These scriptures that teach the pre-existence of Jesus have been compiled by Irene (Baker), Pierre (Terrarica), Wm (Seeking Truth), Mike (mikeboll64) and t8. There are currently 48 scriptures or passages listed. Proverbs 8:22-31 NIV22 “The LORD brought me forth as the first of his works, before his deeds of old; 23 I was formed long ages a…[Read more]

Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 21 2010,11:34)Mikethis is new to me were is this written??i think this comes from JA?I thank you for reminding me that the Nephilim were in Canaan after the flood.  Shimmer was right that angels might actually still be procreating with humans to this very day.  I thought God had put an end to it after the flood, but I w…[Read more]

Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 21 2010,11:26)T8can we bring a copy of all our scriptures that we have collected right here in the begining so we do not have to search for them in a other placepierreHey Pierre,I'll add the last few in by order and post it here for us. I'm sure t8 won't mind.mike

Quote (t8 @ Nov. 21 2010,11:00)Do you have any other verses that you think do not fit what I am saying?Hi t8,Here are just a few.John 8:44You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Nov. 21 2010,10:59)The word for son is 'huios' and it is not using the word 'theos'.Hi t8,This info is from NETNotes:Joh 1:181tc The textual problem μονογενὴς θεός (monogenh” qeo”, “the only God”) versus ὁ μονογενὴς υἱός (Jo monogenh” Juio”, “the only son”) is a notoriously difficult one. Only one letter would have differe…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 21 2010,04:01)Hi Mark,Mike consistently shows us how the NWT translates proskuneo as not 'worship' when given to Jesus.  He knows that those that developed the NWT believed that Jesus was an angel and they translate accordingly since the Bible speaks directly to not worshiping angels.  In another thread Mike claims that J…[Read more]

Quote (mikeangel @ Nov. 21 2010,07:31)As I stated before, I wouldn't trust the men who translated the NWT, I'm not a JW, why would I?Okay Mark,That statement says alot about you Mark.  I wouldn't dismiss any translation based on that reason.  But then again, I actually check out the Hebrew and Greek words to find out what a scripture is REALLY s…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Nov. 21 2010,09:18)Scripture talks about many gods (theos) but says that there is only one Almighty Theos IDENTIFIED as the Father.So yes there are many who partake in divine nature, but there is only one is the Divine.Hi t8,We've discussed this briefly before, and I'm still not on board with this “nature” thing.  Idols were “gods” to…[Read more]

JA:Quote The Angels were not 'Angels' when they procreated. They are Spirits…they created human bodies, placed themselves, that is 'Spirit', so the bodies became 'living souls' and then procreated….What scripture taught you this JA?  Anyway, no matter how you slice it, it still ends up with “spirit sperm” impregnating a human egg.  And the a…[Read more]

Quote (seekingtruth @ Nov. 21 2010,05:29)I appreciate your posting the scriptures with chapter and verse for me, this is how it should work;Hi Wm,I almost always do it this way. In fact, I usually post the whole scripture and which translation it was from in the color blue.I will take to heart your words about leaving out “liar” and “deciever”…[Read more]

Proverbs 30:4 (New International Version)4 Who has gone up to heaven and come down?   Whose hands have gathered up the wind? Who has wrapped up the waters in a cloak?   Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is his name, and what is the name of his son?   Surely you know!(Thanks for that one t8)NASB Romans 9:5 whose are the fa…[Read more]

JA:Quote Mike,Only two questions…Jesus is directly created from God, you say,…so he is God from God.And, you say, God created the Angels through Jesus.1) What higher glory can a God from God have?2) If Jesus is God from God, how would anyone want to compare him to that which he had a hand in creating – Angels.(Is the Potter compared to the…[Read more]

Quote (mikeangel @ Nov. 20 2010,23:24)Due to this I will assume you are a JW.Hi Mark,And once again the old “assume” addage is proven true! I am not a JW, nor do I believe everything that they do. In fact I strongly oppose some of their understandings of scripture, especially that Jesus actually IS the archangel Michael.What I was pointing out is…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 19 2010,11:29)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Nov. 18 2010,17:39)Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 19 2010,07:31)true but He tells Peter to feed HIS sheep, He doesn't say to feed His Father's sheep but His sheep.Does Jesus refer to the ones that his God has given him out of the world?Scriptures say “Yes”.  In fact, Jesus says, “they were yours,…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 21 2010,04:41)For indeed Jews  ask for signs and Greeks search for wisdom; 23 but we preach Christ crucified, to Jews a stumbling block and to Gentiles foolishness,  24 but to those who are the  called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than me…[Read more]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 21 2010,03:31)Notice When Jesus was Showing his disciples about himself he used the scriptures that were written (ABOUT) him , he never said a was alive before he ever was born on earth as a angel or anything.Hi Gene,Sure he did.  That's what Matthew 22:44-46 is all about.  Jesus is telling the Pharisees who were also e…[Read more]

Hi Gene,I will bump what I posted to Adam to you:John 6 NIV41 At this the Jews there began to grumble about him because he said, “I am the bread that came down from heaven.” 42 They said, “Is this not Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? How can he now say, ‘I came down from heaven’?”1.  Jesus CLEARLY said he “came down f…[Read more]

Hi Adam,But I thought you told t8 that you have led 50 people to Christ.  Maybe I misread what you wrote?Because you can't lead anyone to a Christ that hasn't yet come, right?Adam, I would suggest reading the words of the gospels.  Many times the writers directly point out the OT Messianic prophecy that was fulfilled by something that Jesus did o…[Read more]

Kerwin:Quote Mike Boll,I do take Micah 5:2, Philippians 2 and John 17:5 literally.  I just take into account that God know all things even those that will occur in the future and acts according to that knowledge.Hi Kerwin, I agree with you that God is the One telling the end from the beginning, because scripture says so.  But that fact doesn't e…[Read more]

Quote (JustAskin @ Nov. 19 2010,19:50)Here he is now also agreeing with Shimmer about Angels 'procreating' with humans, when he claimed over and over that JustAskin was making this up….Hi JA,That's not exactly the way I remember it.  I remember you claiming as fact your OPINION that spirits cannot procreate.What Shimmer and I have worked out is…[Read more]