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Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Mar. 19 2011,12:23) But check this out mike.
If you started to call me gene all the time, and someone who doesnt know we are joking, would actually start to believe that my name is Gene becuase again he doesnt know me.
And if Jesus made a habit of calling Peter “Satan”, then you would have point.Psh…………I don't care either.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 20 2011,18:06) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Mar. 19 2011,12:23) But check this out mike.
If you started to call me gene all the time, and someone who doesnt know we are joking, would actually start to believe that my name is Gene becuase again he doesnt know me.
And if Jesus made a habit of calling Peter “Satan”, then you would have point.Psh…………I don't care either.
mike
JFis God or any of is messenger ever JOKED?
if not should you ? or are you not …………
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 20 2011,09:41) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 20 2011,18:06) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Mar. 19 2011,12:23) But check this out mike.
If you started to call me gene all the time, and someone who doesnt know we are joking, would actually start to believe that my name is Gene becuase again he doesnt know me.
And if Jesus made a habit of calling Peter “Satan”, then you would have point.Psh…………I don't care either.
mike
JFis God or any of is messenger ever JOKED?
if not should you ? or are you not …………
Pierre
Oh shut up Pierre,
stop being so Judgemental.Gosh.
No one cares for your Judgemental comments.Hi Mike,
Quote It's hard to debate the spiritual truth, Wispring. I could say that the Holy Spirit is telling me Jesus is NOT God while Dennison could say that same spirit is telling him Jesus IS God. Where would that leave us?
First, I will have to wholeheartedly agree with you that debating spirtual truth is a hard thing. Secondly, It would most likely leave you both in the same places you are now and the same places you both will be in at the conclusion of your debate simply because adding the phrase “I was guided by the Holy Spirit” to say this or present that information to you will not add compelling persuasiveness to either of your arguements to each other in each others mind at this time. I can only hope that you pray for each others eternal salvation as Jesus taught us we should do so that you can both be sons of your Father in heaven.Quote [Quote] (Wispring @ Mar. 18 2011,18:45) Imagine a trinitarian and a non-trinitarian in the presence of God for final judgement. God says something like “You were both close, but, didn't quite fully grasp what my son Jesus Christ was teaching. In the balance, however, your understanding and practice was good enough to qualify for eternal life.”[/q]
That's hardly a possibility IMO. For Trinitarians worship someone other than God as God Himself. That is breaking direct commandments from God and His Son Jesus. I believe that in order to “play the everlasting life game”, you must show you are able to obey and follow the commands of your rulers.
Well, sir, Jesus taught me that all things are possible with God. I personally find that to be a very encompassing teaching. Jesus also taught me that every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. If the truth or non-truth of the tritinitarian doctrine has been revealed via the Holy Spirit to either you or Dennison and either one of you has failed to accept it, God will be the judge of that. My heart and mind lean to the non-tritinitarian point of view based on the things Jesus said. I do see strong logical arguments in the Old Testament also. The Holy Spirit has not yet revealed the truth in this matter to me. To share I have also done much research on the origins of the Trinitarian Doctrine and don't find it compelling enough to my heart and mind to change my mind about at this time. I do remain open to the possibility of it and if it is God's will he will reveal it me via the Holy Spirit. The day God decides to reveal it to me I will immediately share the revelation. I believe I already have everlasting life now and unless I massively change my way of doing the best I can with with the life God has given me in this world of walking in his ways I will be OK.
My God, your God, Jesus God, everones God is more merciful, loving, and forgiving than we individualy or as a group can imagine. I have an undying trust and faith in Him and my love for Him know no bounds. I pray every day that he will reveal more of his self to me and to the world each day I live.
For now I see part of him in every Jesus loving, God Loving person that posts at this site and in the acts of goodness and compassion i see in every day life by all good people. This in itself is a blessing.With Love and Respect,
WispringWhy are we debating? The truth from Jesus about God is multifacited like an expensive diamond. Every facet is a way into the heart of the precious stone. We all think different in manifold ways. No two are alike. If we give our interpretation of scripture, in a positive way intended to build up the hearor then let it be, it is doing the very thing it is sent out to do, build up and enhance with love. There are only scriptures from Jesus that are all gospel/good news for the believer. All condemnation was to unbelievers. If Jesus says you can move mountains, you either can do so and haven't yet, or he made a mistake and you really can't or just maybe with deeper understanding and revelation knowledge you will find the “mountains” to be referring to something else.
A revelation to one person is most often not a revelation to anonther. Time, patience, dedication, meditation, and willingness to change will bring much revelation or enlightenment to your heart. If we keep thinking smaller and smaller we are contracting our minds to death. If we keep pushing and expanding our thinking with the words of Jesus unto the fullness of God we will rejoin the universal source of all creation where we came from. A complete, perfect man/God. Then the first becomes the last. The last (now) becomes as at first. IMO, Blessings to all, every person on this site is growing up into the fulness and perfection of God through Jesus. TK
Here is a beautiful truth from a friend.
“We were created in the image of God, but do we create God in our image? Through an attempt to define your God, you box God in, and by doing so, you box yourself in. The image you have created and thereby are created by, is that of limitation. If the Source of something is perfect, would not the creation of that Source also be? Let go of the misconception that you are less than you are, don't go through life, but LIVE life.”
The problem is that To accept all truths from different doctrines and interpretation is the death of Truth because they are all contradicting one another.
Quote (Tim Kraft @ Mar. 20 2011,03:43) There are only scriptures from Jesus that are all gospel/good news for the believer. All condemnation was to unbelievers.
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’Tim, do these people who were “prophsying, driving out demons, and performing miracles in Jesus' name” sound like “unbelievers” to you? Yet, Jesus tells them, “I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!” And who does Jesus say will enter the Kingdom of heaven? “only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.”
Wispring, what exactly is the will of the Father in heaven?
Deut 13
Fear the LORD your God, serve him only……..Matthew 4:10
Jesus said to him, “Away from me, Satan! For it is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.’ ”Deut 13
6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods”…………do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the LORD your God.My aim is to purge Christianity from this bane of the Trinity Doctrine, which teaches God's little ones, against their own common sense, that the Son OF God is the God he is the Son OF, thereby convincing these little ones to worship and serve as God someone other than Jehovah. You can “pity”, “spare” and “shield” them all you want. I will follow the command of my God to do none of those things.
mike
Hi Mike,
Quote Wispring, what exactly is the will of the Father in heaven?
Well, brother, this scripture fairly well sums up for me what the will of the Father in heaven is.Quote John 14:23 (King James Version) 23Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
I am also not a trinitarian. Read my signature. I also believe in recognizing, loving, serving, and worshiping one God and one God alone.
With Love and Respect,
WispringHi Wispring,
You quoted this scripture: John 14:23 (King James Version)
23Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Wouldn't these be “words” of Jesus that we are told to “keep”: “Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.”
You said:
Quote I am also not a trinitarian. I also believe in recognizing, loving, serving, and worshiping one God and one God alone.
Then maybe you should desist from “pitying”, “sparing” and “shielding” those who encourage God's little ones to worship someone other than Him against His and His Son's direct commandments.Just my opinion.
mike
Hi so-journ,
Perhaps you know of some of the words of Jesus we are to keep, that tell us to worship him as God Himself?
mike
Hello Mike,
“and in vain do they worship Me, teaching teachings, commands of men”
You go through learning hopefully by the Holy Spirit and not Man, and then you go through the spiritual side which is much different…. and understanding what everything means is no longer the main focus.
Does that answer your question Mike?
Hi so-journ,
Not only does that not answer my question, but spawns more.
First of all, I assume you know the one who was being worshipped in vain in your scripture is Jehovah, not His Son Jesus, right?
Secondly, there are many spirits. Even Satan can masquerade as an angel of light, so how much more so his disciples?
Third, the scriptures are not the teachings and commands of men. “All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work.
The Trinity Doctrine, on the other hand, is neither scriptural nor inspired of God. This comically flawed man-made doctrine is an example of what God spoke about in the scripture you quoted. And those who follow this unscriptural teaching of man worship God in vain.
My hope is to educate those who follow this doctrine blindly, not even knowing that it causes them to break the direct commands of both God and His Son.
Now if you're telling me that some spirit is teaching you things that are contrary to what the written word of God clearly teaches, or that this spirit is telling you that we don't need to study the words of God to know what He wants from us, then you are being lead by a spirit of darkness, not one of light. It may be masquerading as a spirit of light, but we have been forewarned about this situation in God's Word. How can we tell? By it's fruit. Are the things this spirit teaches you absolutely and exactly confirmed by God's Word? Well, how can we know that? By reading the written Word of God over and over and studying it very carefully until we get to the point that understanding what everything means IS the main focus.
Everything I speak is derived from and supported by the scriptures. That is how you know my fruit is truth. And if I ever speak unscripturally, be sure to let me know right away so I can correct my mistake as soon as possible.
peace and love,
mikeHi Everyone,
One of the questions put forward in the O.P. was “How do we recieve truth?” I would like to post some scripture and comment about it.
Quote
Matthew 16:13-20 (King James Version)13When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am?
14And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.
15He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
These passages I believe show that the most reliable way of receiving the the truth is by direct revelation from God alone via the Spirit. Jesus even says that he will build his church (Which is the same as God's church because Jesus and God share the same purpose) upon this rock. For a spiritual interpretation of this scripture, the rock is a symbol of the process of revelation.With Love and Respect,
WispringHi Mike.
The stage to come to is spiritualness.
Anyone can corrupt their own thinking by reading anything other than scripture, including discussions and debates here. And the feeling of confusion can be intense, especially if you continue on in that. The only way to recover from that state is to take back control yourself, and if you are knowingly or unknowingly following someone else….then Return to God and He will return to you.
“Perfection” would be – to be drawn by the spirit, taught alone through the scriptures (alone) and to be led to wherever God wants you to be (total submission to Gods will for us)…..The truth has probably been corrupted everywhere today. Too much reading, too much listening, too much Internet forums debating and discussing!…..Truth should be simplistic and it should lead us toward true spirituality (What is spirituality to you Mike?)
Look at scripture, the New Testament Writers were led by the Holy Spirit. Did they spend their time debating? What did they talk about most and what did they do?
If you asked me to write down what I believe, how can I honestly do that? I believe truth is found in what we say and what we do and what is in our heart, more than what it all means.
To find someone else who believes something similar is a good thing, especially if you are on your own and not part of a Church. Wonderful. But then what? If what you have is only being used to debate with other believers…..what of the lost? the sinners? Aren't we supposed to be 'fishers of men?' and “he who turns back a sinner from the straying of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall cover a multitude of sins.
Quote (so-journ @ Mar. 21 2011,02:06) Hi Mike. The stage to come to is spiritualness.
Yes,And the Spirit tells me that everything we need to know and do is written down for us. Follow the written instuctions, and you'll be just fine.
I see the difference in us though. You are more into “love your enemies”, and I'm more like Moses who was so mad that the Israelites were worshipping the golden calf that the shattered the tablets containing the Laws that God had written. Or more like Phinehas who ran a spear through the Israelite man and the Midianite women he brought into the camp. The actions of Phinehas turned back the wrath of God in that case.
mike
Can someone find me a verse where it says we must read the whole bible (includeing the NT) to understand Truth, or have the Truth?
To all,
Love does not tolerate (reconize and respect) sin though it does suffer(endure as pain) it in oneself and others.
To Everyone,
This is a scripture that I found that in my humble opinion does a fine job of describing how someone should behave when teaching the truth. I am continually amazed at the things the Bible reveals.
Quote 2 Timothy 2:22-26 (Young's Literal Translation) 22and the youthful lusts flee thou, and pursue righteousness, faith, love, peace, with those calling upon the Lord out of a pure heart;
23and the foolish and uninstructed questions be avoiding, having known that they beget strife,
24and a servant of the Lord it behoveth not to strive, but to be gentle unto all, apt to teach, patient under evil,
25in meekness instructing those opposing — if perhaps God may give to them repentance to an acknowledging of the truth,
26and they may awake out of the devil's snare, having been caught by him at his will.
With Love and Respect,
Wispring
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