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Quote (abe @ Dec. 28 2011,12:38) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 27 2011,03:50) Quote (abe @ Dec. 26 2011,17:56) Hi Gene, Jn. 8:58 Jesus said to them, ” Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I Am.”
toby……….> Look up the word fro before used there it means in position of importance, and has nothing to do with time of Existence as a Sentinel “BEING” of any kind.peace and love to you and yours…………………………………gene
Hi Gene, Jn. 8:12 Then Jesus spoke to them again, saying, ” I am the light of the world. He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life.” Gen. 1:3 And God said, ” Let there be light: and there was light.
Abe………that was the LOGOS that was (IN) Jesus (IT) was the light of the world, Musch of the time God himself was directly speaking through Jesus. He is and example ,”Destroy “this temple” and in three day (I) (GOD Speaking Directly through Jesus' Mouth) “WILL raise (IT) up. and again Jerusalem O Jerusalem, you who kill the Prophets and Stone them sent unto You, how often would I (GOD) would have gathered you as a Hen gathers her Chicks, but you would NOT, therefore you house is left unto you desolate and you shall no more hear from me until you say blessed is he that comes in the name of the LORD.”Abe God was (IN) Jesus and that was the Light in the World not Jesus the Man, Jesus was the one GOD the LOGOS was Speaking Through.
peace and love……………………………gene
And when Jesus prayed to God, Gene? Was it the “word/light/God Himself” inside of Jesus praying to Himself?
Or do you just get to pick and choose which times it was God speaking directly, and which times it was Jesus speaking?
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 29 2011,02:36) Quote (abe @ Dec. 28 2011,12:38) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 27 2011,03:50) Quote (abe @ Dec. 26 2011,17:56) Hi Gene, Jn. 8:58 Jesus said to them, ” Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I Am.”
toby……….> Look up the word fro before used there it means in position of importance, and has nothing to do with time of Existence as a Sentinel “BEING” of any kind.peace and love to you and yours…………………………………gene
Hi Gene, Jn. 8:12 Then Jesus spoke to them again, saying, ” I am the light of the world. He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life.” Gen. 1:3 And God said, ” Let there be light: and there was light.
Abe………that was the LOGOS that was (IN) Jesus (IT) was the light of the world, Musch of the time God himself was directly speaking through Jesus. He is and example ,”Destroy “this temple” and in three day (I) (GOD Speaking Directly through Jesus' Mouth) “WILL raise (IT) up. and again Jerusalem O Jerusalem, you who kill the Prophets and Stone them sent unto You, how often would I (GOD) would have gathered you as a Hen gathers her Chicks, but you would NOT, therefore you house is left unto you desolate and you shall no more hear from me until you say blessed is he that comes in the name of the LORD.”Abe God was (IN) Jesus and that was the Light in the World not Jesus the Man, Jesus was the one GOD the LOGOS was Speaking Through.
peace and love……………………………gene
Hi Gene, Gen. 1:3 says that God created the light of the world. Thank you for your time.Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 29 2011,12:12) And when Jesus prayed to God, Gene? Was it the “word/light/God Himself” inside of Jesus praying to Himself? Or do you just get to pick and choose which times it was God speaking directly, and which times it was Jesus speaking?
Mike………..YOUR THE ONE PICKING AND CHOOSING, So was GOD the FATHER “REALLY IN JESUS” as He said HE. a simple Yes or No will suffice and Was it God who was (IN) Him doing the WORKS as He said it WAS, a simple YES or NO will suffice.And if your answer is YES then “HOW” was GOD (IN) Jesus, was it a SPIRIT BODY in him, or a SPIRIT(intellect) that was (IN) HIM> O thats right you believe the word “SPIRIT” has all kind of Meanings Right MIKE? so it could be anything right?
peace and love……………………………………………..gene
My answer is “NO”, Gene.
The Being of God Almighty was not physically within the flesh body of Jesus at any time.
The phrases “the Father is in me” and “God is with us” are metaphorical.
God's dwelling place is in heaven, as is made clear many times in scripture. That is where He spoke from when Jesus was baptized. And that is where he was any time Jesus looked toward heaven and prayed to Him.
Gene, listen to this beautiful song:
Tell me if Peter Frampton was LITERALLY dwelling inside his girlfriend and vice-versa.
Mike…………Peter Frampton was not Spirit either is He. So comparing apples with oranges does not work Mike. Bottom line is you do not believe Jesus when He said the The Father was (IN) Him, and you just admitted it. Jesus said it many many time in fact, But you seem to make your religion up as you go and push only what you want to, no matter what Jesus Himself SAID Or scripture says or doesn't say. Maybe the will help you, Thomas said to Jesus [/B]my Lord “AND” My GOD Seem Thomas came to see GOD'S Presence (IN) Jesus. When are you going to start to believe what Jesus said was in fact true, GOD was truly (IN) Jesus and was PRESENT with him also. Jesus plainly said He was Not alone becasue the FATHER was WITH HIM> This was not some other person thinking about someone like you song is about. No it was a real Presence of GOD the FATHER who is Spirit and HE was (IN) Jesus and considered His BODY a TEMPLE He INDWELLS and he also indwells all those who have his Spirit (IN) them ALSO, and that is a presence of GOD himslef abiding (IN) those who have his spirit (IN) them.
peace and love……………………………………………………….gene
gene
I thought that God add given us a spirit that goes back to him after we dies ,SO THAT IS NOT TRUE
?EVERY TRUE CHRISTIAN WILL TREAT HIS BODY AS BEING A TEMPLE WERE GOD CAN BE PRESENT IN A HOLY WAY ,BY BEING TRUTHFUL TO HIS WORD,AND ACTING ACCORDING TO GODS WORD,
Pierre
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 30 2011,18:02) Bottom line is you do not believe Jesus when He said the The Father was (IN) Him, and you just admitted it.
Hi Gene,I've always “admitted it”. It's just that “the Father is in me” doesn't really mean what you think it does. If the Being of the Almighty God Most High ever tried to be LITERALLY “inside” of a human body, that body would most likely exploded like an atom bomb times 1,000,000.
God dwells in heaven, Gene. He always has dwelt in heaven, never on earth, and never INSIDE a flesh body.
Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 29 2011,22:27) Hey Mike, Nice song.
Yeah Ed.
This is my favorite from him. Ironically, it is the song that did his career in. He was loved as a “rocker”, and his rock fans didn't appreciate this sappy love song. The release and subsequent popularity of this song was the beginning of the end of his rock career.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 31 2011,14:24) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 30 2011,18:02) Bottom line is you do not believe Jesus when He said the The Father was (IN) Him, and you just admitted it.
Hi Gene,I've always “admitted it”. It's just that “the Father is in me” doesn't really mean what you think it does. If the Being of the Almighty God Most High ever tried to be LITERALLY “inside” of a human body, that body would most likely exploded like an atom bomb times 1,000,000.
God dwells in heaven, Gene. He always has dwelt in heaven, never on earth, and never INSIDE a flesh body.
Mike ……….Do you want me to post all the scriptures where is says He (IS) in a Person and He is Nye unto us and even (IN) our Mouths, If you understood that GOD the FATHER who is SPIRIT INDWELT Jesus you could see GOD”S PRESENCE, If Not, as HE Said Just Believe the Miracles and then you can Believe GOD was truly (IN) HIM. You preexistence are even worse then your counter parts the Trinitarians becasue they at Lest understand GOD'S presence (IN) Jesus, only problem is they think that Jesus was the GOD that was (IN) HIM. But you on the other hand do not even believe GOD was truly there.
What do you do with where Jesus said to the disciples that not to take thought of what they would say when they are on trial becasue it would be given them what to say at the time , and that it would not be them but the Father speaking through them.
Problem is Mike you have no idea what Spirit really is, or you could easily understand this. God is everywhere there is Life He himself sustains that life . I could give you tons of Proof from scripture that proves this. if you need it.
peace and love……………………………………………gene
Gene,
Our main difference on this issue is that when you read the following………..
Exodus 3:12
And God said, “I will be with you. And this will be the sign to you that it is I who have sent you: When you have brought the people out of Egypt, you will worship God on this mountain.”………….you imagine that the Being of God Almighty was PHYSICALLY and LITERALLY right there beside Moses. I know better than that. I know that “I will be with you” is metaphoric, meaning that Jehovah would be SUPPORTING and HELPING Moses all the way – not that God Almighty left His dwelling place in heaven and came to earth.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 31 2011,07:16) He (IS) in a Person and He is Nye unto us and even (IN) our Mouths,
See Gene? You even think it is possible for our God, who dwells in UNAPROACHABLE LIGHT, to physically been inside your mouth. That is NOT what is meant by the scripture, though.Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Dec. 31 2011,07:16) Problem is Mike you have no idea what Spirit really is, or you could easily understand this.
Gene, if you would stop being stubborn and trying so hard to be “right” about everything, you would be able to learn what spirit really is. Keep paying attention to the Bodies thread, Gene. Perhaps you'll learn something from my discussion with Toby.Mike…………Again you misrepresent what i am saying where did is say God was PHYSICALLY IN a Persons Mouth , No GOD is in the MIND of the Person and caused Him to speak His words, BY revealing thing to him. WHY Because GOD is a SPIRIT (INTELLECT) NOT a Metaphysical anything. Your the one thinking GOD is Physical Not me, you envision him in a physical sense not I.
Here is something that might help you, even though over the years i have quoted this many times, I will do it for you if i haven't already.
Mat 16:16……> And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed are you Simon Bar-jona becasue flesh and Blood has not revealed it unto you, but my Father which is in Heaven: 18..> And i say (ALSO) unto you, that you are Peter, and upon “THIS ROCK” I shall build my church: and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
now lets look at that Mike, Notice Jesus said several things there , One that (Flesh and Blood) did “NOT REVEAL” it to Peter , Jesus was flesh and Blood, so it could not have been Him either that revealed it to Peter right?. There was a HIGHER SOURCE of PETER'S KNOWLEDGE then the MAN JESUS.
Now notice also Jesus said this ,”ALSO” (in like manor) “I say unto you, “YOU ARE PETER”. This “ALSO” meant Jesus had the SAME REVEALED KNOWLEDGE from GOD “ALSO” about WHO PETER WAS.
But wait there is more, Jesus went on to say
upon “THIS ROCK” (the power of God to get in the Mind of a person and reveal truth) ” i will build the church” So you see GOD the FATHER HIMSELF is active in all He is calling and using by a Direct presence of his spirit, Just as he was in JESUS and IN PETER.
Now tell me Mike is GOD Present in the Mind of a Person or NOT? God is both inside and outside His creation He is a Spirit MIKE> And that is NOT a PHYSICAL Being at all.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………………………….gene
Mike………..Notice Jesus said God is (A) Spirit, the “A” there means a type OF SPIRIT. Spirit's impute cognate (INTELLECT) abilities into our minds they can come and go they are not Bodies of any kind. They are what is (IN) Bodies of all kinds. They animate all Bodies including ours. IMO
peace and love………………………………………………gene
Mike………..Notice Jesus said God is (A) Spirit, the “A” there means a type OF SPIRIT. Spirit's impute cognate (INTELLECT) abilities into our minds they are aspects of our minds, they can be removed come and go they are not Bodies of any kind. They are what is (IN) Bodies of all kinds. They “Types” of cognate thought in LIFE and animate all Bodies including ours. Spirits it self is powerless it must be (IN) a POWER SOURCE to effect any thing. A clean or unclean Spirit can do nothing of it self it can only deal with you mind and you as “the power source” can carry out it's effect on you.
Remember when Jesus said howbeit when the comforter comes it will not speck of it own , but what it hears that is what it shall speak That “TYPE” of Spirit simply relays God perception of Truth to us . Also Remember where Jesus said this KIND or Type of Spirit only comes out only with prayer and fasting?. Spirits can be removed and replaced and added to us all. they are types pf intellects not “BEINGS” we are Being what have Spirits (IN) Us. IMO
Peace and love…………………………………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 01 2012,10:11) Mike…………Again you misrepresent what i am saying where did is say God was PHYSICALLY IN a Persons Mouth
That is correct, Gene. God is not physically in anyone's mouth, body, or physically with any human being.So when Jesus said it was God in him doing the works, he was metaphorically that God was doing the works THROUGH Jesus. He was NOT implying that the BEING of God Almighty was physically INSIDE of the flesh body of Jesus.
Are we in agreement yet?
Mike………….Your in error Mike because you refuse to see GOD was “TRULY IN JESUS” as a SPIRIT or LOGOS that was revealing to Jesus everything GOD wanted Done and Jesus was Fellowing that “PRESENT” SPIRIT Which was (IN) HIM. and WITH HIM. There was no Metaphoric thing going on , it was really GOD who (IS) Spirit that was (IN) Jesus doing HIS WORK (IN) and (THROUGH) HIM> Thomas did not Say “MY LORD AND MY GOD, in a Metaphoric sense now did he?
Mike if you could only come to see God can and does “LIVE” In and Through His creation, you need to try to see God not in a Physical sense but in a Spiritual sense. Spirit and Physical and not the same and not even close in existence, a Spirit is What (INDWELLS) “LIVING” Physical things. They (SPIRITS) are what LIFE (IS) giving LIFE (IN) PHYSICAL THINGS , Like Bodies. It really is simple to me to understand and nothing complicated about it Mike.
What are we told to ask for when we pray Mike, did Jesus not say ” and how much more will The Father give the “SPIRIT” to them “THAT ASK” , did he not say ask and it shall be given unto you , seek, and you shall find , knock and it shall be opened unto you. Don't you know you (ARE: the TEMPLE of the LIVING GOD.
If the “SPIRIT” of Him that was (IN) Christ Jesus our Lord “DWELL” in you (IT) Shall (ALSO) quicken Your MORTAL Body ,
Just that simple MIKE> “know you not your body (IS) the temple of the “LIVING GOD”. This is not a metaphor Mike, it is a true and Literal statement. It plainly says “For the Spirit (of GOD) bares “Witness” with (OUR) Spirit that we (ARE) the sons of the living GOD.” It is not our intellect that bares witness with us but GOD'S INTELLECT that gives us that witness, and we have no need of a teacher becasue the SPIRIT (OF GOD) teaches us all things. Nothing Metaphorical about it Mike Just plain truth.
Mike if you view this as metaphors then you have no sense of the reality of it, because Metaphors are not reality now are they , they are examples using fictitious Illustration like Proverbs and etc.
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 05 2012,10:29) Mike………….Your in error Mike because you refuse to see GOD was “TRULY IN JESUS” as a SPIRIT or LOGOS
No Gene,Jehovah was in His dwelling place in heaven the entire time Jesus was on the earth. Jehovah did send His Spirit upon Jesus, and helped him through His Spirit and through His angels. But God Himself was never “inside the body of Jesus”.
Also, the logos IS Jesus, not God. The phrase “word OF God” should be enough to tell you the logos was OF God, and not God Himself.
peace,
mike
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