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Hi BD,
God is my God and that of Jesus, our appointed mediator and master.
But you have a man you claim is greater than the Lord Jesus?Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 23 2009,15:26) Hi BD,
God is my God and that of Jesus, our appointed mediator and master.
But you have a man you claim is greater than the Lord Jesus?
Actually I haven't said much about any man, I have kept steadfast to the fact That God is Sovereign and there is no God but Him.Hi BD,
So where does you leader fit in the picture when God has never spoken of him?
Jesus is the Son of God and Lord of all.Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 23 2009,16:13) Hi BD,
So where does you leader fit in the picture when God has never spoken of him?
Jesus is the Son of God and Lord of all.
Just tell me where in the bible before the Gospel was “Jesus” mentioned. He is only called Jesus in the NT so why is it the Quran cannot speak of Muhammad?Who spoke of Paul except Paul?
Even Moses wrote of Moses, Your logic makes no sense because essentially you are saying that if the collection of books known as The Holy Bible had not been compiled til after Muhammad and the Quran was one of the books you would believe in it and the prophethood of Muhammad but you seem to think that The Bible is a single book and not a collection compiled over time most which is not accepted by Jews at all, so does their total disbelief in the NT make it less valid?
Jesus speaks ogf Jonah by name, Abraham by name, Moses by name, David by name now tell me which one of those mentioned Jesus by name?
Luke 16:28-30 (King James Version)
28For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
29Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
30And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
31And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.
Why wouldn't Abraham say nor Moses nor prophets but only Jesus can save?
even in this account by Jesus
Hi BD,
You add what you will to your beliefs but your teachings are unrelated to the Word of God.
Are you saying your faith is in the house of Moses as Abraham does not have one?Have you become a Jew?
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 23 2009,18:06) Hi BD,
You add what you will to your beliefs but your teachings are unrelated to the Word of God.
Are you saying your faith is in the house of Moses as Abraham does not have one?Have you become a Jew?
Abraham 's religion was simple and pure: Worship GodThe testimony of Jesus Christ: Worship God
Why muddy the waters Nick?
The Most High God has no partners nor persons Believe in God and also believe in Jesus Christ but don't just stop there believe in all the worshippers of God even the least of these
Jesus said whoever is not against you is for you.
Mark 9:40 (New King James Version)
40 For he who is not against us is on our side.
Do you believe these words of Jesus?
Hi BD,
No muddying of the waters BD.
Read Jn3 and you will see your salvation hope is in Jesus Christ the Son of God.
There is salvation in no other name under heaven so cast aside the false leader and teacher you have come to follow.BD………..There is non that GOD raised from the dead to eternal but Jesus Christ, He is the (firstborn) of all creation having eternal life. He is the head of the household of GOD. Don't let any prophet rather Mohammad , or Moses or any other replace Jesus in your mind . He said no one comes to the FATHER except BY HIM. He is the true way, brother. IMO
peace and love…………………………..gene
Quote (Gene @ June 24 2009,02:29) BD………..There is non that GOD raised from the dead to eternal but Jesus Christ, He is the (firstborn) of all creation having eternal life. He is the head of the household of GOD. Don't let any prophet rather Mohammad , or Moses or any other replace Jesus in your mind . He said no one comes to the FATHER except BY HIM. He is the true way, brother. IMO peace and love…………………………..gene
Amen Gene! We agree on something.
thinker
Quote (Gene @ June 24 2009,02:29) BD………..There is non that GOD raised from the dead to eternal but Jesus Christ, He is the (firstborn) of all creation having eternal life. He is the head of the household of GOD. Don't let any prophet rather Mohammad , or Moses or any other replace Jesus in your mind . He said no one comes to the FATHER except BY HIM. He is the true way, brother. IMO peace and love…………………………..gene
If that is true then why did Jesus say that you could go to the Father directly.John 16:25-27 (King James Version)
25These things have I spoken unto you in proverbs: but the time cometh, when I shall no more speak unto you in proverbs, but I shall shew you plainly of the Father.
26At that day ye shall ask in my name: and I say not unto you, that I will pray the Father for you:
27For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
If you believe Jesus you should go to the Father himself Jesus did what the Father asked him to and finished it
John 17:3-5 (King James Version)
3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
4I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Keep in mind this was before he was sentenced to death, he said that he was finished the work he was given.
So I Glorify the name of God and you find fault with that?
Have I not said consistently that God sent Jesus who is Christ?
I said that Jesus was not God nor would he say such a thing. Jesus was circumcised just like I am even he kept the original covenant.
Hi BD,
You should not think the teachings of Scripture written for those in Christ apply to the heathen.
The reborn sons of God can now go to their Father.The rest must first go through the door of Christ.
Seek ye first the kingdom…
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 24 2009,05:38) Hi BD,
You should not think the teachings of Scripture written for those in Christ apply to the heathen.
The reborn sons of God can now go to their Father.The rest must first go through the door of Christ.
Seek ye first the kingdom…
Could you explain that comment a little further?It sounds like you have changed the meaning of Heathen
BD………..I do not find fault for you glorifying GOD the FATHER, I find fault for you not believing in Jesus and what He said about Himself. “Who soever has the Son Has the Father also”, John told us. BD, brother…> you can't circumvent Jesus in the saving process, He is the Lamb of GOD sacrificed By Him for the sins of the world, it was not Mohammad who was sacrificed for the sins of the world , but it was Jesus who was. And no man comes unto the FATHER except the way He showed us, rather Jew , Christian, or Islamic. I know there is more clarity that shall be revealed about GOD the Father as Jesus said , but for now we have what He told us. IMO
peace and love to you and yours…………………….gene
Quote (Gene @ June 25 2009,03:30) BD………..I do not find fault for you glorifying GOD the FATHER, I find fault for you not believing in Jesus and what He said about Himself. “Who soever has the Son Has the Father also”, John told us. BD, brother…> you can't circumvent Jesus in the saving process, He is the Lamb of GOD sacrificed By Him for the sins of the world, it was not Mohammad who was sacrificed for the sins of the world , but it was Jesus who was. And no man comes unto the FATHER except the way He showed us, rather Jew , Christian, or Islamic. I know there is more clarity that shall be revealed about GOD the Father as Jesus said , but for now we have what He told us. IMO peace and love to you and yours…………………….gene
Gene,I really think you misunderstand my position. I love Jesus and believe that Jesus was sent from God, I learned about Islam through studying Jesus and what he says about “Our Father” God led me to the reading, reading the Quran with a pure heart many things became crystal clear.
We all know that terms like Father and Son are affectionate terms, as God does not sire children in any way. However these terms have caused confusion with many people some to the point where at certain times Mary was thought to be part of the “trinity” i.e. The Mother, The Father and The Son and even today she is called the Queen of Heaven and is prayed to and Worshipped.
There is liberal usage of titles in the OT and the NT many people are called gods or lords and hence there is much confusion. The Quran does not have any of these confusions there is no such thing as “Allahs” Allah is the arabic meaning of Elohim it really means “All Powerful” but in Arabic it is Always singular and never pertains to gods. God is not simply the one with powers God is ALL-POWERFUL.
You can see when Jesus said Eloi, Eloi (matthew has Eli, Eli)or My God, My God in aramaic a clear similarity.
But understanding that God saved Jesus from death was the most shocking and unsettling until it all made so much sense. We tend to think that God “sacrificed” His son but God hates child sacrifice and commanded us not to kill our children. God also says that he will not accept any sacrifice of an animal that has been beaten, gorged, mangled or tortured in other words a crucifixion is not a sacrifice it is Murder.
The Quran says that they plotted to kill The Messiah and you know that's what it was “a plot”
(1) And (the unbelievers) plotted and planned, and Allah too planned, and the best of planners is Allah.
( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #54)We believe that Jesus can save us but God cannot save His “Son”
why is it God says
Malachi 3:17 (New King James Version)
17 “ They shall be Mine,” says the LORD of hosts,
“ On the day that I make them My jewels.[a]
And I will spare them
As a man spares his own son who serves him.”Yes it was preached that he was crucified but it was revealed
(9) That they said (in boast), “We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #157)(9) Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise;-
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #158)Remember the story of Abraham
God did not let Abraham sacrifice his own son saying:
Genesis 22:11-13 (New King James Version)
11 But the Angel of the LORD called to him from heaven and said, “Abraham, Abraham!”
So he said, “Here I am.”
12 And He said, “Do not lay your hand on the lad, or do anything to him; for now I know that you fear God, since you have not withheld your son, your only son, from Me.”
13 Then Abraham lifted his eyes and looked, and there behind him was a ram caught in a thicket by its horns. So Abraham went and took the ram, and offered it up for a burnt offering instead of his son.Plus you believe that all the sin was placed on Jesus for atonement, right?
well if that is the case read this:
Leviticus 16:7-9 (King James Version)
7And he shall take the two goats, and present them before the LORD at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation.
8And Aaron shall cast lots upon the two goats; one lot for the LORD, and the other lot for the scapegoat.
Leviticus 16:20-22 (King James Version)
20And when he hath made an end of reconciling the holy place, and the tabernacle of the congregation, and the altar, he shall bring the live goat:
21And Aaron shall lay both his hands upon the head of the live goat, and confess over him all the iniquities of the children of Israel, and all their transgressions in all their sins, putting them upon the head of the goat, and shall send him away by the hand of a fit man into the wilderness:
22And the goat shall bear upon him all their iniquities unto a land not inhabited: and he shall let go the goat in the wilderness.
Notice it say by the hand of a fit man:
Matthew 11: (King James Version)
11 Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Who could be more fit:
Matthew 3:5-7 (King James Version)
6 And were baptized of him in Jordan, confessing their sins.
Matthew 3:12-14 (King James Version)
13 Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him.
But why would Jesus want to be baptized?
15And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
16And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:
17And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
Matthew 4
1Then was Jesus led up of the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted of the devil.Leviticus 16:9-11 (King James Version)
9And Aaron shall bring the goat upon which the LORD's lot fell, and offer him for a sin offering.
10But the goat, on which the lot fell to be the scapegoat, shall be presented alive before the LORD, to make an atonement with him, and to let him go for a scapegoat into the wilderness.
But remember Jesus did not sin so who was he being baptized for? The Children of Israel! That's right Jesus confessed the sins of Israel and with that sin upon him was tempted of the devil and sinned not. The fact is the scapegoat must be presented alive and hence Jesus was raised alive into heaven and has not died since his birth .
This is what God revealed to me. Just remember if Jesus had died the atonement would be impossible for people of today but Jesus is alive and also remember this:
The blood is the life of the flesh.
Deuteronomy 12:22-24 (King James Version)
22Even as the roebuck and the hart is eaten, so thou shalt eat them: the unclean and the clean shall eat of them alike.
23Only be sure that thou eat not the blood: for the blood is the life;
and thou mayest not eat the life with the flesh.24Thou shalt not eat it; thou shalt pour it upon the earth as water.
Jesus had them drink the wine with bread showing that his blood was to remain with his flesh and not be poured out
2 Kings 14 (King James Version)
6 But the children of the murderers he slew not: according unto that which is written in the book of the law of Moses, wherein the LORD commanded, saying, The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, nor the children be put to death for the fathers; but every man shall be put to death for his own sin.
Hi BDm,
God is the Father of Jesus.
God does no longer accept He is the father of all men.
You can only become His adopted son by being joined with Jesus Christ.You must be born again.
Seek ye first the kingdom and everything else will be added to you.Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 25 2009,07:24) Hi BDm,
God is the Father of Jesus.
God does no longer accept He is the father of all men.
You can only become His adopted son by being joined with Jesus Christ.You must be born again.
Seek ye first the kingdom and everything else will be added to you.
No Nick,It is first seek the KINGDOM of GOD
God does not, nor need to have children as if he were expecting to die and need progeny to carry on his line.
God being a Father is relational out of his Kindness not that we are of his kind and yet those who are kind are like him.
So each kind accordingly.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 25 2009,10:52) Hi BD,
It is never a case of God needing anything.
But salvation is offered through His Son.[Jn3]
Salvation has always been offered by various means.God did not let thousands of years past and then suddenly think “hey, I will now offer salvation to mankind”
It's ridiculous to believe such a thing. God has always been God and has always provided salvation.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 25 2009,13:27) Hi BD,
Is there another entrance into the kingdom apart from the gate of Jesus?[jn10]
Yes, of course.There is only one continuous gate with more increased opportunities for Salvation not less but the gate is Narrow for the way is straight as believing in Jesus requires a belief in Moses and a belief in Moses requires a belief in Jesus.
I'm pretty sure you don't quite understand what I am saying but to believe in the lessor is to believe in the Greater.
Jesus was saying that while I am here I am the light of the world therefore I am the way and no one can come to the Father except through me but obviously he transfered that to hios disciples who then the people had to believe that Jesus sent them and hence they could say if you do not believe in this gospel you will not be saved.
But His truth goes maching on and God keeps sending His mercies even though you reject these mercies as the Jews reject your beliefs today.
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