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Hi Jodi,
Flesh and bones that cannot die?
And not need washing and feeding and toileting ?
No we will be like to the angels.
Get over fleshly earthly creation and look to the new creation in the Spirit.
Hi Jodi,
There are terrestrial bodies and heavenly bodies, Not the same thing at all.
What is planted as a seed is not what is produced from that planting.
The last Adam was made a quickening Spirit.
Believe.
So Nick….Jesus body did see coruption, according to you views, but scripture says it didn’t see corruption, now ask yourself why., could it be because he did not sin., the judgement of God was that the man (body with the breath of life in it) would die and his body would go back to the dust right. But jesus never sinned so that judgement OF ETERNAL DEATH did not come on him, so He never lost his body to dust. That would have been a coruption of the judgement of God, so his body was perserved and the breath of life was added back into it. He was dead when “his” body died, but after “his” body was resurected without “it” seening coruption, he was then alive forever more. Never to die again with the body he was born with.
Now ask yourself what would have happened if Adam never sinned, would he still be alive this day? Yes , he would have, in fact he had to be blocked from taking of the tree of life to prevent him from living forever in “that” body, just as he was according to scripture.
You belittle GOD’S CREATION OF MAN, as some kind of bad creation, a fluke, that really wasn’t “good” but God said it was “very good” just like it was, but you know better right?
Tell us when Paul said “it” is sown in weakness and “it” is raised in power, when did the “it” change and why even raise “it” again? Seening according to you the “lt” was not needed any longer. Tell us also why is every hair on our heads numbered, if there is no need for them.
You are given over to all kind of wrong thinking about this, and just grabbing straws to try to keep you false conclusions alive. There is nothing wrong with the bodies God gave us, the problem is sin, not the body, and God corrects that in us by his Spirit he gives us eternal life along with a regenerated resurected “body” just as scripture shows, everwhere, even in the valley of dry bone the same type of regeneration is shown.
Trying to force text to meet you renditions only works on the blind, not those who have the spirit of God in them NICK. Your wrong on this one brother and also about people still alive when the die. When people die that are “truly dead” Nick, they are not in some neither world going about still alive as you falsely assume.
Peace and love to you and yours. ….gene
Good Morning LU,
How is God born? That makes no sense, God is not born, He does not change, He is NOT to be made into an image of MAN, nor is He able to be TEMPTED.
As you know there is no passage that says Jesus is the “only begotten God” that is your addition.
James 1:13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
Hebrews 4:15 For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Please explain LU how you can call Jesus, the “only begotten God” when we are told that God cannot be tempted, and JESUS was in fact tempted just like we are?
What you say directly conflicts with scripture, please do explain?
Likewise,
Romans 1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
God is not able to die and therefore He is certainly not able to decay and perish. Jesus on the other hand did die, and he would have perished if God didn’t intervene. This was also a promise given to David that his descendant God would not allow his flesh to decay, but instead would give this Son of Man eternal life.
Calling Jesus “the only begotten God” goes against direct scripture of who God is. Yes we are told that with God anything is possible, that relates to miracles He performs for humans, it does not relate to going against scripture that says God does not change, God is not to be made into an image of man, man is to be made into the image of God, and God is not capable of decay or perishing.
PLEASE explain?
Hi Lu,
Speaking of David, Acts 13:23 “From this man’s descendants God has brought to Israel the Savior Jesus, as he promised. 24 Before the coming of Jesus, John preached repentance and baptism to all the people of Israel.
LU your belief does not exist in the passage above, the PROMISE that God had made was not in a pre-existing son, but in a descendant of David. That promise also held that BEFORE John WAS to RISE from the dead Jesus was placed BEFORE him. Jesus proclaimed I AM the resurrection, and John said “I AM not the Messiah”, and John said, ” “I AM the voice of one calling in the wilderness, ‘Make straight the way for the Lord.’ ” John also said that Jesus is preferred before him, and that would be because Jesus was the Messiah and would be made the firstborn of the dead appointed to bring others into the eternal life that he has, which included John.
Jesus said, “25 The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us.” 26 Then Jesus declared, “I, the one speaking to you—I am he.”
What you fail to acknowledge LU is the very definition of the Messiah, and what the people believed through what was revealed to them by the prophets concerning the Messiah.
God was not to be made into a Messiah, that is truly ludicrious giving the definition of the Messiah, which was to be the SON of DAVID anointed with God’s Spirit. What was to come was an anointing of a man, not God becoming a man.
Once again God is NOT TEMPTED,
Luke 4:1 Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, left the Jordan and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness, 2 where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry.
14 Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about him spread through the whole countryside. 15 He was teaching in their synagogues, and everyone praised him. 16 He went to Nazareth, where he had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day he went into the synagogue, as was his custom. He stood up to read, 17 and the scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to him. Unrolling it, he found the place where it is written: 18 “The Spirit of the Lord is on me,because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor.He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind,to set the oppressed free, 19 to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor.” 20 Then he rolled up the scroll, gave it back to the attendant and sat down. The eyes of everyone in the synagogue were fastened on him. 21 He began by saying to them, “Today this scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.”
LU the Messiah is the ANOINTED ONE which means being given God’s Spirit, if Jesus is God as you say then he is certainly NOT a MAN, and he certainly would not need to be anointed with God’s Spirit. If Jesus is half god and half man, he is NOT a MAN but some other sort of creature, this too is directly against what God is.
LU to your belief, is it “the only begotten God” changed into a man, or changed into a part god part man, and ceased being the “only begotten God”, or was there no change at all? ..or what? If Jesus that walked on earth was “the only begotten God” how is it that as an “only begotten God” he could do nothing of himself, he could not even say that he by himself was good?
Your whole doctrine just makes no sense.
It will never make sense when you take passages and define them as speaking of Jesus as pre-existing god.
When you apply all scripture to representing a MAN anointed with God’s Spirit, or a Son of Man sitting at God’s right hand who has eternal life, but at one point was just like us able to be tempted and able to die, there exists absolutely no conflict. What you have in fact is deeper faith in God because you recognize that He fulfills His promises, and if He has fulfilled His promises according to the Son of David, He will fulfill His promises in regards to us. What you have is deeper faith because you know that what God can accomplish in one true man, He can accomplish in other men.
1 Corinthians 15 makes it clear that we are to be just like Jesus is NOW, and Jesus is recognized as the Son of Man returning on the clouds to give us that life.
Are we to become the one and only True God as well? according to you?
You say that Christ is the “only begotten God”,
How do you explain this passage,
Ephesians 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Christ is not the “only begotten God”, he is the Son of God which is defined as a PERFECT MAN. Christ means anointed with God’s Spirit. Jesus the Christ was the ONLY man who did not sin, and as prophecy tells us,
1 Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles. 2 He shall not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to be heard in the street. 3 A bruised reed shall he not break, and the smoking flax shall he not quench: he shall bring forth judgment unto truth. 4 He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set judgment in the earth: and the isles shall wait for his law. 5 Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein: 6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles; 7 To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house. 8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images. 9 Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them.LU you have major problems with your belief as it does not fit in anyway with the above passage. The LORD does not give his glory to another, and He is speaking of a MAN, a SERVANT.Jesus did not receive glory in pre-existing as “the only begotten God”, how can that be according to this scripture?That glory that Jehovah does not give to another is His Spirit without measure to a human SERVANT.Jesus was the ONLY man given this glory, and with that glory he remained without sin, with that glory of which was the anointing of God’s Spirit, Jesus was able to be made perfect through suffering and become the sacrificial lamb without spot or blemish. The LORD so loved the world that He gave a PERFECTED MAN who was not deserving of death like all other men, over to death for us. The LORD so loved the world He gave His Only Begotten Son, the ONLY SERVANT given the LORD’s GLORY, the only human servant that was BORN in the fullness of the LORD’S Spirit, to die on the cross for us.The one that died on the cross for you LU was NOT an “only begotten God”, he was a servant, a MORTAL man of God, a MORTAL man given God’s full glory, His Spirit without measure, making him the ONLY BORN Son of God.This is God’s glory in what He was able to accomplish in ONE MAN by making ONE man BORN in the fullness of His Spirit.Christ is called the Son of God, the Son of God is defined for us as the perfect MAN, Christ was the ONLY man begotten with the fullness of God’s Spirit, Christ was the ONLY MAN who was just like all other men able to be tempted, but yet remained without sin. This Christ died on the cross. This Christ said himself he was anointed with God’s Spirit and was SENT out into the world.How you change the wording of “only begotten Son” to “only begotten God” is beyond me.How you cannot identify how the “only begotten son” that God sent into the world to save his brothers and sisters by dying on the cross, did not represent the man BORN of God’s Spirit without measure is beyond me.You deny Jesus the CHRIST and you make him into a god INSTEAD of the CHRIST. You deny the Son of Man that is coming on the clouds that will be bringing eternal life.He received eternal life himself because through the works of God’s Spirit he was able to remain without sin as a MORTAL MAN and was not worthy of the punishment of death. But you want to make him into a god, and if he were truly a god he would not be worthy of death anyways.Jodi:
you claimed:
As you know there is no passage that says Jesus is the “only begotten God” that is your addition.
New International Version
No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.New Living Translation
No one has ever seen God. But the unique One, who is himself God, is near to the Father’s heart. He has revealed God to us.English Standard Version
No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father’s side, he has made him known.Berean Study Bible
No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is Himself God and is at the Father’s side, has made Him known.Berean Literal Bible
No one has ever yet seen God. The only begotten God, the One being in the bosom of the Father, He has made Him known.New American Standard Bible
No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.Christian Standard Bible
No one has ever seen God. The one and only Son, who is himself God and is at the Father’s side —he has revealed him.Contemporary English Version
No one has ever seen God. The only Son, who is truly God and is closest to the Father, has shown us what God is like.Good News Translation
No one has ever seen God. The only Son, who is the same as God and is at the Father’s side, he has made him known.
International Standard Version
No one has ever seen God. The unique God, who is close to the Father’s side, has revealed him.NET Bible
No one has ever seen God. The only one, himself God, who is in closest fellowship with the Father, has made God known.
Aramaic Bible in Plain English
No man has seen God at any time; The Only Begotten God Who is in the bosom of The Father, he has declared him.”New American Standard 1977
No man has seen God at any time; the only begotten God, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.LU…Cherry picking biased,and corrupt “trinitarian” bibles is hardly good scholarship. You can get millions, in fact two “billions” of “trinatarians” to agree with you, “because wide is the way that leads to destruction and “many” go in threat there of”. But “straight is the gate and narrow is the way that leads to life and “FEW” THERE BE THAT FIND IT”.
SEEMS YOU ARE ENJOYING THE WIDE “TRINITARIAN” WAY. You need to really start to think about this LU.
Peace and love to you and yours. …..gene
Nick you are denying scripture,
READ it AGAIN,
35 But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come? 36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: 37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance* of wheat, or of some other grain:
38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body. 39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. 40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory. 42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: 43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: 44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. 46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. 47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven. 48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly. 49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
Jesus was RAISED in GLORY, Jesus was raised in POWER, Jesus was RAISED a SPIRITUAL BODY. People were witnesses of his resurrection, his glory. You say Nick that they were not witnesses of his raised spiritual body.
Jesus was raised a spiritual BODY that was made a quickening spirit, meaning his spirit was made alive again, his spirit was brought BACK to LIFE.
You want to believe that the passage was saying he was made into some sort of new spirit being.
That is NOT what the passage is telling you Nick. God is saying that Jesus’s spirit was dead and He quickened it, made it ALIVE again!!
quickening means–to produce alive, begat or bear living young
to cause to live, make alive, give lifeThe natural body is one that can be tempted and thus sin and thus die.
The spiritual body is one that cannot be tempted, cannot sin, and thus can never die. This was the body that Paul died in hope for.
Jesus abolished in his FLESH the enmity, the carnal mind, the mind that fears death and is tempted to serve a mortal body, over serving God. A mind that has an imagination that invents ways to serve the flesh over serving the laws of righteousness. Jesus denied his carnal mind that is aroused by weak mortal flesh, he was spiritual minded and was able to deny temptation aroused by the body of which tempts the mind.
This is why God would not allow Jesus’s flesh to see corruption, it was not worthy of decay because the mind of Jesus had been perfected. The spiritual mind of Jesus that overcame the carnal mind that only existed because the body was mortal, was deserving of an immortal body, a spiritual body, which is an eternal body that is not weakened by fear of death. With an eternal body Jesus is free from the bondage of the fear of death.
The resurrected Jesus had taken part in flesh and blood, to deliver people from the fear of death, who were slaves in bondage because of that fear. That fear told men to serve the carnal mind in order to live, to rely on our own minds for life, but we must serve God and rely on God in order to live, so thus that carnal mind is a slanderer, it is a liar. The carnal mind through God’s Spirit has the power to become spiritually minded even if it lives in weak flesh. Jesus overcame through being spiritually minded, he no longer lives in weak flesh, his flesh did not see decay it was RAISED in glory, it was raised in power, raised free from the bondage to the fear of death. He received the body Adam and Eve had, but unlike them he has a perfected mind, and thus he is not just immortal but has eternal life.
Adam and Eve were carnally minded even though they did not fear death, even though they did not have weak flesh, they desired knowledge and relied on their own minds their carnal minds, their ignorant minds, to seek knowledge instead of relying on God. God brought forth the enmity, weak mortal flesh and the fear of death, where the carnal mind would now be subjected to not only an ignorant mind with an imagination that can slander God’s truth and invent their own truth, but a weak mortal body that thinks it must serve itself in order to have life.
Jesus over came that enmity, that weak body, through being spiritually minded over carnally minded. God gave his spirit knowledge, wisdom, strength, to overcome that carnal mind and deny temptation.
14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
Some supernatural wicked rebel spirit being does not have the power of death, if we choose to follow our carnal minds that leads us to sin and thus death. This is why it is said that the carnal mind is at enmity against God, not some spirit creature.
This is why James tells us exactly how it is we are drawn away and enticed, and it is NOT by some invisible wicked rebel spirits.
14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed. 15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.
The carnal mind is called a SERPENT in Genesis because a serpent is a creature that is deaf and blind, it is a creature that is ignorant to God. This is exactly why Jesus calls the Pharisees vipers. This is why Jesus calls Peter an adversary, for they all had in mind the things of men, they were NOT spiritually minded but carnally minded. This is why we are called brute beasts, why a Roman Emperor who put Christians into prison is called a slanderer. This is why the Kings in Daniel are called beasts, because they act like beasts, ignorant of God only following their carnal mind, like that of an animal.
When Jesus had fasted for 40 days and nights and was hungry, he was NOT in fear of his life, he was not feeling in bondage to the fear of death? He was not tempted by his own mind to use the powers of God’s Spirit to make himself food? He was not being tempted by his carnal mind?
Oh no he was being tempted by a supernatural wicked rebel spirit being, how flat out stupid is that?? VERY!!
Jesus denied the carnal mind the slanderer that was telling him to make food for himself since he hadn’t eaten in 40 days, he broke away from the bondage of the fear of death and served God. God made our bodies weak, He placed the enmity as we are told in Genesis, but it is our own minds that choose to serve that weakness, it is our own minds through our imaginations that lead us to sin. Jesus denied the carnal mind, the slanderer that was telling him to serve the body in order to live, instead of serving God.
Hi Gene,
No the body of Jesus did not see corruption.
Neither will our bodies if we are alive when he returns.
1 Cor 15
‘Behold I tell you a mystery, we will not all sleep, but we will all be changed
in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet;
for the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised imperishable,
and we will be changed. For this perishable must put on the imperishable,
and this mortal must put on immortality. But when this perishable will have
put on the imperishable, and this mortal will have put on immortality,
then will come about the saying that is written,
Death is swallowed up in victory..’
Hi LU,
Certainly the numbers in false churches give people a sense of family security.
But the real church is not visible and there is no group membership but each must enter alone.
And true worship of the Lord God is not in buildings made by men but in the temple of the human heart.
There His children worship Him in Spirit and in truth.
Hi Jodi,
I know the spiritual concepts in scripture offend your sense of logic.
But it is our minds that must we renewed, not the food of scripture discarded or changed.
‘Lord to whom else can we go? You have the words of eternal life’
Hi Jodi,
The resurrection from death of Jesus Christ was the visible evidence of the fulfilment of the promises to David
and the sign of Jonah. You will not believe that Jesus was changed as we who follow him will be because it was
not witnessed by the eyes of men. We believe also what is not seen as well as what was seen because.
’Faith is the evidence of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen’ and
‘Blessed are they who have not seen and yet believe’
Hi Jodi,
No the minds of men are not called Satan.
Rev 20.2
‘And he laid hold of the dragon, the serpent of old, who is the devil and Satan,
and bound him for 1000 years, and he threw him into the abyss,
and shut it and sealed it over him..
You should not alter scripture because it offends you.
Who is your Master?
Hi Jodi,
The seed that is buried is not the plant that grows.
I am surprised you do not know this.
Unless a grain of wheat falls to the ground and dies it remains alone, but if it dies it bears much fruit.
Jn 12.24
Mk 4.16
And He was saying
‘The kingdom of God is like a man who casts seed upon the soil, and he goes to bed at night
and gets up by day, and the seed sprouts and grows-how he himself does not know. The soil
produces crops by itself; first the blade, then the head, then the mature grain in the head.’
Hi Jodi,
The mind is not the enemy though it is a stronghold of the god of the world.
It must be renewed according to the Spirit and not allowed to act as a filter for logic.
Hi Jodi,
You say of the resurrection of Jesus.
’His spirit was brought back to life’
Sorry but in your search for weighty matters you forget the simple.
The spirit of a man does not die but returns to God Who gave it, at death. ECC 12
You still do not realise the true meaning of the Sign of Jonah that an anointed man lives forever.
And you do not understand that it was the given Spirit of God that raised him and now gives him eternal life.
Death where is thy sting?
THE SPIRIT OF LIFE DOES NOT LEAVE THE ANOINTED AND CANNOT DIE
Hi Jodi,
Lk 16 is not a new teaching.
The OT is replete with descriptions of Sheol or the pit.
Jesus simply enlarged what we can know about the waiting places for the dead,
Why can you not accept his teaching?
Hi Jodi,
You are offended by the description of Hades as a place of suffering?
Do you know better than the Lord?
Or are you saying this scripture cannot be truth because of your idea of the justice of God?
Hi Jodi,
You speak of the enmity in Gen 3
The Lord God said to the serpent…
‘And I will put enmity between you and the woman, between your seed and her seed;
he shall bruise you on the head, and you shall bruise him on the heel.’
So this is spoken to the serpent, the dragon, the devil or Satan.
We know that snakes can bite feet or can be stood on.
Rom 16.19
…but I want you to be wise in what is good and innocent in what is evil.
The God of peace will soon crush Satan under your feet.
Heb 12.13
Therefore strengthen the hands that are weak and the knees that are feeble,
and make straight paths for your feet, so that the limb which is lame
may not be put out of joint, but rather be healed.
Rev 12 also gives light.
The seed of Eve is the Son of Man who went to war against the demonic seeds of the serpent and was killed.
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