesh for them to see Him and to touch Him.To witness to them that he is truly Jesus.
crucified.Men can not see spirit.Spirits can do that also. The fallen angels did that when
they went into the women before the flood.
They appeared in the flesh to have sex.Melchisedek also appeared in the flesh.
He was not born; he just appeared.
The angels of God have also done this today.Hebrews 13:2 Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: ***for thereby some have entertained angels unawares***.
Jacob *wrestled* with an angel all night.
wakeup.
Hi WU,
But Jesus showed his flesh body to his brothers.Did he have new miraculous powers ?
Yes.First believe
Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 08 2014,07:40) Hi GB,
I am sure angels can see God and we are told we will be like to the angels
Nick,I am not so sure as it is written:
John 1:18
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)18 God no one hath ever seen; the only begotten Son, who is on the bosom of the Father — he did declare.
John 1:18
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)18 God no one hath ever seen; the only begotten Son, who is on the bosom of the Father — he did declare.
Some say “man” instead of “one” but these are the more literal translations of the Koine Greek. If no one has seen him then he is invisible to humans as well as angels.
A similar one is:
John 6:46
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)46 not that any one hath seen the Father, except he who is from God, he hath seen the Father.
This sounds like it testifies anyone angel or human that is from God has seen the invisible God. Some believe “he” is specifically referring to Jesus.
Matthew 18:10
Young's Literal Translation (YLT)10 `Beware! — ye may not despise one of these little ones, for I say to you, that their messengers in the heavens do always behold the face of my Father who is in the heavens
This one speaks of messengers that see God's face in heave but Moses saw God's back when he asked to see God's glory and goodness. At the same time he was told man(sinful?) cannot see the face of God and live. Sin he could not have seen God's back then it was both the face and back of God's glory and goodness that were being addressed.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 08 2014,08:05) Quote (kerwin @ May 07 2014,10:00) Wakeup, It is written that Moses saw God face to face………
Kerwin,It is written that God SPOKE TO Moses “face to face”.
Deuteronomy 5:4
The LORD spoke to you face to face out of the fire on the mountain.Deuteronomy 4:12
Then the LORD spoke to you out of the fire. You heard the sound of words but saw no form; there was only a voice.Deuteronomy 4:15
You saw no form of any kind the day the LORD spoke to you at Horeb out of the fire.
Mike,We have spoken of these and I believe we have come to agreement that no man has seen God's features.
I believe angels have not either but you disagree on that point.
I was pointing out to wakeup that face to face does not mean that a person saw God's features.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 08 2014,08:14) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 07 2014,19:39) Hi GB,
When the sons of God are revealed perhaps they will be different and be able to see God?
Flesh eyes cannot see anything invisible.
“Invisible” is a relative statement anyway, right?What might be “invisible” to one being isn't necessarily “invisible” to another.
When it is said that God is “invisible”, the statement is clearly relative to human eyes.
Mike,It is stated like it is all encompassing face, like Jehovah is the only invisible God. In other word the “the”.
Colossians 1:15
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation;
1 Timothy 1:17
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)17 To the King of the ages, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever.[a] Amen.
In this one it is just one his characteristics but being the only God is as well.
Quote (Wakeup @ May 08 2014,14:15) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 08 2014,15:01) Hi WU, Jesus said his body was flesh and bone but you deny this?
Nick.Yep.
wakeup.
Wakeup,Jesus gave evidence he was not a spirit but you claim he was.
Hi,
.Luke 24:39
See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have.”Quote (kerwin @ May 09 2014,09:19) Quote (Wakeup @ May 08 2014,14:15) Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 08 2014,15:01) Hi WU, Jesus said his body was flesh and bone but you deny this?
Nick.Yep.
wakeup.
Wakeup,Jesus gave evidence he was not a spirit but you claim he was.
Kerwin.I know that Jesus appeared in the flesh.
You must find out the reason why.
Because in the resurrection we all have a new body.
A scrard face person will not be resurrected with a scard face. Or would he?So why was Jesus resurrected with all his wounds?
It is for you to find out why.wakeup.
Hi WU,
We do not start from the point of view that he did things that a body cannot normally do, such as walking through walls.
We believe him and we believe in miraclesKerwin,
While the angel was already visible to the donkey, he was still invisible to Balaam.
While the chariots of fire were already visible to Elisha, they remained invisible to his servant.
Invisible to one being doesn't necessarily mean invisible to another being.
Mike,
I am not saying that there cannot be selective invisibility. I am saying the way it is written when speaking of Jehovah has no context to base the claim there is selectivity in his case.
Quote (kerwin @ May 09 2014,06:00) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 08 2014,08:05) Quote (kerwin @ May 07 2014,10:00) Wakeup, It is written that Moses saw God face to face………
Kerwin,It is written that God SPOKE TO Moses “face to face”.
Deuteronomy 5:4
The LORD spoke to you face to face out of the fire on the mountain.Deuteronomy 4:12
Then the LORD spoke to you out of the fire. You heard the sound of words but saw no form; there was only a voice.Deuteronomy 4:15
You saw no form of any kind the day the LORD spoke to you at Horeb out of the fire.
Mike,We have spoken of these and I believe we have come to agreement that no man has seen God's features.
I believe angels have not either but you disagree on that point.
I was pointing out to wakeup that face to face does not mean that a person saw God's features.
Kerwin.You need to go through all the bibles you can get, to find one that suits your believe;
Revelation 22:4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.
No one has seen Jesus as he is,the jesus the apostles saw was not as he really is. So can not be used as evidence that he is flesh.wakeup.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 09 2014,19:27) Hi WU,
Yes they saw him in his FLESH body
Now he is the man from heaven
Nick.Yes; for one purpose; to show his brethren that HE is resurrected.
wakeup.
Hi WU,
Matthew 12:39
But He answered and said to them, “An evil and adulterous generation craves for a sign; and yet no sign will be given to it but the sign of Jonah the prophet;Matthew 16:4
An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign; and a sign will not be given it, except the sign of Jonah.” And He left them and went away.Luke 11:29
As the crowds were increasing, He began to say, “This generation is a wicked generation; it seeks for a sign, and yet no sign will be given to it but the sign of Jonah.Luke 11:30
For just as Jonah became a sign to the Ninevites, so will the Son of Man be to this generation.Wakeup……….Jesus said He was NOT a SPIRIT” and went one to say , because a Spirit does “NOT” have flesh and bone “AS HE HAD” and that was after he went through the door and after his “BODY” was resurrected from the grave. Why wouldn't even be any reason for a physical Resurrection in the first place, if we are all going to be changed into spirit beings , common sense would tell you there would be no need for a physical Resurrection at all,
You say he just appeared that way for our sake, not one scripture says that. your forcing the text to say what in fact it does not say. Kerwin i believe has presented it best here, No one has seen God, not now or ever will , God is Spirit we must worship him in spirit and truth and no spirit is visible, It can be manifested in and through a body, as God the Father was truly “IN” Jesus' body indwelling him as he can also be “IN” us to
When Thomas said my lord “AND” my God he had just come to realize God the Father was truly “IN” Jesus , but none of that made Jesus a God, or the God that was present there in him. God is invisible and lives vicariously in and through his creation, or haven't you read, that God may be in 'ALL” and “THROUGH” ALL God is a Spirit you simply can not see him , except through the eyes of the Spirit. He is “SPIRITUALLY PERCEIVED” , not physically seen, not now or ever has or ever will be. IMO
Think about it.
pace and lvoe to you and yours……………………………………..gene
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