Preexistence

[2besee]

Hi Mike,

Seeing that you like to do “word studies” from the Greek, then study this:

'There is one God. There is also one mediator between God and human beings—a human, the Messiah Jesus.'
or as some versions would have it:
'There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.'

Man/Human Being.

Strong's Concordance:

anthrópos: a man, human, mankind
Original Word: ἄνθρωπος, ου, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: anthrópos
Phonetic Spelling: (anth'-ro-pos)
Short Definition: a man, one of the human race
Definition: a man, one of the human race.

444 ánthrōpos – man, also the generic term for “mankind”; the human race; people, including women and men (Mt 4:19, 12:12, etc.).

444 (anthrōpos) relates to both genders (male and female) as both are created in the image of God – each equally vested with individual personhood and destiny (cf. Gal 3:28). Accordingly, the Bible uses 444 (ánthrōpos) of a specific man, woman, or class (type, group) of people – i.e. mankind in general (inclusive of every man, woman and child; see also 1 Cor 11:7). (435 /anḗr specifically refers to a male and 1135 /gynḗ to a female.)

[444 /ánthrōpos (“man”) answers to the Hebrew term, ̓adam – and 435 (anḗr) answers to the Hebrew term ̓ish.

K. Wuest, “There are two words in Greek which mean 'man,' anēr, which refers to a male individual of the human reace, and anthrōpos, which is the racial, generic term, and which has the general idea of 'mankind' ” (3, Great Truths to Live By, 46).]

Now we all should know that right.

Does the verse above not say clearly that Jesus was a Human Being?

And then what does it say.

1st Corinthians 15:

This, indeed, is what is written: “The first man, Adam, became a living being.” The last Adam (Man) became a life-giving spirit.'

[2besee]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,11:16)

You guys keep talking about Gnostics as if it is a cuss word, and claiming that it was they to whom John referred in 1 John 4:2-3. But it is obvious from what Gene said about the Gnostics that they DID believe Jesus “has come in the flesh”, right?  So how then could they be the antichrists John warned against? Please explain.

Mike, I cannot yet, I am learning about the Gnostics, though I am time limited.

As I learn more I will post my findings in the thread about it, okay.

Peace Mike.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 23 2013,14:48)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,01:41) Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 21 2013,18:36) Hebrews 2:14 King James Version (KJV) 14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; The scripture you posted compliments the OP scripture I started the thread with, Kerwin. The green “are partakers” in your scripture is the Greek word “koinoneo” – which refers to people sharing a common thing.  Ie:  Human beings all naturally share a flesh and blood nature. The maroon words “took part”, on the other hand, are the Greek word, “metecho” – which means “to BECOME a partaker”. There is a reason Paul used two different words – one that refers to a common thing that all people share, and another one that refers to someone who was not naturally a partaker in that thing, but BECAME a partaker. Think about how perfectly your scripture aligns with John's words, “has COME in the flesh”. Mike, You are claiming that the Greek “took part” has connotations that the Greek “partakers” does not and that these connotation do not translate from Ancient Greek to English. I have my doubts.

The second word means “to BECOME a partaker”, Kerwin.

How does one who already partakes in a certain thing BECOME a partaker in that thing? Please explain.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 23 2013,15:08)

So from the above we can see that: Jesus is the Lord. The Lord is the Spirit. The Spirit is the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is the one who knows the deep things of God. The Spirit is not some other God, but is God's own Spirit.

So then the teaching is that GOD knows the things of GOD?

How profound.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 23 2013,15:17)

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 23 2013,15:59) Quote None of you has yet to produce one. Is this true. Why is that? At least give an explanation as to why others are never mentioned as coming in the flesh. If you cannot, then at least look into your own heart and mind and ask why. T8, Did you look up “in the flesh”? You really do not need to as you already know each and every human being comes in the flesh when they come into this world.

If that is the case, Kerwin, it should be VERY EASY for you to find another instance where a normal human being was said to have “come in the flesh”, right?

So?  Where are those many instances?

Also, are you claiming John was simply telling us that Jesus was a human?  Was he saying, “Anyone who does not believe Jesus of Nazareth existed as a human being has the spirit of the antichrist”?  (Please answer this. And while you're at it, tell me WHO then, IS the antichrist. Who is it that refuses to believe Jesus of Nazareth existed as a human being?)

[mikeboll64]

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 23 2013,15:22)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,10:15) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 23 2013,10:22) Now you come up with this garbage we never Produced ONE. Don't get confused, Gene. I'm asking for a published statement from anywhere and any time in the history of the world, where someone has used the phrase, “has come in the flesh” to convey the thought that the person was just a normal human being like the rest of us. Can you show us one? That is so ridiculous Mike!! What is this supposed to prove? Gnostics believed that Jesus was a Spirit or a god rather than a man of flesh and blood, and that He came in appearance only, and not only whilst on the earth but also once risen. This is what John was meaning by “came in the flesh” Nothing at all to do with pre-existance etc.

That's not what Gene said the Gnostics believed.  He said they were people who believed Jesus existed as a god and then dwelled on earth AS a human being – not PRETENDING TO BE a human being when he really wasn't.

2B, why do you think you guys can't easily produce some writing where a normal human being was said to have “come in the flesh”?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 23 2013,16:33)

Hi Mike, Seeing that you like to do “word studies” from the Greek, then study this: 'There is one God. There is also one mediator between God and human beings—a human, the Messiah Jesus.' or as some versions would have it: 'There is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.' Does the verse above not say clearly that Jesus was a Human Being? And then what does it say. 1st Corinthians 15: This, indeed, is what is written: “The first man, Adam, became a living being.” The last Adam (Man) became a life-giving spirit.'

Let me post the rest of the sentence for you, 2B:

1 Timothy 2
5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself as a ransom for all men—

Was Jesus a human being WHEN he gave his life as a ransom? Of course he was. But is he STILL a flesh and blood human being? The second scripture you posted answers the question for us, right?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 23 2013,16:36)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,11:16) You guys keep talking about Gnostics as if it is a cuss word, and claiming that it was they to whom John referred in 1 John 4:2-3. But it is obvious from what Gene said about the Gnostics that they DID believe Jesus “has come in the flesh”, right?  So how then could they be the antichrists John warned against? Please explain. Mike, I cannot yet, I am learning about the Gnostics, though I am time limited. As I learn more I will post my findings in the thread about it, okay. Peace Mike.

Fair enough 2B. But if you cannot yet explain it, do you really think it wise to jump on Gene's Gnostic bandwagon?

[GeneBalthrop]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,07:06)

Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 22 2013,13:10) T, Quote Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. I have not looked at the Greek behind these words but this version does noes not support the claim that Jesus was the first created by Jehovah.  “over” gives the context The Greek words are “pasa ktisis” – in the genitive form.  It is correctly translated into English as “firstborn of all creation”, or “firstborn of every creature”. The Trinitarians change the “OF” to “OVER” because they don't want anyone to make the obvious connection that Jesus was the first being ever created. The non-preexisters follow suit with the Trinitarians on this verse, because they also don't want Jesus to have been the first being ever created. But the actual words:  “firstborn OF every creature” spell it out quite clearly – if you allow yourself to see it without blinders.

Mike………According to your own words , “BORN” did not include Adam as you say, But the Rest of Us , Because of the word “BORN”, So why does that change with Jesus seeing scriptures say he is First “BORN” of all Creation.

Now we have established the Fact, Jesus was indeed BORN and the only way he could have been BORN is through a Flesh experience of coming into existence through the womb of a women.

So with that understanding what was the First-“BORN”  of or “from” all creation be referring to, if not a Position that he received after his berth as a BORN human being and his resurrection from the dead, which would make him the First-BORN of or from all Creation. It does not say from first “created”from all creation as you falsely assume Mike.

Mike as all Preexistences do, you switch the word firstborn to mean first created, a completely different thing Mike.

peace and love to you and yours………………………gene

[2besee]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,11:57)

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 23 2013,15:08) So from the above we can see that: Jesus is the Lord. The Lord is the Spirit. The Spirit is the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is the one who knows the deep things of God. The Spirit is not some other God, but is God's own Spirit. So then the teaching is that GOD knows the things of GOD?   How profound.

Mike,

There is only one God, there are a lot of men.
The spirit of the one God knows the deep things of God just as the spirit in a man knows the deep things of the man. So, the spirit of the man is a PART OF that man, and likewise the spirit of God is a PART OF the one God. (1st Corinthians 2: 10-16)

Hope that clears that up.

[2besee]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,12:05)

2B, why do you think you guys can't easily produce some writing where a normal human being was said to have “come in the flesh”?

Mike, WHY?
As if there were other people who had been like Jesus?
Jesus was the second Adam, the only one who overcome, the only one who was the firstborn of/over all of creation as the resurrected from the dead in the flesh to eternal life and a new creation.
So why compare and search for one other example??
Of course we wouldn't find it.

I do not see what your point is Mike with this.

[GeneBalthrop]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,10:13)

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 23 2013,16:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,11:16) You guys keep talking about Gnostics as if it is a cuss word, and claiming that it was they to whom John referred in 1 John 4:2-3. But it is obvious from what Gene said about the Gnostics that they DID believe Jesus “has come in the flesh”, right?  So how then could they be the antichrists John warned against? Please explain. Mike, I cannot yet, I am learning about the Gnostics, though I am time limited. As I learn more I will post my findings in the thread about it, okay. Peace Mike. Fair enough 2B.  But if you cannot yet explain it, do you really think it wise to jump on Gene's Gnostic bandwagon?

Mike…….Its not “my” bandwagon , it is a historical fact, why not try to investagate it for yourself also, it might enlighten you brother. It is all well documented in early church history.

peace and love to you and yours……………..gene

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 24 2013,03:08)

Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 23 2013,14:28) Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 23 2013,13:26) Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 23 2013,06:46) K you do not see what you are saying ,and do not understand it neither , that what you say his false; Mt 28:18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. and you have the reason for him to send the comforter to his disciples wrong ; the comforter was send to them in replacement of him going away and so that they would not feel lost being alone ;this was the true reason T, Quote It is expedient for you that I go away. Jesus' death and ascension is important. Quote for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; If Jesus didn't die and ascend then no Comforter would have come. Quote but if I depart, I will send him unto you. Only when Jesus departs is he able to send the Comforter. After Jesus departed he told the Eleven that all authority in heaven and on earth was given to him. When Jesus is given the authority he gains the ability to send the Comforter. K do you not feel that you have to lie to explain your opinion you do not show scriptures because you know you twisting and lie,or are you testing me if you gamble on my ignorance of the scriptures I do hope you bring your view into the truth , Jn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Jn 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. Jn 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: Jn 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. and NO,it is not his dead that means his “going away “”read the last verse I quoted Jn 16;7 Jesus says specifically THAT HE WILL SEND INTO THEM ” CAN YOU READ THAT YES   AND HE DID NOT SEND IT BEFORE THE PENTECOST,WEN THEY ALL WERE INSIDE THE UPPER ROOM RIGHT YES T, There is no lie in what I wrote. I used two scriptures which are John 16:7 and Matthew 28:18. I paraphrased parts of John 16:7 in hopes of making their meaning clear. I am of the belief that his going away started with his self sacrifice and accumulates with his sitting on his throne that is in heaven. As you write, Jesus did not use his authority to send the Spirit until after he was siting on his throne in heaven.  Never the less he states he has the authority to do so after his resurrection but before his ascension.

K

Quote

I am of the belief that his going away started with his self sacrifice and accumulates with his sitting on his throne that is in heaven.

you have much to learn in scriptures ,and unless you stop carrying the load of your.opinions into scriptures I am afraid you will never come to the truth of God ,

it seems that you cannot absorb any knowledge and can not teach any truth in scriptures as well ,

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 24 2013,03:08)

Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 23 2013,14:28) Quote (kerwin @ Feb. 23 2013,13:26) Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 23 2013,06:46) K you do not see what you are saying ,and do not understand it neither , that what you say his false; Mt 28:18 Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. and you have the reason for him to send the comforter to his disciples wrong ; the comforter was send to them in replacement of him going away and so that they would not feel lost being alone ;this was the true reason T, Quote It is expedient for you that I go away. Jesus' death and ascension is important. Quote for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; If Jesus didn't die and ascend then no Comforter would have come. Quote but if I depart, I will send him unto you. Only when Jesus departs is he able to send the Comforter. After Jesus departed he told the Eleven that all authority in heaven and on earth was given to him. When Jesus is given the authority he gains the ability to send the Comforter. K do you not feel that you have to lie to explain your opinion you do not show scriptures because you know you twisting and lie,or are you testing me if you gamble on my ignorance of the scriptures I do hope you bring your view into the truth , Jn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Jn 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. Jn 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me: Jn 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. and NO,it is not his dead that means his “going away “”read the last verse I quoted Jn 16;7 Jesus says specifically THAT HE WILL SEND INTO THEM ” CAN YOU READ THAT YES   AND HE DID NOT SEND IT BEFORE THE PENTECOST,WEN THEY ALL WERE INSIDE THE UPPER ROOM RIGHT YES T, There is no lie in what I wrote. I used two scriptures which are John 16:7 and Matthew 28:18. I paraphrased parts of John 16:7 in hopes of making their meaning clear. I am of the belief that his going away started with his self sacrifice and accumulates with his sitting on his throne that is in heaven. As you write, Jesus did not use his authority to send the Spirit until after he was siting on his throne in heaven.  Never the less he states he has the authority to do so after his resurrection but before his ascension.

K

Quote

There is no lie in what I wrote.

so why could I show you scriptures that are saying the exact opposite of what you quoted as to be true to me ?

[2besee]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,12:13)

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 23 2013,16:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 24 2013,11:16) You guys keep talking about Gnostics as if it is a cuss word, and claiming that it was they to whom John referred in 1 John 4:2-3. But it is obvious from what Gene said about the Gnostics that they DID believe Jesus “has come in the flesh”, right?  So how then could they be the antichrists John warned against? Please explain. Mike, I cannot yet, I am learning about the Gnostics, though I am time limited. As I learn more I will post my findings in the thread about it, okay. Peace Mike. Fair enough 2B.  But if you cannot yet explain it, do you really think it wise to jump on Gene's Gnostic bandwagon?

Hi Mike,
I have looked into Gnostics in the past, I also read a book on Gnostics in the past so from my memory only, they believe something similar to what Gene is saying.

It is all to do with “hidden knowledge” and that the creator of the world was unknowable and bad, or something similar.

I also know Trinitarians who claim the same, in a way – and say that they pray to Jesus only, because He was more like us, or something similar. And that God is a “mystery” and cannot be known, or something similar!!

Sometimes I wonder if there is a connection?

[terraricca]

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 24 2013,03:06)

Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 24 2013,08:32) so be good to me ;and show me ONE SINGLE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS THAT CHRIST JESUS ” HIS “” THE HOLY SPIRIT OR SHOW ME ONE SINGLE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS “” THE SON OF GOD /MAN “”HIS THE HOLY SPIRIT “” IF YOU DO NOT HAVE ONE SINGLE CLUE TO BACK YOU UP ,YOU ARE IN ERROR AND SO YOUR BELIEVE WOULD BE WRONG , Hi T, You ask me to show you one single verse that proves what I beleive, otherwise you say it is wrong. Show me one single verse that shows us all straight out that Jesus Christ pre-existed as an Angel or as another god. ————— Here are a few verses for what I believe: 1st Corinthians 12 3For this reason I want you to be aware that no one who is speaking by God’s Spirit can say, “Jesus is cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit. 4Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit, 5and there are varieties of ministries, but the same Lord. 6There are varieties of results, but it is the same God who produces all the results in everyone. 7To each person has been given the ability to manifest the Spirit for the common good. 8To one has been given a message of wisdom by the Spirit; to another the ability to speak with knowledge according to the same Spirit; 9to another faith by the same Spirit; to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit; 10to another miraculous results; to another prophecy; to another the ability to distinguish between spirits; to another various kinds of languages; and to another the interpretation of languages. 11But one and the same Spirit produces all these results and gives what he wants to each person. 12For just as the body is one and yet has many parts, and all the parts of the body, though many, form a single body, so it is with the Messiah. 13For by one Spirit all of us—Jews and Greeks, slaves and free—were baptized into one body and were all privileged to drink from one Spirit. 2nd Corinthians 3 12Therefore, since we have such a hope, we speak very boldly, 13not like Moses, who kept covering his face with a veil to keep the people of Israel from gazing at the end of what was fading away. 14However, their minds were hardened, for to this day the same veil is still there when they read the old covenant. Only in union with the Messiah is that veil removed. 15Yet even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. 16But whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is removed. 17Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Lord’s Spirit is, there is freedom. 18As all of us reflect the glory of the Lord with unveiled faces, we are becoming more like him with ever-increasing glory by the Lord’s Spirit. 1st Corinthians 2 10But God has revealed those things to us by his Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the deep things of God. 11Is there anyone who can understand his own thoughts except his own inner spirit? In the same way, no one can know the thoughts of God except God’s Spirit. 12Now, we have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who comes from God, so that we can understand the things that were freely given to us by God. 13We don’t speak about these things with words taught us by human wisdom, but with words taught by the Spirit, as we explain spiritual things to spiritual people. 14A person who isn’t spiritual doesn’t accept the things of God’s Spirit, for they are nonsense to him. He can’t understand them because they are spiritually evaluated. 15The spiritual person evaluates everything but is subject to no one else’s evaluation. 16For “Who has known the mind of the Lord so that he can advise him?” However, we have the mind of the Messiah.

2bee

so let see if you really do understand scriptures ;;;

1Co 12:1 Now about spiritual gifts, brothers, I do not want you to be ignorant.
1Co 12:2 You know that when you were pagans, somehow or other you were influenced and led astray to mute idols.
1Co 12:3 Therefore I tell you that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.
1Co 12:4 There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1Co 12:5 There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord.
1Co 12:6 There are different kinds of working, but the same God works all of them in all men.
1Co 12:7 Now to each one the manifestation of the Spirit is given for the common good.
1Co 12:8 To one there is given through the Spirit the message of wisdom, to another the message of knowledge by means of the same Spirit,
1Co 12:9 to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healing by that one Spirit,
1Co 12:10 to another miraculous powers, to another prophecy, to another distinguishing between spirits, to another speaking in different kinds of tongues, and to still another the interpretation of tongues.
1Co 12:11 All these are the work of one and the same Spirit, and he gives them to each one, just as he determines.
1Co 12:12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ.
1Co 12:13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body—whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free—and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.

Jn 4:13 Jesus answered, “Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again,
Jn 4:14 but whoever drinks the water I give him will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give him will become in him a spring of water welling up to eternal life.”

2Co 3:7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, fading though it was,
2Co 3:8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious?
2Co 3:9 If the ministry that condemns men is glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness!
2Co 3:10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory.
2Co 3:11 And if what was fading away came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts!
2Co 3:12 Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold.
2Co 3:13 We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to keep the Israelites from gazing at it while the radiance was fading away.
2Co 3:14 But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away.
2Co 3:15 Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts.
2Co 3:16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.
2Co 3:17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.
2Co 3:18 And we, who with unveiled faces all reflect the Lord’s glory, are being transformed into his likeness with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit.

1Co 2:7 No, w
e speak of God’s secret wisdom, a wisdom that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began.
1Co 2:8 None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
1Co 2:9 However, as it is written:
“No eye has seen,
no ear has heard,
no mind has conceived
what God has prepared for those who love him”—
1Co 2:10 but God has revealed it to us by his Spirit.
The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God.
1Co 2:11 For who among men knows the thoughts of a man except the man’s spirit within him? In the same way no one knows the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God.
1Co 2:12 We have not received the spirit of the world but the Spirit who is from God, that we may understand what God has freely given us.
1Co 2:13 This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, expressing spiritual truths in spiritual words.
1Co 2:14 The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.
1Co 2:15 The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man’s judgment:
1Co 2:16 “For who has known the mind of the Lord
that he may instruct him?”
But we have the mind of Christ.

and it is on those scriptures that you base your believe yes ,you say ;I CAN TELL YOU NOW THAT YOU HAVE NOT GIVEN ME ONE SINGLE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS THAT CHRIST OR THE SON OF GOD HIS THE HOLY SPIRIT ,IT DOES NOT SAY THIS AT ALL ;YOU MUST SEE DREAMS LIKE SOMEONE ON DRUGS ,I START TO BELIEVE THAT YOU DO NOT EVEN UNDERSTAND THE BASICS OF THE SCRIPTURES ;SURE YOU PUTTING ON A SHOW BUT IT ALL HIS INFO FROM OTHERS ,THAT INFO YOU SPRAID IS NOT FROM YOUR HEART ,AND YOUR UNDERSTANDING IN GOD'S SCRIPTURES ,

SO I NOW CONFIRM THAT YOU HAVE NOT BE ABLE TO PROVIDE ANY SCRIPTURES FOR YOUR BELIEVE AND SO DECLARE IT FALSE AND AGAINST THE TRUTH OF GOD AND TEACHINGS OF THE APOSTLES ,

2BEE

THERE HIS A BIG DIFFERENCE OF KNOWING AND HAVING STUDY AND HAVE SUBMIT YOURSELF TO GOD IN TRUTH .

[2besee]

Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 24 2013,13:20)

K Quote I am of the belief that his going away started with his self sacrifice and accumulates with his sitting on his throne that is in heaven. you have much to learn in scriptures ,and unless you stop carrying the load of your.opinions into scriptures I am afraid you will never come to the truth of God  , it seems that you cannot absorb any knowledge and can not teach any truth in scriptures as well ,

T,
Why do you get so personal with people and judge them personally as if you have the power to do so?

What right do you have to disrespect somebody who believes in God – to tell them that they will never come to the truth whereas you have all of truth it seems?

You do this to almost everyone, T. You need to stop.

What point is there in what you say? It just seems as if you are a “troll” of a “flamer”.
Google it.

[2besee]

Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 24 2013,13:48)

and it is on those scriptures that you base your believe yes ,you say ;I CAN TELL YOU NOW THAT YOU HAVE NOT GIVEN ME ONE SINGLE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS THAT CHRIST OR THE SON OF GOD HIS THE HOLY SPIRIT ,IT DOES NOT SAY THIS AT ALL ;YOU MUST SEE DREAMS LIKE SOMEONE ON DRUGS ,I START TO BELIEVE THAT YOU DO NOT EVEN UNDERSTAND THE BASICS OF THE SCRIPTURES ;SURE YOU PUTTING ON A SHOW BUT IT ALL HIS INFO FROM OTHERS ,THAT INFO YOU SPRAID IS NOT FROM YOUR HEART ,AND YOUR UNDERSTANDING IN GOD'S SCRIPTURES , SO I NOW CONFIRM THAT YOU HAVE NOT BE ABLE TO PROVIDE ANY SCRIPTURES FOR YOUR BELIEVE AND SO DECLARE IT FALSE AND AGAINST THE TRUTH OF GOD AND TEACHINGS OF THE APOSTLES , 2BEE THERE HIS A BIG DIFFERENCE OF KNOWING AND HAVING STUDY AND HAVE SUBMIT YOURSELF TO GOD IN TRUTH .

T,

SHOW ME ONE SINGLE VERSE THAT PROVES THAT JESUS WAS AN ANGEL OR A gOD – ONE VERSE T, OTHERWISE EAT YOUR OWN WORDS. AND DID YOU NOT KNOW THAT IT IS CONSIDERED RUDE TO SHOUT IN CAPITALS AND IN BOLD ON INTERNET FORUMS?

I cannot believe I am getting down to your level.
See how rude that was?

[terraricca]

Quote (2besee @ Feb. 24 2013,07:00)

Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 24 2013,13:48) and it is on those scriptures that you base your believe yes ,you say ;I CAN TELL YOU NOW THAT YOU HAVE NOT GIVEN ME ONE SINGLE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS THAT CHRIST OR THE SON OF GOD HIS THE HOLY SPIRIT ,IT DOES NOT SAY THIS AT ALL ;YOU MUST SEE DREAMS LIKE SOMEONE ON DRUGS ,I START TO BELIEVE THAT YOU DO NOT EVEN UNDERSTAND THE BASICS OF THE SCRIPTURES ;SURE YOU PUTTING ON A SHOW BUT IT ALL HIS INFO FROM OTHERS ,THAT INFO YOU SPRAID IS NOT FROM YOUR HEART ,AND YOUR UNDERSTANDING IN GOD'S SCRIPTURES , SO I NOW CONFIRM THAT YOU HAVE NOT BE ABLE TO PROVIDE ANY SCRIPTURES FOR YOUR BELIEVE AND SO DECLARE IT FALSE AND AGAINST THE TRUTH OF GOD AND TEACHINGS OF THE APOSTLES , 2BEE THERE HIS A BIG DIFFERENCE OF KNOWING AND HAVING STUDY AND HAVE SUBMIT YOURSELF TO GOD IN TRUTH . T, SHOW ME ONE SINGLE VERSE THAT PROVES THAT JESUS WAS AN ANGEL OR A gOD – ONE VERSE T, OTHERWISE EAT YOUR OWN WORDS. AND DID YOU NOT KNOW THAT IT IS CONSIDERED RUDE TO SHOUT IN CAPITALS AND IN BOLD ON INTERNET FORUMS? I cannot believe I am getting down to your level. See how rude that was?

2BEE

Quote

SHOW ME ONE SINGLE VERSE THAT PROVES THAT JESUS WAS AN ANGEL OR A gOD –

    just because you can not show me any scriptures that backs up your believe ,

Mike as shown you scriptures about Christ being called god and right from the start tell me in youR view what would be the tittle of THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD

SO YOU ADMIT THAT THEIR ARE NO SCRIPTURES THAT TELLS THAT CHRIST HIS THE HOLY SPIRIT YOU SAY YES RIGHT

Quote

I cannot believe I am getting down to your level. See how rude that was?

TELL ME DID I EVER TOLD YOU OR GIVE YOU FALSE INFORMATION ? DID I IN MY ANSWERS TO YOU DID I NOT TOLD YOU THE TRUTH AS PER THE SCRIPTURES IF I DID ,DO YOU THINK I AM IN TITTLE TO THE SAME RESPECT THAT I GIVE YOU  

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Feb. 23 2013,17:34)

Mike………According to your own words , “BORN” did not include Adam as you say, But the Rest of Us , Because of the word “BORN”, So why does that change with Jesus seeing scriptures say he is First “BORN” of all Creation.

Gene,

As usual, I don't even have a clue what you're saying.

At the beginning of God's creation, there had to be a living being that God created FIRST, right? Who do you think was the first being God ever created?

[Author]

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