Mike,Quote The boy scoutS made the fire. Are you saying that “GodS created man in THEIR image”? Elohim is a plural word, like 'scouts' is a plural word, so? I'm saying that the word “God” in the Genesis verse “Let US make man in OUR image” is likely the God who is a unity of more than one member. In that verse, one member of the unity is…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 11 2011,10:25)Quote (Devolution @ Dec. 11 2011,02:12)Quote (jammin @ Dec. 11 2011,12:28)who is this GOD that spoke to the prophets long ago Hebrews 1:1-2Hi Jammin,It was the Father.I am not sure where your question is going here…I believe Jammin is making the same point you are, Devo.The God who spoke to the Israelites…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 09 2011,22:53)Quote (Lightenup @ Dec. 09 2011,21:16)Mike,Quote EVEN Trinitarians, and others who think Jesus is either the Father he is the Son of, or the God he is the Son of. Trinitarians do not believe that.KathiKathi, If Trinitarians believe Jesus is God Most High, then they believe that Jesus is the God he is the Son…[Read more]

Quote (jammin @ Dec. 17 2011,11:04)you are using angels created by GOD. they are not the same with GOD and christ. the term equal in phil 2:6 can not be used to the created angels of GOD. i agree with you jammin' Jesus is not a created angel…He created the angels. The Son is the same type of being as the one that beget Him.Like begets like…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Dec. 18 2011,09:39)Quote (Lightenup @ Dec. 17 2011,23:22)Amen jammin, and welcome!  It is God not god you are absolutely correct!KathiActually, Kathi agrees that there are TWO completely different gods spoken of in John 1:1 – one of whom was WITH the other.In fact, Kathi and I once agreed to the Father being “GOD”, with all…[Read more]

Pierre,Can man say to man, “You are my son?” My husband can say that to four men…he has four sons. Why is that hard for you?Kathi

Amen jammin, and welcome! It is God not god you are absolutely correct!Kathi

Mike, It says 'let Us make' and that indicates more than one person. The unity created. God is a singular person in some contexts and a unity of more than one person in other contexts. The unity performs a singular action, i.e. more than one person performs a singular action which could easily be the case in this verse. Remember the two sticks…[Read more]

Mike, I answered your questions. Did you miss that?Kathi

Mike,Gen 1:26″Let Us make man…”You do believe that the 'us' includes the Son, right? The 'us' would be the subject of the quote.Also, the plural form of the word 'creator' or 'maker' appears in the OT.Is 54:5 has the word 'maker' in the plural in the Hebrew.For another example, Ecclesiastics 12:1, has the word 'creator' in the plural in…[Read more]

Mike,Is 43:11Acts 26:15 Jesus says “I am Jesus” which means “I am Yahweh saves” which, when you substitute “Yahweh” with “I Am” you get “I am I Am saves”What is your point, Mike? If Yahweh never said “I am Yahweh” would that mean He couldn't be Yahweh?

Mike you know that there are passages that acknowledge that Jesus was credited as the agent of creation.John 1:3Col 1:16Heb 1:31 Cor 8:6

No Mike, I don' acknowledge that.

Quote (Devolution @ Dec. 09 2011,20:13)Quote (Lightenup @ Dec. 10 2011,08:18)Welcome Devolution,you said:Quote Would like to discuss this famous statement that trinity believers quote so often as one of the bedrocks to their belief of Jesus being the father Himself.Trinitarians do not believe that the second person is the first person of the…[Read more]

Mike,Quote EVEN Trinitarians, and others who think Jesus is either the Father he is the Son of, or the God he is the Son of. Trinitarians do not believe that.Kathi

Welcome Devolution,you said:Quote Would like to discuss this famous statement that trinity believers quote so often as one of the bedrocks to their belief of Jesus being the father Himself.Trinitarians do not believe that the second person is the first person of the trinity. That would be Modalism.Kathi

Mike, Jehovah didn't even say I am I am. So?

Mike,In your example all the 'you's and your's' are pointing to one person, the Father. In Hebrews all the you's are pointing to one person, the Son. The 'and' is just a part of the reason this is further talking about the Son, all the 'you's' are another reason. Have you noticed the Eusebius thread and that Eusebius admits to there being a…[Read more]

Pierre:Heb 1:8 But of the Son  He says,         “ YOUR  THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER,         AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM.9“ YOU  HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS;         THEREFORE GOD, YOUR  GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU         WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS.”10And,         “ YOU , LORD,…[Read more]

Here in this quote we can see that Eusebius understands the scriptures to be speaking of two Lords (Jehovah is what the Hebrew word is for 'LORD' in the OT at this event which Eusebius references), btw, he also does not consider the Son as one of the subordinate angels as you can see here:Quote 9. Moses most clearly proclaims him second Lord after…[Read more]