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Nick…..You greatly error not knowing that the word ISREAL,IS NOT JUST JEWS,AS YOU ASSUME. THERE ARE THIRTEEN TRIBES OF ISRAEL,THE JEWS ARE ONLY 1/13 OF THE TRIBES OF ISRAEL. YOU ALSO ERROR IN SAYING THAT Ezk 34 is just talking about the Jews because the word JEW IS NO EVEN MENTIONED THERE. WHAT IT SAYS IS “THIS IS THE “WHOLE” HOUSE OF “ISRAEL”, NOT JUST PART OF IT.
Your denial of what scripture actually says, and then injecting your own conclusions in, is your way of rejecting the word of GOD. You should not pick and chose what just fits your own belifs while rejecting the other scriptures that go againt your belifs. THE “SUM” OF GOD’S WORD IS THE TRUTH, NOT JUST PARTS, that can be taken out of context. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ……………..gene
AndrewAD. ……Yes we are to “GROW IN GRACE AND KNOWLEDGE”, WE ARE IN A JOURNEY TOWARD PERFECTION , we haven’t yet reached it, but we like Paul, forgetting those things that are in the past and press on for the mark of the high calling, and we are more then overcomer,through Jesus the CHRIST OF GOD, who loved us and gave himself for us. IF WE SIN WE HAVE AN ADVOCATE WHITH THE FATHER, JESUS CHRIST. We should always strive to put sin out of our lives, we should be though, overcomming sin in our lives with GODS HELP. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ………………gene
Hi Gene
You said:
DB…….THE REASON JESUS ADDRESS THE BODY AND THE SOUL is because that is what a “living soul” or being is. Two points, one if you will look up the word used there for soul , you will see it can be interputed as spirit. But even if we say soul and body it still can mean that a “living soul” is a body with the breath of life in it, Paul also said
so are you saying that Jesus was really saying “do not be afraid of those who can kill your Body but not kill your spirit”? “but be afraid of the one that can kill both Body and spirit”?
I mean if you interpret soul to be spirit there why not other places? Do you really think that was just a bad interpretation?
Matthew 16:26 What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul?
This is interesting
Isaiah 14:9 New International Version
The realm of the dead below is all astir to meet you at your coming; it rouses the spirits of the departed to greet you— all those who were leaders in the world; it makes them rise from their thrones– all those who were kings over the nations.Now this seems to be talking about active spirits, how do you see this?
Bd…….SPIRITS ARE ACTIVE FORCES, BUT A “LIVING SOUL” IS A BODY WITH THE BREATH OF LIFE IN IT. SPIRITS CAN COME AND GO, BOTH CLEAN AND UNCLEAN , GOOD AND EVIL SPIRITS CAN ENTER OUT LIVING SOULS AND ATTACH THEMSELVES TO US AND BECOME PART OF OUR EXISTENCE. OUR MENTAL STATE IS GREATLY EFFECTED BY SPIRITS, just as unclean spirits can take us one way mentally, clean spirits can take us another way mintally. Remember where Jesus described the person that had the unclean spirit, how it left him and went about in arid (dry) places looking for rest, and reentered him later and his last state was worse then his first, because it brought 7 more worse then itself. All spirits effect our state of being. they all leave us at death, and return where they came from.
You can view our souls as a house that can let spirits come in and go out, GOD VIEWS US AS TEMPLES HE CAN LIVE IN, SPIRITS seek bodies to live in. Even the SPIRIT of GOD, “for HE earnestly desires us”, GOD THE FATHER LIVES VARCARIOUSLY IN AND THROUGH HIS CREATION, evil spirits seek us too, as JESUS TOLD PETER, that Satan sought him to siffth him like wheat, and he prayed to the FATHER that his faith would not fail.
The word spirit and soul get mixed up, espically in the GREEK. The best interputation of what JESUS WAS SAYING ABOUT NOT FEARING THOSE WHO CAN KILL THE BODY, AND AFTER THAT CAN DO NOTHING ELSE, is found in,
Luke 12:4-5. Notice it does not EVEN USE the word “SOUL” THERE, WHY BECAUSE THE BODY THAT WAS ALIVE WAS THE “LIVING SOUL”, i believe that is the best and most accurate translation of what JESUS was saying.
Also BD remember JESUS only commended his SPIRIT in the hands of the FATHER, NOT HIS SOUL, because he knew his soul was going to die, and was going to the grave, waiting for the RESURECTION to take place. That would witness the redemption of his body. Just as PAUL SAID WE ARE HOPING FOR. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ………………gene
Nick & Andrew AD,
We can become self absorbed focussing on striving to be sinless.
It is the work of the sanctifying Spirit and we can only get in the way.
Jesus teaches us:
Luke 13:24 [Full Chapter]
Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.and
Matthew 6:33Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
I know that we are to see God’s righteousness by faith and not by our own works but if our faith does not bear fruit it is false.
Kerwin…….Show us your “FAITH”, WITHOUT WORKS. When we obey the FATHER TROUGH “FAITH” we are showing “HIS” RIGHTIOUSNESS, NOT OUR OWN RIGHTIOUSNESS, RIGHTIOUSNESS IS IMPUTED TO US “BECAUSE OF OUR FAITH”, JUST AS IT WAS FOR ABRAHAM. THERE IS ONLY ONE THAT IS TRULY RIGHTIOUS, AND ONLY ONE THAT IS GOOD AND THAT IS GOD THE FATHER.
If come to a point to be able to do the FATHERS WILL, WE DO WELL, AND THEN WE AS JESUS CAN SAY, WE ALWAYS DO THOSE THINGS PLEASES THE FATHER. “For he works “in” us “both” to will and do of “his” good pleasure.
“For we are saved by GRACE AND THAT NOT OF OURSELVES, it is a “GIFT” FROM GOD”, not of “WORKS” least any should “BOAST”. FAITH IN THE FATHER produces every good work in us. So works are there and they are evidenced in a believers life, BEING EVIDENCED by the power of GOD WORKING IN THOSE WHO ARE OF THE TRUE FAITH. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ………………..gene
Okay Gene
So are you saying the persons spirit is their actual identity in other words out of my Body I would be spirit me?
So is Soul the connecting force? because dead people don’t have spirits in them and spirits look for Living souls if they were to possess them or communicate with them.So the Body by itself is not useful without the “Life”(soul) and the Spirit is an activating force by itself or in a soul…
Is that what you are saying?
Hi KW,
The verses you quote are about ENTRY to the eternal kingdom.
Nothing is more important than obeying this command.
Without it this is all useless talk.
Dear Kerwin,you are right that we should strive to master what can be mastered,and to attain what is attainable,even to realize that which can be realized,then our spiritual work will bear fruit.
You are right that to walk the straight and narrow path requires discipline,but let us not become too down on ourselves or others when we realize we aren’t perfect yet.
BD….. THE COMPLETE YOU, IS YOUR SOUL, the soul is all of you not part of you. Here is a example , the complete computer is what you buy, the word computer is all of it not just part of it, it has it’s own operating system in it at time of purchase, called ROM (READ ONLY MEMORY) SAME WITH US , IN A SENSE WE ARE WHAT WE ARE BORN WITH, WE ALSO HAVE AT TYPE OF RAM (random acces memory) WE CAN ALSO STORE INFORMATION AND ACCESS IT. BUT LIKE A COMPUTER IS DEAD UNTIL IT RECIEVES POWER FROM OUT SIDE OF IT SELF, SAME WITH US, our power is the breath of life, it supplies us with the power to be active. So a SOUL is a “body” and like a computer without power it is dead, unable to funtion, we without the breath of life in our BODY, OUR SOULS are also unable to funtion, we are dead THERE IS NO “LIVING” SOUL, JUST LIKE A COMPUTER WITHOUT POWER IS DEAD, SO ARE WE.
SPIRITS on the other hand are “LIKE” strands of information (intellects) that can be loaded into a computer and stored and recalled , they can inhance the operating ability, BUT some are like a deadly viruses and destory it. Same with us, clean spirits are good and inhance our lives, unclean spirits are evil and work to destory us. They can infect us, as a deadly virus can a computer if allowed into its operating system.
I am not saying we are a computer at all, just using it as a comparsion here, we have over 600 billion nurions to sort and store information with, so we are far,far superior to any computer. Just using this as an analogy nothing more implied.
SPIRITS CAN COME AND GO ,BUT OUR SOUL IS THE REAL US, IT IS THE COMPLETE US IT IS NOT SEPERATE FROM OUR BODIES IT INCLUDES OUR BODIES, IT IS APSOLUTELY CRUCIAL WE ABTAIN THE RESURECTION FROM THE DEAD AFTER WE DIE, OR WE CEASE TO EXIST FOREVER. IMO
WHAT IS EVEN MORE SCARY IS, REVELATION SAYS GOD WILL JUDGE THE “DEAD” OUT OF WHAT IS WRITTEN. IT DOES NOT SAY HE SHALL JUDGE THE “LIVING” OUT OF WHAT IS WRITTEN, BUT THE DEAD. PERHAPS THOSE JUDGED UNWORTHY WILL SIMPLY REMAIN DEAD FOREVER, AND NEVER SEE LIFE AGAIN. That would probably be the more merciful thing for them, There are some scriptures that indicate that, i think i can find them for you if you like.
Again i am not saying or suggesting we are computers, BUT WHAT I AM SAYING IS A “LIVING SOUL” IS A BODY WITH THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IN IT, NOTHING MORE AND NOTHING LESS. Gen 2:7, IMO
AndrewAd,
Dear Kerwin,you are right that we should strive to master what can be mastered,and to attain what is attainable,even to realize that which can be realized,then our spiritual work will bear fruit.
You are right that to walk the straight and narrow path requires discipline,but let us not become too down on ourselves or others when we realize we aren’t perfect yet.
I am not sure how to answer you as Jude and other of the writers of Scriptures definitely get down on others and yet I also you need to encourage your brother in their efforts to do right.
I see your point but there is a time to rebuke your brother as well. There is also times to rebuke yourself. We must always have faith.
I guess my point was our bodies are still bodies when their lifeless. For example, say a person dies for a certain time do you simply say he is a dead soul? If the life is in the blood and the blood stops the life stops but the body still remains. What do you think about what I am saying?
Gene,
Kerwin…….Show us your “FAITH”, WITHOUT WORKS. When we obey the FATHER TROUGH “FAITH” we are showing “HIS” RIGHTIOUSNESS, NOT OUR OWN RIGHTIOUSNESS, RIGHTIOUSNESS IS IMPUTED TO US “BECAUSE OF OUR FAITH”, JUST AS IT WAS FOR ABRAHAM. THERE IS ONLY ONE THAT IS TRULY RIGHTIOUS, AND ONLY ONE THAT IS GOOD AND THAT IS GOD THE FATHER.
Gene,
You are not listening to Paul’s words. If you were then you would see he does not say anything about the “righteousness from God” being imputed(credited). Elsewhere he mentions that Abraham was credited with righteousness because of his faith but that what Paul is writing to Christians is a new things that Abraham only looked forward to. Paul in his letter to the Ephesian Christians to teaches them to take off the old man who disobeys God and put on the new man who is created like Jesus in true righteousness and holiness.
The only room for being credited with righteousness I see is those that believe that God is able and willing to make them righteous as he is righteous but who have not yet become fully mature in Christ. This is because they have faith but God has not yet finished his work. The belief that God is able and willing to make you like him in true righteousness a holiness is the critical factor.
Teaching that it is impossible to stop sinning is a destroyer of that critical factor.
Nick,
I agree but many do not see obeying that command as seeking to be righteous as God is righteous even though Jesus instructs his students to seek first God’s righteousness and God’s kingdom.
Nick,
Philippians 3:14Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
14 I press toward the mark for the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 3:14New English Translation (NET Bible)
14 with this goal in mind, I strive toward the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
Philippians 3:14New English Translation (NET Bible)
14 with this goal in mind, I strive toward the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.
2 Peter 3:14New English Translation (NET Bible)
14 Therefore, dear friends, since you are waiting for these things, strive to be found at peace, without spot or blemish, when you come into his presence.
Other versions use different words that express the same idea just as my example from the AV of KJV does. The Av of the KJV uses the word strive in passages the NET does not. For example:
Luke 13:24Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
24 Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.
Kerwin……again you are taking scripture out of context then trying to bring them back in, no one here as ever said or is teaching it is impossible to have sin put out of their lives,it just the wy it put you have screw up,it is not put out by human efforts, but by the power of GOD, YOU PREACHING OF SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS IS FALSE, AND PAUL SHOWED QUIT CLEARLY THAT ABRAHAMS (FAITH) WAS WHAT WAS ACCREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS, ANY ONE SHOULD UNDERSTAND THAT STRIVING TO PLEASE GOD IS DOING IT BY FAITH.
KERWIN YOU SEEM TO BE SEEKING TO JUSTIFY YOURSELF RATHER THEN GOD, WHO SAID, “OUR’ RIGHTEOUSNESS IS AS FILTHY RAGES TO HIM, NOTICE HE DID NOT SAY OUR EVIL WAS, BUT “OUR” RIGHTEOUSNESS WAS. Have you ever thought why he said that? The very sin of ADAM AND EVE WAS ABOUT APPLYING WHAT IS GOOD AND EVIL TO “THEMSELVES”. TO CREATE IT AS COMMING FROM THEMSELVES, GOD COMMANDED THEM NOT TO “EAT” (take to themselves) FROM THE TREE (that which produces from it’s self) good and evil. Why do you think JESUS SAID THERE IS “NON” GOOD BUT “ONE”, AND THAT IS GOD, he understood you can’t apply good OR evil AS COMMING FROM yourself. ALL GOOD AND ALL EVIL HAS ALWAYS EXISTED, WE EITHER DO ONE OR THE OTHER. NO human being has created GOOD OR EVIL, WE SIMPLY DO ONE OR THE OTHER, if we obey GOD AND DO WHAT HE SAYS, IT “HIS” RIGHTIOUS ACTS WE ARE DOING NOT OURS. That is why it all about FAITH IN GOD, WHO CREATES “IN” US “HIS” RIGHTEOUSNESS NOT OURS. HE IS THE ONE WHO MAKES THE TREE GOOD AND ITS FRUIT GOOD NOT US. SO IF GOD HAS MADE US GOOD TREES, WE CANNOT BRING FORTH BAD FRUIT.
ROM 4:5…. BUT TO HIM THAT “WORKS NOT”, BUT BELIEVES ON HIM (GOD), THAT “JUSTIFIES” THE “ungodly”, his “FAITH” IS “COUNTED” for “RIGHTEOUSNESS”. 6, EVEN AS DAVID ALSO DESCRIBES THE “BLESSEDNESS” OF THE MAN, UNTO WHOM GOD “IMPUTES” RIGHTEOUSNESS WITHOUT “WORKS” 7, BLESSED ARE THEY WHOSE “INIQUITES ARE FORGIVEN, AND WHOSE SINS ARE COVERED. 8, BLESSED IS THE MAN TO WHOM THE LORD WILL “NOT” “IMPUTE” SIN.
ROM 4:13-25…..READ IT ALL AND THINK ABOUT IT KERWIN .
peace and love to you and yours. …………………gene
peace and love to you and yours. …………….gene
Gene,
You are teaching it is impossible to stop sinning and in that you are in error. It is about faith but in order to have faith you must believe it will be done. If you teach that you will always sin while in your mortal body then you are teaching that God either does not have the power to overcome this world or will not use that power to enable those that believe to overcome the world.
Teaching the gospel is about strengthening that belief and not weakening it. James face the hearsay that it was enough to have faith and his response is faith without works is dead. His audience was Christians.
James speech is not against faith but it is against faith that did not bear fruit.
A self righteous individual is a person that is content with there own righteousness and therefore does not seeks God’s righteousness. You cannot be self righteous and still claim to seek God’s unless you are lying about God’s righteousness or that you are seeking it.
Kerwin……FIRST OF ALL WHERE HAVE I EVER SAID said that?, please post it, YOUR JUMPING TO CONCLUSIONS AGAIN, what i did was to quote what THE APOSTLE JOHN SAID, so your argument is with him no me. But tell us kerwin do you have any sin in you? Are you a completely rightious and without sin yourself? Or DO you still need the sacrifice of CHRIST FOR A COVERING, so the shame OF YOUR NAKEDNESS DOES NOT APPEAR?
peace and love to you and yours. ……………..gene
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