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Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 07 2011,02:08) Charles Quote adore the Father in spirit and in truth So only Jesus the TRUTH AND YOU MUST SEEK HIM IN ORDER FOR THE FATHER TO ACCEPT YOU.
BUT IN A CHURCH.
NOT ALONE
PEACE AND LOVE IN JESUS ( NOT IN GOD ONLY)
CHARLES
let see what scriptures says;;
Jn 4:23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
now how can someone worship in spirit and in truth ?? those two qualities are reflected within a persons heart ,and soul,
you say; IN A CHURCH.
3JN 1:6 and they have testified to your love before the church. You will do well to send them on their way in a manner worthy of God.
3JN 1:9 I wrote something to the church; but Diotrephes, who loves to be first among them, does not accept what we say.
3JN 1:10 For this reason, if I come, I will call attention to his deeds which he does, unjustly accusing us with wicked words; and not satisfied with this, he himself does not receive the brethren, either, and he forbids those who desire to do so and puts them out of the church.(assembly)MT 18:20 “For where two or three have gathered together in My name, I am there in their midst.”
so two or three are what makes a church (assembly) but always in spirit and in truth of God,
you say;;NOT ALONE
would that mean that no one can receive from God when he is alone
, Jn 5:40 yet you refuse to come to me to have life.
there is no scripture where it calls that churches are needed to worship God after Christ ,the only church their is our the body of Christ the 144k all others are not part of the heavenly call,but the earthly call and same worship is required from all ,
in spirit and truth ,;;My dear friend we are called in our hearts to God not trough a men made church,(to many false Christ)
any believer that worship God in spirit and truth (according to the scriptures) his a member of Christ church ,the ONLY true church,
Pierre
Terarricca,Quote in spirit and truth ,;;My dear friend we are called in our hearts to God not trough a men made church,(to many false Christ)
Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
How can you achieve the above if you remain all by yourself.
How can you be blessed(Sermon on the mount) if you remain all by yourself.
peace and love in Jesus the only way,truth,and life to be known by God.
Charles
terraricca,Nov. wrote:Charles
Therefore Jesus is God almighty,Everlasting Father,and all the titles and attributes of God.Quote this can not be true ;only one his the creator ,of ALL things that is GOD the father ,but Christ is the creator after him self excluded and it still the will of the father that Christ follows ,therefore Christ can not be God his father ,but he can be god to the rest of creation ,he can be a father to them,a prince of peace , ………………………
Quote this can not be true ;only one his the creator ,of ALL things that is GOD the father , KJV
15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
20And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Terraricca,
reflect in dept and you will realize that Jesus is God IN FLESH.
17……..by him all things consist IT MUST BE GOD IN HIS SON.
19For it pleased the Father that IN HIM SHOULD ALL FULLNESS DWELL.
ALL CREATION DWELLS IN HIM
Some scriptures for there own interest since they beleive that Jesus is not God alterred this and render it so:
19For it pleased the Father that in him should all HIS fulness dwell.
THAT IS WRONG.If you read this chapter the context is about Jesus as creator through the power of the Holy Spirit from the Father,it's all about Jesus function in creation.
So the right application is ALL FULLNESS (CREATION) DWELL.
20 …….by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Now if you read Colossians2:9 you will be able to realize that the chapter is talking about the deity of Jesus:
Colossians 2: 1:1For I would that ye knew what great conflict I have for you, and for them at Laodicea, and for as many as have not seen my face in the flesh;
2That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ;
3In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge.
4And this I say, lest any man should beguile you with enticing words.
5For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ.
6As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: 7Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.
8Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
9For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Notice all the Chapter is talking about the deity,so here it is right to be read in His fullness to refer to the Father.
So Jesus according to Paul was explaining that Jesus is the dwelling place of both the Father and creation.
That's why ALL.
Notice carefully the mystery is not only of GOD,not of the Father,and not of the Son.
but : the mystery is of God, and of the Father, and of Christ;
So God is not the Father only, but also Christ
John 17:3And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Here Jesus made it clear that the true GOD IS ALSO JESUS CHRIST,ETERNALLY.
As I stated at the very end even the Father has to acquire all what Jesus owns TO BECOME THE TRUE GOD because as He is GOD remains a MYSTERY.
THAT WAS THE CONCEPT THAT GOD BECOMES MAN.
AND JESUS WAS GOD MAN ON EARTH TO REAVEL THE TRUTH ABOUT GOD.
PEACE AND LOVE IN JESUS.
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 07 2011,15:24) Charles Quote It is only in Jesus that all creation dwells not in God the Father. this is not true ;Christ is a creation and the only way to be true is that it is in God that ALL creation dwells; if it is Christ as you say there would be one missing ;
Quote this is not true ;Christ is a creation and the only way to be true is that it is in God that ALL creation dwells; if it is Christ as you say there would be one missing Teraricca,
Where in scriptures says that all creation dwells in God ?
If here it reads ALL THE FULLNESS DWELL IN CHRIST?
What is the meaning of ALL, and FULLNESS?
To me no matter what it is,whatever was created is in Christ's spirit.
KJV
Colossians 1:19 For it pleased the Father that IN HIM should all fullness dwell;
Now the DRBV.render it even more clear:
16 FOR IN HIM were all things created in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominations, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him and IN HIM.
17 And he is before all, and by him all things consist.
18 And he is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he may hold the primacy:
19 Because IN HIM, it hath well pleased the Father, that all fullness should dwell;
THREE TIMES IT STATES IN HIM.
So if all dwells in Christ no one is missing because they are all in Christ.That's why there's the word fullness.
peace and love in Jesus.
Charles.
charles
Quote Terarricca, Quote
in spirit and truth ,;;My dear friend we are called in our hearts to God not trough a men made church,(to many false Christ)Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
How can you achieve the above if you remain all by yourself.
How can you be blessed(Sermon on the mount) if you remain all by yourself.
peace and love in Jesus the only way,truth,and life to be known by God.
Charles
How can you achieve the above if you remain all by yourself.I have been alone for over 40 years (with family)and have shown example live ,by teaching Gods truth to them,and where I worked I did the same things ,always show Christian way of truth,this is many people I have met in 40 years ,
How can you be blessed(Sermon on the mount) if you remain all by yourself.
God have blessed me way out of my expectation,I do not rely on men s organization to access God blessingsMatthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
this is to be done by all of us in our personal lives ,every day in all the things we do,
Pierre
charles
Quote Now the DRBV.render it even more clear: 16 FOR IN HIM were all things created in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones, or dominations, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him and IN HIM.
17 And he is before all, and by him all things consist.
18 And he is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he may hold the primacy:
19 Because IN HIM, it hath well pleased the Father, that all fullness should dwell;
THREE TIMES IT STATES IN HIM.
So if all dwells in Christ no one is missing because they are all in Christ.That's why there's the word fullness.
scriptures are telling the truth it is what you say or mean that is not true ,Christ is not God and so receive all his priviledges and glory from his father and God.
Pierre
Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,10:08) Quote (mikeboll @ 64) Which version of the Bible does this wording come from, Charles? For sure both:
KJV, AND BRBV.
What Bible is “BRBV”? It says nothing about “life eternal” in the Greek of 1 John 1:3, nor in the KJV.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,10:08) Now you stated that the Almighty God shares His glory with no one. Read this:
Acts 7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looking up steadfastly to heaven, saw THE GLORY OF GOD, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God. And he said: Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.
So THE GLORY OF GOD ,AND JESUS STANDING ON THE RIGHT HAND OF GOD.
SO JESUS IS PART OF THAT GLORY!
Actually, since God Himself cannot be seen with human eyes, Stephen was only able to see the glory of the Father, and not the Father Himself. But Stephen WAS able to see Jesus standing at the right hand of that glory. Why? Because no man can see God, but Jesus is not God. That's why Stephen could clearly see Jesus, but only the glory of God.peace,
mikeQuote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,10:08) GOT IT MIKE ALL! EVEN UP TO NOW. IF I WERE YOU I CONCENTRATE MORE ON JESUS THAT ON GOD IF YOU WANT TO REACH GOD THE FATHER!
Charles,Is Jesus the Son OF God, or God Himself? He cannot be both. Which one do the scriptures say he is? Which one did HE say he was?
Please answer these questions DIRECTLY, with scriptural answers.
peace,
mikecharles
Quote As I stated at the very end even the Father has to acquire all what Jesus owns TO BECOME THE TRUE GOD because as He is GOD remains a MYSTERY. I really don't understand you you really believe that you have any power ???look what you say;As I stated” ;and then go on and say something what is not in scriptures .do you understand what the word SUBDUE MEANS if you do that is what Christ do at the end because he is only the son of God ,but you do not want to believe that right ?
Pierre
charles
Quote So if all dwells in Christ no one is missing because they are all in Christ.That's why there's the word fullness. 1Co 15:27 For he “has put everything under his feet.” Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ.
1Co 15:28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.
look what and how scriptures are different of what you say,
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 08 2011,03:47) charles Quote Terarricca, Quote
in spirit and truth ,;;My dear friend we are called in our hearts to God not trough a men made church,(to many false Christ)Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
How can you achieve the above if you remain all by yourself.
How can you be blessed(Sermon on the mount) if you remain all by yourself.
peace and love in Jesus the only way,truth,and life to be known by God.
Charles
How can you achieve the above if you remain all by yourself.I have been alone for over 40 years (with family)and have shown example live ,by teaching Gods truth to them,and where I worked I did the same things ,always show Christian way of truth,this is many people I have met in 40 years ,
How can you be blessed(Sermon on the mount) if you remain all by yourself.
God have blessed me way out of my expectation,I do not rely on men s organization to access God blessingsMatthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
this is to be done by all of us in our personal lives ,every day in all the things we do,
Pierre
Quote ]this is to be done by all of us in our personal lives ,every day in all the things we do That what I meant! and that is the right church.
But not only within your own Family.
I was under the impression that Pastry is Isolated, alone!!
You can refer to my post.
Than you came in.
But this is the CHURCH that Jesus meant:
Matthew 5:1414Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.
16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
Reading all Matthew, one will be aware of the right Church which Jesus Meant.
To achieve that kind of Church,as Jesus confirmed you have tribulations,but Jesus also confirmed that HE WON THE WORLD.
That's where comes the blessings.
If a person is expecting an easy ride in this corrupted world, and avoid tribulations,and contradictions,then that person is not imitating Jesus.
Look at Martin Luther King.
9Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God
Martin is a Son of God.
I humbly speaking ,am on heaven net not for an easy ride, but to face contradictions,and hope that I myself recieve more light,but also convinced that I am like that candle
shines before men, that they may see my good works, and glorify My Father, and Jesus Christ who is in heaven.
peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (carmel @ Nov. 08 2011,17:38) Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 08 2011,03:47) charles Quote Terarricca, Quote
in spirit and truth ,;;My dear friend we are called in our hearts to God not trough a men made church,(to many false Christ)Matthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
How can you achieve the above if you remain all by yourself.
How can you be blessed(Sermon on the mount) if you remain all by yourself.
peace and love in Jesus the only way,truth,and life to be known by God.
Charles
How can you achieve the above if you remain all by yourself.I have been alone for over 40 years (with family)and have shown example live ,by teaching Gods truth to them,and where I worked I did the same things ,always show Christian way of truth,this is many people I have met in 40 years ,
How can you be blessed(Sermon on the mount) if you remain all by yourself.
God have blessed me way out of my expectation,I do not rely on men s organization to access God blessingsMatthew 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38This is the first and great commandment. 39And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
this is to be done by all of us in our personal lives ,every day in all the things we do,
Pierre
Quote ]this is to be done by all of us in our personal lives ,every day in all the things we do That what I meant! and that is the right church.
But not only within your own Family.
I was under the impression that Pastry is Isolated, alone!!
You can refer to my post.
Than you came in.
But this is the CHURCH that Jesus meant:
Matthew 5:1414Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
15Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.
16Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
Reading all Matthew, one will be aware of the right Church which Jesus Meant.
To achieve that kind of Church,as Jesus confirmed you have tribulations,but Jesus also confirmed that HE WON THE WORLD.
That's where comes the blessings.
If a person is expecting an easy ride in this corrupted world, and avoid tribulations,and contradictions,then that person is not imitating Jesus.
Look at Martin Luther King.
9Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God
Martin is a Son of God.
I humbly speaking ,am on heaven net not for an easy ride, but to face contradictions,and hope that I myself recieve more light,but also convinced that I am like that candle
shines before men, that they may see my good works, and glorify My Father, and Jesus Christ who is in heaven.
peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Pierre,Quote ,(to many false Christ) No there can never be false Christ.
It is more possible to have false God than false Christ.
That's contradiction in itself.
Christ is truth!
Whatever is in Christ is acceptable to the Father,except sin.
Luke 9:49And John answered and said, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name; and we forbad him, because he followeth not with us.
50And Jesus said unto him, Forbid him not: for he that is not against us is for us.
Now all sins are paid for with the blood of Jesus.
We were,and are,and will be always in dept with Satan through our sins.
For every sin we commit, it's like borrowing money from some one ,and therefore we have to pay it back.
But Jesus paid for it. Redeemed us in His body,and through His blood on the cross and reconciled all onto Himself.
That's why He overcame this corrupted world.
peace and love in Jesus Christ
Charles
charles
Lk 21:8 He replied: “Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am he,’ and, ‘The time is near.’ Do not follow them
2Pe 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2Pe 2:2 Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
2Pe 2:3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.any one that lives in Christ does not sin .
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 09 2011,08:59) charles any one that lives in Christ does not sin .
Pierre
Hi Pierre,Agreed! (see 1John 5:18 and 2Tm.3:5)
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Nov. 09 2011,18:48) Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 09 2011,08:59) charles any one that lives in Christ does not sin .
Pierre
Hi Pierre,Agreed! (see 1John 5:18 and 2Tm.3:5)
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Nov. 06 2011,04:01) Quote (carmel @ Nov. 04 2011,12:40)
The DRB render from the beginning.“From the beginning” does not mean or refering to the Son of God,that He had a beginning, but it is referring to the beginning of the spiritual creation,through the Son's spirit,THE WORD, who was one with the Father.
That comment makes no logical sense………….just like most of the Trinitarian mish-mash that they try to pass off as logical, when it is anything but.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 04 2011,12:40)
So Jesus is making it clear that before the world was He was with the Glory of the Father.
I agree that Jesus was with his own God before the world was founded. He even asked PERMISSION from his own God to be granted the glory he had at that time.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 04 2011,12:40)
The word YOU,is a reference to the Father,and since the Father was eternal,and Jesus stated that He was with the GLORY OF THE Father it is clear that He was eternal with Him.
Can't you even see the wishful thinking on your part here, Charles? The words say “before the world was made”, but in your mind it says “from eternity”.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 04 2011,12:40)
Quote (mikeboll @ 64) The fact is that the Hebrew words “yowm” and “qedem” don't refer to “eternity” or “everlasting”, but to “of old” and “ancient”.
Mike, where did you get the word “yowm”
I made a mistake, Charles. The Hebrew word “yowm” means “time period”, like a day or whatever. The word I meant to write is “owlam”. The Hebrew says that this Messiah's origins were from “days of antiquity” (yowm owlam). I mistakenly posted “yowm” instead of “owlam”. Sorry for the confusion.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 04 2011,12:40)
So what you stated here about Jesus, AND THE WORD “OLAM” IS USED, does it mean that psalm 90:2, since it refers to the Father, is also not enough proof that the word “OLAM” MAKES THE FATHER ETERNAL?
That is EXACTLY what I'm saying. And I brought up Ps 90:2 in a thread I started that asked the question: “Is God really from eternity?”. Because there is NO Hebrew word that really means “from eternity”. As your source, Dr.Arnold Fruchenbaum said, owlam and qedem are “are the strongest Hebrew words ever used for eternity past.” But we know from many other scriptures that they don't actually MEAN “from eternity past”, but instead “from a long time ago”. So while I strongly believe that God Almighty IS from eternity, there is no scripture that specifically says so. All the scriptures say is that God was “from a long time ago”.Charles, consider this scripture, which uses the same words concerning the city of Tyre:
Isaiah 23:7
Is this really your boisterous city whose origins are in the distant past, and whose feet led her to a distant land to reside?
This verse also uses “qedem yowm”, meaning “from ancient days”. This is similar to the phrase used of Jesus in Micah 5:2 (yowm owlam). Will you make a claim that the city of Tyre is “from eternity” also? Or do you only make “wishful thinking” claims like that when it comes to Jesus?Quote (carmel @ Nov. 04 2011,12:40)
THE PERSON who said WHOM SHALL I SEND is the same person who said HERE I AM, SEND ME!This is a clear proof that the Godhead are three persons in one God
Are you saying that Isaiah is a member of the “Godhead”? Because that is who said “Send me”.peace,
mikeQuote Can't you even see the wishful thinking on your part here, Charles? The words say “before the world was made”, but in your mind it says “from eternity”. But why in my mind it says “from eternity???”
Have you got an idea why Jesus said: BEFORE THE WORLD WAS??
Because Jesus to recreate our world left the Father ,not didn't exist! OK Mike??
Before the world was, Jesus was always in, and with the Father, as one spirit, but since there was a rebel,(GENESIS 1: 2) and Satan was thrown into the world,Jesus left the Father,to recreate our world.(GENESIS 1:3)
peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Sorry Charlie……………that isn't even close to what is taught in scripture. You seem to be just making things up. Where is your scriptural proof of what you just stated?
mike
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 09 2011,08:59) charles Lk 21:8 He replied: “Watch out that you are not deceived. For many will come in my name, claiming, ‘I am he,’ and, ‘The time is near.’ Do not follow them
2Pe 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2Pe 2:2 Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
2Pe 2:3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.any one that lives in Christ does not sin .
Pierre
Quote this is not true ;Christ is a creation and the only way to be true is that it is in God that ALL creation dwells; if it is Christ as you say there would be one missing ; Quote any one that lives in Christ does not sin Teraricca,
Which of the above is the truth??
First you stated that :
the only way to be true is that it is in God that ALL creation dwells
Then you stated
any one that lives in Christ does not sin
Aren't you a creature, if you are part of creation you are a creature.
So how come that according to you all dwells in God and not in Christ.
and in the same time you live in Christ
So God is Christ after all!
Merriam-Webster Dwell: 2a : to live as a resident
peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Nov. 10 2011,07:55) Sorry Charlie……………that isn't even close to what is taught in scripture. You seem to be just making things up. Where is your scriptural proof of what you just stated? mike
[/QUOTE]
John 17:5And now glorify thou me, O Father, with thyself, with the glory which I had, before the world was, with thee
What is the meaning with thyself, with the glory which I had, before the world was, with thee
If God the Father is eternal,and Jesus said WITH YOURSELF,and ended up with the words WITH YOU.
THEREFORE JESUS WAS ETERNAL WITH GOD HIMSELF.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Nov. 06 2011,23:55) Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,00:07)
1 LET not your heart be troubled. You believe in God, believe also in me.Mike ,
In the above scripture,Jesus made it clear to His apostles that from then on they shouldn't worry to believe in God,like it was in the old testament with so many gods and voices,which eventually all would end.
Jesus told his apostles not to worry about believing in God? That's just whack, man.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,00:07)
They believe in God ,but also in Him othewise it would be useless,because only through Him the Father accept whatever goes to Him.
That part I agree with. Jesus is the way to God. Charles, remember that if Jesus is THE WAY TO God, then Jesus cannot possibly BE the God we're on the way to.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,00:07)
Then in 6 He confirmed it :Jesus saith to him: I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me.
That is the truth of scriptures, Charles. Our ultimate goal is to come to GOD. Jesus is not that God, but the one we have to go THROUGH to get to that God. If Jesus was God Himself, then it couldn't be said that Jesus is THE WAY TO God, for we would have already reached God be reaching Jesus.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,00:07)
So after the Father raised Jesus body ,both Jesus and the Father became ONE ALMIGHTY GOD IN MYSTICAL SPIRITUAL FLESH BODY, AND ON THE LAST DAY IT WILL BE OWNED BY THE FATHER, BUT NOT BEFORE ALL JESUS SPIRIT, WHICH WAS CONSUMED IN THE ENTIRE CREATION IS BACK TO THE FATHER TO BE ALL UNDER HIM.
Show me the scriptures that say any of this.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,00:07)
THIS IS A PROOF THAT JESUS SPIRIT IS OF THE FATHER NOT CREATED, IN ORDER TO BE CALLED ETERNAL.
Our spirits are also of God, as He breathed His spirit into Adam. Yet Adam wasn't the God whose spirit he received any more than Jesus is that God.Quote (carmel @ Nov. 06 2011,00:07)
1JOHN1:3 For the life was manifested; and we have seen and do bear witness, and declare unto you THE LIFE ETERNAL, which was with the Father, and hath appeared to us:
Which version of the Bible does this wording come from, Charles?Quote 1. The Father is the “you” – as can be attained from verse 1, where it shows who Jesus is praying to.
2. The one referred to as “you” is “the only true God”.
Mike Jesus was not actually praying, He was declaring and confirming what was about to happen through His death.
It means that from the glorification onwards, the only true God would include also Christ, not just God.Before Jesus, there were gods not God
The God of the Old Testament was not only a mystery but also unknown.
It was one of Jesus tasks to reveal the real God and called Him Father.
All the covenants of the Old Testament were of no use because it was between an unknown god and humans, where the last eternal covenant was between men and real true God as human.
John 4:22You worship you know not what……
23But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
24God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
Jesus in the above scripture said to the Samaritan woman : “you worship you know not.”
That's how evident was God. Not only a mystery but unknown, never mind Father.
But Jesus confirmed:
23But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth:
Now what actually meant Jesus??
Obvious:
That from than on (now is) Christ was to become the evidence of the only true God.
But how, and why?
Without Christ there’s no TRUE GOD. CHRIST IS TRUTH!!
Therefore whoever adore the Father must adore Him in Spirit and in Truth.
Got it Mike??
In SPIRIT of the Father, and in TRUTH, of Christ.
The Father was never visible, only Jesus was , God in flesh. The truth. The true God. THE ONLY VISIBLE GOD! IN CHRIST!!
Therefore: IN SPIRIT AND IN CHRIST.
IN THE FATHER IN CHRIST
John 1:17 For the law was given by Moses; grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
Luke 9: And there came a voice out of the cloud, saying, This is my beloved Son: HEAR HIM AND NO OTHER UNKNOWN VOICES FROM THEN ON! No more I AM YOUR GOD, I AM YOUR ALMIGHTY GOD,IAM THE GOD OF ABRAHAM,THE GOD OF IZAKK,AND THE GOD OF JAKOB! BUT GOD THE FATHER, AND CHRIST.
God the Father could never be established on earth, even now, since He was invisible, like all the other gods. Jesus was the genuine visible of the invisible God.
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God's enemies pretended that they are also gods, and no one had officially a supremacy.That's why Jesus Said I AM IN COMMAND OF HEAVEN AND EARTH because officially He wasn't. He had to prove it only by becoming human and glorify.
The only guarantee of the supremacy was whoever owns the flesh, and become visible.
1 Corinthians 8:5For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,)
6But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.
Notice, how it is written, …..but one God,(comma)the Father,(comma) describing the Father,(comma)and one Lord Jesus Christ,(comma) describing Jesus.
So the TRUE GOD IS:
THE FATHER AND JESUS CHRIST. THE UNIQUE EVIDENCE OF GOD. THE GLORIFICATION OF JESUS IN SPIRITUAL FLESH.
Paul, had to mention also Jesus Christ, it was vital to state also one Lord Jesus Christ.
This to prove that Christ is the evidence that God the Father is the true God. This for the simple reas
on that only Jesus out of all those gods that acquired the human body on earth, and glorified through the power of the Holy Spirit from the Father to become the dwelling of the Father, the only God in mystical body. The sole proprietor of the entire creations!! Almighty God in Christ. In the truth of Christ.Satan in complete blindness through his pride, believed that since he owned the earth, it would not be possible for God to become man. From the other hand he himself would become the direct contender for that kind of achievement and become like the most High.
Isaiah 14: 13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
Jesus with the power of the Holy Spirit from the Father has won against ALL ODDS!
peace and love in Jesus
Charles
charles
Quote Teraricca, Which of the above is the truth??
First you stated that :
the only way to be true is that it is in God that ALL creation dwells
Then you stated
any one that lives in Christ does not sin
Aren't you a creature, if you are part of creation you are a creature.
So how come that according to you all dwells in God and not in Christ.
and in the same time you live in Christ
So God is Christ after all!
Merriam-Webster Dwell: 2a : to live as a resident
charles
I said ;the only way to be true is that it is in God that ALL creation dwells
I say;any one that lives in Christ does not sinyou ask me witch of those two statement are true ;they are both true ;try to go out side of Gods hand and you will see that you can not do that ;;;but if you live like Christ did and thought us then you will stop sinning ,because if you do not then you are not with Christ but with the devil ,
Merriam-Webster Dwell: 2a : to live as a resident ;;;this is very true in what I have said BECAUSE IT IS IN THE SPIRIT THAT WE WORSHIP GOD AND FOLLOW CHRIST EXAMPLE FOREVER AND EVER ,and so DWELL IN THE SAME SPIRIT THAN THE FATHER AND THE SON OF GOD ,
Pierre
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