Oh, David, it's so hard for you to admit that Jesus receives deity worship in the Bible.All things were made by HimHe is the Lord of allHe is the Lion of JudahHe is the Root of JesseHe is the First and the LastHe is the Alpha and the OmegaHe is the Lord of lordsHe is the great ShepherdHe is the Redeemer of IsraelHe purchased the church with His…[Read more]

Mike, contd.You said:Quote Jesus was begotten BY God. (Psalm 2:7, John 3:16)Jesus is a creation OF God. (Col 1:15, Rev 3:14)Jesus is the Son OF God. (Matt 16:16)Jesus is the Word/Spokesman OF God. (John 1:1, Rev 19:13)Jesus is the Messiah/Christ/Anointed One OF God. (Luke 2:11, Acts 2:36)Jesus is the sacrificial Lamb OF God. (John 1:29, Rev…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 31 2013,14:38)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 28 2013,23:24)………i didn't ignore it for some trick. I just spoke about what I thought was his main point. I don't have time to always address everything………….And by His simple will the Word sprang forth……… became the firstbegotten work of the Father…………. we…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ April 01 2013,17:06)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 29 2013,18:47)God the Father, sent God the Son. Two persons in unity, not melded together.No fail here, just rocky soil that heard this before but the wind blew it away.Oh so you are unique in that God is not a substance as the Trinitarians teach.So God HIM is really THEY.Got it. Makes…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 01 2013,19:42)(4)  Now there are many who are sincerely concerned about religion, and who fall here into great perplexity. They are afraid that they may be proclaiming two theos and their fear drives them into doctrines which are false and wicked.Who here refuses to accept John 1:1 the way it was written, due to a fear…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2013,21:45)Quote (t8 @ Mar. 27 2013,01:13)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 27 2013,20:14)I believe the Tatian quote is showing how the Father did not become less when He begat from Himself another person, like how one flame can start another flame without becoming less than it was before. It is the idea of being fruitful by…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2013,21:28)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 25 2013,23:06)Quote (mikeboll @ 64)Because the scriptures I know about speak of Jesus having origins “from days of old”, and being the “firstborn of every creature”, and being “the beginning of the creation by God”, etc.And you do not understand ANY of those things accurately,…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 27 2013,18:31)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 27 2013,12:04)Quote (t8 @ Mar. 26 2013,23:38)Also notice the words “But He came into being”.What does that tell you?t8A tree comes into being from a seed, that doesn't mean it's coming into being was a beginning of existence. It just means that it came into being in a different state. It…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Mar. 27 2013,17:04)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 28 2013,05:26)The Roots sent the Shoot and yet the Shoot is the continuation of one of the Roots, therefore one of the Roots and the Shoot are the same person as Jesus says that He is the Root and Offspring of David. The first Root sent the second Root to continue it's life in a Shoot and as a…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Mar. 27 2013,02:05)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 27 2013,20:04)t8A tree comes into being from a seed, that doesn't mean it's coming into being was a beginning of existence. It just means that it came into being in a different state. It went from within a seed to be apart from the seed. It existed within the seed before it came forth from the…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Mar. 26 2013,01:54)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 26 2013,20:47)I never said that Jesus was God the Father too.You are saying that Jesus is the Only true God too and that he sent Jesus because we both know that the only true God sent Jesus. Two problems here. 1) The only true God is the Father, so you are wrong.2) The only true God sent…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Mar. 27 2013,17:00)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 28 2013,05:26)Jesus is not an attribute of God, Jesus has the fullness of God in Him.Are you talking to yourself here.I believe Jesus is a being, not part of God as you do.He was begotten by God and even Jesus said, “if God was your Father, you would believe that I came from God”.First you do…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 28 2013,20:34)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 27 2013,10:58)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 19 2013,23:03)The point of my exercise is that ALL of the things said about the Word in John 1 are also said about Jesus in other scriptures.  That isn't the case with “the Most High God” and “the Son of the Most High God”, is it?In some verses…[Read more]

Bo,The Father and Son…two persons giving one direction via their Holy Spirit. Your verse about serving two masters is about two persons each giving different directions. The Son speaks what He hears the Father saying, and He does what He sees the Father doing. They give only one directive, not each giving opposing directives.Quote Jesus is never…[Read more]

Mike,you keep saying this but it is not true for the Hebrew. For the Greek it is true. Hebrew just has feminine and masculine words, no neuter.Quote All words in Hebrew and Greek have either a masculine, feminine or neuter gender, but this does not dictate the sex of one who has a title related to a word that has grammatical gender

Quote (jb2u @ Mar. 27 2013,15:46)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 28 2013,07:28)3. You say that one 'set' of something doesn't have singular personal pronouns to go with it. I disagree completely. The church is a 'she.' Israel is 'my,' 'I,' even in the Shema, Israel is singular and 'hear' is the singular verb with it yet Israel is one as a 'set' as you…[Read more]

Quote Oh Lightenup (please read all of my words)…”the gods that I believe exist” as you say are the same ones that God claims exists.Psalm 82God refers to judges as “gods.”1 Cor 8:5God states “there be gods many, and lords many.”But we are talking about a belief in a trinity. Let's start at Deut 6:4God states “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is…[Read more]

terarricca,Jesus has no beginning of days…He is the eternal life that was with the Father in the beginning.

Kerwin,Jesus is both the Root and the Shoot…God and Man…and is worthy of my worship. Through Him I was created and redeemed from my sin. He sits on the white horse in Revelations and with His own arm and His own righteousness, He wins the final battle.Kerwin, are you to make a covenant to God through another god?

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 19 2013,23:03)Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 18 2013,22:52)I can show you scriptures that speak of YHVH and also scriptures where the exact things are said of Jesus.And I can show you where those things can be, and are, said of others besides Jesus and his God, Jehovah.  But this is not the thread for it.The point of my exercise…[Read more]