Jodi:  I have started a chart that I have titled The Pre-existence Debate and of course John 8 is on there. I am hoping to share it soon and as debate continues I can always add to it.

You’re welcome to use the Preexistence Scriptural Database that I began right here 12 years ago if you want.  I just kept editing the first post as people p…[Read more]

Oh, just thought of an English example of a “historical present” that was described in my previous post.  Picture a 14 year old girl talking to her BFF…

And then she goes, well I liked Brian first!  And so I say, that doesn’t matter, because he likes me, not you!  And then she is all like, I hate you!

The bolded words are all English present te…[Read more]

Berean: No Jodi, I’m not fooled.
Before Abraham WAS, THE SON OF GOD EXISTED!
IT’S NOT COMPLICATED.

THIS IS CONFIRMED BY JOHN 17:5
And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. 

…..with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

SIMPLICITY JODI

That is 100% scriptura…[Read more]

Jodi:  From atoms, to cells, to looking at entire eco systems, we see creations of God’s wisdom.

Sounds to me like you’re conflating “the wisdom IN God’s creation” with various different “creations OF God’s wisdom” – as if God created different “wisdoms” with each thing He created.

But I’m sure we’ll touch on Prov 8 again in the new thread whe…[Read more]

Jodi:  We all just keep going around in circles and I think this will stop that where I have hopes that people will finally give explanations to scriptures that I see are being ignored.

Amen!  That’s precisely the reason I urged Kathi to start this thread, and the reason we now have our own preexistence thread.  Enough circling already! 😎

Carmel: Christ of God – Luke 9:20  JESUS, THE MIGHTY GOD, Isaiah 9:6, THE HIGHEST, NOT THE FATHER,

GODMAN! 

Christ and Messiah both mean refer to someone who was anointed by God for a specific task/purpose.  The Bible includes many different christs/messiahs – Jesus being one of them.

So the title “Christ/Messiah of God” simply means that Jesus…[Read more]

Jodi:  You are removing words of the text to show me that my interpretation doesn’t match the text? That sounds odd my friend.

I was trying to make it easier for you to see that Jesus is the firstborn of ALL creation…. AND ALSO the firstborn from among the dead.  But I’m going to defer to our new private thread for this and all other pre…[Read more]

Jodi: Hi Mike,

This is what I was first addressing in my next post leading up to Proverbs 8.

1 Chronicles 17, “I will be his father, and he shall be my son…”

Psalms 89, “I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth.”

These words were originally said about Solomon, right?

Jodi:  There was NO SON YET and NO FIRSTBORN…

[Read more]

Proclaimer:  

Point #2…

If the earth was a ball, we wouldn’t be able to see that sun reflection from the horizon to our feet in the first place.  I’ll use an image for this one…

If I am the little red arrow standing at the shoreline, my eyes would be able to see the sun in the sky (blue dashed line), but the reflection from the sun co…[Read more]

Proclaimer:  Truth Bomb 2
Flatties claim that the sun doesn’t disappear behind the horizon, but that it gets so far away that it escapes our range of view. However , if that were the case, the reflection would remain on the waters since it’s still there and the reflection stretches all the way from the horizon.

Wait… are you saying that if t…[Read more]

Proclaimer:  TRUTH BOMB 1

…flat earthers are not wise…

Wow, you really got us on that one.  We’re devastated, and there’s just no coming back from such an authoritative claim from a person who thinks gravity’s attractive force pulls masses together up to the point that its repellant force takes over, and just holds the two masses in limbo a…[Read more]

Okay Berean, for these last 3 entries, think back to the YouTube animation of how seasons work on a flat earth…

53) At places of comparable latitude North and South, the Sun behaves very differently than it would on a spinning ball Earth but precisely how it should on a flat Earth. For example, the longest summer days North of the equator are…[Read more]

52) Iceland at 65 degrees North latitude is home to 870 species of native plants and abundant various animal life. Compare this with the Isle of Georgia at just 54 degrees South latitude where there are only 18 species of native plants and animal life is almost non-existent. The same latitude as Canada or England in the North where dense forests…[Read more]

50) If the Earth were truly a globe, the Arctic and Antarctic polar regions and areas of comparable latitude North and South of the equator should share similar conditions and characteristics such as comparable temperatures, seasonal changes, length of daylight, plant and animal life. In reality, however, the Arctic/Antarctic regions and areas of…[Read more]

49) If Earth were a spinning ball heated by a Sun 93 million miles away, it would be impossible to have simultaneously sweltering summers in Africa while just a few thousand miles away bone-chilling frozen Arctic/Antarctic winters experiencing little to no heat from the Sun whatsoever. If the heat from the Sun traveled 93,000,000 miles to the…[Read more]

Berean: Salut Mike 

Can you explain the seasons in the flat earth model because I only understand in the case of a globe earth. thank you.

Hi Berean.  Here is an animation that attempts to address your question.  (You don’t have to watch the whole thing play out.  You can just grab the red dot on the time bar at the bottom and slide it to the…[Read more]

Proclaimer: Danny, using the bible, there appears to be a number of errors with your diagram above. Let’s start with this one:

And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

And God called the firmament (raqia) Heaven. And the evening and the mor…

[Read more]

Proclaimer: @dannyd

Also explain why the sun goes down, which is possible in the heliocentric model, but not the flat earth model. Thank you in advance.

The sun rises, and the sun goes down, and hastens to the place where it rises.

The word translated as “rises” means “comes forth”.  The word translated as “goes down” means “goes in”.  But it…[Read more]

Berean: And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so. (Genesis 1:15)

GOD DOES NOT Dwell IN THE FIRMAMENT(raquiya) OF THE HEAVEN( BUT IN HEAVEN (shamayim)

 

1Kings 8:49

Then hear thou their prayer and their supplication in heaven thy dwelling place, and maintain their cause,…

It is ce…

[Read more]