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Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I do not see that explicit idea expressed in the Writings.
Then you, my friend, are blind. Perhaps these scriptures will help to remove the scales from your eyes.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I am stating that an explicitly expressed idea is more convincing than a argument based on personally perceived implications.
I agree. Especially when those “personally perceived implications” result in absurd statements and conclusions.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
When someone falls back on the last ditch argument that God can do anything to explain something then they are stating they have no idea how to explain it.
Let me get this straight: YOU claim that God cannot bring forth a spirit Son unto Himself because it would be “evil”. Then I point out that nothing is impossibly for God, let alone bringing forth a Son unto Himself, since it's something any puny human can do. And then YOU hit me with this crap?
Why don't YOU explain how it would be “evil” for God Almighty to beget a Son. Was it “evil” when YOU begot your son? 
Talk about stating something you have no idea how to explain. Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
Mine is that Jesus is a spirit son of God because he continually walks according to the teachings.
Your understanding has God just picking any old human out of the blue and placing His Spirit on him (like He did to MANY other prophets in the past). But for some odd reason, this particular regular old human is loved more by God than all the rest, held in a much higher esteem than even Abraham, David, and Moses, and said to be God's ONLY begotten Son that God GAVE as a sacrifice for our sins. Why Jesus and not John the Baptist, Kerwin? Because John sinned and Jesus didn't? WHY? ALL men born of human parents are born into sin, Kerwin. NONE are without sin. So what made Jesus so special if he was “exactly like the rest of us”?Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I agree that Jesus is the primary son of David’s body and so his body must be descended from David’s and not just changed into a copy of it.
God PREPARED a body for his Son, Kerwin. Or did you miss that scripture? Jesus tried to explain to the Pharisees that he could NOT be David's literal offspring and nothing else – just like we try to explain it to you modern day Pharisees.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
Wisdom is female and the personification of Wisdom as well as being the firstborn of God. Some even call her an angel. Proverbs 8 covers her quite well. Jesus is not a female and so is not called “she”.
That is a weak argument, Kerwin. The Church is also referred to in a FEMALE gender. Does that mean the Church of Christ is really a chick? Plus, the Word that became flesh and had the glory of God's only begotten was described with MALE pronouns. Did Wisdom have a sex change operation upon becoming flesh? Don't let the gender or the Greek words confuse you. The word “righteousness” is a female word in the Greek language, but that doesn't mean everyone who is righteous is a female.Kerwin, we all KNOW who God's only begotten Son is. His name is Jesus.
Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I believe both in the name of the Wisdom of God and the name of Jesus Anointed
There is only ONE name under heaven through which we can be saved, Kerwin. That name is Jesus Christ. Believe on HIS name alone if you want to be saved.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
That is not what scripture states. It instead states that because Jesus exists in the form of God he did not seek to be equal to God but in lowliness of mind esteemed others better than himself and so took on himself the form of a servant; and God created him in the likeness of human kind.
So God created him in the likeness of human kind AFTER he already WAS a human being who “esteemed others better than himself”? See, THIS is one of those “personally perceived implications” that results in absurd statements and conclusions. Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
You assume the Last Adam is Jesus but I know:The outer Adam was the man created from the earth.
The inner Adam was the man from heaven that gave life to the Adam that came before it.
This statement also falls into the “absurd” category. Scripture speaks of a FIRST Adam and a LAST Adam. Scripture does NOT mention any “inner Adam” or “outer Adam”.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
It is the same body he ascended in and will descend with on that day.
It can't be. He was raised from the dead in the FLESH body he died in. He is now in the Kingdom of God ruling from the right hand of his God. Therefore he can no longer be flesh.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57) So I don’t see where scripture states the resurrected dead are spirit beings though they are spiritual beings.
And what is a “spiritual body” in your opinion, Kerwin?Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
you seemed to believe Jesus has a mixture of a spirit body and a flesh body. Perhaps I erred and you instead think he has two bodies that his soul occupies at different times.
You err on both accounts. Jesus WAS a spirit being, then was made a human being, then was raised to heaven a spirit being again. No “mixture of two kinds”. No “two bodies at the same time”. No “crossbreed”.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
What verses from his two genealogies do you speak of?
Ask me that question in our debate thread, Kerwin. That is the proper place to carry out a discussion as in depth as that one will be.Quote (Paladin @ Sep. 23 2011,16:34) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 22 2011,10:10) Paladin, from your point of view, is the following a fair assessment of your belief: The Messianic Prophecy is the Root of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, David, Solomon, and so on down the line until Jesus Christ. And the fact that the Messianic Prophecy is Root of all of them shows that that Messianic Prophecy came BEFORE all of them.
Is that statement true in your eyes?
After.
I don't understand. I thought you said the Messianic Prophecy began in Gen 3:15. How could that be AFTER Abraham and the others?Please explain.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 24 2011,08:52) Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 22 2011,22:34) I am convinced that the experts do believe that the two words are not always synonyms and I am confident God chooses his words carefully to advance his righteous plan.
If they are “not ALWAYS synonyms”, then there is no “set rule of thumb” regarding them. Like I said: Take ONE scripture at a time, give your understanding of “logos” or “rhema” in THAT verse, and I might even agree with you on THAT verse. But to make a blanket statement that “logos” ALWAYS MEANS THIS and “rhema” ALWAYS MEANS THAT is to do so WITHOUT evidence.Are we agreed?
Mike,I am going to agree there is no set rule since it is a debatable issue among experts.
Mike………..Paladin has given a complete and accurate understand of the scriptures concerning Jesus and the LOGOS of GOD as (“coming in the Flesh”) it was (IN) the flesh man Jesus and can be (IN) us also. By the anointing of GOD Spirits (INTELLECTS) Just that simple , there was no Preexisting Jesus in any form , He was Prophesied to come into existence at the “proper time” through the Womens Seed. No need to cloud the clear understand of People by false Trinitarian and Preexistence teachings of preexistence “MYSTERY RELIGIONS” which separates Jesus from our exact Identity with him as a son of man. IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………………………………………….gene
Gene,
In what way did Jesus “go to God”? Did the literal PERSON Jesus Christ literally and physically “go TO God” when he ascended to heaven?
Mike……….According to the event at the time it appears he really did ascend with his body, But was there some kind of change that took place I do not know nor do you. To say there was is Pure speculation on your part or anyone else's . Jesus told Mary not to touch his body because he had had not yet appeared to the Father indicates there was a Body Present even to be presented to the FATHER. Mike i don't think there is a problem what God can do with our present Bodies, they have walked on water, have vanished , have went through doors among other things. You seem to thing GOD can't do thing with our Present Bodies are you not limiting God ability? IMO
peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 26 2011,09:15) Mike……….According to the event at the time it appears he really did ascend with his body, But was there some kind of change that took place I do not know nor do you. To say there was is Pure speculation on your part or anyone else's . Jesus told Mary not to touch his body because he had had not yet appeared to the Father indicates there was a Body Present even to be presented to the FATHER. Mike i don't think there is a problem what God can do with our present Bodies, they have walked on water, have vanished , have went through doors among other things. You seem to thing GOD can't do thing with our Present Bodies are you not limiting God ability? IMO peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………………..gene
genewhy would Paul say that the ones for the heavenly call would be changed in a blink of a eye ?
Pierre
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 25 2011,09:15)
Mike……….According to the event at the time it appears he really did ascend with his body,John 13:3
Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into his hands, and that he had come from God and was going to God.Gene, you agree that the BEING of Jesus literally went TO God after the resurrection. Why would you think Jesus coming FROM God would carry a different meaning than Jesus going back TO God in this scripture?
(I tried to find this scripture from memory, and mistakenly checked John 3:13 instead of John 13:3. I was amused to discover that 3:13 contains the exact same teaching: “No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.” Perhaps my friend Ed J could shed some numerology light on this coincidence of transposed numbers.
)Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Sep. 25 2011,09:15)
But was there some kind of change that took place I do not know nor do you. To say there was is Pure speculation on your part or anyone else's
I would say it is more of an “educated guess” than “pure speculation”, Gene.1. Jesus was raised from the dead in a flesh body. (Luke 24:39)
2. Flesh cannot inherit God's Kingdom, of which Jesus is now Lord and King. (1 Cor 15:50)
3. Jesus became a life-giving spirit. (1 Cor 15:45)
4. Paul hopes that his body will also be transformed into a glorious new body like the one Jesus now has. (Phil 3:21)
5. Jesus is obviously not a flesh and blood man anymore. (Gal 1:1, 12)
So you are correct that there is no specific scripture that says Jesus was “changed” upon his ascension back to heaven, but these scriptures, among others, leave little doubt in my mind that a “change” was inevitable.
peace,
mikeQuote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 24 2011,10:02) Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I do not see that explicit idea expressed in the Writings.
Then you, my friend, are blind. Perhaps these scriptures will help to remove the scales from your eyes.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I am stating that an explicitly expressed idea is more convincing than a argument based on personally perceived implications.
I agree. Especially when those “personally perceived implications” result in absurd statements and conclusions.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
When someone falls back on the last ditch argument that God can do anything to explain something then they are stating they have no idea how to explain it.
Let me get this straight: YOU claim that God cannot bring forth a spirit Son unto Himself because it would be “evil”. Then I point out that nothing is impossibly for God, let alone bringing forth a Son unto Himself, since it's something any puny human can do. And then YOU hit me with this crap? Why don't YOU explain how it would be “evil” for God Almighty to beget a Son. Was it “evil” when YOU begot your son? Talk about stating something you have no idea how to explain. Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
Mine is that Jesus is a spirit son of God because he continually walks according to the teachings.
Your understanding has God just picking any old human out of the blue and placing His Spirit on him (like He did to MANY other prophets in the past). But for some odd reason, this particular regular old human is loved more by God than all the rest, held in a much higher esteem than even Abraham, David, and Moses, and said to be God's ONLY begotten Son that God GAVE as a sacrifice for our sins. Why Jesus and not John the Baptist, Kerwin? Because John sinned and Jesus didn't? WHY? ALL men born of human parents are born into sin, Kerwin. NONE are without sin. So what made Jesus so special if he was “exactly like the rest of us”?Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I agree that Jesus is the primary son of David’s body and so his body must be descended from David’s and not just changed into a copy of it.
God PREPARED a body for his Son, Kerwin. Or did you miss that scripture? Jesus tried to explain to the Pharisees that he could NOT be David's literal offspring and nothing else – just like we try to explain it to you modern day Pharisees.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
Wisdom is female and the personification of Wisdom as well as being the firstborn of God. Some even call her an angel. Proverbs 8 covers her quite well. Jesus is not a female and so is not called “she”.
That is a weak argument, Kerwin. The Church is also referred to in a FEMALE gender. Does that mean the Church of Christ is really a chick? Plus, the Word that became flesh and had the glory of God's only begotten was described with MALE pronouns. Did Wisdom have a sex change operation upon becoming flesh? Don't let the gender or the Greek words confuse you. The word “righteousness” is a female word in the Greek language, but that doesn't mean everyone who is righteous is a female.Kerwin, we all KNOW who God's only begotten Son is. His name is Jesus.
Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
I believe both in the name of the Wisdom of God and the name of Jesus Anointed
There is only ONE name under heaven through which we can be saved, Kerwin. That name is Jesus Christ. Believe on HIS name alone if you want to be saved.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
That is not what scripture states. It instead states that because Jesus exists in the form of God he did not seek to be equal to God but in lowliness of mind esteemed others better than himself and so took on himself the form of a servant; and God created him in the likeness of human kind.
So God created him in the likeness of human kind AFTER he already WAS a human being who “esteemed others better than himself”? See, THIS is one of those “personally perceived implications” that results in absurd statements and conclusions. Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
You assume the Last Adam is Jesus but I know:The outer Adam was the man created from the earth.
The inner Adam was the man from heaven that gave life to the Adam that came before it.
This statement also falls into the “absurd” category. Scripture speaks of a FIRST Adam and a LAST Adam. Scripture does NOT mention any “inner Adam” or “outer Adam”.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
It is the same body he ascended in and will descend with on that day.
It can't be. He was raised from the dead in the FLESH body he died in. He is now in the Kingdom of God ruling from the right hand of his God. Therefore he can no l
onger be flesh.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
So I don’t see where scripture states the resurrected dead are spirit beings though they are spiritual beings.
And what is a “spiritual body” in your opinion, Kerwin?Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
you seemed to believe Jesus has a mixture of a spirit body and a flesh body. Perhaps I erred and you instead think he has two bodies that his soul occupies at different times.
You err on both accounts. Jesus WAS a spirit being, then was made a human being, then was raised to heaven a spirit being again. No “mixture of two kinds”. No “two bodies at the same time”. No “crossbreed”.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 23 2011,00:57)
What verses from his two genealogies do you speak of?
Ask me that question in our debate thread, Kerwin. That is the proper place to carry out a discussion as in depth as that one will be.
Mike,This post looks to me like we are both spinning our wheels uselessly. I am going to take a hiatus for a while. If God chooses he will bring up these things at a later time after he has taught us each more.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 26 2011,04:20) (I tried to find this scripture from memory, and mistakenly checked John 3:13 instead of John 13:3. I was amused to discover that 3:13 contains the exact same teaching: “No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.” Perhaps my friend Ed J could shed some numerology light on this coincidence of transposed numbers. )
Hi Mike,And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down
from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. (John 3:13)
Doesn't John 3:13 seem to indicate that we all preexisted our birth?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (kerwin @ Sep. 25 2011,11:37) Mike, This post looks to me like we are both spinning our wheels uselessly. I am going to take a hiatus for a while. If God chooses he will bring up these things at a later time after he has taught us each more.
Ok Kerwin. I don't like it when the posts get so long it takes me over an hour to answer them. That was the point of the debate thread. To deal with these same issues ONE point at a time.Perhaps, since you are afraid to come to the debate thread
, you will answer the question you told me you would get to when you had access to the scripture:Kerwin, in 1 Cor 8:6, what exactly is included in the “ALL THINGS” that came from the Father?
Mike,
Quote Kerwin, in 1 Cor 8:6, what exactly is included in the “ALL THINGS” that came from the Father? Quote 1 Corinthians 8:6
King James Version (KJV)6But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
This context that relates to 1 Corinthians 8:6 teaches us about the things of godly knowledge.
Quote 1 Corinthians 8
King James Version (KJV)1Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.
2And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
3But if any man love God, the same is known of him.
4As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.Hearing that context causes me to conclude he the “all things” of 1 Corinthians 8:6 is congruent to that of the “all things” that God has given Jesus and the Spirit will take from Jesus to reveal to those that believe.
Quote John 16
King James Version (KJV)13Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
14He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.
15All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 22 2011,13:27) Quote (Paladin @ Sep. 21 2011,14:23) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 19 2011,10:50) Paladin,Sep. wrote:Gene did not corrupt God's word and neither did I, We simply tried to find a way to explain it so you would understand it.
Well, Gene believes that Jesus being the ROOT OF David means that Jesus CAME FROM David's roots. Is that a correct assumption, Paladin?I assumed you believed the same from your “sucker tree root” story.
I now know that you realize that Jesus being the ROOT OF David means Jesus came BEFORE David. That is something Gene has yet to accept.
Which brings us to YOUR misunderstanding: You accept that Jesus came BEFORE David, but ODDLY invent some crazy idea that Jesus EXISTED from the moment he was prophesied about – but not as a real person.
Paladin, a person begins to exist the minute they become a PERSON – not before and not after. So for Jesus to have come BEFORE David, the PERSON Jesus had to have existed BEFORE David.
So yes, you and Gene are BOTH corrupting the word (logos? rhema?) of God – just in different fashions.
It's too bad scripture doesn't list the life span of Cyrus. Because if they added the 160 years between the time he was first prophesied about and the time he actually began to exist to his number of lived years, you could easily make your point!
Quote I now know that you realize that Jesus being the ROOT OF David means Jesus came BEFORE David. [/quot] I certainly hope you don't think this is a quote from my post.
Try this one instead –
Quote Everybody in the lineage is the root of David, and of Messiah, who is the root of them all in prophecy. You seem to think that a root can only be on one side of the tree, that of begetting the tree, but that is not so. Scripture tells us of a root that dried up, and could bear no fruit “from the tree.” This is speaking of the root of the tree being dried up, so that that tree could not bear fruit. This bearing of fruit follows the growing of the tree, not just leading to the tree.
That is the way Messiah is, as the root from which the whole Messianic lineage comes, each in turn coming from the same root leading in turn to the next growth of that root.
A root goes down to extend more roots, while it goes up to bear fruits.
“And the remnant that is escaped of the house of Judah shall again take root downward, and bear fruit upward:
[II Kings 19:30][Isa 37:31]For example:Messiah was the root in prophecy, [Gen 3:15]; which formed on Abraham, formed again in Isaac; yet again in Jacob, who bore fruit in Judah, Joseph, and the other sons of Israel;of which Ephraim was dried up, but Manasseh flourished.
Hosea 9:16 Ephraim is smitten, their root is dried up, they shall bear no fruit:
Do you see it Mike? “Their root” both preceded them and followed them, in the Messianic line, from the prophecies concerning Messiah, through Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Jesse, the Christ David, to the fulfillment in Christ Jesus.
But, just as the fulfillment of prophecy follows the prophecy, so also the root that is Christ Jesus, followed the root that was David, which followed the root that was Jesse, that followed the root that was Jacob; who followed the root that was isaac, who followed the root that was Abraham, who followed the root that began in the woman of Gen 3:15.
I would have posted this sooner but I thought everybody knew it who knows anything about the old testament, which some on this board claim they already know without help from me. Some even insist there is no reason to begin bible study in the old testament because after all, we are Christians and the new testament is for us, and not the old testament which was done away in Christ.
And that is a sad commentary on Christian teachers that would teach any such nonsense. It only serves to create ignorant Christians who know nothing of their “roots” which go all the way back to Abraham in the covenant, and back to Gen 3:15 in prophecy. It is what results from lazy teachers who think they already have too much scripture to memorize without crowding thier little minds with Old Testament stuff.
If you would learn this “stuff” you would know there cannot be a trinity (which you already know) AND there cannot be a pre-existant Jesus; or anyone else other than God himself. That “pre-existant” stuff comes from beginning at the end of the story, recorded in John, and moving backwards to read Paul's writings.
But as you have pointed out many times on this board, “It makes no difference” what order you study the books in. To which I can only respond – “your choice.”
Paladin,Your premises are 1) Scripture cannot be broken, 2 Root is Hosea 9:16 to mean the entire linage of Ephram.
Your conclusion is Jesus is the root of David can mean that Jesus is the linage of David.
Do I have that correct?
Abso-positively-lutelyQuote (kerwin @ Sep. 25 2011,20:20) Quote (mikeboll @ 64) Kerwin, in 1 Cor 8:6, what exactly is included in the “ALL THINGS” that came from the Father? Hearing that context causes me to conclude he the “all things” of 1 Corinthians 8:6 is congruent to that of the “all things” that God has given Jesus…………
Let's see:5 For even if there are those called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many gods and many lords), 6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live………
This means that although there are many gods, both in heaven and on earth, for us there is only the one true God, from Whom all things came. In other words, OUR God is the One who created all things, and is therefore incomparable to these other gods.
Paladin, can I get an Amen to that? How about you Gene?
Kerwin, since Paul simply said “ALL THINGS”, why would you conclude that the “ALL THINGS” only refers to things that God has given Jesus? I don't see anything in the whole chapter that references “things given by God to Jesus”.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 27 2011,07:29) Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 25 2011,20:20) Quote (mikeboll @ 64) Kerwin, in 1 Cor 8:6, what exactly is included in the “ALL THINGS” that came from the Father? Hearing that context causes me to conclude he the “all things” of 1 Corinthians 8:6 is congruent to that of the “all things” that God has given Jesus…………
Let's see:5 For even if there are those called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many gods and many lords), 6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live………
This means that although there are many gods, both in heaven and on earth, for us there is only the one true God, from Whom all things came. In other words, OUR God is the One who created all things, and is therefore incomparable to these other gods.
Paladin, can I get an Amen to that? How about you Gene?
Kerwin, since Paul simply said “ALL THINGS”, why would you conclude that the “ALL THINGS” only refers to things that God has given Jesus? I don't see anything in the whole chapter that references “things given by God to Jesus”.
mike
Mike,The whole chapter of 1 Corinthians 8 is concerning food sacrificed to idols, even the clause “all things”. I also know that godly knowledge comes from God through, by, and for Jesus Anointed. Paul was just supplying a tool that his readers could do as Peter instructs them in this passage.
Quote 2 Peter 1:5 King James Version (KJV)
5And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;
Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 26 2011,10:32) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 26 2011,04:20) (I tried to find this scripture from memory, and mistakenly checked John 3:13 instead of John 13:3. I was amused to discover that 3:13 contains the exact same teaching: “No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.” Perhaps my friend Ed J could shed some numerology light on this coincidence of transposed numbers. )
Hi Mike,And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down
from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. (John 3:13)
Doesn't John 3:13 seem to indicate that we all preexisted our birth?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
ED J…………..Notice it say except the son of Man who (IS) in heaven. It does not say (WAS) as in the past tense but (IS) as in the present tense.This would be a interesting to discuss here what is Meant by the word Heaven, I believe there is much confusion about this word , it may imply a state of Mind and not and actual location. It would be an interesting discussion. Heaven could be a position where the Mind is coming from in a Spiritual sense, I know it also can be taken in a Physical sense also. Would make a interesting discussion here.
peace and love to you and yours………………………………gene
Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 27 2011,07:38) Mike, The whole chapter of 1 Corinthians 8 is concerning food sacrificed to idols, even the clause “all things”. I also know that godly knowledge comes from God through, by, and for Jesus Anointed. Paul was just supplying a tool that his readers could do as Peter instructs them in this passage.
Kerwin, you seem to have a real hangup with the phrase “ALL THINGS”. In Col 1:16, you think it means “NEW things” for some reason. And in 1 Cor 8:6, you think it means “FOOD things” or “KNOWLEDGE things”. Kerwin, can you give me ANY scriptural or logical reason Paul could not actually mean “ALL things” in 1 Cor 8:6?? Those are the words he wrote, after all.
When God is called the Maker of heaven and earth and EVERYTHING in them, you don't automatically start imagining the word “everything” really means only “NEW things”, or only “FOOD things”, do you?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 28 2011,06:22) Quote (kerwin @ Sep. 27 2011,07:38) Mike, The whole chapter of 1 Corinthians 8 is concerning food sacrificed to idols, even the clause “all things”. I also know that godly knowledge comes from God through, by, and for Jesus Anointed. Paul was just supplying a tool that his readers could do as Peter instructs them in this passage.
Kerwin, you seem to have a real hangup with the phrase “ALL THINGS”. In Col 1:16, you think it means “NEW things” for some reason. And in 1 Cor 8:6, you think it means “FOOD things” or “KNOWLEDGE things”. Kerwin, can you give me ANY scriptural or logical reason Paul could not actually mean “ALL things” in 1 Cor 8:6?? Those are the words he wrote, after all.
When God is called the Maker of heaven and earth and EVERYTHING in them, you don't automatically start imagining the word “everything” really means only “NEW things”, or only “FOOD things”, do you?
Mike,The specific meaning of “all things” depends on the topic of conversation among other things; such as whether it spoken in generalities or not.
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