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@t8,
No t8, I am not saying God is like water…I’m saying that Jesus is identified by Peter in 1 Peter 2 as the Jehovah of hosts of Isaiah 8. Jehovah says this about Jesus (Jehovah of hosts):
13Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offense to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken..
I hope that helps. Thanks for asking! 🙂
Hi Rebecca,
Welcome to Heavennet! Aside from the trinity doctrine, do you understand that Peter in 1 Peter 2, identifies Jesus as the Jehovah of hosts of Isaiah 8:13Isaiah 8
11For Jehovah spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,12Say ye not, A conspiracy, concerning all whereof this people shall say, A conspiracy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be in dread thereof .
13Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.
I hope that helps! 🙂
Very weak argument @Lightenup
Yes the stone is Christ in 1 Peter. And yes it says something similar in Isaiah 8. But did it not occur to you that any description of God would also be true of the servant by which he brings it to fruition. This is basic knowledge and easily seen in many other scripture.
We are told “God is light”. We are told that Jesus is the light of the world. Jesus said of his servants: “Ye are the light of the world”. If God and Jesus are light, then does that make Jesus God? No, if it did, then you could equally argue that we are God too. As one lie leads to another.
In order to mould God into an image that satisfies your carnal thinking, (as all idol worshippers do), you desperately grab at things that could be twisted to your way of thinking, and the result is you are unable to make fair and reasonable judgements regarding scripture.
When Jesus said that the only true God was his Father and that eternal life was to know this God and also himself who the true God sent, he meant exactly what he said.
Whereas you are pretty much saying that Jesus is wrong because the Father is not the only true God. You subtly bring in the lie that the son is also that true God and by doing so, you absolutely oppose Jesus words of eternal life when he called his Father the only true God and the one whom sent him.
If we are to know the only true God and also the one whom he sent, then how can you claim to know him if you make this basic error about who the true God is. Not saying that you do not know him, but that this basic error certainly should make you question that.
Hi Kathi,
I started a thread in the forum part of the site called “Does God Almighty Rule From The Throne Of David?”
Please check it out and give me your comments.
God sent his son into the world to do his will. Thus whatever is said of God can be said of his messenger.
We are told that God is light. We are told that Yeshua is the light of the world. We are also told that we are the light of the world. None of this means that we are God or Jesus is God, just the same as 1 Peter and Isaiah 8 doesn’t say that Jesus is God. In fact the thing that should stand out here is that Yeshua is the one whom YHWH sent, a belief that is part of eternal life. For certainly Jesus did the will of God. Even when he asked for the cup to be removed, he still did God’s will despite his own will.
It only proves that when we do things in the name of someone, that we too get am obvious and similar descriptive. How many times is the Church described in terms similar to Jesus Christ. Quite a lot.
Jesus said that the only true God was his Father and that this only true God is our God and he sent Yeshua to us. And to know both God and Yeshua is eternal life. If you think they are the same God, then how is it that you can claim to know him. Instead you claim to know them. But God is a him. He is the Father. Even the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ.Lightenup.
Where does it say that Jesus is Jehovah?
Isaiah 8:13 Sanctify the LORD of hosts himself; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
Jesus said; your God and my God.
Never said; I am the Father; or I was the Father.
If He was;then God was dead.
If He was not; then God did not truly die.
Then that was all just pretence.(holywood).
If God truly died; The universe would have gone out of course,for all things are framed by the Word of God.
How ever one twists and turns the Word of God:In the end he/she will be found trapped.The only way out is become a deceiver; by rephrasing scriptures, or take away whole verses.(what happened to conscience)?
Jesus is not God, but the WORD of God made flesh.
God’s speech made flesh.God gave *HIS SON*: *NOT HIMSELF*.wakeup.
People who believe that Jesus is God, believe that God died. You are right, who was looking after things when God died? The folly of the Trinity, Binity, or Jesus is God is self-evident. It shouldn’t even be a point of discussion, but some how folly followed folly and now probably over a billion people believe in the Trinity. It is one of the great deceptions of the world.
To all trinies.
It is ridiculous to teach that your God died.
God died for us on the cross you say; and everyone will go; Amen.We non trinies say NO. The Word made flesh died on the cross.
The Lord of host resurrected Him;because he was not dead.
If God resurrected Himself; then God was not dead.He is alive and well.God is not a deceiver of His children.
When Jesus was dying ,HE said: Into they hands I commend my spirit.
God was in heaven; not hanging on the cross.
He also said: Father forgive them;for they do not know what they do.God would not be His own God,when Jesus said: your God and my God.
It gets even worse; they say God went to hell.
But wait; there is more; God appeared to men after his resurrection.
Scripture says; no one can see God and live.
After His resurrection Jesus said: I go to my Father.They use the case of the doubtful thomas as an example;that Jesus is God.
Saying that thomas called Jesus God. How can Jesus appearing to thomas be also God,does God himself has to go to His Father which is in heaven? Was God not in that room with the apostles;as you say,He is?No thomas said: my Lord and my God. My Lord=Jesus and his God,and our God. Many more scriptures can be against the trinies.But the doctrine has set as concrete. We need a slash hammer to break it.
wakeup.
@Wakeup,
Let me just say that trinies do not say that God died. You do not understand the trinity if you believe this. Jesus’ flesh died but He didn’t. The trinies do not believe the Son is the Father, either.Just trying to help you, my friend.
@t8,
The Son is also named Jehovah and that is what you miss, it seems. He represents Himself as He represents His Father. There is no disagreement. They can have the same name because they have the same character, an eternal God character. They are of the same mind. Notice the use of plural pronouns that I use. You would see them in the Bible if you knew Greek, btw.Just trying to help you, my friend.
Matt 28:18
And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.That should help answer your question. Thanks Mike for the invite. I’m trying not to get too spread out.
@Wakeup
Peter identifies Jesus to be the stumbling stone which Isaiah writes about and that stone is called Jehovah (LORD) of hosts by Jehovah. There are two who are named Jehovah. One is the Father and the other is the Son.Hope that helps!
But your doctrine implies it. If Jesus is God and Jesus died, then God died. You have to accept that as part of your doctrinal package. And you need to come up with another theory to explain it. Perhaps 50% God and 50% man and the 50% man died. But then you have to also explain the resurrection. Did the 50% man rise from the dead? Lies always create a mess and needs lots of work to try and keep it intact. The truth is way easier, simple, and often self-evident.
What, someone gave God all authority? So one part of God gave the other all authority. This is silly. I don’t see anyone taking your teaching seriously. But by all means, carry on with the free entertainment.
God is light. Jesus is the light of the world. We are the light of the world. Hello, we are all God or gods right? Well taking your thinking process then yes. But obviously a faulty way of thinking.
What is said of God is very often said of Jesus. Why is that? Because he is like God. So like God that he is the image of God. And because he does God’s will, then what YHWH decides to subject himself to will be done through his son. e.g., God saves, Jesus Saves, even Moses saved.
Once you sign up to a man-made doctrine, then all contrary common sense and self-evidence goes out the window. But you are not alone. Billions are deceived in a similar way and those not caught up in their particular lie can easily see the deception. It is how people end up in cults.
If you do not look at the full counsel of scripture, then you will take what you can and twist it, and ignore all contrary evidence. An extreme example would be an Atheist saying that the Bible says “there is no God”. It says that of course, but he could conveniently miss out the part about him being a fool.Kerwin.
The mark must be seen by every person;christians and non christians.
So can not be a spiritual mark. Such as sunday worshippers.
According to the sda.wakeup.
Lightenup.
No scriptures can proof the trinity doctrine,but only disproof.
All scriptures states that He is the Son of God.
In The old testament; He was mentioned as, the Branch.
In genesis 3:15, He was mentioned as the seed of the woman.(not Mary). But God’s woman.(heavenly Zion).
God is never the seed of His woman. But God’s woman came from inside God. Just as Eve came from inside Adam.
Gods woman is his doctrine,rules and laws. His true doctrine(woman), produces many,many children.
Spirit children;when she will give birth,but Her labour must come first.(tribulation first).wakeup.
Okay then, Kathi. 🙂
I’ll give you the gist of it:
Isaiah 9:7
He will reign on David’s throne and over his kingdom… from that time on and forever.Luke 1:32-33
The Lord God will give him the throne of his father David, and he will reign over Jacob’s descendants forever…….So unless God Almighty will rule forever from the throne of God’s servant David, Jesus isn’t God Almighty………. because Jesus WILL rule forever from the throne of God’s servant David.
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