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Quote (terraricca @ June 08 2014,12:12) gENE SCRIPTURES SAYS THAT THE DEAD IN THE FLESH HAVE NO PART ANY LONGER UNDER THE SUN ;MEANS THEY HAVE LOST THEIR MEAN TO BE ACTIVE IN THE FLESH BECAUSE A MEN SOUL NEEDS A BODY OF FLESH TO BE ACTIVE IN IT ,
Terricca………good you have some of it right, a new Soul or (person) what is a Soul ( a body + spirit ) must be completely remade by our Heavenly Father from the earth where all mankind came from and go to when they die.We all must attain unto the resurrection in order to continue to live again after death. Remember what Jesus said , I was dead , and “NOW” am alive forevermore. He was not kidding he truly was “DEAD” and dead does not mean alive no matter what anyone tell you. IMO
We to will be able to say the same thing brother if we attain unto the first resurrection. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours……………………gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2014,12:39) Hi GB,
What are parables?
Nick……. Parables are ( factious illustrations) they relay a message by use of allergic language. They can not be taken literal, the message they convey can be, if the right understanding of their metaphors and symbolic meanings are known.This is one of the reasons we have so many different doctrines today, because some people take thing to literal ,not discerning the true intent of those sayings. Nick the bible is full of symbolic language from Genesis to Revelations.
Peace and love to you and yours …………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 08 2014,07:00) Quote (kerwin @ June 08 2014,06:40) Gene, Jesus actually implied that the soul is still alive in the grave when he stated Jehovah is not a God of the dead but he the God of the living.
So in order for the God's words “I am the Lord God of Abraham thy father, and the God of Isaac..” then Abraham, who body was dead and lying in its burial location had to still be alive and waiting the resurrection of his body.
So as is you seem to be saying that Jesus either lied or was mistaken.
In another place Jesus said do not be afraid of those who can destroy your body (causing the first death) but be afraid of him who can destroy both you body and soul in Hell(causing the second death).
Once again Jesus implies the death of the soul does not occur when the body dies but only when God chooses to destroy it in the final death.
Kerwin…….True God is not the God of the “DEAD” why? Because ” the dead know nothing, there is NO knowledge, Nor Work, Nor Wisdom in he grave where we go! when we DIE, and obviously a dead person has no God or anything else as far as the Goes.I tell you Kerwin it is vital we all attain to the resurection of a flesh body , created by the spirit of God, a body exactly like Jesus and Adam had.
There is NO LIFE after a man dies left, the body is corrupted in the grave and the spirit of life goes back to him who gave it in the first place. God does not lie ” THE SOUL that SINS “IT” SHALL “DIE”. And that does not mean still LIVING. All have Sinned and ALL will DIE, God is not MOCKED. YOU must simply believe what he said is true and accurate.
The whole concept that a person is still ALIVE after DEATH is of Satan, he was the one who said ” YOU Shall not “SURELY DIE” , FOR God know you will be Like HIM”. Trust me Kerwin when God told Adam the would DIE and return to Dust, “FROM WHENCE THEY WERE TAKEN” he truly meant it. When He said “DUST YOU “ARE” and DUST “YOU” SHALL RETURN, He truly meant every word out of His Mouth.
I know for most here that is hard to believe , but it doesn't change what God said no matter what we want to believe? I have posted many scriptures that completely back up what I have said.
It is absolutely crucial we all attain unto the resurrection from DEATH, and that is not a resurrection of a living soul life, in some abyss or what ever state of living, that you and others think we are in after DEATH. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours……………………….gene
Gene,Your words still seem to imply Jesus is a liar. You have nor reconciled his words with what you claim is true.
Genesis 26:24
New English Translation (NET)24 The Lord appeared to him that night and said, “I am the God of your father Abraham. Do not be afraid, for I am with you. I will bless you and multiply your descendants for the sake of my servant Abraham.”
According to God's words he was currently the God of Abraham at the time he spoke with Isaac. Abraham had died the first death at that time. So either Jehovah was God of the dead Abraham or God considered Abraham to still be living even though he died the first death.
That is one passage you have to resolve with your chosen doctrine. Quoting other Scripture does not do it unless you can use them as part of the resolution.
Hi GB,
One of the reasons there are so many doctrines is that folk do not believe the words but allegorise them.Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 08 2014,07:47) Quote (terraricca @ June 08 2014,12:12) gENE SCRIPTURES SAYS THAT THE DEAD IN THE FLESH HAVE NO PART ANY LONGER UNDER THE SUN ;MEANS THEY HAVE LOST THEIR MEAN TO BE ACTIVE IN THE FLESH BECAUSE A MEN SOUL NEEDS A BODY OF FLESH TO BE ACTIVE IN IT ,
Terricca………good you have some of it right, a new Soul or (person) what is a Soul ( a body + spirit ) must be completely remade by our Heavenly Father from the earth where all mankind came from and go to when they die.We all must attain unto the resurrection in order to continue to live again after death. Remember what Jesus said , I was dead , and “NOW” am alive forevermore. He was not kidding he truly was “DEAD” and dead does not mean alive no matter what anyone tell you. IMO
We to will be able to say the same thing brother if we attain unto the first resurrection. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours……………………gene
Hi GB,
You say
“Terricca………good you have some of it right, a new Soul or (person) what is a Soul ( a body + spirit ) must be completely remade by our Heavenly Father from the earth where all mankind came from and go to when they die.”By your reasoning yes.
But I have given you a verse showing there is a division between soul and spirit and another to show man is body, soul and spirit. No responses
You have been helpful to me on some things over the years but your stubborn refusal to grasp what is obvious in scripture at time is bewilderingQuote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2014,08:16) Hi GB,
One of the reasons there are so many doctrines is that folk do not believe the words but allegorise them.
Nor just do not believe in them ,
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2014,13:16) Hi GB,
One of the reasons there are so many doctrines is that folk do not believe the words but allegorise them.
Nick…….Is that not what you are doing , by not believing scriptures that say when person is dead they TRULY are dead , and not believing God who plainly said ” YOU “ARE DUST” aNd to dust “YOU SHALL RETURN.”I have given you scriptures that back up what I have said.
I will say it again,unless you and I and all attain unto the resurrection ,which “will witness the redemption of OUR “BODIES” we simply will not live again, and there is NO LIFE in the GRAVE where we all Go.
satan wants us all to believe we TRULY do not DIE, and that we are Still ALIVE,after we die, it is just another of his deceptions. Believe what God himself said, and Jesus said nothing to the contrary. IMO
As far as judgement goes , we are being judged NOW, ” FOR judgement begging at the house of God”. But for the rest they must be first resurrected and then they will be judged.
Jesus took our eternal death sentence away from us, and If we truly believe we SHOULD NOT, Parish. We all will give an account of what we have done with what we know, but, unto whom much is given much is required, and unto whom little is given little is required.
Bottom line is , it is by GRACE we are saved,
Judgement is a good thing, it is like A FIRE under metal it dissolves it and forces up the DROSS so it can be scraped off leaving PURE Metal.
So are the judgements of God, they are not meant to destroy , but to purify. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours…………………….gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 08 2014,15:03) Hi GB,
You say
“Terricca………good you have some of it right, a new Soul or (person) what is a Soul ( a body + spirit ) must be completely remade by our Heavenly Father from the earth where all mankind came from and go to when they die.”By your reasoning yes.
But I have given you a verse showing there is a division between soul and spirit and another to show man is body, soul and spirit. No responses
You have been helpful to me on some things over the years but your stubborn refusal to grasp what is obvious in scripture at time is bewildering
Nick……READ Genesis ,again and it PLAINLY tell you What a SOUL is. Why add to it, it there describes A COMPLETE LIVING “SOUL”. Do you see it broken down into THREE PARTS , or JUST TWO, a BODY with the BREATH OF LIFE IN IT. That is what a LIVING SOUL “IS” , NICK.That is what our GOD created and scripture say that is what a living SOUL IS.
Question is why do you not believe that Nick? You understand many things we have talked about and agree on many things, but this one seem to present a stumbling block.
You cannot produce a single text that say a man is made up of a BODY, SPIRIT, and a SEPARATE SOUL of some kind that keep on living after he is dead. Nor have you shown a single time where the WORD DEAD does not Actually Mean DEAD
Satan does not want us to believe God or His words, “the soul that sins “IT”shall “DIE” , you are saying the same thing rather you see it now, or not. I have posted scriptures that plainly show there is NO Life in the grave none left, you are just a dead Soul corrupting in the grave where there is no knowledge, wisdom. No thought, because in the day a man (LIVING SOUL) dies his thoughts parish . The body goes one place while the spirit goes another, back to God who gave it in first place. That is it, the end of our existence, and if God leaves it that way we are gone for ever, but he can resurrect another body, and add our spirit back into it ,
if he choses to, and the we again can become a LIVING SOUL once more.This is the way i see it Nick, I have for a long time seen it that way and still do brother.
Peace and love to you and yours………………….gene
Gb
the scriptures tells us that the soul that sins must die ; but we all know that it is not the flesh it self that is sinning but the soul inside of the flesh ,that is why it says the soul and not the flesh ;but to maintain it self the soul stuck in a body of flesh as to look after that flesh ,for it as needs that differs from the ones of the soul because the soul is spirit not flesh ,it is like a spirit inside of a box ,but this in no way changes what God says about the soul that sin will die ,
what is this mean ;in truth if at the end the soul refuses to accept Christ (meaning not sinning )will certainly be destroyed and so die ,
the body 's dead is only for restricting men's ability of progressing in sin with the collaboration of Satan ,Satan live as a angel and so does not die after 100/200/or 1000 years but men does after 100 or so this put Satan back to find new men on a constant base ,but all will be judged ,
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2014,05:57) Hi GB,
God spoke of the flesh.
But living souls do not return to dust
Nick…… True “Living SOULS” DO not turn to dust, BUT DEAD ones DUE.If you think the soul does not die you are sadly mistaking. What scripture actually says brother. IMO
Whengodsaid the soul (the complete being) Sins IT ( what ever consist of a Soul) shall surely DIE, he was not kidding Nick.Satan does not want you to believe your just a complete soul being, he wants you to think your still alive when in fact you are actually dead when you die. Why can't you see that brother?
Our ONLY HOPE is the RESURRECTION of a spiritual made physical body. Made by God the Father, just like Adams and Eves and Jesus' was made by his spirit, so must our new bodies be made exactly as there's was, a spiritual made “BODY” , not a spirit body, as some “assume” but a spiritually made physical body. Made by by our Father God himself.
He that has eyes to see let him see.
Peace and love to you and yours Nick……………………..gene
Quote (terraricca @ June 09 2014,02:11) Gb the scriptures tells us that the soul that sins must die ; but we all know that it is not the flesh it self that is sinning but the soul inside of the flesh ,that is why it says the soul and not the flesh ;but to maintain it self the soul stuck in a body of flesh as to look after that flesh ,for it as needs that differs from the ones of the soul because the soul is spirit not flesh ,it is like a spirit inside of a box ,but this in no way changes what God says about the soul that sin will die ,
what is this mean ;in truth if at the end the soul refuses to accept Christ (meaning not sinning )will certainly be destroyed and so die ,
the body 's dead is only for restricting men's ability of progressing in sin with the collaboration of Satan ,Satan live as a angel and so does not die after 100/200/or 1000 years but men does after 100 or so this put Satan back to find new men on a constant base ,but all will be judged ,
Terricca……..No we ALL do not know that, I sure don't see it that way even if everyone else does, that is not how God has allowed me to see it.Look show me a SPECIFIC SCRIPTURE that say a Mans SOUL is still alive after he DIES then you have a point, So far no one has shown such a SPECIFIC SCRIPTURE. But only scriptures where words are added into the text to make then mean what they do not SPECIFICALLY say. AS people do with a preexistent Jesus, or Jesus is also a God or the word of God and on and on it goes. Into the cloud of confusion Satan's teachers and synagogues have come up with these past two thousand years. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours………………………..gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2014,06:47) Hi GB,
DEAD LIVING SOULS??God is the God of the Living-Abraham, Isaac and Jacob etc
Nick…….The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, is indeed the God of the Living, just as he was their God when they were alive also. He is not the God of the dead. The dead have no God the have NO KNOWLEDGE, not Wisdom iN he grave where we all go when we DIE, trust me Nick DEAD TRULY means DEAD., not half or one third dead, but completely dead . Living in la, la, land is not living in reality brother.God did not LIE when he said “the SOUL that Sins “IT” SHALL DIE” , it does DIE, as soon as we stop breathing and lose consciousness, the light are out foreever, until the LORD Our God, resurrects US and gives us new BODIES and adds SPIRIT of LIFE back into it, and then we become a NEW LIVING SOUL Again. The old man is gone the New “MAN” takes it's place, renewed in BODY and SPIRIT., a New LIVING SOUL. OLD THINGS have PASSED AWAY, ALL THINGS BECOME NEW.
IMOPeace and love to you and yours………………………gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2014,07:23) hi GB,
They are alive by the Spirit of Life in them
Jesus spoke with some on the mountain.
Nick….. Your taking about the Mountain of transfiguration , was also the Christ coming in the KINGDOM them, NO but what did he just say before that that some standing here would not see death until they see the son of man coming in the kingdom, do you also really believe that Jesus was truly coming in the kingdom at that time with Elijah and Mosses ? It was a vision of a “FUTURE” event NICK, you know that.Peace and love to you and yours…………………..gene
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