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” is there more than one divine being?”
For us?
For us there is one God
And he is the Father of JesusJn 8.54
” 54Jesus answered, “(A)If I glorify Myself, My glory is nothing; (B)it is My Father who glorifies Me, of whom you say, 'He is our God';”That is all we need to know.
The Pharisees asked Jesus whether the Jews should support the Roman government with taxes.
The Trick: If Jesus said they should, the people would be angry for they resented Roman rule and expected their Messiah to defeat Rome. If Jesus said they shouldn't, the Pharisees could turn him in to the Romans for rebellion.
The Answer: Give to Caesar's what is his, and give to God what is his. Jesus described a difference between what was God's and what was man's. God wanted the heart of his people, which they would not give. Caesar's wanted tribute, which they resented. Jesus didn't present a conflict. Besides, it is all God's to begin with.
When the Pharisees failed, the Sadducees thought they could trap Jesus with a question. The Question: If a woman is married several times, whose wife will she be in heaven?The Trick: Perhaps they thought this question proved there was no life after death and were trying to make Jesus look uneducated.
The Answer: Life after death is not like life here – there is no marriage. If they had correctly understood the scriptures they could have known this, because God said he is the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, not was their God. They had limited God's power to raise the dead, and they had ignored scripture when it did not fit their opinions.
Quote Is there more than one divine being?
A monotheist would not be afraid to answer this question, would not obfuscate, would not feel the need to qualify their answer. They would not think twice about the answer. They would simply write “no”.There is only one divine being.
A question to trick or to learn.
Be honest.
Trick or learn?
Let God be your witness and answer truthfully.
Hi Is.1.18
Thank you
“There is only one divine being.”Now can you address the scripture posted above before you put your feet up. It is not good enough to make such bland statements and not take into account all of scripture.
There is for us One God, the God of Jesus.
Quote (t8 @ Aug. 22 2006,10:48) A question to trick or to learn. Be honest.
Trick or learn?
Let God be your witness and answer truthfully.
I asked the question for no other reason than I wanted to know if NH (and later yourself) really believed there was more than one divine being in existence. It just came into my head and I asked it. I did not spend any significant time in forethought, trying to come up with the ultimate 'trap question'. Having said that, in retrospect it was exactly that, as an answer in the affirmative is a blatant admission of polytheism and a reply in the negative apparently contradicts a number of previously-made statements. And of course that would lead to some 'please explain this statement' type responses. So i'm not really surprised a 'yes' or 'no' was not forthcoming.t8, if someone asked me if I believed there was more than one divine being, and I was troubled by the question and could not answer without equivocation, I would have to seriously re-evaluate my theology! That particular question should never present a dilemma for a monotheist…..
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 22 2006,10:12) Quote (Is 1:18 @ Aug. 22 2006,09:49) NH,
Is there more than one divine being?
Hi Is 1.18
For us there is but One God.
1Cor 8.1f
” 1Now concerning (A)things sacrificed to idols, we know that we all have (B)knowledge Knowledge ©makes arrogant, but love (D)edifies.
2(E)If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet (F)known as he ought to know;3but if anyone loves God, he (G)is known by Him.
4Therefore concerning the eating of (H)things sacrificed to idols, we know that [a]there is (I)no such thing as an idol in the world, and that (J)there is no God but one.
5For even if (K)there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords,
6yet for us (L)there is but one God, (M)the Father, (N)from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and (O)one Lord, Jesus Christ, (P)by whom are all things, and we exist through Him. “
Scripture shows that our God is also the God of Jesus. This scripture also shows that Jesus is not our God but our Lord.We are elevated in Christ above the angels. But angles atre greater than natural men
2Peter 2.9f
” 9(AB)then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the (AC)day of judgment,10and especially those who (AD)indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and (AE)despise authority Daring, (AF)self-willed, they do not tremble when they (AG)revile angelic majesties,
11(AH)whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.”
Men worship and serve greater beings but they are not gods to us. Scripture too speaks of them as gods as in 1Cor 8 and also
Ps 97.5 f
” At the presence of the (K)Lord of the whole earth.
6The (L)heavens declare His righteousness,
And (M)all the peoples have seen His glory.
7Let all those be ashamed who serve (N)graven images,
Who boast themselves of (O)idols;
(P)Worship Him, all you gods.
8Zion heard this and (Q)was glad,
And the daughters of Judah have rejoiced
Because of Your judgments, O LORD.
9For You are the LORD ®Most High over all the earth;
You are exalted far (S)above all gods.”
Ps 96
” 11″Now I know that (A)the LORD is greater than all the gods; indeed, (B)it was proven when they dealt proudly against the people.”
etcSatan is the god of this world and judges and idols are all called gods by scripture.You cannot put aside scripture in defence of your doctrinal purity.
For us there is one God and one Lord.
God relates to us and we to Him.The rest of the world have other gods.
Quote Hi Is.1.18
Thank you
“here is only one divine being.”Now can you address the scripture posted above before you put your feet up. It is not good enough to make such bland statements and not take into account all of scripture.
There is for us One God, the God of Jesus.
I don't understand what it is that you would like me to address? Were you trying to say that the scriptures you quoted teach that there is more than one divine being? That was the issue at hand.Tell me specifically what it is that you would like me to address.
To Is 1:18,
Quote (Is 1:18 @ Aug. 24 2006,03:30) t8, if someone asked me if I believed there was more than one divine being, and I was troubled by the question and could not answer without equivocation, I would have to seriously re-evaluate my theology! That particular question should never present a dilemma for a monotheist…..
Was the motive to the question when you originally asked it on this page to trick or to truly learn.Be honest.
Trick or learn?
Let God be your witness and answer truthfully.
That particular question should never present a dilemma if you were seeking to know the truth and you weren't a Pharisee.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 22 2006,10:12) Quote (Is 1:18 @ Aug. 22 2006,09:49) NH,
Is there more than one divine being?
Hi Is 1.18
For us there is but One God.
1Cor 8.1f
” 1Now concerning (A)things sacrificed to idols, we know that we all have (B)knowledge Knowledge ©makes arrogant, but love (D)edifies.
2(E)If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet (F)known as he ought to know;3but if anyone loves God, he (G)is known by Him.
4Therefore concerning the eating of (H)things sacrificed to idols, we know that [a]there is (I)no such thing as an idol in the world, and that (J)there is no God but one.
5For even if (K)there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords,
6yet for us (L)there is but one God, (M)the Father, (N)from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and (O)one Lord, Jesus Christ, (P)by whom are all things, and we exist through Him. “
Scripture shows that our God is also the God of Jesus. This scripture also shows that Jesus is not our God but our Lord.We are elevated in Christ above the angels. But angels are greater than natural men
2Peter 2.9f
” 9(AB)then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the (AC)day of judgment,10and especially those who (AD)indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and (AE)despise authority Daring, (AF)self-willed, they do not tremble when they (AG)revile angelic majesties,
11(AH)whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.”
Men worship and serve greater beings but they are not gods to us. Scripture too speaks of them as gods as in 1Cor 8 and also
Ps 97.5 f
” At the presence of the (K)Lord of the whole earth.
6The (L)heavens declare His righteousness,
And (M)all the peoples have seen His glory.
7Let all those be ashamed who serve (N)graven images,
Who boast themselves of (O)idols;
(P)Worship Him, all you gods.
8Zion heard this and (Q)was glad,
And the daughters of Judah have rejoiced
Because of Your judgments, O LORD.
9For You are the LORD ®Most High over all the earth;
You are exalted far (S)above all gods.”
Ps 96
” 11″Now I know that (A)the LORD is greater than all the gods; indeed, (B)it was proven when they dealt proudly against the people.”
etcSatan is the god of this world and judges and idols are all called gods by scripture.You cannot put aside scripture in defence of your doctrinal purity.
For us there is one God and one Lord.
God relates to us and we to Him.The rest of the world have other gods.
Hi Is 1.18,
These are the verses I would like you to address to start with.
And remember it is us who say there is no other deity except the Father of Jesus Christ before you judge others for polytheism.
The Holy Spirit wrote them through men like Paul so it is the Spirit you may be judging.Quote (Is 1:18 @ Aug. 24 2006,03:30) Quote (t8 @ Aug. 22 2006,10:48) A question to trick or to learn. Be honest.
Trick or learn?
Let God be your witness and answer truthfully.
I asked the question for no other reason than I wanted to know if NH (and later yourself) really believed there was more than one divine being in existence. It just came into my head and I asked it. I did not spend any significant time in forethought, trying to come up with the ultimate 'trap question'. Having said that, in retrospect it was exactly that, as an answer in the affirmative is a blatant admission of polytheism and a reply in the negative apparently contradicts a number of previously-made statements. And of course that would lead to some 'please explain this statement' type responses. So i'm not really surprised a 'yes' or 'no' was not forthcoming.t8, if someone asked me if I believed there was more than one divine being, and I was troubled by the question and could not answer without equivocation, I would have to seriously re-evaluate my theology! That particular question should never present a dilemma for a monotheist…..
OK. Then I will ask you a question.Will you partake of divine nature one day?
Quote (Is 1:18 @ Aug. 23 2006,08:30) Quote (t8 @ Aug. 22 2006,10:48) A question to trick or to learn. Be honest.
Trick or learn?
Let God be your witness and answer truthfully.
I asked the question for no other reason than I wanted to know if NH (and later yourself) really believed there was more than one divine being in existence. It just came into my head and I asked it. I did not spend any significant time in forethought, trying to come up with the ultimate 'trap question'. Having said that, in retrospect it was exactly that, as an answer in the affirmative is a blatant admission of polytheism and a reply in the negative apparently contradicts a number of previously-made statements. And of course that would lead to some 'please explain this statement' type responses. So i'm not really surprised a 'yes' or 'no' was not forthcoming.t8, if someone asked me if I believed there was more than one divine being, and I was troubled by the question and could not answer without equivocation, I would have to seriously re-evaluate my theology! That particular question should never present a dilemma for a monotheist…..
Hi Is 1.18,
There are two divine beings shown in scripture, one a son and and image reflection of the other.
We worship with Jesus the One God
and the other is Jesus, our Lord.Phil 2.5f
” 5(A)Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in (B)Christ Jesus,6who, although He Âexisted in the (D)form of God, (E)did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
7but [a](F)emptied Himself, taking the form of a (G)bond-servant, and (H)being made in the likeness of men”
Quote (t8 @ Aug. 23 2006,09:58) Was the motive to the question when you originally asked it on this page to trick or to truly learn. Be honest.
Trick or learn?
Let God be your witness and answer truthfully.
That particular question should never present a dilemma if you were seeking to know the truth and you weren't a Pharisee.
I have already answered this question:Quote I asked the question for no other reason than I wanted to know if NH (and later yourself) really believed there was more than one divine being in existence. It just came into my head and I asked it. I did not spend any significant time in forethought, trying to come up with the ultimate 'trap question'….
Clearly if I “wanted to know something” I could not have foreknown it, I did not have the information and wanted to learn it, so I asked for it. That was my motivation in asking it t8. In retrospect I could see that it was a trap question, but hey – it's not question that would ever trap a monotheist…..
In all sincerity t8, you should be very concerned that you could not answer that question. Questions like that should never trouble a monotheistic christian.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 23 2006,11:16) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 22 2006,10:12) Quote (Is 1:18 @ Aug. 22 2006,09:49) NH,
Is there more than one divine being?
Hi Is 1.18
For us there is but One God.
1Cor 8.1f
” 1Now concerning (A)things sacrificed to idols, we know that we all have (B)knowledge Knowledge ©makes arrogant, but love (D)edifies.
2(E)If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet (F)known as he ought to know;3but if anyone loves God, he (G)is known by Him.
4Therefore concerning the eating of (H)things sacrificed to idols, we know that [a]there is (I)no such thing as an idol in the world, and that (J)there is no God but one.
5For even if (K)there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords,
6yet for us (L)there is but one God, (M)the Father, (N)from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and (O)one Lord, Jesus Christ, (P)by whom are all things, and we exist through Him. “
Scripture shows that our God is also the God of Jesus. This scripture also shows that Jesus is not our God but our Lord.We are elevated in Christ above the angels. But angels are greater than natural men
2Peter 2.9f
” 9(AB)then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from temptation, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment for the (AC)day of judgment,10and especially those who (AD)indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and (AE)despise authority Daring, (AF)self-willed, they do not tremble when they (AG)revile angelic majesties,
11(AH)whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.”
Men worship and serve greater beings but they are not gods to us. Scripture too speaks of them as gods as in 1Cor 8 and also
Ps 97.5 f
” At the presence of the (K)Lord of the whole earth.
6The (L)heavens declare His righteousness,
And (M)all the peoples have seen His glory.
7Let all those be ashamed who serve (N)graven images,
Who boast themselves of (O)idols;
(P)Worship Him, all you gods.
8Zion heard this and (Q)was glad,
And the daughters of Judah have rejoiced
Because of Your judgments, O LORD.
9For You are the LORD ®Most High over all the earth;
You are exalted far (S)above all gods.”
Ps 96
” 11″Now I know that (A)the LORD is greater than all the gods; indeed, (B)it was proven when they dealt proudly against the people.”
etcSatan is the god of this world and judges and idols are all called gods by scripture.You cannot put aside scripture in defence of your doctrinal purity.
For us there is one God and one Lord.
God relates to us and we to Him.The rest of the world have other gods.
Hi Is 1.18,
These are the verses I would like you to address to start with.
And remember it is us who say there is no other deity except the Father of Jesus Christ before you judge others for polytheism.
The Holy Spirit wrote them through men like Paul so it is the Spirit you may be judging.
I still haven't been specifically told what it is about these verses that I am supposed to be addressing. Are you saying that these verses teach that there is more than one divine being?– if 'yes' then I will certainly address them.
– if 'no' then there is no point, as they are not germane to the issue at hand.yes or no?
Hi Is 1.18,
How about doing a dissertation on 1Cor 8 for us.!cor 8.1f
“
1Now concerning (A)things sacrificed to idols, we know that we all have (B)knowledge Knowledge Âmakes arrogant, but love (D)edifies.
2(E)If anyone supposes that he knows anything, he has not yet (F)known as he ought to know;3but if anyone loves God, he (G)is known by Him.
4Therefore concerning the eating of (H)things sacrificed to idols, we know that [a]there is (I)no such thing as an idol in the world, and that (J)there is no God but one.
5For even if (K)there are so-called gods whether in heaven or on earth, as indeed there are many gods and many lords,
6yet for us (L)there is but one God, (M)the Father, (N)from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and (O)one Lord, Jesus Christ, (P)by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.”
Scripture there speaks of One God, the Father, which we both say is true for us.
In the same chapter are mentioned Jesus Christ who is not called God but our Lord.
There are other “gods” or beings greater than natural man who are worshiped by some[[col 2.18].
And false gods or idols are mentioned.Does this not clarify all things?
Does it not show that for us Jesus is not our God but our Lord?
Why add to the information shown here by the Holy Spirit and introduce unscriptural concepts such as Jesus being a deity “in his own right”?
Unfortunately, much is lost in the translation of the Scriptures from the original Hebrew and Greek into our modern day English. Both the singular expressions in the Hebrew—“El,” “Eloah”— and the plural—“Elohim” are translated into the English as “God.” It is important to note that in Genesis 1:1 “In the beginning God…” the Hebrew word which is a plural, “Elohim” is used. In Genesis 1:2 we read, “And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.” Therefore, in the first two verses of the Bible we are already introduced to the triune nature of God
Hi and welcome Frank,
And where does scripture teach about the alleged triune nature of God or do we have to read between the lines?
Scripture does not teach it but only men do and you should not follow them.Quote (Frank @ Aug. 25 2006,08:58) Unfortunately, much is lost in the translation of the Scriptures from the original Hebrew and Greek into our modern day English. Both the singular expressions in the Hebrew—“El,” “Eloah”— and the plural—“Elohim” are translated into the English as “God.” It is important to note that in Genesis 1:1 “In the beginning God…” the Hebrew word which is a plural, “Elohim” is used. In Genesis 1:2 we read, “And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.” Therefore, in the first two verses of the Bible we are already introduced to the triune nature of God
Frank.Q: Who did God create the universe through?
A: His son.So have you thought that it may be possible that God is talking to his son? Not God talking to God or to himself.
This “reading between the lines” you talk of could also be called “reading too much into something”.
We want solid scripture, not some loose interpretation of something.
Speculate by all means, but don't teach your speculation lest you be called a false teacher.
Nick,
You are reading between my lines. I did not say God is talking to himself. Elohim in Hebrew is a plural noun which translates into “Gods”. Ergo, more than one entity. Yes, I know the world was made by the Word, i.e. Jesus. His relationship to God is expounded in the John 1. The three entities making up the one Godhead are stated in Matthew 3:16-17. “And Jesus (Son), when He was baptized, went up immediately out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened to Him. and he (John the Baptist) saw the Spirit of God (The Spirit) descending like a dove, and lighting upon Him.
And lo a voice (God the Father) from heaven, saying, This is My beloved Son, in who I am well pleased. That the three persons: Father, Son, and Spirit, make up one Godhead is stated by Jesus in Mark 12:28-29, “And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that He had answered them well, asked Him, Which is the first commandment of all?
And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord.My previous post is in response to the points both Nick and t8 raised, even though I only addressed it to Nick.
Hi Frank
“Matthew 3:16-17. “And Jesus (Son), when He was baptized, went up immediately out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened to Him. and he (John the Baptist) saw the Spirit of God (The Spirit) descending like a dove, and lighting upon Him.
And lo a voice (God the Father) from heaven, saying, This is My beloved Son, in who I am well pleased.”
No Frank no trinity is stated here.
You have inferred it.
Did you not know God is in heaven and does all His work on earth through His amazing Spirit?
His son was His humble servant that He anointed with the fullness of His Spirit.
Is 66 1-3
“
1Thus says the LORD,
“(A)Heaven is My throne and the earth is My footstool
Where then is a (B)house you could build for Me?
And where is a place that I may rest?
2″For ©My hand made all these things,
Thus all these things came into being,” declares the LORD
“But to this one I will look,
To him who is humble and (D)contrite of spirit, and who (E)trembles at My word.”Is 61
1-3
” 1The (A)Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me,
Because the LORD has anointed me
To (B)bring good news to the ©afflicted;
He has sent me to (D)bind up the brokenhearted,
To (E)proclaim liberty to captives
And freedom to prisoners;
2To (F)proclaim the favorable year of the LORD
And the (G)day of vengeance of our God;
To (H)comfort all who mourn,
3To (I)grant those who mourn in Zion,
Giving them a garland instead of ashes,
The (J)oil of gladness instead of mourning,
The mantle of praise instead of a spirit of fainting
So they will be called (K)oaks of righteousness,
The planting of the LORD, that He may be glorified”God lives and works in His Son through His Spirit, and when we are reborn into the Son we too can share in that Spirit and continue that life unto eternity that God may be all in all.
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