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Hi Berean,
I really hope you can reply to this post specifically. I discussed this already, maybe I missed your response somewhere.
I believe Philippians 2 gives us a MOST profound truth, where it also brings greater meaning to other passages. I would argue your interpretation is empty, where mine is quite rich. So let’s COMPARE!!
Concerning Philippians 2,
4-5 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
You: Christ Jesus = pre-existing spirit son dwelling in heaven
ME: Christ Jesus = Christ Jesus, the anointed Jesus, anointed with the fullness of God’s Spirit and all the powers therein at the river Jordan.
6-7 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
YOU: pre-existing spirit son being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made “in the FORM of the human flesh”.
ME: Christ Jesus being in the form of God (for he received of God’s Spirit not by measure, with all the powers therein leaving the river Jordan in the form of God), thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation (he said he could do nothing of himself), and he took upon him the form of a servant (Christ Jesus was sent upon his anointing of the Spirit out into the world to fulfill God’s will and deny his own), and was made in the likeness of men (though the Son of Man Christ Jesus was in the form of God having the fullness of the Spirit dwell within he was also like all humans, having desires of the flesh, temptation of the flesh, and able to die)
Side note: Psalms 8 tells us that God would be mindful of a man, visit him, make him a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death to then crown him with glory and honor. God’s righteous angels follow all of God’s will, they are servants of God, they are no longer able to die, the anointed Jesus made into God’s servant to follow all of His will was not made no longer able to die, he was in the likeness of all humans being able to die.
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
You: and being found in fashion as a man (the FORM of the human flesh), he humbled himself (? not sure who your “he” is here who humbled himself, did the humbling come before or after he came to earth), and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.
ME: and being found in the fashion as a man, Christ Jesus (who was in the form of God but also had weak mortal flesh) humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even death of the cross (Christ Jesus could have used the powers of the Spirit to serve himself, make bread from stones when he hungered, he could have saved himself from the cross, instead he was a humble servant obedient unto a painful death).
fashion -Schema, the habitus, as comprising everything in a person which strikes the senses, the figure, bearing, discourse, actions, manner of life etc.
9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
YOU: he returned back to his pre-existing glory
ME: Prophecy fulfilled, the man God was mindful of and visited giving him the fullness of His Spirit to do all the work that God asked him to do/execute God’s purpose, this man was highly exalted where God gave him a crown of glory and honor and sat this Son of Man at His right hand. Every tongue should confess that Jesus the anointed is lord, to the glory of the Father. As we are told in Acts, the man who was crucified, God made him both lord and Christ. The Son of Man in Psalm 8 was to receive from God dominion over all the works that God had made.
YOU: WHEN HE WAS IN THE FORM OF GOD, HE WAS NOT A SERVANT
ME: Berean, you say Jesus pre-existed not as a servant, however Jesus said that he came not of his own will, so if he in heaven chose not to follow his own will but God’s in coming down to earth, he was thus a SERVANT. Jesus is still a servant, the Son of Man is returning in his Father’s glory to complete God’s will.
Phil 2:1 If there be therefore any consolation in Christ, if any comfort of love, if any fellowship of the Spirit, if any bowels and mercies, 2 Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind. 3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves. 4-5 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
Berean, you believe that Paul is asking people to be like minded with the pre-existing son in heaven who was not a servant?? No way, that ‘s ridiculous. You change the IMAGE of Christ Jesus and destroy Paul’s entire message.
Jesus was anointed with the Spirit not by measure and he was sent out TO preach God’s word, TO give prophecy, TO perform miracles, heal. Jesus was in FULL fellowship of the Spirit.
People likewise received of God’s Spirit and they too were sent out preaching, giving prophecy, performing miracles, healing. Each had a measure of fellowship of the Spirit.
They were not of this world as Christ Jesus was not of this world, they were sent upon an anointing as Jesus was sent upon an anointing. The body of Christ was flesh fully anointed with the Spirit, they together being many members were one body, an image of the body of Christ.
It is THEY who needed to be like minded with the Jesus of Nazareth who was anointed and then sent. They needed to serve God’s will in love with nothing being done in strife or for vainglory.
Jodi
you
I believe that Philippians 2 gives us a MORE profound truth, where it also brings greater meaning to other passages. I would say that your interpretation is empty, while mine is quite rich. So let’s compare!
Whatever you tell me is NOT worth anything at all.
YOU’RE JUST SAYING TWISTED THINGS
NO MORE, NO LESS.
THIS IS NOT FROM GOD.THE UNITARIAN THEORY IS WORTHLESS
Hi Berean,
What exactly have I said that you specifically believe is twisted?
The fact that I said Jesus Christ = Jesus Christ?
What is TWISTED is that you think Paul is teaching that people need to be like minded with a pre-existing son in heaven who was not a servant.
What is twisted is that,
Jesus on earth has the full measure of God’s Spirit and all the powers therein upon him where by such he speaks only God’s word and performs only God’s will, but you think Paul is not speaking of him as the one who is in the form of God.
It’s not twisted to look at Jesus Christ and say he was in the form of God, but at the same time he was in the likeness and fashion of men, as he was able to be tempted and he was able to die, just like all men.
Hi Berean,
Jesus Christ = Jesus Christ
It’s not twisted to believe that Jesus Christ humbled himself when he was in the wilderness and went 40 days and 40 nights without food and had an empty stomach and found himself hungry, where he had the power to make bread from stones, but he emptied himself of his own desires and will, remaining a servant to God.
It’s not twisted to believe that Jesus Christ humbled himself when he was taken captive, mocked, beaten, crucified unto a painful death, when he was not deserving at all of that death, and he had the power to save himself. He instead remained a servant to God and did as God willed.
Jodi
That’s not what I’m talking about.
what is frankly false in what you say is that you deny the existence of Christ before He came to earth;
There’s a lot of texts that show that he’s divine and that he came from heaven and returned to heaven…you are like the jews
John 6[42] And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven?
John6[46] Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he (the divin Son of God)which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
John 5:37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.
WHICH MEANS THAT THE DIVINE SON OF GOD
WHO SAYS THIS ,WHILE ON EARTH, HAD SEEN GOD AND ALREADY HEARD HIS VOICE.IT’S NORMAL THAT HE WAS WITH GOD IN HEAVEN.
The SON OF MAN ascended to where he was before.
The SON OF MAN was in heaven and came to earth?
I though you believed an anointed spirit only begotten son came down from heaven and emptied himself to become a Son of Man? Are you saying he transformed himself into a man first and then descended?
Did it every cross your mind it is the same person but different role?
Did it cross your mind that Jesus was telling people who he was and that he was much more than what people saw?
I could be a New Zealand citizen and say that I came from the USA and am returning to the USA. I might have come to NZ and got citizenship and partaken of the Kiwi way of life for a time.
Likewise those of God are citizens of Heaven but can be resident on Earth and you seem puzzled by all this.
Pray that God can open your mind to be renewed by the word of God.
T8
You
“Do you mean that he first turned into a man and then went down?”
ME
no, He came down at God’s due time and having annihilated himself (see Philipians), he was joined in Mary, his divinity united to our humanity.
“The WORD Was made flesh”Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:(Hebrews20:5)
Colossians 2:
[9] For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.Jodi cherry-picks all the humanity verses and thinks this nullifies all the other verses that show us who Jesus is and where he came from.
As if these verses disproved the other verses.
We believe Jesus was a man.
Jesus Christ came in the flesh.
Hi Berean,
The pre-existence belief does not add up to me at all because of many specific passages.
The passages you give to prove he pre-existed, I understand differently, and that which I understand fits perfectly with all other scriptures.
Can you talk about the below passage Berean, how does it fit with your belief?
Acts 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. 23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.
Who is Jesus identified as in John 6?
6:14 Then those men, when they had seen the miracle that Jesus did, said, This is of a truth that prophet that should come into the world. 15 When Jesus therefore perceived that they would come and take him by force, to make him a king, he departed again into a mountain himself alone.
God raised up a prophet from among brethren and upon being raised up he THEN COMES INTO THE WORLD.
Whose the king? The king is the promised son of David who God said He would be a Father to.
6:26 Jesus answered them and said, Verily, verily, I say unto yo.u, Ye seek me, not because ye saw the miracles, but because ye did eat of the loaves, and were filled. 27 Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.
6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them,This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
So far from John 6, he whom God sent into the world is the prophet who God raised up from among brethren, and the Son of Man who God the Father sealed.
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
The living bread = Jesus’s flesh
I am the flesh which came down from heaven
John 8:42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. 43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
That which Jesus speaks he speaks through having been anointed with God’s Spirit for the purpose to be SENT out to preach the very words we hear him say in John 6 and 8. Jesus of Nazareth proceeded forth and came from God, through the Spirit having abode upon him, such made his flesh the living bread that came down from heaven/from God that was sent into the world. He was sent out to be for a light, delivering captives out of darkness, “in him was life; and the life was the light of men”, “his own received him not“.
Don’t forget, Jesus is not of this world as they are not of this world. God’s word from the beginning was that a man would execute His purpose of salvation. Of the seed of David God according to a promise raised unto Israel a savior, Jesus. God sent that very word of His from the beginning down from heaven fulfilling it in the flesh of Jesus who then became the living bread that was sent out into the world. The king spoken of in John 6, is the king who sits on his father David’s throne according to the flesh and he is God’s Son according to the Spirit.
Hi Jodi,
YOU: So let’s COMPARE!!
Concerning Philippians 2,
4-5 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others. Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
YOU: Christ Jesus = Christ Jesus, the anointed Jesus, anointed with the fullness of God’s Spirit and all the powers therein
at the river Jordan.
ME: LIES, OFFICIALLY CONFIRMED AT THE RIVER JORDAN!
JESUS BEFORE WAS WITH THE FULLNESS OF GOD’S SPIRIT.
HE WAS BORN WITH THE FULLNESS OF GOD’S SPIRIT.
Matthew:1:18Now the generation of Christ was in this wise. When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together,
she was found with child, OF THE HOLY GHOST (not by the power of the holy ghost as you FALSELY say!)
20 But while he thought on these things, behold the Angel of the Lord appeared to him in his sleep, saying: Joseph, son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife, for that which is conceived in her
IS OF THE HOLY GHOST
Now to
Luke1:35 And the angel answering, said to her:
The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee ( OK Jodi, THE HOLY GHOST HIMSELF UPON MARY)
and the power of the Most High shall overshadow thee. ( OK Jodi,
THE POWER OF GOD ALMIGHTY, not the power of the Holy Ghost. CLEAR?)
And therefore also
The Holy
which shall
be born of thee (NOT AT THE RIVER JORDAN)
shall be called
the Son of God.
YOU: Christ Jesus being in the form of God
(for he received of God’s Spirit not by measure, with all the powers therein leaving the river Jordan in the form of God),
ANSWER Jodi,
HOW ON EARTH JESUS BORN LOADED WITH ALL THE SINS PAST, PRESENT and FUTURE, EMBODIED ALL CREATION IN HIM, BOTH GOOD IN HIS DIVINE NATURE,
OF THE HOLY GHOST,
and EVIL IN HIS HUMAN NATURE
IN “THE WORD” the Son of Man
could be
sinless
could live on earth and
for 18 years in THE HARSHEST SPIRITUAL WARFARE against
THE FULL POWER of Satan and his demons, to commit sin, and
NEVER SINNED
unless
GOD ALMIGHTY WAS WITH HIM BY HIS SPIRIT WITHOUT MEASURE?
Confirmed in
John 8:46 Which of you shall convince me of sin?
YOU: thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation
(he said he could do nothing of himself), ME: AS MUCH AS GOD THE FATHER COULD DO NOTHING OF HIMSELF ON EARTH!
and he took upon him the form of a servant
(Christ Jesus was sent
ME: OFFICIALLY PROCLAIMED: upon his anointing of the Spirit out into the world to fulfill God’s will and deny his own),
Read now
Matthew 3:13 Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to the Jordan, unto John, to be baptized by him.
14But John stayed him, saying:
I ought to be baptized by thee, (what did John see in Jesus Jodi? did Jesus have the spirit without measure?)
and comest thou ( the anointed, the Christ, Godman) to me?
15And Jesus answering, said to him:
Suffer it to be so now. ( WHY DID JESUS SAY SUCH STATEMENT?)
For so it becometh us
to fulfill all justice.
Then he suffered him.
Jodi, JESUS ON HIS BAPTISM, OFFICIALLY ON EARTH, PRECISELY IN ISRAEL (LUCIFER’S SPIRIT)
AFTER HE WON HIS SPIRITUAL WARFARE AND ANNIHILATED SATAN AND HIS DEMONS
FOR THE SAKE OF THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE, WAS
JUSTIFIED THE FIRSTBORN SON OF GOD
IN WATER AND IN THE HOLY GHOST
John3:5 Jesus answered: Amen, amen, I say to thee, unless a man ( JESUS and IN HIM THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE) be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
Jodi, IN THAT MOMENT IN TIME ON HIS BAPTISM THE ENTIRE HUMAN RACE WAS
BAPTIZED AND BECAME SONS OF GOD ALL IN HIM!
JESUS NEVER NEEDED BAPTISM, HE RECEIVED FOR THE SAKE OF THE HUMAN RACE!
in order to make MANY others his brethren! Well declared in
Romans 8:28 And we know that to them that love God all things work together unto good: to such as,
according to his purpose, are called to be saints. 29For whom he foreknew,
he also predestinated to be made conformable to the image of his Son:
that he might be the Firstborn amongst many brethren. ( on his baptism)
30And whom he predestinated, them he also called. And whom he called,
them he also justified.( on his baptism)
And whom he justified, them he also glorified. ( on his resurrection)
the man born again John3:3 BY HIS SPIRIT, from the HEART OF ALL
THE SPIRITUALLY DEAD
in hell and on earth
ORIGINALLY SLAIN LIKE A LAMB FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE WORLD Rev.13:8
back to
Philippians 2:5 For let this mind be in you,
which was also in Christ Jesus:
6Who being (PRE-EXISTED) in the form of God, thought it not robbery ( JUSTIFIED) to be equal with God:
7But emptied himself,(FROM HIS DIVINITY, PRE-EXISTED)
taking the form of a servant, (DESPITE HE WAS NOT)
being made in the likeness of men, and in habit found as a man.
Jodi, JESUS WAS MADE
IN THE LIKENESS OF MAN/HUMAN, AND IN THE HABIT OF MAN/HUMAN.
ARE YOU, Jodi,
MADE IN THE LIKENESS OF HUMAN AND IN THE HABIT OF HUMAN? ANSWER!
DEFINITELY NOT!
YOU ARE HUMAN Jodi!
AND OF THE SATANIC EARTH!
BUT JESUS WAS
MADE IN THE LIKENESS OF HUMANS….
HE WAS NOT ONE OF THE HUMANS OF EARTH!
DO YOU ACCEPT THE ABOVE TRUTH?
Timothy 3:16 And evidently great is
the mystery of godliness, (THE DIVINE TASK OF JESUS)
which was manifested in the flesh, (God in the form of a man)
was justified in the spirit, (Philippians 2:6 not robbery ( JUSTIFIED) to be equal with God:)appeared unto angels, (ANGELS ON EARTH AS HUMANS:Luke 10:24 For I say to you that many prophets and kings have desired to see the things that you see and have not seen them, and to hear the things that you hear and have not heard them.)
hath been preached unto the Gentiles,
is believed in the world, is taken up in glory.
Peace and love in Jesus Christ
Hi Carmel,
Mary was found with child by the power of the Holy Ghost, how else would God fulfill His promised sign of a virgin birth unto the house of David concerning David’s biological heir?
The virgin birth was for a SIGN that is direct prophecy, and the sign was for the house of David so that they would know that God keeps His promise concerning David’s throne having his own seed upon it.
The virgin birth was not for God to make himself a demigod.
Carmel, you deny the SIGN, speak pagan garbage making Jesus into a false image, and then you play down the actual glory of Jesus Christ that he received at the river Jordan where God’s word was made true in the flesh (Isaiah 11, 42, 44, 45, 46, 61, Psalm 8, 1 Chron 17).
God doesn’t declare “THIS is my beloved Son” upon the moment Jesus is begotten with the full measure of God’s Spirit and power, because he pre-existed as a spirit son, or because he was born a demigod.
Hi Carmel,
Luke 1 tells you that the child that is born IS the son of David and that he WILL be great and that he WILL be called the Son of the Highest. Then we hear God declared “THIS is my beloved Son” at the river Jordan and we read that is when the Son is SENT, and we read that is when he becomes famous because of his great works that he performs through God’s Spirit.
Luke 1 tells you that the child that is born IS the son of David and that he WILL be great and that he WILL be called the Son of the Highest.
Totally fits if he came from Heaven and is back in the glory that he had with the Father before the universe was created.
Then we hear God declared “THIS is my beloved Son” at the river Jordan
A public declaration by God himself of the one who stood before them.
It doesn’t say that he became the beloved son as you are suggesting. That is adding words.
Jodi
You
The living bread = the flesh of Jesus
I am the flesh that came down from heaven…
Me
Don’t cheat, Jodi.
1) >>>The Word was with God…and was God(1)
2)>>>> And the word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, full of grace and truth; and we have seen his glory, the glory as the glory of the only begotten Son from the Father.(14)
The Word is BECAME flesh = bread
While they were eating, Jesus took bread, and when he had given thanks, he broke it, and gave it to the disciples, saying, “Take, eat; this is my body. (Matthew 26:26)
BODY/FLESH= BREAD
God bless
THE WORD BECAME FLESH ON EARTH
HEAVEN
1) >>>>> Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:……
EARTH
2) >>>>>But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
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