Okay Jack.I guess that the mss that Biblos.com, the JW's interlinear, and the 8 translations I posted above were newer mss?  Where is your source to back up your claim?I'll look into it some more when I have the time.  As I told Kathi a long time ago, this scripture does not really do her justice anyway, for even inanimate objects are often r…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 06 2011,14:49)Mike,I merely wish to establish that flesh and blood can enter heaven to counter some who state scripture declares it cannot.Then find yourself a scripture that clearly says flesh CAN enter heaven……………not one that is at best a “maybe”.  Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 06 2011,14:49)A second point I strive to…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 06 2011,15:54)Jesus claim that all things including all judgement are in his hands is a claim to equality with God!”Debunked!Ah, but Jesus' claim wasn't simply that “all things ARE IN my hands”, was it?  His claim was that his God “has PLACED all things in my hands”.There is a big difference, Keith.  You claim that b…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 06 2011,14:36)Scripture declares that Jesus is the son Abraham, David, and Mary.Kerwin, did you even read the scriptures I listed?  What exactly do you think Jesus was trying to tell the Pharisees?  (I'll give you a hint:  It was the SAME EXACT THING we've been trying to tell you…………..that he was not only the BRANCH of…[Read more]

Only if you consider being touched or eating something to be activities that can only be performed by one with HUMAN FLESH, Kerwin.I do not consider that to be the case.peace,mike

Jack and Keith,Please stick to the exercise of this thread. We are supposed to be finding the directly quoted words of Jesus himself where he clearly teaches us that he IS God Almighty. (From the first 8 chapters of John's gospel.)All I need to see from you is a quoted scripture from one of the first 8 chapters of John, and your explanation as…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 06 2011,15:21)Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 31 2011,11:56)Using ONLY the words of Jesus himself, as DIRECTLY quoted by John up until chapter 8, verse 24, can you show us where JESUS HIMSELF ever claimed to be God, or equal to Him?MikeThe above is your challenge. I have shown you by Jesus own words that “all things are in…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Aug. 06 2011,13:17)MikeJohn 1:1 tells us Jesus is “theos\god”.Hi Keith,Welcome aboard…………….FINALLY.  John 1:1 does not actually teach what you pretend it does.  In reality, 1:1 speaks of a god called “the Word”, who happened to have been WITH THE God in the beginning.  But since 1:1 does not include the di…[Read more]

Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ Aug. 05 2011,09:17)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 02 2011,13:04)Well, at least they would be safer there Pierre.  They wouldn't have to put up with you and Irene and t8 and me constantly blasting that comically flawed, man-made doctrine to shreds.  Mike tears his own theology to shreds by speaking out of two sides of his mouth. J…[Read more]

Jack,Look at the green part of my post at the top of this page.  Notice the bolded word, “IT”, is masculine.  Is the church both a “HE” and a “SHE”?

I'm enjoying this discussion greatly. But I am wondering if anyone is ever going to post a scripture that clearly teaches us that Jesus is still a human being in heaven?

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2011,02:45)Mike,You wrote to Marty that:Quote Scripture doesn't record the transformation Jesus underwent as he ascended into heaven.  But he left the earth as flesh and blood, and we know those things cannot inherit God's Kingdom.I want to point out to you that scripture does not record angels tranforming either.Yes,…[Read more]

Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 04 2011,23:28)Mikei think that, that scripture only testify that it was Christ ,but was it the real body ? because they never recognized him each time that he appear to them ,PierreHi Pierre,I think that if Jesus was a spirit being who just “manifested” a flesh and bone body to FOOL his disciples, he would have been being…[Read more]

I agree Irene! I can't believe Kathi takes a scripture that says we have but ONE GOD, THE FATHER, and tries to use that very scripture to claim that Jesus is ALSO our God. It is true that Jesus is our Lord, but only because God made him so:Acts 2:36“Therefore let all Israel be assured of this: God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both L…[Read more]

Thanks, Irene.I can't believe I left out “Messiah/Christ/Anointed one” OF his God.

Quote (ftk @ Aug. 06 2011,04:20)Mike: Jesus confirmed that he was the Messiah to come or the Christ at John4:26, I that speak unto thee am he….Very good, Tim.  So when Jesus said he was exactly who he'd been claiming to be all along, it includes “Messiah OF God”, right?  Not “God Himself” or “Equal TO God”, but “One whom God anointed”, r…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2011,23:18)When I see scriptures that Jesus is the son of Abraham, David, and Mary then it becomes obvious that he did not exist before they did and so I am convinced those that believe in preexistence do not properly believe is passages such as Matthew 1:1 and Luke 1:31.Hi Kerwin,And the Pharisees also thought the same as…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2011,02:18)You believe Jesus is a spirit being that stopped being a spirit being for 30+ yearrs and then picked up being a spirit being one more.  In the meantime you believe you believe he was a human being.  I believe that the preexistent Spirit of God the first born of all creation through which all things were made a…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 05 2011,23:35)Mike,If you are willing then I would point out that 2 Corinthians 12:1-4 does not stat that the man Paul knew viewed the third heaven  it literally states he was caught up into the third heaven and then later caught up into paradise.  I therefore assure you that he entered heaven as that is the result of being c…[Read more]

Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 05 2011,07:38)Hi T8 and Mike,I've been reading and enjoying all the rudimentary philosophies. (Col.2:8) Because one can explain an idea, does not make it biblical!Here is yet another verse that has to be gymnastically explained away to fit the many cocamemy ideas presented here; NO NAMES!Philippians 2:9-11 Wherefore God also…[Read more]