John 8:25

[NickHassan]

Hi mB,
Look beyond the flesh.
Carnal men see only flesh.

[Marlin1]

Brother Mike,

I have read through this link of yours and have found most of it very disturbing.
Here is Why,  because most came against Kathi the trinity person.  This is what Jesus said,

MATTHEW 7:5 † Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

I agree the the trinity doctrine is wrong, but so is your two Gods that you don't like me saying.

COL 1:16 † For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

So if Jesus is not God then you have two gods.

God Bless
bro. Marlin

[Marlin1]

Brother Mike,

your quotes,

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But the son of David who had a three year ministry on earth IS the Son of God who existed alongside God with glory of his own before the earth was even created.  It is that ONE person who said “I live because of the Father”.

The Son of God was the LOGOS, not another god.  It was God manifested, the Word of God, the Son of God.  The same Spirit all the time.

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I agree with your statement because it is scripturally true.  (Although I would say “born THROUGH”, or “born BY MEANS OF” the Holy Spirit instead of “born OF” the Holy Spirit – because Jesus is not the Son of the Holy Spirit, but of God.  So even according to the flesh, Jesus was born OF GOD, “BY MEANS OF” God's Holy Spirit.

You are completely confused here,  GOD and the Holy Spirit are the same SPIRIT.
If you think they are different, then you have just made yourself three gods.

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It is known that he is the Word OF God, which therefore INSISTS that he can't BE God.

The simple answer is above.

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The son OF Mike is not Mike.

This is true Mike, but I would sugest that this is different.  
Here is how,  Jesus said if you seen Me you have seen the Father.  
If I see the son of Mike, I haven't seen Mike have I.  
So this is different.

God Bless
bro. Marlin

[Marlin1]

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Kathi said, “If you can't believe that Jesus is the only begotten God,”

Hi Kathi, You believe in the trinity, yet here you make one of your Gods to have a beginning.
Gods don't have beginning or endings.

You see, it wasn't three persons, or three gods,  It was God in three offices.
The Father (God over US), The Sonship (God with US), The Holy Ghost (God in US)

The same God all the time.

God Bless
bro. Marlin

[terraricca]

M1

Do you really know what is a god

[Marlin1]

Quote

M1 Do you really know what is a god ————– Pierre

Brother Pierre,

I doubt very much if my definition matches yours.
What is yours?

bro. Marlin

[terraricca]

Quote (Marlin1 @ Dec. 04 2012,05:28)

Quote M1 Do you really know what is a god ————– Pierre Brother Pierre, I doubt very much if my definition matches yours. What is yours? bro. Marlin

m1

i am 72 years old and not a dummy ,so answer my question kid

[Richtuner]

mikeboll64 ,

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Using ONLY the words of Jesus himself, as DIRECTLY quoted by John up until chapter 8, verse 24, can you show us where JESUS HIMSELF ever claimed to be God, or equal to Him?

Forgive me if I missed something in the posts, but I must say that you can not just take on a scripture or set of them in one place and know enough about it and build a foundation or upon the foundation of a thing.

Jesus did not say every thing that has to be said about His relationship with God. God put a lot of scriptures in the bible to find and put together to have an understanding.

Just look at this, Php 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, though, it not robbery to be EQUAL with God:

[Marlin1]

Brother Pierre,

Congratulations on being 72, I try to make it a point not to answer any SMART REMARKS.

God Bless
bro. Marlin

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Richtuner @ Dec. 03 2012,18:01)

…………you can not just take on a scripture or set of them in one place and know enough about it and build a foundation or upon the foundation of a thing.

Hi Rich,

I agree.  The point of the thread was that Jesus' answer in verse 25 was, Just who I've been saying all along.

The question is:  Well, just what HAD Jesus been saying about himself all along?

That's why I limited it to things JESUS HIMSELF said up until the point he said, Just who I've been saying all along.

Using that criteria, were you able to find a scripture in the first 8 chapters of John where JESUS HIMSELF said he was God Almighty, or equal to God Almighty?

[mikeboll64]

Hi Marlin,

I will get back to you, hopefully the day after tomorrow. (I've been very busy with work and my 11 year old son.)

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Marlin1 @ Dec. 01 2012,22:47)

Brother Mike, I have read through this link of yours and have found most of it very disturbing. Here is Why,  because most came against Kathi the trinity person.

Yeah, that's how we roll on Heaven Net, Marlin.  If someone comes in talking unscriptural smack, we take the gloves off and let them have it.  

In all the words you posted on this thread, I haven't yet seen that ONE scripture where JESUS HIMSELF claims to either be God, or be equal to God.

Can you point that scripture out to me?  Rich?  How about you?  Where is the scripture in which Jesus, IN HIS OWN WORDS, claims to either be God, or be equal to his God?

(That is, after all, what this thread is for.)

[mikeboll64]

Also guys, could you point out any of the claims I listed on the first post of this thread that are wrong?

If not, perhaps you both should take a good, long look at that list and recongnize who Jesus actually claimed to be. (Note that all of the things he claimed positioned him as someone OTHER THAN God. Can you deny this?)

[terraricca]

I have always wander why do people not understand scriptures if they can read it ,

but as I was reading the story about Judas Iscariot , I start to think about him ;first he spend 3.5 years with the best of the best teacher that can be ,he knew the scriptures for being a Jew, and yet he took money out of the purse for them all ,and that for his personal use to be using the proper words stealing,

what type of man was he well for sure he was a liar ,a cheat, and add his own agenda ;

tell me if a person does not follow the scriptures what stop him to be like Judas Iscariot .He as well did not like the truth ,only his way not God's way ,

they also can become what he did betray the truth and those who love the truth.

[mikeboll64]

Agreed, Pierre. We must let God and the scriptures guide US. We don't have the authority to decide for ourselves what the scriptures SHOULD teach.

If scripture says Jesus had glory alongside his God before the world began, then we must believe that.

If scripture says Jesus is the Son of God, then we must not FORCE that into the asinine and laughable doctrine that the Son OF God can BE the very God he is the Son OF.

If scripture says God sent His Son, then we can't decide for ourselves that we like it better if God sent HIMSELF into the world.

And so on, and so on……………….

[GeneBalthrop]

Mike…………If you believe the Father was in Jesus then the Father who is God was in the World. Jesus turned his will over to God and did only Fathers Will , that is why he said “if you have seen me you have seen the Father”. Thomas was not lying when he said my Lord and ” my GOD. Mike 2besee explained exactly right to you God who is Sprit was indeed “IN” Jesus. But that did not make Jesus who the Father GOD was in a GOD, no More then if GOD were in you that would make you a God or god either. Jesus has all seven Sprit of the living God “IN” him as shown in Revelations, IMO

peace and love to you and yours………………………………………………………….gene

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 09 2012,10:02)

If you believe the Father was in Jesus then the Father who is God was in the World.

So Gene,

What happened when Jesus prayed to God in heaven? Did the Father cease to be in Jesus during those prayers? Did He desert Jesus, and fly back to heaven to receive Jesus' prayers?

Walk me through it.

[mikeboll64]

Marlin? Rich?

I'm still waiting for that one scripture where Jesus, in his own words, claimed either to be God, or to be equal to God.

[terraricca]

m1 and rich

are you looking for this scripture;JN 4:24 “God is spirit, and those who worship Him “MUST” worship in spirit and truth.”

THIS IS NOT A REQUEST ,IT IS AN ORDER,

[Lightenup]

Quote (Marlin1 @ Dec. 02 2012,00:06)

Quote Kathi said, “If you can't believe that Jesus is the only begotten God,”   Hi Kathi, You believe in the trinity, yet here you make one of your Gods to have a beginning. Gods don't have beginning or endings. You see, it wasn't three persons, or three gods,  It was God in three offices. The Father (God over US), The Sonship (God with US), The Holy Ghost (God in US) The same God all the time. God Bless bro. Marlin

Hi Marlin,
you said:

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You believe in the trinity

Where did you get that understanding?

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yet here you make one of your Gods to have a beginning. Gods don't have beginning or endings.

The fact that the Son was begotten before the ages does not indicate a beginning of existence. He that was begotten/brought forth was eternally within God the Father before being brought forth. The Heavenly Father has always been a Father and He always had a Son. The Son was not yet begotten/brought forth till day one, as I understand it.

I realize that your view is shared by others but it was not the early church view. I began a thread called 'eternal Sonship' that is about a document regarding the matter. You might find it interesting:
https://heavennet.net/cgi-bin….18;st=0

The oneness of God is hotly debated on here. I believe that YHWH is the name of the 'eternal God unity' of Father and Son together with their Holy Spirit. YHWH is also the name of each member of this unity from what I can tell.

Also, good insight about the hypocritical spirit on here.

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