Mike,Do you realize that on one post you want a scripture that makes it crystal clear that show the Son was from eternity and in another post you want me to show you that He ALWAYS existed. Those are two different questions. I have answered you regarding the Son being from eternity with both John 1 and Prov 8. Both of those chapters makes it…[Read more]

Pierre,And then there is the the favorite little bbq stand that is initiated, owned, and run by the father, and managed by the son…he is the buyer, the cook and serves the food…their spirit fills the air and people love the food and service and recognize the father and son as the makers of the little bbq stand. See, Pierre? Without even one…[Read more]

Hello,I choose that there is only one true Godhead which includes the Father, Son and Spirit. I know that is not one of the choices and so I can't really vote here.Many religions recognize one God and their God is the cause of everything, or the 'principal.' I believe that the God of the Christians is all-sufficient to create AND to be…[Read more]

Keith??

Hi Mike,you said:Quote Why do you keep asking more and more questions when you haven't been able to answer my first one yet? I have attempted to answer all your bolded questions. Truthfully, I am not satisfied with any of your answers to my bolded questions but at least I am realizing that you are making an attempt. Feel free to stay on one topic…[Read more]

Hi Mike,Thanks for your thoughts…we have so much we could go on and on about. This is good!Regarding your NET notes, are you prepared to say that God was without wisdom at one point? The Almighty God…without wisdom? Whether or not the word in Prov 8:22 is create, I'm sure that it does not intend to imply that the Almighty God did not have…[Read more]

Hi Keith,Keith's question #1 to KathiCan you show me a scripture that implies Jesus was a “son” in the Father before he came into existence as a begotten Son?This verse implies that He was in the Father and came out from Him…and that He sent Him. The fact that He said to the disciples that He was the Son of God implies that He came out from…[Read more]

OK Keith…I will wait for your first question. Remember, this is only a place for an ongoing discussion between us without distractions from other posters, not some formal debate to try to win. Bless you,Kathi

Hi Mike,Thanks for your answer. I noticed that you did not include all of the default definition that I suggested…the part about the offspring having the same nature as the parent/parents. I will assume that you also agree to that since you didn't say otherwise.Here is another answer to your question #2 to me:Your question #2:But moving…[Read more]

Keith,I like the format that Mike and I are discussing with. Can we do the same? If so, I'll go ahead and open it with a post like I did there and I will let you start with your first question. We will do one question at a time, back and forth, and eventually we will cover your initial posts from here…over there, if you would like. I would…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ April 30 2011,23:25)Keith,I'm back…my electricity is now working again after 72 hours.  I read through this thread and I think a one on one 'discussion' would be more effective, don't you?  It gets very distracting with all those who deny the deity of Christ posting as well.  I really don't want to debate, just discuss re…[Read more]

Ok Mike,My original question #2:Mike, can you show me a verse that says the first of it's kind is also considered the firstborn of that kind? 'Kind' meaning nature. My question #2 to Mike, restated for better understanding, will be asked in two questions:Kathi's question #2 to Mike:Do you agree that the only begotten Son was a literal offspring…[Read more]

Dear Mike,Let's take a slight time out here to clarify our rules. I think that we should number our questions and answers so that we can clearly see that we are each getting in a question after an answer and label it something like “Kathi's question #2 to Mike, Kathi's answer to Mike's #2 question”. Also, there are likely going to be many times…[Read more]

Mike,Yes, the word was God, in the beginning and we know that the 'word' was the Son who was with the Father in the beginning.Mike, can you show me a verse that says the first of it's kind is also considered the firstborn of that kind? 'Kind' meaning nature.

Mike,Good, remember them for our discussion thread.Kathi

Mike,I started our discussion thread. I will answer you there. Kathi

Pierre,We disagree then. So be it.Kathi

Mike,Can you show me a scripture that tells us that the only begotten Son did not exist before He was begotten before the ages?Kathi

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 01 2011,19:16)Quote (Lightenup @ May 01 2011,16:44)Mike,1 Cor 8:6yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.For one thing, the 'all things' does not include the one Lord, Jesus Christ otherwise He…[Read more]

Pierre,Deity is not created, Jesus is deity because He is the only begotten Son of God. His nature is not a created nature. He 'came out from thee' and was always within before that. The Father was all sufficient to save from eternity. He didn't have to create a savior to become flesh, He always had that savior within Him.Kathi