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Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2012,18:19) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 20 2012,05:35) edj Quote 2 Cor 5:19 explains John 1:14. no ,it does not ,2Co 5:19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.
John 1;14 ;talks about a person (Christ),while the other talks about the message were it offers the way to salvation through Christ
kJn 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2012,18:18) Going by the use of “in” in these it appears Jesus became inside “the likeness of a human being”; the body God prepared for him.
Oh brother! Is there no end to it, Kerwin? Is there no level to which you won't stoop?You're talking complete nonsense here, but let's entertain it anyway:
If Jesus “became inside the likeness of a human being”, then it means there already existed a Jesus to “become inside the likeness of a human being”…………… whatever that would mean.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 20 2012,12:51) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2012,18:18) Going by the use of “in” in these it appears Jesus became inside “the likeness of a human being”; the body God prepared for him.
Oh brother! Is there no end to it, Kerwin? Is there no level to which you won't stoop?You're talking complete nonsense here, but let's entertain it anyway:
If Jesus “became inside the likeness of a human being”, then it means there already existed a Jesus to “become inside the likeness of a human being”…………… whatever that would mean.
MIke b.You are absolutely correct.
For him to take the human form,only means that he was there before he took up the human form.He was there in the spirit form.
Thank you.
wakeup.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 20 2012,07:51) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2012,18:18) Going by the use of “in” in these it appears Jesus became inside “the likeness of a human being”; the body God prepared for him.
Oh brother! Is there no end to it, Kerwin? Is there no level to which you won't stoop?You're talking complete nonsense here, but let's entertain it anyway:
If Jesus “became inside the likeness of a human being”, then it means there already existed a Jesus to “become inside the likeness of a human being”…………… whatever that would mean.
Mike,I already stated that hypothesis is based on the use of “en”/”in” in certain verses. I am not confident of it as “en” is used multiple times of which I observed but a few as well as looking at the definition give by the experts of Ancient Greek.
I do know that testing it by Scripture to determine if it is false or true is the way to proceed.
I don't believe Jesus' soul was made in his flesh which is why I switched the “made” translation to the more generic “became” translation. Even that belief needs testing.
Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 20 2012,08:51)
MIke b.You are absolutely correct.
For him to take the human form,only means that he was there before he took up the human form.He was there in the spirit form.
Thank you.
wakeup.
Wakeup,I do believe the human soul is present to take up the human body God prepares for it.
Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 20 2012,06:34) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2012,18:19) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 20 2012,05:35) edj Quote 2 Cor 5:19 explains John 1:14. no ,it does not ,2Co 5:19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.
John 1;14 ;talks about a person (Christ),while the other talks about the message were it offers the way to salvation through Christ
kJn 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
T;Since you claim the Word was made flesh then where did the non-flesh parts come from?
The Word was indeed made flesh just not how you state it was. It was made flesh just how Jehovah declared beforehand that he would do so. Is it that difficult to understand the words “I will put my spirit on him” and “I will write my Law on their hearts and place it in their inward beings”?
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2012,22:28) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 20 2012,06:34) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2012,18:19) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 20 2012,05:35) edj Quote 2 Cor 5:19 explains John 1:14. no ,it does not ,2Co 5:19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.
John 1;14 ;talks about a person (Christ),while the other talks about the message were it offers the way to salvation through Christ
kJn 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
T;Since you claim the Word was made flesh then where did the non-flesh parts come from?
The Word was indeed made flesh just not how you state it was. It was made flesh just how Jehovah declared beforehand that he would do so. Is it that difficult to understand the words “I will put my spirit on him” and “I will write my Law on their hearts and place it in their inward beings”?
KYou are mixing up prophecy,and realities what his foretold are prophecies, what his said and declared his reality,read Colssians 1:15 to21
This is not a prophecy but a declaration of what his and why,
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2012,15:20) Quote (Wakeup @ Aug. 20 2012,08:51)
MIke b.You are absolutely correct.
For him to take the human form,only means that he was there before he took up the human form.He was there in the spirit form.
Thank you.
wakeup.
Wakeup,I do believe the human soul is present to take up the human body God prepares for it.
Kerwin.You are laying with words:
The human soul; wat is the human soul?
See rev 11:11.
wakeup.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 18 2012,07:31) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 16 2012,18:27) Mike………The Word of GOD came to be (IN) the flesh man Jesus the Christ……..
No Gene, because that would require John 1:14 to say, “the Word came to be IN someone who was already flesh”. But 1:14 clearly does NOT say that, does it?Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 16 2012,18:27) You surely are not so ignorant as to not know a WORD can NEVER actually “BE” FLESH………..
And surely YOU are not so ignorant as to think that a PERSON who is called “the Word” because it's his title can never be flesh, right?John 1, 1 John 1, and Rev 19 don't talk about a literal “word”, Gene. They talk about a PERSON who has the TITLE “the Word”.
Mike………..Jesus said the FATHER is (IN) ME< God and His word are one and the same thing, So the Word "GOD" was Indeed IN Jesus according to Jesus' own word. Need Proof? the “SON (OF) MAN”, can do “nothing” of himself , the “Father who is “IN HIM” (HE) does the works.. how clear can anyone get. If Jesus was the Word it would be Jesus doing his “OWN” works not some one else that was “IN” Him doing it.Mike God and “HIS” words are one and the same they are Spirit and can indwell Jesus or anyone He choses to. God also Spoke (words) to us through the Prophets, face it Mike You simply do not believe Jesus or his word that the Father who is “SPIRIT” was indeed in Him, do you?. Now if you did believe Jesus you would also believe God was indeed (IN) him and if God was in Him what was GOD Doing? , SPEAKING and Performing Miricales through Him.
Why can't you simply believe the words of scripture that say God who “SPOKE” to us in times past “THROUGH” the Prophets has in these latter days “SPOKE” to us “THROUGH” a SON> So who “SPOKE” GOD or the SON?, Mike what do you think Jesus Spoke to us with?, “WORD” Mike “WORDS” . and He plainly said they were not “HIS” Words he was speaking to us Mike? how clear can you get , Think about it Mike.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………………gene
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2012,22:28) Since you claim the Word was made flesh then where did the non-flesh parts come from?
Kerwin,Jesus is “the Word”. (Rev 19)
Jesus, as the Word, had glory alongside God before the worlds were created through him. (John 1:3, 17:5, Heb 1:2, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6)
He was sent down from heaven to do the will of God. (John 6:38)
He was existing in the form of God (as a spirit entity), but then became flesh by being made in the likeness of a human being. (Phil 2, John 1:14.)
He then ascended to where he was before. (John 6:62, Acts 1:9)
Why must you people make a nonsensical riddle out of such an easy teaching?
God made His spirit Son into the likeness of a human being to accomplish many things on earth. God then raised His Son from the dead, and took him back to where he was originally from – heaven.
It's really not that hard of a teaching guys………….UNLESS you allow your own personal wishes and doctrines to get in the way.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 21 2012,07:34) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2012,22:28) Since you claim the Word was made flesh then where did the non-flesh parts come from?
Kerwin,Jesus is “the Word”. (Rev 19)
Jesus, as the Word, had glory alongside God before the worlds were created through him. (John 1:3, 17:5, Heb 1:2, Col 1:16, 1 Cor 8:6)
He was sent down from heaven to do the will of God. (John 6:38)
He was existing in the form of God (as a spirit entity), but then became flesh by being made in the likeness of a human being. (Phil 2, John 1:14.)
He then ascended to where he was before. (John 6:62, Acts 1:9)
Why must you people make a nonsensical riddle out of such an easy teaching?
God made His spirit Son into the likeness of a human being to accomplish many things on earth. God then raised His Son from the dead, and took him back to where he was originally from – heaven.
It's really not that hard of a teaching guys………….UNLESS you allow your own personal wishes and doctrines to get in the way.
Mike B.You are correct,accept he has now an identity of a man of the root of David, a righteous man glorified,and he is given all authority by his Father to judge men.
He will do His Fathers will on earth,and set up his kingdom on earth,to bring all men to the father,by teaching them the truth,and his saints will be there with him teaching.
He has a 1000yrs to do the job,untill all the bad guys has been sifted out, satan destroyed.
Then he himself will be subject to God; and God will be all in all.wakeup.
wup
Quote He has a 1000yrs to do the job,until all the bad guys has been sifted out, satan destroyed.
Then he himself will be subject to God; and God will be all in all.this is Gods rest for all the faithful the believers ,and the set up of the preparation for the second resurrection,but by no means will there be unbelievers of any kind ,first resurrection ,
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 21 2012,15:42) Pierre and Wakeup, That sounds about right.
this is not clear enoughQuote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2012,10:17) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 20 2012,07:51) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2012,18:18) Going by the use of “in” in these it appears Jesus became inside “the likeness of a human being”; the body God prepared for him.
Oh brother! Is there no end to it, Kerwin? Is there no level to which you won't stoop?You're talking complete nonsense here, but let's entertain it anyway:
If Jesus “became inside the likeness of a human being”, then it means there already existed a Jesus to “become inside the likeness of a human being”…………… whatever that would mean.
Mike,I already stated that hypothesis is based on the use of “en”/”in” in certain verses. I am not confident of it as “en” is used multiple times of which I observed but a few as well as looking at the definition give by the experts of Ancient Greek.
I do know that testing it by Scripture to determine if it is false or true is the way to proceed.
I don't believe Jesus' soul was made in his flesh which is why I switched the “made” translation to the more generic “became” translation. Even that belief needs testing.
Mike,Ephesians 4:24
King James Version (KJV)24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
This passage reveals how “en” like “in” can mean within the limits as well as physically inside.
Jesus became inside the limits of the likeness of humanity just like the new man is created inside the limits of God's righteousness and holiness.
Mike……….Why don't you answer my last Post on the last page, is it becasue you have no answer. But worse yet why ignore what Jesus himself said over and over, is holding on to you own dogmas so important to you , even if it opposes the truth of what Jesus said?.
I hope someday you will come to see the error of you “PREEXISTENCE” teachings, Which is a work of “SEPARATION” of Jesus form his identity with his fellow human brothers and sisters. Not a good position to be in Mike, IMO.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………………..gene
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 21 2012,02:25) Jesus became inside the limits of the likeness of humanity……………
Oh brother.Kerwin, I sincerely hope that one day you will just drop your PERSONAL beliefs, and start accepting the OBVIOUS and SENSIBLE meanings to the scriptures – instead of trying every nonsensical combination of illogical things the Greek words could mean.
You're talking gibberish here.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 21 2012,09:31) Mike……….Why don't you answer my last Post on the last page, is it becasue you have no answer.
Gene,Seeing how you've been posting the same exact 10 or so posts for the three years I've been on HN, I'm quite sure that I HAVE answered each of your points a dozen times already.
Gene, I often don't respond to your posts, because they are novels; and because I have ALREADY answered you about EVERYTHING you continually bring up.
BUT……….. if you ever want me to RE-AFFIRM my answers to your points, then ask those points in a short, easy to read post containing a question or two. Here, I'll show you what your last post REALLY says to me:
Mike, do you believe God and the Word of God are the same thing?
Gene, NO.
Mike, do you believe Jesus when he said the Father in him does the works?
Gene, YES.
Then doesn't that mean that God Himself was inside Jesus while he was on earth?
Gene, NO. Jesus MANY times speaks about our Father, WHO IS IN HEAVEN. As I've told you many times before, the Father being “in” Jesus, or “in” anyone else is metaphorical, and does NOT mean that the being of God Almighty was literally living inside any particular human being.
Do you remember me telling you these things before, Gene? Because I sure do.
Anyway, in the future, if you want answers from me, then ASK a simple question, and DON'T hide that question within a novel of your usual rantings.
peace,
mikeQuote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 22 2012,00:39) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 21 2012,02:25) Jesus became inside the limits of the likeness of humanity……………
Oh brother.Kerwin, I sincerely hope that one day you will just drop your PERSONAL beliefs, and start accepting the OBVIOUS and SENSIBLE meanings to the scriptures – instead of trying every nonsensical combination of illogical things the Greek words could mean.
You're talking gibberish here.
Mike,That “gibberish” is an English definition of the word “in” according to Merriam-Websters online dictionary.
Quote a —used as a function word to indicate limitation, qualification, or circumstance My purpose though was to point out that “inside” may be a unsound interpretation by pointing out that “en” does not mean inside/amongue in all cases.
K
Do you ever wander what those people in the congregation that Paul,or Peter attend to and spoke or write to ,understood Those were very common uncomplicated people just like most of us,what was it that they should understand they were not carrying a encyclopedia under their harms each time Paul or Peter showed up or send a letter,or did they in your view
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