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Nick………A word can come to be in a flesh and blood person, but a word CAN NOT (BE) A FLESH AND BLOOD PERSON, Jesus said the words He spoke (ARE SPIRIT), they were not Flesh. This is why we can never progress Here you can't even see the simplest of things, Quite frustrating Brother.
love and peace to you and yours…………………………..gene
G,
Do you have a concordance for your own bible?
You need one because the words you add are not in ours.G,
Jn6
63It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.The words the LIVING WORD spoke were and are spirit and life.
Quote Thinker……..Then we can't overcome (EVEN) as He did, right. Because He really wasn't like Us right? Well that's not logically sound.
Quote It would be a lie to say He was exactly like us in (EVERY WAY) if He preexisted. IMO Are you speaking of Heb 2:17: Consequently he was obliged to become like his “brothers” in all respects, that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, in order to offer propitiatory sacrifice for the sins of the people.
Or perhaps 4:15:
For we have as high priest, not one who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but one who has been tested in all respects like ourselves, BUT WITHOUT SIN.Why don't you just quote some scriptures every now and then Gene? Gene, you said:
Then we can't overcome (EVEN) as He did, right. Because He really wasn't like Us right?
But the Bible says of that Jesus has been tested in all respects like ourselves, BUT WITHOUT SIN.I think Heb 2:17 was referring to this:
PHILIPPIANS 2:7
“No, but he emptied himself and took a slave’s form and came to be in the likeness of men.”Gene, you mention: speculation based on and assumption
I am thinking if both you and those you speak with use the Bible and quote from it, there would have to be less speculation and less assumption on both sides. Why not try that?Hi brother Gene,
Thanks for such pain you have taken to explain to brother Nick that Jesus never preexisted as some alleged being next to God the Father and created everything alone in this universe. But I doubt whether he ever can agree with you or me because he and others are led by this myth called 'preexistence'. Let us discuss this on our regular thread “preexistence” and let us come back to Jn 1:1. Yes you are right in saying that there was no name “Jesus” substitued for the “word” in Jn 1:1. If so John could have told us at least in his epistles. Instead of that he says the “word” as impersonal “word of life” which later manifested in flesh(man) called Jesus whom he could see, hear and touch with his hands.Again I stress here for the Jewish eyes no God/demi-god can exist besides one God. If so Jn 1:1 can only be taken as Only One God whose impersonal “word”, spoken word or expression or even a plan for His creation was with Him in the beginning which later fulfilled in the man Jesus. Other than this it will make Jn 1:1 a polytheist statement even if our Preexistence or Trinitarian brothers are offended by this.
Love and peace
AdamAdam…..As i have said before John know how to say Jesus and if that was His meaning in John 1:1, he simply would have said it. And this word which was GOD and is GOD, came to be in Jesus a flesh and blood man. Who said the words He spoke were Spirit and life and He also said the Words were (NOT) His words. How clear, How Plain, How Simple, NO confusion just simple truth. The Father has given you the privilege of understanding these truths brother, sell it not, and continue to rely on Him to reveal His truths to you and yours.
Love and peace to you and yours Adam………………………….gene
Nick………. yes i do Nick and it doesn't conflict with any of the meanings i have posted .Without intelligence your God would not have any love or anything else for that matter, You cant separate one from the other as you and some try to. Love is and emotion brought about by ones INTELLECT or KNOWLEDGE . For GOD pitteth us as a father pitteith his children. Pitty is a realization brought on by ones Knowledge or intellect and it caused Him to Pitty . You can't separate on from the other they are ties together. Even sorrow is a process of the intellectual understanding. IMO
love and peace to you and yours………………………………..gene
Quote (Gene @ April 07 2009,04:35) Nick………. yes i do Nick and it doesn't conflict with any of the meanings i have posted .Without intelligence your God would not have any love or anything else for that matter, You cant separate one from the other as you and some try to. Love is and emotion brought about by ones INTELLECT or KNOWLEDGE . For GOD pitteth us as a father pitteith his children. Pitty is a realization brought on by ones Knowledge or intellect and it caused Him to Pitty . You can't separate on from the other they are ties together. Even sorrow is a process of the intellectual understanding. IMO love and peace to you and yours………………………………..gene
Gene,
Yet you try to seperate the qualities of intellect and love from personhood. For you it is an impersonal Elohim that thinks and loves.thinker
Quote (gollamudi @ April 06 2009,19:32) Hi brother Gene,
Thanks for such pain you have taken to explain to brother Nick that Jesus never preexisted as some alleged being next to God the Father and created everything alone in this universe. But I doubt whether he ever can agree with you or me because he and others are led by this myth called 'preexistence'. Let us discuss this on our regular thread “preexistence” and let us come back to Jn 1:1. Yes you are right in saying that there was no name “Jesus” substitued for the “word” in Jn 1:1. If so John could have told us at least in his epistles. Instead of that he says the “word” as impersonal “word of life” which later manifested in flesh(man) called Jesus whom he could see, hear and touch with his hands.Again I stress here for the Jewish eyes no God/demi-god can exist besides one God. If so Jn 1:1 can only be taken as Only One God whose impersonal “word”, spoken word or expression or even a plan for His creation was with Him in the beginning which later fulfilled in the man Jesus. Other than this it will make Jn 1:1 a polytheist statement even if our Preexistence or Trinitarian brothers are offended by this.
Love and peace
Adam
Not so much as one word from gollamudi above makes sense. Not so much as one! Jesus said:Quote Father, glorify Me with the glory I had with You before the world was (John 17;5) Hmmmm. What does the expression “before the world was” mean? And what is the “glory” that Jesus possessed with the Father before the world was?
thinker
Quote (Gene @ April 07 2009,04:35) Nick………. yes i do Nick and it doesn't conflict with any of the meanings i have posted .Without intelligence your God would not have any love or anything else for that matter, You cant separate one from the other as you and some try to. Love is and emotion brought about by ones INTELLECT or KNOWLEDGE . For GOD pitteth us as a father pitteith his children. Pitty is a realization brought on by ones Knowledge or intellect and it caused Him to Pitty . You can't separate on from the other they are ties together. Even sorrow is a process of the intellectual understanding. IMO love and peace to you and yours………………………………..gene
G,
You elevate intelligence but do you have any understanding of love?Nick……….explain what your understanding of LOVE without INTELLECT or Knowledge is then, Just more meaningless hog-wash Nick.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………gene
Quote (thethinker @ April 07 2009,04:39) Quote (Gene @ April 07 2009,04:35) Nick………. yes i do Nick and it doesn't conflict with any of the meanings i have posted .Without intelligence your God would not have any love or anything else for that matter, You cant separate one from the other as you and some try to. Love is and emotion brought about by ones INTELLECT or KNOWLEDGE . For GOD pitteth us as a father pitteith his children. Pitty is a realization brought on by ones Knowledge or intellect and it caused Him to Pitty . You can't separate on from the other they are ties together. Even sorrow is a process of the intellectual understanding. IMO love and peace to you and yours………………………………..gene
Gene,
Yet you try to seperate the qualities of intellect and love from personhood. For you it is an impersonal Elohim that thinks and loves.thinker
thinker ….So show me where i separate GOD'S Intellect and knowledge from Me or anyone else. In fact it is GODLY intellect and love that comes into us together. IMOlove and peace to you and yours……………………………..gene
HG,
So spirit is not just intellect now but love as well?
Why not just offer sacred scripture?
Men's thoughts are uselessthinker……….The glory Jesus had with the Father was that He was in the Plan of GOD before he ever came into existence. It was that Glory Jesus was referencing. It is simple thinker you just have to shake off your preconceptions brought on the the false teaching of the Trinity and Preexistences. Try it and Scriptures will start to fall in place. IMO
love and peace to you and yours……………………………….gene
thinker……….The glory Jesus had with the Father was that He was in the Plan of GOD before the world ever came into existence. It was that Glory Jesus was referencing. It is simple thinker, you just have to shake off your preconceptions brought on the the false teaching of the Trinity and Preexistences. Try it and Scriptures will start to fall in place. IMO
love and peace to you and yours……………………………….gene
Nick………Spirit is Just intellect and If you have the Spirit (intellect of truth) that intellect will produce love in your mind and heart. IMO
peace and love to you and yours………………………………….gene
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