They are modern day Pharisees.6 He replied, “Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you hypocrites; as it is written:   “‘These people honor me with their lips,   but their hearts are far from me. 7 They worship me in vain;   their teachings are but rules taught by men.’   8 You have let go of the commands of God and are holding on to the t…[Read more]

So that is a “YES”, right? You and I agree that all things were created through the Word of God?

Hi Ed,Hebrews speaks of the word of the oath, which came AFTER the Law.  Do you suppose that the Word of God did not exist until AFTER the Law?All “words” are not equal, Ed.  Just because you read the word “logos” does not mean that particular mention refers to the Word of God.  Sometimes, the word “logos” simply refers to a spoken or written wo…[Read more]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 28 2011,19:04)Hi Mike,Isn't the glory of the “Sun” and the glory of the “Moon”, both referring to God's glory? …who gave them their splendor?No Ed, but I'm beginning to understand you a bit more now.God did not forbid anything or anyone else from having their own glory. He just said He wouldn't share HIS glory with anyone…[Read more]

Hi t8,I believe Keith's claim was that if Jesus was already with God when the “beginning” began, then he must have existed before any beginning, and therefore from eternity.I was attempting to show Keith the various “beginnings” mentioned in the Bible.

As interesting as that is, I don't see how it sheds light on the topic of this thread. Am I missing something?peace,mike

Hi Ed,The only point I'm making about John 1:3 with this thread is that all things were created through the Word. Do we agree on this?

Hi Ed,My post was sincere.  When I thanked you for directly answering my questions, I meant it.  I was not being sarcastic about you, Kerwin or Kathi.  All three of you guys eventually address my questions directly.  Quote 3) Which points, if any, do YOU feel I have dodged?None.  You have directly addressed all of my points, and I thank you for…[Read more]

    Good one, Kathi!  You heard it here first, folks.  Kathi, who “knows” Jesus IS God, apparently knows what Satan, who use to actually live in heaven, does NOT know!  

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 28 2011,14:32)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 29 2011,06:15)Ed?Mike?John 1:3 was your first point; was it not?I will pick apart your post, one point at a time.God blessEd JFantastic! I can't wait.

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 28 2011,14:30)To you, is Jesus one of the gods mentioned in Jeremiah 10:11-12?…        Mike?   …Or do you consider these verses to be wrong?…Hi Ed,Jeremiah speaks of idols who did not create the earth. Jesus is not an idol, so “NO”, Jesus is NOT one of the gods mentioned in Jer 10.Nor do I consider those verses to be wron…[Read more]

Thank you for your patience during my questioning, Ed.There is no need to go any further, for you have clearly displayed your inability to comprehend the clear English (Greek) of this verse.  And that's what the whole exercise was about.  This will be the case for anyone who stands and defends their doctrine against the truth, and actually D…[Read more]

Ed?

Absolutely, Ed! We ARE in agreement on this. So let me begin our proceedings:What exact glory did this Word have? Was it the glory of the Father? Or was it the glory as of ONE WHO WAS BEGOTTEN BY THE FATHER?

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 28 2011,12:48)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 28 2011,13:46)Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 28 2011,12:12)that is what the passage is about, not to teach about the Godhead but to teach that Jesus was tempted by satan like the rest of us and yet remained without sin.That's quite a take on it, Kathi.    Because the way I understand it, S…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 28 2011,12:47)Do you, yourself believe that the title of king of kings is the same as Jesus being the King of kings? If you do, then you have much to learn.Read you own words above, Kathi. Translation: If Mike thinks that Nebuchadnezzar being called the King of kings equates him to the Lord of heaven and earth, then he…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 28 2011,12:37)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 28 2011,10:17)And consider this:  Just because the church in Thyatira put up with “that women Jezebel” does not mean the church in Pergamum did, right?Similarly, just because Jesus and his God are one in purpose does not mean that Jesus created the heavens and earth just because his…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 28 2011,12:18)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 28 2011,09:22)You have two, COMPLETELY SEPARATE God Almighties.  Ask Jack, Keith, or your pastor how many God Almighties there are………….and see if they still agree with you.Mike,I do not teach two Almighty God the Fathers.  KathiWhy are you now being shy and playing word games a…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 28 2011,12:12)that is what the passage is about, not to teach about the Godhead but to teach that Jesus was tempted by satan like the rest of us and yet remained without sin.That's quite a take on it, Kathi. Because the way I understand it, Satan is quite convinced that Jesus is not his own God and Creator, but the Son…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 28 2011,11:50)Mike,Can you tell me which one is the Lord?  The verse talks about our Lord and our God, not just God.  Jehovah is both Lord and God.  Deut 10:17KathiEzekiel 26:7“For this is what the Sovereign LORD says: From the north I am going to bring against Tyre Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, King of kings, with hors…[Read more]