Should a muslim be able to post in believers area?

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,11:59)

Hi BD,
Since you have chosen your own peculiar path why do you want others to join you?
Does it make you feel insecure to be alone?

I don't believe that I have said in a single post that anyone shoud join me in belief and I don't need to, if the truth is made clear from error let each person decide for themselves.

My only obligation is to be honest about the source of my joy and salvation it is only certain people that evangelize and compel a person to join but I am taught that there is no compulsion in religion.

November 23, 2009 at 1:16 am#158198

Participant

Hi BD,
No compulsion in Islam?
Hmmm

November 23, 2009 at 1:18 am#158200

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,12:16)

Hi BD,
No compulsion in Islam?
Hmmm

(1) Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #256)

November 23, 2009 at 1:23 am#158201

Participant

Hi BD,
I know your book might say so but the reality?

November 23, 2009 at 1:28 am#158202

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,12:23)

Hi BD,
I know your book might say so but the reality?

The reality is always the word of God not the deeds of men and therefore I go by what is written. If all went by what is written there would be no conflict on earth but mankind is ever ungrateful.

(9) It is He Who gave you life, will cause you to die, and will again give you life: Truly man is a most ungrateful creature!
( سورة الحج , Al-Hajj, Chapter #22, Verse #66

November 23, 2009 at 1:35 am#158204

Participant

Hi BD,
Then why not go by the sacred words and not your weak human additions?

November 23, 2009 at 2:28 am#158219

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,12:28)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,12:23)

Hi BD,
I know your book might say so but the reality?

The reality is always the word of God not the deeds of men and therefore I go by what is written. If all went by what is written there would be no conflict on earth but mankind is ever ungrateful.

(9) It is He Who gave you life, will cause you to die, and will again give you life: Truly man is a most ungrateful creature!
( سورة الحج , Al-Hajj, Chapter #22, Verse #66

BD, Your words(to follow the Quran) don't line up here with Sura 9 #5.

November 23, 2009 at 7:58 am#158245

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 23 2009,13:28)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,12:28)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,12:23)

Hi BD,
I know your book might say so but the reality?

The reality is always the word of God not the deeds of men and therefore I go by what is written. If all went by what is written there would be no conflict on earth but mankind is ever ungrateful.

(9) It is He Who gave you life, will cause you to die, and will again give you life: Truly man is a most ungrateful creature!
( سورة الحج , Al-Hajj, Chapter #22, Verse #66

BD, Your words(to follow the Quran) don't line up here with Sura 9 #5.

The Surah and verse you are talking about is during battle
Of course I could show you like verses in the Bible.

And he said unto them, Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, Put every man his sword by his side, and go in and out from gate to gate throughout the camp, and slay every man his brother, and every man his companion, and every man his neighbour.
Exodus 32:26-28

And it came to pass, when Israel had made an end of slaying all the inhabitants of Ai in the field, in the wilderness wherein they chased them, and when they were all fallen on the edge of the sword, until they were consumed, that all the Israelites returned unto Ai, and smote it with the edge of the sword.
Joshua 8:23-25

Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
1 Samuel 15:2-4

But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.
Luke 19:26-28

Surah 9
5 But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

There are many more but you refuse to know that entire Truth about God preferring to pick and choose. God according to the scriptures of the Bible ordered that even the women and infants be killed in 1 Samuel 15:2-4

November 23, 2009 at 8:01 am#158246

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,12:35)

Hi BD,
Then why not go by the sacred words and not your weak human additions?

Should I simply believe you when you say what is or is not sacred?

Is it at least possible to you that God could have sent down a revelation as He did throughout the thousands of years?

November 23, 2009 at 8:47 am#158255

Proclaimer

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,10:45)

Of Course I have always considered my self a SLAVE of GOD hence being a SUBMITTER(MUSLIM).

The fact is Adam was not given a choice in the garden of Eden he was told to submit to the will of God instead he yielded to his own desires.

Most people do not understand that God does not teach free will God teached His will. Satan teaches "free will"

And yet you say in another post:

Quote

that I agree with you that the salvation of God is available to anyone who chooses to do the will of God (no blood necessary)

You admit that people can CHOOSE to do the will of God.
So we are free to do the will of God. That is what free will is.

We are free to do the will of God or not.

You then say that it is Satan who teaches free will and then you teach it also in a around about way. Did you just condemn yourself with your own words?

November 23, 2009 at 9:40 am#158526

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,18:58)

Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 23 2009,13:28)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,12:28)

The reality is always the word of God not the deeds of men and therefore I go by what is written.
If all went by what is written there would be no conflict on earth but mankind is ever ungrateful.
Al-Hajj, Chapter #22, Verse #66

BD, Your words(to follow the Quran) don't line up here with Sura 9 #5.

Surah 9
5 But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, an seize them,
beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent,
and establish regular prayers and practise regular charity, then open the way for them: for Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

There are many more but you refuse to know that entire Truth about God preferring to pick and choose.
God according to the scriptures of the Bible ordered that even the women and infants be killed in 1 Samuel 15:2-4

Hi BD,

It's your 'spin' on "Truth" that I find troubling.
I believe that (biased on your previous posts) you believe that 'joining god's to God' is a belief in 'a trinity' as you say it.
Is this not true?

You further believe that considering Jesus' Father(Holy Spirit) GOD Paramount's to Jesus having "Deity status"; which is also a violation of 'joining god's to God'.
Now because of this type of logic; all who believe in either(as described in the last two paragraphs) are deserving of being slain.
Is this not true?

1John 3:7-15 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous,
even as he is righteous. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.
For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin,
because he is born of God. In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil:
whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.
For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother.
And wherefore slew he him(why did he do it)? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you. We know that we have passed from death(Satan) unto life(GOD),
because we love the brethren. he that loveth not his brother abideth in death(Satan).
Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.

Luke 12:8 Also I say unto you, Whosoever shall confess me(Jesus) before men,
him shall the Son of man also confess before the angels of God:
But he that denieth me(Jesus) before men shall be denied before the angels of God.
And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him:
but unto him “that blasphemeth” against the Holy Spirit(Jesus’ Father) it shall not be forgiven.
And when they bring you unto the synagogues, and unto magistrates, and powers,
take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say:
For the Holy Spirit(Jesus’ Father) shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.

To reject the “Deity”=63 of Jesus’ Father(YHVH=63) is the only thing that WILL NOT be forgiven.
Is this really what you choose to do?

November 23, 2009 at 10:46 am#160379

Tim Kraft

Participant

Quote (t8 @ Nov. 18 2009,12:07)

Quote (Tim Kraft @ Nov. 17 2009,22:04)

As soon as someone takes it upon themselves to know the truth and protect others from error, then free choice, free will, and freedom of speech are out the window. This site should now be T8.net.nz! Very sad! TK

I have to disagree with you TK.

This site has always had a rule that people post to a discussion that is appropriate and related to the subject.

People do not always stick to this (including myself) but having forums in categories helps and having believers in the Believers Place has helped further.

No one is barred from posting, it is just about posting in the right place. This is what gives this forum value. People can find what they are looking for and read about a topic and see what people have to say. If a loose attitude was prevalent, then people would post what they wanted where they wanted and there would be less value in reading the discussion. When people see a Heading in a topic, then they can read that topic and get something relevant out of it. If you don't see value in what I am saying, then imagine going to Google and searching on God and getting a whole lot of random sites about topics such as real estate and soccer.

If I went to a Science Forum then I could see merit to a Scientist Only area. If they had a part for laymen like myself to post, then I would be thankful for that if I wanted to voice my opinion on something.

Nothing has changed on Heaven Net. The thing you complain about was enforced before you even came here.

As for T8.net.nz, well all I can say is that I am not the biggest poster around here and I don't think I am even second. I have been here the longest, but not the most. I am a member just like everyone else, but I have the job as a moderator too.

t8: Thank you for expanding the truth of your intentions a bit more for me. I stand corrected and tend to agree with you on the different catagories. I also have many times accidentally posted in wrong forums for the topic I was intending to cover.
I misunderstood your intent when I to quickly voted. I tend to hate altering free speech but I see this now as so different.
Thanks for the correction. TK

November 23, 2009 at 5:41 pm#160389

Participant

Quote (t8 @ Nov. 23 2009,19:47)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,10:45)

Of Course I have always considered my self a SLAVE of GOD hence being a SUBMITTER(MUSLIM).

The fact is Adam was not given a choice in the garden of Eden he was told to submit to the will of God instead he yielded to his own desires.

Most people do not understand that God does not teach free will God teached His will. Satan teaches "free will"

And yet you say in another post:

Quote

that I agree with you that the salvation of God is available to anyone who chooses to do the will of God (no blood necessary)

You admit that people can CHOOSE to do the will of God.
So we are free to do the will of God. That is what free will is.

We are free to do the will of God or not.

You then say that it is Satan who teaches free will and then you teach it also in a around about way. Did you just condemn yourself with your own words?

You have not read the context of what you quoted.

Those who are obedient to God are slaves of God but those who rebel by using "free will" will be punished.

Choosing not to do God's will is not a "free" option as their is a penalty involved. Satan teaches that "free will" has no penalty involved but giving someone godlike power and authority to decide what is good and what is evil for themselves.

We are commanded to do the will of God, we are not asked

November 23, 2009 at 5:50 pm#160391

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 23 2009,20:40)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,18:58)

Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 23 2009,13:28)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,12:28)

BD, Your words(to follow the Quran) don't line up here with Sura 9 #5.

Hi BD,

It's your 'spin' on "Truth" that I find troubling.
I believe that (biased on your previous posts) you believe that 'joining god's to God' is a belief in 'a trinity' as you say it.
Is this not true?

To reject the “Deity”=63 of Jesus’ Father(YHVH=63) is the only thing that WILL NOT be forgiven.
Is this really what you choose to do?

Ed,

When did you see me write anywhere that I reject God?

Jesus is not God and if he is the entire OT is wrong since God said:

Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.
Isaiah 43:9-11

Just this one verse alone proves every single person wrong to give deity to Jesus.

That verse in Isaiah is concluding that Jesus cannot be what you say Jesus is and that God formed Jesus as a Man unless you disbelieve God Himself.

It also proves what I said you cannot join other gods with God it is blasphemy so are you sure you want to do that?

November 23, 2009 at 6:04 pm#160396

Participant

Hi ED,
God is One.
You stumble.

November 23, 2009 at 8:29 pm#160407

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 24 2009,04:41)

Quote (t8 @ Nov. 23 2009,19:47)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 23 2009,10:45)

Of Course I have always considered my self a SLAVE of GOD hence being a SUBMITTER(MUSLIM).

The fact is Adam was not given a choice in the garden of Eden he was told to submit to the will of God instead he yielded to his own desires.

Most people do not understand that God does not teach free will God teached His will. Satan teaches "free will"

And yet you say in another post:

Quote

that I agree with you that the salvation of God is available to anyone who chooses to do the will of God (no blood necessary)

You admit that people can CHOOSE to do the will of God.
So we are free to do the will of God. That is what free will is.

We are free to do the will of God or not.

You then say that it is Satan who teaches free will and then you teach it also in a around about way. Did you just condemn yourself with your own words?

You have not read the context of what you quoted.

Those who are obedient to God are slaves of God but those who rebel by using "free will" will be punished.

We are commanded to do the will of God, we are not asked

Hi BD,
Those who are obedient to God do not try to correct the words of His Spirit.

November 23, 2009 at 9:27 pm#160410

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 24 2009,04:50)

It also proves what I said you cannot join other gods with God it is blasphemy so are you sure you want to do that?

Hi BD,

I try to answer your all questions; why do you avoid mine?
Once again you did not answer my questions(as is your pattern);
here again are same three questions, this time please answer them.

You believe that belief in 'a trinity' (as you say it), Paramount's to(in your opinion) 'joining god's to God'?
Is this not true?

You also consider the belief that if Jesus' Father(Holy Spirit) is GOD(making Jesus God's only begotten Son)
Paramount's to Jesus having "some kind of deity status only because he would be considered God's Son",
which is also(in your opinion) a violation of 'joining god's to God'.
Is this not true?

Now based on your view of the teachings of 'the quran'(Sura 9#5); those who believe in either
(point that I described in the last two paragraphs) are deserving(according to your opinion) of being slain.
Is this not true?

Please do not dodge these three questions; which is your pattern!

November 23, 2009 at 10:00 pm#160412