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Quote (terraricca @ July 04 2010,07:09) Quote (barley @ July 03 2010,11:49) Quote (Ed J @ July 02 2010,13:09) Quote (barley @ July 02 2010,12:26)
Why would believers preexist? Why bother with sending them down to earth to live if we were already with God before? What about unbelievers? Why send them down to earth to live if they were already with God before? What is this another test from God? If they were unbelievers before, why would they change now? Maybe someone says, so JC could save them? If we already were alive with God and Jesus Christ before, why couldn't God and JC save the unbelievers without a heaven and an earth?See, more problems, no solutions.
Hi Barley,Glad you are now ready to reason together with me concerning us. (Isaiah 1:18)
Rev.12:4 may indicate a Luciferian rebellion involving a third of the Angels of Heaven.
1Peter 1:18-22 may be speaking of an interaction with rebellious Spirits by Jesus Christ.What if we were all with God in Spirit form before we were born here as our Human experience? (John 15:27)
What if we all agreed to: let's call it “A mind Sweep” to erase our Pre-existence memories. (Psalm 22:17)
This would allow all to see who will follow God and who will follow Lucifer/Satan? (Hebrews 2:3)
Have you ever considered that this may in fact be what Life is all about? (2Corinthians 6:2)
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Revelation 12:4 does indicate Lucifer's rebellion against God.I Peter 1:18 does not speak of Jesus Christ being in existence at the time of the rebellion. Verse 20 speaks of Jesus Christ being foreordained or more precisely, foreknown before the foundation of this world. And it speaks that he was made manifest in these last times for you. God clearly foreknew him, but he was not in existence until he was conceived and born.
Psalm 22:17 does not speak of preexistence at all, it is prophetical of future events. Specifically,a partial description of the torture and abuse Jesus Christ would endure for our sakes.
You might want to read II Peter 1:20,21. We are not to let our minds loose on the scripture. We are to study and work the scripture for what it says. We are not to let our imaginations run wild when we study scripture.
hiVerse 20 speaks of Jesus Christ being foreordained or more precisely, foreknown before the foundation of this world.
I GOT ONE QUESTION TO YOU OR ANYONE;HOW DID PETER LEARN ABOUT THAT INFORMATION??
Pierre
I can not give you a precise answer for that.However, I can think of two possibities from scripture.
One possibility is that Jesus Christ had told him. Certainly, not all things that Jesus Christ said are recorded in the scripture. Or in the gospels. See Acts where it is stated that Jesus C. said that it is more blessed to give than to receive. That quote does not appear any where in the gospels.
Another is that the Father showed him, even as the Father shewed Peter that JC is the Christ, the son of the living God.
These two are reasonable possibilities that scripture teaches. There may be others but at this late hour and at first glance, I do not have anymore to offer.
Quote (barley @ July 04 2010,07:32) Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 03 2010,15:43) Quote (barley @ July 02 2010,12:26) I do not in the general scheme of the scriptures, have any reason to conclude that either you or I or Jeremiah or Jesus Christ existed before we were born. God, having foreknowledge would have know about us before our conceptions and births, even as far back as “before the foundations of the world”.
I don't think your “foreknowledge” theory accounts for scriptures like John 1:1-4, 3:13, 6:38, 6:62, 16:28 & 17:5; 1 Cor 8:6, 10:14; Col 1:16; Phil 2:5-8; Heb 1:10 & 2:9; 1 John 1:2, Rev 22:16.In fact, I think they make a mockery of it.
Keep thinking. God's word is not subject to what you think. We are to let this mind be in you, which was in Christ Jesus. We can handle thinking the thoughts of Christ, but God's ways are higher than our thoughts, etc.Mock on.
Barley, you made assertion. I quoted 14 scriptures that are in plain contradiction to it. Are you going to defend your assertion? Or do you just ignore scripture that doesn't align with your doctrines?Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 04 2010,07:42) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 04 2010,01:47) Isa 1:18…………..Not one scripture say “JESUS PREEXISTED HIS BERTH ON EARTH AS ANY KIND OF BEING”
That's right, Jesus did not preexist his “berth”. He's not a ship Gene….
Is 1:18………….Sorry , i am not the best speller here i definitely know that. Birth is what i was meaning. But none the less Jesus did not preexist his Birth here on earth. IMOpeace and love to you and yours …………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 05 2010,00:51) Is 1:18………….Sorry , i am not the best speller here i definitely know that. Birth is what i was meaning.
No worries Gene. I was just having a little fun with you…For All: If any choose to have a possibly new experience, read the New Testament translating the word, “flesh” for carnal, ot physical works unto God. “flesh” refers to the old way. We know that the new way(nt) of Jesus is the spirit/truth by believing. So many people think the reference to “flesh” as being the physical human body. It is not! The comparison is between flesh/ot/physical works, and spirit/nt/truth by believing. We are not in a war with our physical bodies! IMO, TK
Hi T,
Peter knew the ways of God having entered into the heart of God in the Spirit.[1Cor2]
God spoke through him in the same way his Master was used.Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 05 2010,21:08) Hi T,
Peter knew the ways of God having entered into the heart of God in the Spirit.[1Cor2]
God spoke through him in the same way his Master was used.
nicknot so,Peter knew that Jesus was the anointed one but for a while add doubts about it ,until that time that he fully became convinced in his heart that Jesus was what he said he was,and this is were God spirit comes in to give us that conviction not men.and so Peter could answer with that conviction and no doubt.
God get s in your heart trough his word.Pierre
Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 06 2010,07:01) Hi T,
What happened at pentecost?
Were the brothers of Jesus instantly changed?
nicki answer that question already, you know that they have been taught by Jesus during 3.5 years ,not counting there age because they were acquainted with the scriptures because they are Jews.
so no they were not change ,but there understanding became clear and so now could move forward,into the work that Christ as past on to them.
Pierre
Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 04 2010,18:20) Quote (barley @ July 04 2010,07:32) Quote (Is 1:18 @ July 03 2010,15:43) Quote (barley @ July 02 2010,12:26) I do not in the general scheme of the scriptures, have any reason to conclude that either you or I or Jeremiah or Jesus Christ existed before we were born. God, having foreknowledge would have know about us before our conceptions and births, even as far back as “before the foundations of the world”.
I don't think your “foreknowledge” theory accounts for scriptures like John 1:1-4, 3:13, 6:38, 6:62, 16:28 & 17:5; 1 Cor 8:6, 10:14; Col 1:16; Phil 2:5-8; Heb 1:10 & 2:9; 1 John 1:2, Rev 22:16.In fact, I think they make a mockery of it.
Keep thinking. God's word is not subject to what you think. We are to let this mind be in you, which was in Christ Jesus. We can handle thinking the thoughts of Christ, but God's ways are higher than our thoughts, etc.Mock on.
Barley, you made assertion. I quoted 14 scriptures that are in plain contradiction to it. Are you going to defend your assertion? Or do you just ignore scripture that doesn't align with your doctrines?
How is it that those 14 scriptures make a mockery of God's foreknowledge?
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