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[rancherforChrist]

Hey Doug,

I understand if you're not a praying person, then at least some of what I've said is going to seem pretty strange. Maybe there are a couple more differences between the individual wanting something and God wanting something. Like you said yourself, there is only so much you can do, and that's it. If God is really and He is who He says He is, then He can open a way for us to do what He wants. If He is God, then it's not magic, and He's not a genie. If He really is God, then what is He? He is sovereign. If He truly is God, then He knows everything that we don't know and He sees everything that we don't see, including what the outcome will be if we choose what we want. If He truly is God and He really loves us, even a Father, then maybe He wants what He wants for our good, and maybe He, above all others, knows what is best for us. If we look at Him as someone besides a selfish being that just wants His own way, then some huge possibilities open up to us. If He will really always do what's best for us, and that's His desire, then we can trust Him, no matter what. Isn't it just possible that He created us to be in relationship with Him?

By the way, nice response. I have enjoyed discussing this with you.

I love you,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Hey Kathi,

This brother's life is similar to mine in some ways. Like me, I believe the Lord is asking him to lay everything down. Similar to me, his wife left him several years ago. Also similar to me, I believe that he decided that he wanted God more than anything else, and that just seems to end up costing a lot.

The following scripture is one of my favorites, because it is really a wake up call and is not for the faint of heart. Salvation isn't easy and heaven isn't cheap. That's just the way it is and I no longer believe that there is another way.

Philippians 2:12-18
12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.
14 Do all things without complaining and disputing, 15 that you may become blameless and harmless, children of God without fault in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation, among whom you shine as lights in the world, 16 holding fast the word of life, so that I may rejoice in the day of Christ that I have not run in vain or labored in vain.
17 Yes, and if I am being poured out as a drink offering on the sacrifice and service of your faith, I am glad and rejoice with you all. 18 For the same reason you also be glad and rejoice with me.

In verse 13 it talks about God's good pleasure. Well, we know that the scripture also says that it is impossible to please God without faith. We also know that it please the Father to bruise His Son. What? How could that be? How could it possibly please any father to bruise his son? I believe that as the Father watched His Son fulfill every letter of the law, the very spirit of the law, fulfill every prophecy, obey every detail of every word the Father spoke to Him, that the Fathers heart was so full of absolute adoration for His beautiful Son when He crawled up on that cross and then said, “Father, forgive the because they don't know what they're doing.”

Anyway, short question long answer. Have a good day.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Funny thing, this brother in Christ has, for so long, held on pretty tightly to material things. Wouldn't ya just know that's where the Lord started cleaning house in his life. This brother told me that the Lord told him to start selling all his things. He also believes the Lord is getting him ready to travel and do full time mission work where ever the Lord leads him. I'm not sure what the Lord has told him to do, but he did tell me that the Lord has told him specifically what he is supposed to do, but he didn't feel like he had a release from the Lord to share the what and when of it.

I have watched him grow in the Lord for several years to some degree, but his heart has changed greatly within the last year more than ever before. He's letting go of everything and really laying hold of Christ.

I'll share more as the Lord leads me.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Today I got to talk with a very dear brother in Christ. I've known him for several years, but about a year ago he and I prayed the hard prayers together. He has continued to pray them as have I. After talking with him today, I realized once again, God's faithfulness to answer those prayers. God is doing such an amazing work in my brothers life and his heart has turned from self towards God. It filled my heart with joy and thanksgiving to hear him say, “I don't care what it costs. I want God to use me however He wants to.” He doesn't want his own way anymore. He wants whatever God wants for him. He literally is denying himself and taking up his cross and following Jesus, and for that I praise God. Today truly was a day of thanksgiving for me.

Thank You Lord

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 18 2009,20:45)

Quote (rancherforChrist @ Nov. 19 2009,15:34) Hi Doug, I've seen those prayers not only make a difference in my own life, but a difference in the lives of many others. Like I said in the challenge, it's ok with me if a person wants to pray those prayers for themselves. I don't agree with the part about, “if it isn't in Gods will, it won't happen”. God doesn't force Himself or His will on anyone. Love forced is not love at all. That's not how God works. I for one have had many occasions in my life when I asked God to give me something, and He gave it to me. Then later when it didn't work out the way I wanted it to, I asked the Lord what was going on. In a number of different ways, the Lord has revealed to me that what I asked for was not what He wanted for me nor what was best for me. After a while, that got my attention and it changed the way I prayed. I don't want God's perfect plan for myself anymore, the plan that is full of grace and mercy for all the wrong choices and wrong prayers I prayed. I want God's perfect will, no matter what it costs me. I want God to replace my desires with His desires for me, and then, give me those desires. Will God give you the desires of your heart? The bible says that He will. Are we supposed to make God's desires to line up with our desires, or are we supposed to ask God to line our desires up with His? Love ya, Chris Hi RFC, It sound like you described what it is to be a Christian rather well. Thanks, ED J

Hello Ed,

How are you. Sorry I haven't got to talk much. I've been kinda busy lately. Thank you for your kind words. As I have time, I'll try to get a bit more involved in some of the discussions here.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (942767 @ Nov. 17 2009,15:44)

Hi Chris: And so, did you ask Jesus to pray to God for you? The disciples asked him to teach them to pray, and so, I am going to do what he has instructed us to do. You can do whatever you want.  I was just trying to help you to see this. Love in Christ, Marty

Hi Marty,

I wasn't aware that I had to ask Jesus to do something He is already doing. The bible says that Jesus intercedes with the Father on my behalf already. I'm pretty sure that Jesus already knows to take my prayers to the Father. The bible also says that Jesus is my High Priest. Praying to the Father on my behalf is part of the responsibilities of My High Priest.

Certainly, do whatever God tells you to do. The Extreme Challenge was just that. The choice is for each person to choose how they will pray and what they will pray. That is something for each to work out with the Lord.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (Douglas @ Nov. 17 2009,01:12)

Quote (rancherforChrist @ Nov. 17 2009,15:54) Also, I can't imagine that the Lord would tell me to pray prayers that weren't His will. There's something slightly circular in this statement though – if it is in Gods will, what difference do you make through the prayers? I know many people pray, and yet, if it isn't in Gods will, it won't happen? What function do the prayers perform?

Hi Doug,

I've seen those prayers not only make a difference in my own life, but a difference in the lives of many others. Like I said in the challenge, it's ok with me if a person wants to pray those prayers for themselves.

I don't agree with the part about, “if it isn't in Gods will, it won't happen”.

God doesn't force Himself or His will on anyone. Love forced is not love at all. That's not how God works. I for one have had many occasions in my life when I asked God to give me something, and He gave it to me. Then later when it didn't work out the way I wanted it to, I asked the Lord what was going on. In a number of different ways, the Lord has revealed to me that what I asked for was not what He wanted for me nor what was best for me. After a while, that got my attention and it changed the way I prayed. I don't want God's perfect plan for myself anymore, the plan that is full of grace and mercy for all the wrong choices and wrong prayers I prayed. I want God's perfect will, no matter what it costs me. I want God to replace my desires with His desires for me, and then, give me those desires. Will God give you the desires of your heart? The bible says that He will. Are we supposed to make God's desires to line up with our desires, or are we supposed to ask God to line our desires up with His?

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (942767 @ Nov. 16 2009,21:25)

I am happy to hear that your prayers were answered, and I don't doubt that Jesus has spoken to you telling you what to pray, but he said that we can come to God in prayer in his name.  He did not say that we should pray to him, did he? Love in Christ, Marty

So I can Ask something of the Father in Jesus name, but if I ask Jesus and He takes my prayer to the Father it doesn't count?

I thought Jesus fulfilled the letter of the law and the spirit of the law too. Don't ya reckon that the spirit of the law concerning prayer, is simply that no one comes to the Father except through Jesus?

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (942767 @ Nov. 16 2009,21:03)

Nothing wrong with what you prayed if that is what is what you wanted to say to God.  He is our Father, and we can come to him praying in the name of Jesus. Just trying to show you by my comment that our prayers should be directed to God, and not to Jesus.  I do talk to Jesus telling him how much I appreciate what he has done for me in making it possible for me to have the priviledge and honor of being a son of the Most High God, and also, telling him that I look forward to being with him for an eternity. Love in Christ, Marty

Hi again Marty,

I understand what you mean about Jesus, God and our prayers. Since Jesus is the High Priest, and He makes intercession with the Father for me, that it's ok with Him and the Father for me to pray to Jesus or in His name. I still figure that They're both ok with it too, because my prayers did get answered. Sometimes I talk to the Father, and sometimes I talk to Jesus, and the both seem to like to respond and talk to me as well. If you believe that you need to pray only to God in the name of Jesus, I'm good with that.

Thing is, it was Jesus talking to me when He told me to pray those hard prayers. Since He and I were already talking, I just prayed the hard prayers to Him.

What can I say, it worked. I figure if it wasn't ok with the Father, that He would have told me.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (942767 @ Nov. 16 2009,20:41)

Hi, when the disciples asked Jesus to teach them to pray, he taught them saying, “after this manner therefore pray, “Our Father which art in heaven…..”. Love in Christ, Marty

Part of the Lord teaching them how they should pray was to pray for the Father's will to be done on earth as it is in heaven.

It seems to me that asking God to kill my sinful flesh, kill the sin in me, teach me to fear God, are all things that are the Father's will. I mean He did mention all those those things in the bible.

Also, I can't imagine that the Lord would tell me to pray prayers that weren't His will.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (georg @ Nov. 15 2009,16:32)

I love you all[/quote] I worship the Father and honor Jesus Christ. He is our King of Kings and Lord of Lords. The Father deserves every prayer and worship. He is greater then Jesus, by His own words in John 14:28 for my Father is greater then I. We pray to the Father in the name of Jesus, Amen. Irene

Hello Irene,

I love Jesus and I love the Father. For that matter, I love the Holy Spirit too. I also believe that Jesus, the Father and the Holy Spirit are all worthy of praise and honor and Glory, I worship them with my life and I lift my voice in praise to them.

Romans 14:10-11 (NKJV)
10 But why do you judge your brother? Or why do you show contempt for your brother? For we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ. 11 For it is written:

“ As I live, says the LORD,
Every knee shall bow to Me,
And every tongue shall confess to God.”

Matthew 1:21 (New King James Version)
21 And she will bring forth a Son, and you shall call His name JESUS, for He will save His people from their sins.”

Philippians 2:5-11 (NKJV)
5 Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, 6 who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, 7 but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. 8 And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. 9 Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, 10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 15 2009,14:19)

Hi RFC, What of your God and the God of Jesus?[jn20,17]

Hi again Nick,

I believe I have stated pretty clearly what I believe and how I pray. What I said before still stands though. I still believe that I would enjoy a discussion with you, but all I have seen from you so far is just questions. As for Jesus and His Father, I love them both and I think thet're both really cool.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 15 2009,14:08)

It sounds like Chris is thinking very clearly for himself and has put up an extreme challenge indeed. Chris, I would like to think that God would not want to get rid of the “Chris” in you but instead to renew the “Chris” in you.  What do you think?  Don't you think that He made us diverse for His glory.  If He got rid of the “Chris” or the “Kathi” then we would lose that diversity. Anyway, this would really be a hard prayer and one that I would LIKE to be willing to pray but it is scary.   Kathi

Hi Kathy,

I should clarify what I mean by the “Chris” in me. I am referring to my sinful flesh that is supposed to be crucified. I understand that there is a Chris in me that God created, and He likes that Chris, but my sinful flesh just gets in the way between He and I. The way the Lord has showed me that is a simple picture. God created me before I was ever conceived in sin in my mothers womb, and He knew me by name. Then, after I was conceived in sin, the sinful flesh began to accumulate around that created seed of Chris and corrupted him. As the Lord has explained it to me, He wants to crucify all that sinful flesh so that He can get to that little child named Chris that He wants to have a relationship with.

Remember what Jesus said to the Pharisees? He said that they look for the Kingdom of God to come, but the kingdom of God is within us, and if we don't receive it as a little child we cannot enter.

I hope that explained it a little better. I know it looks like a scary prayer to pray, but I found out that the toughest prayers to pray are the ones that we need to pray the most, and I have also found them to be the most effective prayers.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (Stu @ Nov. 14 2009,12:30)

“The truth is, Jesus is interested in every little detail of my life and yours. He wants to pick out what shirt I wear and what I eat and if I eat and who I talk to and how long I sleep and every little detail because He has plans for us and His plans are perfect.” Can you not think for yourself? Stuart

I can think for myself, but it works a lot better when I don't.

Proverbs 3:5&6
Trust in the Lord with all your heart, Lean not on your own understanding, In all your ways acknowledge God, And He will direct your paths.

[rancherforChrist]

Oh by the way Irene, I don't hold to the trinity doctrine as such. I know what the Catholics, the Baptists and others believe. I was raised as a Baptist preachers kid. Do I believe what they believe concerning the trinity doctrine and some other issues? No. There are a whole lot of things that don't look at all the way we have perceived them for years.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (georg @ Nov. 14 2009,15:26)

NO, he is not the God of creation, neither is he the God of Israel, but God created all things “through” him. Georg[/quote] Thanks Irene, I appreciate your answer cuz I was already pretty sure Nick wasn't gonna answer it. I don't agree with you, but I'm still grateful for your answer. Love ya, Chris[/quote] That was my Husband who answered you, please watch the signature.  That is going to happen a lot since Georg and I share the same Computer. Tell me why you don't agree with His answer. Irene

Hi Irene,

I'm sorry that I didn't realize your husband George had signed that post. Thanks for making me aware of that. I do usually read the signature, but I missed it that time. I appreciate that George was willing to answer that question directly and honestly. George spoke what he believes. That's why I didn't say that he is wrong, I simply said that I don't agree with him.

I do believe that Jesus is the God of creation, and I believe that because of much evidence in the bible supporting what I believe, and because of the things the Lord has spoken to me directly. I understand that one can find evidence of the opposite in the bible as well, that's why I don't base my beliefs solely on scripture. God the Father has a voice and Jesus has a voice. Even the scripture says that specifically. To read the scriptures without interaction and communication with God, is like trying to rightly divide a spiritual message without the Spirit. In and of ourselves, we cannot rightly divide God's word.

Though it may not be to others, the scriptures openly show that all things were created by Jesus, the Son of God. The scriptures surrounding verse 16 make it clear that God is speaking about His Son Jesus when He says:16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.

Colossians 1:12-18
12 giving thanks to the Father who has qualified us to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in the light. 13 He has delivered us from the power of darkness and conveyed us into the kingdom of the Son of His love, 14 in whom we have redemption through His blood,[c] the forgiveness of sins.
15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him. 17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist. 18 And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence.

This scripture of course is just one piece among so much evidence. Jesus Himself taught that fig tree cannot produce or bring forth fruit other than it's own kind, “figs”. Likewise, how can God the Father produce or bring forth something other than God. Sure, God can create beings, plants, animals and etc. that are not God, but He did not create His Son.

Obviously there are many here that don't agree with me, and that's ok. It's not my job to define what they believe, and neither is it their job to define what I believe. I lift all things up to the Lord and let Him explain and give me understanding of the Truth.

Thanks for asking Irene. Thanks for starting over with me.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (georg @ Nov. 14 2009,09:47)

Quote (rancherforChrist @ Nov. 15 2009,03:52) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 14 2009,00:07) Hi RFC, Is Jesus the God of israel? Hi Nick, Is Jesus the God of creation? I might as well answer that while I'm on here. NO, he is not the God of creation, neither is he the God of Israel, but God created all things “through” him. Georg

Thanks Irene,

I appreciate your answer cuz I was already pretty sure Nick wasn't gonna answer it. I don't agree with you, but I'm still grateful for your answer.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 14 2009,00:07)

Hi RFC, Is Jesus the God of israel?

Hi Nick,

Is Jesus the God of creation?

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (georg @ Nov. 14 2009,06:34)

Hi, My name is Chris and I love Jesus with all my heart. I also love the brethren. It's very nice to meet you. Love ya, Chris[/quote] We my Husband and I, is that to your liking> Peace and Love Irene

Thanks Irene,

It's certainly more courteous. I love Jesus with all my heart. I'm not sure about soul and mind, but I'm still working on that and God is still working on me. I also love people and I love to minister to their needs, whatever needs they have. I resigned from my job in Kansas City about 4 years ago because that's what the Lord told me to do. I have been doing full time mission work around the country every since, to help the needy and homeless however the Lord leads me.

How about you and your husband? What is the Lord doing in and through you?

Nice to meet you Irene.

Love ya,
Chris

[rancherforChrist]

Quote (katjo @ Nov. 13 2009,18:57)

He is our Lord God!

Katjo,

I know that you love the Lord. Why do you keep doing this while they gnash at you like a pack of wolves? Not that I mind if you like it. I was just wondering why?

Love ya,
Chris

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