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Hi Gene,
You prove that our “wills” are free to choose. …thus we have a “Free Will”!
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgEd,
Do you get the feeling you're telling a little kid the sky is blue and the grass is green, but he keeps insisting it is the other way around? Welcome to my world.
I thank God I have the FREE WILL to decide whether or not to follow this thread.
Quote (Ed J @ July 01 2012,08:36) Hi Gene, You prove that our “wills” are free to choose. …thus we have a “Free Will”!
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
GENEevery thing is relative ;is a elephant free to fly of cause not ;
can a tree walk ? of cause not ;
but can man think ? yes he does if he wants to do it right
if not we can call him as dumm as a rock
can men chose yes they can ; even if it is only between two things it still a choice and it is done through our free will ,
no free will = no choice if no choice we are automated and robots
Hi Gene, please consider the meaning of this verse…
“Be ye not as the horse, or as the mule, which have no understanding:
whose mouth must be held in with bit and bridle, lest they come near unto thee.” (Ps.32:9)Here is the meaning of the verse: Our “Free Will” allows us to put God's will above our own.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgThis is how lucifers philosophy was in the beginning and is today. This is how he rebelled against his creator,and became satan. His philosophy is that there is no such as love for God; but just bribery.And there is no such as free will under God.
There is no such as free will,it is God that decides in the end. lucifer wanted to be free; and seperated himself from the clutches of his creator.And look at his works; is this worth the sacrifice for having free will? Free will such as; do what your heart desires,without any outside interference.
Children always like to do things their way;why cant we do this, or why cant we do that;not fair.The parents show them the rules; they can make a choice to abide by it or not.
And if the wrong choice is made,then the punishment: Not fair,why should we be punished,we have made our free choice;we should be rewarded.??But this philosophy states that it is not really free choice,you make the right choice you receive a reward; but if you make the wrong choice you are damned.(there should be a reward for both).then this would be truly free choice.??
Lets say there are two drinks infront of you; one has got wine in it;and the other has some steroids in it.and you are free to make a choice; you can have the wine as your favourite drink or have the steroid as your favourite drink.
You choose the steroids because it make you superman.
Then you find you have cancer; and you say this is not fair bacause I made my free choice.What ever hapened and what ever will happen in the future God already saw it happen,therefore he decices what is good for us.All is his and HE decides what he does with his creation.
The potter makes the decision what he will do with the clay.Think before you follow this philosophy.
wakeup.
Wakeup…………LIBERTY to Chose our desires and Having a WILL the Is FREE if INFLUENCES is quite different. It is a Satanic Spirit at work (IN) People that makes them think they have a will that is FREE. If God granted us a “FREE WILL” then he would find not faults with us becasue he created us with that So-called FREE WILL and want us to us it “FREELY” so why find fault then we are simply doing what He wanted us to Do according to all “FREE WILLER'S” and that is exactly what the serpent working in EVE'S mind wanted Her to believe (IT) want here to feel “FREE to Chose what ever she wanted to despite what GOD had Said, and all FREE WILLER'S do the Same thing today, they simply do not realize they are being held captive by their own WILLS> You as many are confusing a FREE will with God giving us LIBERTY to express our Captivated WILLS> Big difference. IMO
Jesus plainly said “THY” kingdom com “THY” WILL be done, I don't see anyone else's WILL being Done there do you? But Man want to pretend he has POWER so he would say, “Well our “FREE WILL” Just allows GOD WILL to BE Done. Of course that give Man the “REAL POWER in DECIDING his FATE right?. So Whom is the GOD there, GOD or Man's “FREE WILL” ?, all I GOD'S believe this way.
There is no such thing as a WILL that is FREE NOt GOD'S WILL nor Man WILL. the term FREEWILL is an OXYMORON> IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,08:49) Wakeup…………LIBERTY to Chose our desires and Having a WILL the Is FREE if INFLUENCES is quite different. It is a Satanic Spirit at work (IN) People that makes them think they have a will that is FREE. If God granted us a “FREE WILL” then he would find not faults with us becasue he created us with that So-called FREE WILL and want us to us it “FREELY” so why find fault then we are simply doing what He wanted us to Do according to all “FREE WILLER'S” and that is exactly what the serpent working in EVE'S mind wanted Her to believe (IT) want here to feel “FREE to Chose what ever she wanted to despite what GOD had Said, and all FREE WILLER'S do the Same thing today, they simply do not realize they are being held captive by their own WILLS> You as many are confusing a FREE will with God giving us LIBERTY to express our Captivated WILLS> Big difference. IMO Jesus plainly said “THY” kingdom com “THY” WILL be done, I don't see anyone else's WILL being Done there do you? But Man want to pretend he has POWER so he would say, “Well our “FREE WILL” Just allows GOD WILL to BE Done. Of course that give Man the “REAL POWER in DECIDING his FATE right?. So Whom is the GOD there, GOD or Man's “FREE WILL” ?, all I GOD'S believe this way.
There is no such thing as a WILL that is FREE NOt GOD'S WILL nor Man WILL. the term FREEWILL is an OXYMORON> IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………….gene
Jas 1:14 but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed.
Jas 1:15 Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.SATAN OR ANY ONE ELSE AS NOTHING TO DO WITH IT ,IT IS OUR OWN MAKING
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,01:49) Wakeup…………LIBERTY to Chose our desires and Having a WILL the Is FREE if INFLUENCES is quite different. IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………….gene
Hi Gene,“Free Will” doesn't define as – a will free of influences?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgEDJ………. EXACTLY Therefore it is a OXYMORON becasue (NO WILL IS FREE) of influence and therefore is not FREE “itself”, What people do EDJ is confuse the Word FREE with the LIBERTY GOD has given us to do and express our “captivated” WILLS> “Cause and effect”, every cause has and effect, and every effect had a cause. Even our Wills EDJ. IMO
peace and love to you and yours Ed J………………………………………………..gene
Hi Gene,
No mention of 'captivated wills'?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,11:30) EDJ………. EXACTLY Therefore it is a OXYMORON becasue (NO WILL IS FREE) of influence and therefore is not FREE “itself”, What people do EDJ is confuse the Word FREE with the LIBERTY GOD has given us to do and express our “captivated” WILLS> “Cause and effect”, every cause has and effect, and every effect had a cause. Even our Wills EDJ. IMO peace and love to you and yours Ed J………………………………………………..gene
gyou mixed with NO FREE GOODY`S
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,01:49) Wakeup…………LIBERTY to Chose our desires and Having a WILL the Is FREE if INFLUENCES is quite different. It is a Satanic Spirit at work (IN) People that makes them think they have a will that is FREE. If God granted us a “FREE WILL” then he would find not faults with us becasue he created us with that So-called FREE WILL and want us to us it “FREELY” so why find fault then we are simply doing what He wanted us to Do according to all “FREE WILLER'S” and that is exactly what the serpent working in EVE'S mind wanted Her to believe (IT) want here to feel “FREE to Chose what ever she wanted to despite what GOD had Said, and all FREE WILLER'S do the Same thing today, they simply do not realize they are being held captive by their own WILLS> You as many are confusing a FREE will with God giving us LIBERTY to express our Captivated WILLS> Big difference. IMO Jesus plainly said “THY” kingdom com “THY” WILL be done, I don't see anyone else's WILL being Done there do you? But Man want to pretend he has POWER so he would say, “Well our “FREE WILL” Just allows GOD WILL to BE Done. Of course that give Man the “REAL POWER in DECIDING his FATE right?. So Whom is the GOD there, GOD or Man's “FREE WILL” ?, all I GOD'S believe this way.
There is no such thing as a WILL that is FREE NOt GOD'S WILL nor Man WILL. the term FREEWILL is an OXYMORON> IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………….gene
GEne B.
I know that we are debating free will; but:
There is no point in debating, if one does not answer questions.You have not answered my questions.
When God had a meeting with his angels;were the angels real creatures or not: if yes, then why is satan not a real creature?If not real; then who was God meeting with?
Who was God speaking to?
If satan is not a creature;then what is lucifer?
What is the dragon and his angels?
What is beelzebub?
What is the devil and his angels?
What will be bound for a 1000yrs?
What is Gog?What went –INTO–Judas iscariot?(since you say evil comes from the INSIDE OF A PERSON, NOT OUTSIDE).
What tempted Jesus in the desert?Has Jesus got evil in him? Did his temptation come from the inside?
Lets settle these questions first,and not go elsewhere untill this is settled.
Defend your self;no need for long sermons.
wakeup.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,07:30) EDJ………. EXACTLY Therefore it is a OXYMORON becasue (NO WILL IS FREE) of influence and therefore is not FREE “itself”, What people do EDJ is confuse the Word FREE with the LIBERTY GOD has given us to do and express our “captivated” WILLS> “Cause and effect”, every cause has and effect, and every effect had a cause. Even our Wills EDJ. IMO peace and love to you and yours Ed J………………………………………………..gene
Gene.Denying free will is the oxymoron. This is basically what denial of free will says:
“Free will doesn't exist, therefore if you do believe in free will, then you cannot freely choose otherwise.”
So why try and convince us that there is no such thing as free will. I mean the fact that you even try to convince us of this means you believe that we can choose to believe your view. In other words we can choose to believe your view.
But we don't choose your view in this matter. Another perfect example that we have a will to choose and why we are responsible for our choices because they are our choices.
Hi gene.
In response to your belief that there is no free will, I have decided to blog about that here.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,01:49) Wakeup…………LIBERTY to Chose our desires and Having a WILL the Is FREE if INFLUENCES is quite different. It is a Satanic Spirit at work (IN) People that makes them think they have a will that is FREE. If God granted us a “FREE WILL” then he would find not faults with us becasue he created us with that So-called FREE WILL and want us to us it “FREELY” so why find fault then we are simply doing what He wanted us to Do according to all “FREE WILLER'S” and that is exactly what the serpent working in EVE'S mind wanted Her to believe (IT) want here to feel “FREE to Chose what ever she wanted to despite what GOD had Said, and all FREE WILLER'S do the Same thing today, they simply do not realize they are being held captive by their own WILLS> You as many are confusing a FREE will with God giving us LIBERTY to express our Captivated WILLS> Big difference. IMO Jesus plainly said “THY” kingdom com “THY” WILL be done, I don't see anyone else's WILL being Done there do you? But Man want to pretend he has POWER so he would say, “Well our “FREE WILL” Just allows GOD WILL to BE Done. Of course that give Man the “REAL POWER in DECIDING his FATE right?. So Whom is the GOD there, GOD or Man's “FREE WILL” ?, all I GOD'S believe this way.
There is no such thing as a WILL that is FREE NOt GOD'S WILL nor Man WILL. the term FREEWILL is an OXYMORON> IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………………….gene
Gene B.Is this Ophrah winfrey and her accomplish you are following?
wakeup.
Quote (t8 @ July 02 2012,15:49) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,07:30) EDJ………. EXACTLY Therefore it is a OXYMORON becasue (NO WILL IS FREE) of influence and therefore is not FREE “itself”, What people do EDJ is confuse the Word FREE with the LIBERTY GOD has given us to do and express our “captivated” WILLS> “Cause and effect”, every cause has and effect, and every effect had a cause. Even our Wills EDJ. IMO peace and love to you and yours Ed J………………………………………………..gene
Gene.Denying free will is the oxymoron. This is basically what denial of free will says:
“Free will doesn't exist, therefore if you do believe in free will, then you cannot freely choose otherwise.”
So why try and convince us that there is no such thing as free will. I mean the fact that you even try to convince us of this means you believe that we can choose to believe your view. In other words we can choose to believe your view.
But we don't choose your view in this matter. Another perfect example that we have a will to choose and why we are responsible for our choices because they are our choices.
T8……..I am not talking about the right to exercise our “captivated “Wills as you presume i am, what i am talking about is the WILL ITSELF that is working (IN) us it is not NOT Free “ITSELF” as you wrongly presume it is. There exist no such thing as a will that (ITSELF) if FREE. There exists no will that itself is FREE , not even God's Will is FREE, or haven't you read “for the lord does all thing after the “COUNCIL” of his will” And again Paul says ' i find no good thing in me “BECAUSE” to”WILL” is PRESENT” in me Now if you are so sure we all have Will that are FREE “themselves” then show scripture to support your AssumptionsLiberty granted us by God to express and exercise our “captivated Wills” is hardly the same thing as saying the will “itself” working us is FREE, Jesus came to set the captives FREE so what was he setting them FREE from T8. What you are doing as many are is zeroing in on the Liberty grants us by GOD and trying to make it about the WILL “ITSELF” that is n(IN) US> That is a completely different subject. Why is it you seen unable to understand the difference T8 ?
Produce scriptures T8 to support your “ASSUMPTIONS” is all i ask.
peace and love to you and yours T8…………………………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 03 2012,06:43) Quote (t8 @ July 02 2012,15:49) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,07:30) EDJ………. EXACTLY Therefore it is a OXYMORON becasue (NO WILL IS FREE) of influence and therefore is not FREE “itself”, What people do EDJ is confuse the Word FREE with the LIBERTY GOD has given us to do and express our “captivated” WILLS> “Cause and effect”, every cause has and effect, and every effect had a cause. Even our Wills EDJ. IMO peace and love to you and yours Ed J………………………………………………..gene
Gene.Denying free will is the oxymoron. This is basically what denial of free will says:
“Free will doesn't exist, therefore if you do believe in free will, then you cannot freely choose otherwise.”
So why try and convince us that there is no such thing as free will. I mean the fact that you even try to convince us of this means you believe that we can choose to believe your view. In other words we can choose to believe your view.
But we don't choose your view in this matter. Another perfect example that we have a will to choose and why we are responsible for our choices because they are our choices.
T8……..I am not talking about the right to exercise our “captivated “Wills as you presume i am, what i am talking about is the WILL ITSELF that is working (IN) us it is not NOT Free “ITSELF” as you wrongly presume it is. There exist no such thing as a will that (ITSELF) if FREE. There exists no will that itself is FREE , not even God's Will is FREE, or haven't you read “for the lord does all thing after the “COUNCIL” of his will” And again Paul says ' i find no good thing in me “BECAUSE” to”WILL” is PRESENT” in me Now if you are so sure we all have Will that are FREE “themselves” then show scripture to support your AssumptionsLiberty granted us by God to express and exercise our “captivated Wills” is hardly the same thing as saying the will “itself” working us is FREE, Jesus came to set the captives FREE so what was he setting them FREE from T8. What you are doing as many are is zeroing in on the Liberty grants us by GOD and trying to make it about the WILL “ITSELF” that is n(IN) US> That is a completely different subject. Why is it you seen unable to understand the difference T8 ?
Produce scriptures T8 to support your “ASSUMPTIONS” is all i ask.
peace and love to you and yours T8…………………………………gene
genethe only thing were we are captive in,is our choice,either God or the devil
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,23:43) Quote (t8 @ July 02 2012,15:49) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 02 2012,07:30) EDJ………. EXACTLY Therefore it is a OXYMORON becasue (NO WILL IS FREE) of influence and therefore is not FREE “itself”, What people do EDJ is confuse the Word FREE with the LIBERTY GOD has given us to do and express our “captivated” WILLS> “Cause and effect”, every cause has and effect, and every effect had a cause. Even our Wills EDJ. IMO peace and love to you and yours Ed J………………………………………………..gene
Gene.Denying free will is the oxymoron. This is basically what denial of free will says:
“Free will doesn't exist, therefore if you do believe in free will, then you cannot freely choose otherwise.”
So why try and convince us that there is no such thing as free will. I mean the fact that you even try to convince us of this means you believe that we can choose to believe your view. In other words we can choose to believe your view.
But we don't choose your view in this matter. Another perfect example that we have a will to choose and why we are responsible for our choices because they are our choices.
T8……..I am not talking about the right to exercise our “captivated “Wills as you presume i am, what i am talking about is the WILL ITSELF that is working (IN) us it is not NOT Free “ITSELF” as you wrongly presume it is. There exist no such thing as a will that (ITSELF) if FREE. There exists no will that itself is FREE , not even God's Will is FREE, or haven't you read “for the lord does all thing after the “COUNCIL” of his will” And again Paul says ' i find no good thing in me “BECAUSE” to”WILL” is PRESENT” in me Now if you are so sure we all have Will that are FREE “themselves” then show scripture to support your AssumptionsLiberty granted us by God to express and exercise our “captivated Wills” is hardly the same thing as saying the will “itself” working us is FREE, Jesus came to set the captives FREE so what was he setting them FREE from T8. What you are doing as many are is zeroing in on the Liberty grants us by GOD and trying to make it about the WILL “ITSELF” that is n(IN) US> That is a completely different subject. Why is it you seen unable to understand the difference T8 ?
Produce scriptures T8 to support your “ASSUMPTIONS” is all i ask.
peace and love to you and yours T8…………………………………gene
Gene B.We are discussing a subject here; that is against the laws of the universe
Like you said for every action there is an equal reaction.
My will is to wallow in that fire,guess what: i am bb'q,well done or half done depends on how long I was in there.Why should we discuss this subject?
Greetings.
wakeup.
Quote (Ed J @ July 03 2012,00:28) Quote (Ed J @ July 02 2012,05:08) No mention of 'captivated wills'?
?
EDJ………..Yes Brother, all our wills are captivated by our thoughts, and are subject to them , that is why they are not FREE. Where is say Christ came to set the captives FREE he was referencing a Person being held captive by his or her thinkings, which controls there will, . Here is a scripture that may help, i will quote it off the top of my head, “the Lord lead captive and host of captives” this to me means were all held captive and he changes our captivity we were under to a new captivity of God. Now how did Jesus himself do that , not my will be done, but thy will be done EDJ do you follow what i am saying brother?Peace and love to you and yours…………………………………….gene
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