- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:05) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,11:58) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,03:41) Why do you insist in propagating your own theories over the Scriptures?
Not just my theories WJ,The “greatest Greek teacher” and “most learned theologian of his day” agrees with “my theory”.
How does your understanding fit in with Eusebius' and Ignatius' understanding that Jesus was begotten by the Father “before all ages”?
mike
Scripture Mike!You have none!
WJ
The scriptures are there for all to see WJ.It is you and KJ who want to change definitions for the scriptural words WITHOUT ANY PROOF.
Eusebius and Ignatius are only there to show you your changes are WRONG.
The scriptures say Jesus was begotten by his God. You try to change what the word begotten means, but you can't.
So sorry, your god #2 is the son of the ONLY TRUE GOD and was BEGOTTEN by Him BEFORE ALL AGES.
mike
Hi All
Mikes own words seem to change as he goes along.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 25 2010,22:22) I CANNOT EVEN COME CLOSE TO PROVING JESUS WAS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD PRIOR TO HIS COMING IN FLESH WITH ONLY THE FACT THAT HE WASN'T CALLED THAT UNTIL HE CAME IN THE FLESH. AND I WILLINGLY ADMIT THAT. THAT IS WHY I WON'T USE THIS INFO AS MY FOUNDATION – GET IT?
Why does he insist on trying to prove what he says he cannot prove?WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:06) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,11:58) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,03:41) Why do you insist in propagating your own theories over the Scriptures?
Not just my theories WJ,The “greatest Greek teacher” and “most learned theologian of his day” agrees with “my theory”.
How does your understanding fit in with Eusebius' and Ignatius' understanding that Jesus was begotten by the Father “before all ages”?
mike
The same thing the Father meant when Jesus sat down at the right hand of the Father and the Father declared the decree……He said to me: ‘You are my son! This very day I have become your father! Pss 2:6, 7 – Acts 13:33 – Heb 1:5 – Heb 5:5
The same thing that he meant when David heard his voice say…
I WILL ANNOUNCE THE LORD’S DECREE. HE SAID TO ME: ‘You are my son! This very day I have become your father! Pss 2:7
WJ
This is YOUR understanding WJ.It is merely YOUR understanding of what begotten means.
It is NOT mine, nor Eusebius' or Ignatius'.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:15) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:05) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,11:58) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,03:41) Why do you insist in propagating your own theories over the Scriptures?
Not just my theories WJ,The “greatest Greek teacher” and “most learned theologian of his day” agrees with “my theory”.
How does your understanding fit in with Eusebius' and Ignatius' understanding that Jesus was begotten by the Father “before all ages”?
mike
Scripture Mike!You have none!
WJ
The scriptures are there for all to see WJ.It is you and KJ who want to change definitions for the scriptural words WITHOUT ANY PROOF.
Eusebius and Ignatius are only there to show you your changes are WRONG.
The scriptures say Jesus was begotten by his God. You try to change what the word begotten means, but you can't.
So sorry, your god #2 is the son of the ONLY TRUE GOD and was BEGOTTEN by Him BEFORE ALL AGES.
mike
MikeNo we have shown you the definition is not only what you say.
It is you that denys the scriptures in their context as even your own antitrinitarian friends have tried to tell you.
WJ
Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:17) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:06) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,11:58) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,03:41) Why do you insist in propagating your own theories over the Scriptures?
Not just my theories WJ,The “greatest Greek teacher” and “most learned theologian of his day” agrees with “my theory”.
How does your understanding fit in with Eusebius' and Ignatius' understanding that Jesus was begotten by the Father “before all ages”?
mike
The same thing the Father meant when Jesus sat down at the right hand of the Father and the Father declared the decree……He said to me: ‘You are my son! This very day I have become your father! Pss 2:6, 7 – Acts 13:33 – Heb 1:5 – Heb 5:5
The same thing that he meant when David heard his voice say…
I WILL ANNOUNCE THE LORD’S DECREE. HE SAID TO ME: ‘You are my son! This very day I have become your father! Pss 2:7
WJ
This is YOUR understanding WJ.It is merely YOUR understanding of what begotten means.
It is NOT mine, nor Eusebius' or Ignatius'.
mike
MikeYou can base your faith on what “You Think” they mean if you like
But the truth is in the scritpures and their given context!
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:16) Hi All Mikes own words seem to change as he goes along.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 25 2010,22:22) I CANNOT EVEN COME CLOSE TO PROVING JESUS WAS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD PRIOR TO HIS COMING IN FLESH WITH ONLY THE FACT THAT HE WASN'T CALLED THAT UNTIL HE CAME IN THE FLESH. AND I WILLINGLY ADMIT THAT. THAT IS WHY I WON'T USE THIS INFO AS MY FOUNDATION – GET IT?
Why does he insist on trying to prove what he says he cannot prove?WJ
You have learned KJ's deceitful tricks very well WJ.Take it up in the debate. You know, the one where you keep stalling.
ps Notice the bolded words in my post. I also can't prove Jesus was begotten by God before he came in the flesh WITH ONLY GENESIS 1:1, EITHER.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:10) And as far as “husband and wife”, one might ask the same question about you and WJ. Do you guys call each other and agree on a time to visit HN? Every time one of you posts, the other is right there with a backslap. Have you worked it out to high five each other for every post in the effort that one agreeing with the other will somehow make what the other posted seem more believable? 
Unfortuantely for you guys, no one here gives much credibility to ANYTHING EITHER ONE OF YOU GUYS HAS TO SAY.
So you agreeing with each other is kind of like the clowns running the circus!
mike
MikeWell your friends here disagree with you. That is why they are silent!
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:18) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:15) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:05) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,11:58) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,03:41) Why do you insist in propagating your own theories over the Scriptures?
Not just my theories WJ,The “greatest Greek teacher” and “most learned theologian of his day” agrees with “my theory”.
How does your understanding fit in with Eusebius' and Ignatius' understanding that Jesus was begotten by the Father “before all ages”?
mike
Scripture Mike!You have none!
WJ
The scriptures are there for all to see WJ.It is you and KJ who want to change definitions for the scriptural words WITHOUT ANY PROOF.
Eusebius and Ignatius are only there to show you your changes are WRONG.
The scriptures say Jesus was begotten by his God. You try to change what the word begotten means, but you can't.
So sorry, your god #2 is the son of the ONLY TRUE GOD and was BEGOTTEN by Him BEFORE ALL AGES.
mike
MikeNo we have shown you the definition is not only what you say.
It is you that denys the scriptures in their context as even your own antitrinitarian friends have tried to tell you.
WJ
Agreed on “gennao”. Now show me the alternate definition that would fit from “yalad”. That is the word Paul quoted.mike
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:20) But the truth is in the scritpures and their given context!
Amen to that!And when you are done playing games, you are about to get an education about that in our debate.
mike
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:22) Well your friends here disagree with you. That is why they are silent!
No, I just don't call Kathi up to say, “Let's go double team WJ! Maybe if we both yell nonsense at him at once, it'll make that nonsense seem more believable.” KJ has been a joke since I joined HN. But you used to be respectable. You are now just like him.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:23) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:18) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:15) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:05) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,11:58) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,03:41) Why do you insist in propagating your own theories over the Scriptures?
Not just my theories WJ,The “greatest Greek teacher” and “most learned theologian of his day” agrees with “my theory”.
How does your understanding fit in with Eusebius' and Ignatius' understanding that Jesus was begotten by the Father “before all ages”?
mike
Scripture Mike!You have none!
WJ
The scriptures are there for all to see WJ.It is you and KJ who want to change definitions for the scriptural words WITHOUT ANY PROOF.
Eusebius and Ignatius are only there to show you your changes are WRONG.
The scriptures say Jesus was begotten by his God. You try to change what the word begotten means, but you can't.
So sorry, your god #2 is the son of the ONLY TRUE GOD and was BEGOTTEN by Him BEFORE ALL AGES.
mike
MikeNo we have shown you the definition is not only what you say.
It is you that denys the scriptures in their context as even your own antitrinitarian friends have tried to tell you.
WJ
Agreed on “gennao”. Now show me the alternate definition that would fit from “yalad”. That is the word Paul quoted.mike
MikeI don't have to, read the Psalm.
2:6 “I myself have installed my king on Zion, my holy hill.” 2:7 “THE KING SAYS, “I will announce the Lord’s decree. He said to me: ‘You are my son! This very day I have become your father! 2:8 Ask me, and I will give you the nations as your inheritance, the ends of the earth as your personal property. NET
Did David hear the decree before he was “born”?
Was the Apostle Paul an idiot for applying this scripture to Jesus after the resurrection?
Did Jesus hear the Father say this to him before he was so-called “born from the Fathers womb”?
WJ
Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:25) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:20) But the truth is in the scritpures and their given context!
Amen to that!And when you are done playing games, you are about to get an education about that in our debate.
mike
WJ
Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:29) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:22) Well your friends here disagree with you. That is why they are silent!
No, I just don't call Kathi up to say, “Let's go double team WJ! Maybe if we both yell nonsense at him at once, it'll make that nonsense seem more believable.” KJ has been a joke since I joined HN. But you used to be respectable. You are now just like him.
mike
MikeThe Joke is on you. You come here trying to push your Arian theology which has its roots in WatchTower and all you do is expose yourself more and more for who you really are.
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:34) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:25) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:20) But the truth is in the scritpures and their given context!
Amen to that!And when you are done playing games, you are about to get an education about that in our debate.
mike
WJ
the Roo
Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:29) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:22) Well your friends here disagree with you. That is why they are silent!
No, I just don't call Kathi up to say, “Let's go double team WJ! Maybe if we both yell nonsense at him at once, it'll make that nonsense seem more believable.” KJ has been a joke since I joined HN. But you used to be respectable. You are now just like him.
mike
I see.It is ok for you and others to high five each other but when we do it it is ganging up on you.
Wha Wha!
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:29) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:22) Well your friends here disagree with you. That is why they are silent!
No, I just don't call Kathi up to say, “Let's go double team WJ! Maybe if we both yell nonsense at him at once, it'll make that nonsense seem more believable.” KJ has been a joke since I joined HN. But you used to be respectable. You are now just like him.
mike
MikeThe Joke is on you. You come here trying to push your Arian theology which has its roots in WatchTower and all you do is expose yourself more and more for who you really are.
WJ
Keith,Mike “amens” Kathi for posting fragments from Calvin. Then after I show what Calvin really taught he says “who cares what Calvin believed?” Yet he says that I am the joke. Mike is the court jester.
His hero is a man who signed a creed that anathematized his friends and who wrote them an aoplogy afterwards.
Jack
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:29) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:22) Well your friends here disagree with you. That is why they are silent!
No, I just don't call Kathi up to say, “Let's go double team WJ! Maybe if we both yell nonsense at him at once, it'll make that nonsense seem more believable.” KJ has been a joke since I joined HN. But you used to be respectable. You are now just like him.
mike
MikeThe Joke is on you. You come here trying to push your Arian theology which has its roots in WatchTower and all you do is expose yourself more and more for who you really are.
WJ
Keith,Mike is acting silly today because he is embarrassed that I caught him and Kathi revising church history. Calvin CLEARLY taught the divinity of our Lord Jesus Christ.
John Calvin on the phrase “Jesus Christ our Lord, who was born according to the seed of David” ( Romans 1:3)
Quote Divinity and humanity are the two requisites which we must look for in Christ if we are to find salvation in Him. His divinity contains power, righteousness, and life, which are communicated to us by His humanity Calvin on the statement “eternally blessed God” (Romans 9:5)
Quote We must further note that this ascription of praise belongs only to the one eternal God. In another passage (1 Tim. 1:17) Paul states that there is one God to whom honor and and glory are due. To separate this clause from the rest of the of the context for the purpose of depriving Christ of this CLEAR WITNESS TO HIS DIVINITY, is an audacious attempt to create darkness where there is full light. The words are quite plain, 'CHRIST, who from the Jews according to the flesh, IS GOD BLESSED FOREVER'
Excerpts taken from Calvin's New Testament Commentaries, Romans and Thessalonians pages 15-16, 196, Wm. B. Eerdman's Publishing CompanyBy the term “begotten before all ages” Calvin meant that the Son of God was eternal. No history revisionism on Kathi's and Mike's part can make Calvin a non-trinitairan. He CLEARLY believed in the divinity of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
the Roo
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:39) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,12:29) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:22) Well your friends here disagree with you. That is why they are silent!
No, I just don't call Kathi up to say, “Let's go double team WJ! Maybe if we both yell nonsense at him at once, it'll make that nonsense seem more believable.” KJ has been a joke since I joined HN. But you used to be respectable. You are now just like him.
mike
I see.It is ok for you and others to high five each other but when we do it it is ganging up on you.
Wha Wha!
WJ
Hey Mike,When I whined as a child my grand dad would say to me, “Want a little cheese with your whine”?
the Roo
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,03:57) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 17 2010,11:02) [No matter how you define it, it always comes up the same: The Son is ALWAYS BEGOTTEN BY THE FATHER, AND THE FATHER IS “UNBEGOTTEN”, AND THE HOLY SPIRIT IS NOWHERE IN THE PICTURE. If that doesn't spell out a difference between the two entities of Jesus and God, I don't know what to tell you.
Fallacious, for no scritpure declares Jesus to be the “Begotten Son of God” before he came in the flesh. All scriptures declaring him as such are prophetic or post incarnation.WJ
And Mike has admitted that scripture does not record that Jesus was begotten before His incarnation.the Roo
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ July 18 2010,04:16) Hi All Mikes own words seem to change as he goes along.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 25 2010,22:22) I CANNOT EVEN COME CLOSE TO PROVING JESUS WAS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD PRIOR TO HIS COMING IN FLESH WITH ONLY THE FACT THAT HE WASN'T CALLED THAT UNTIL HE CAME IN THE FLESH. AND I WILLINGLY ADMIT THAT. THAT IS WHY I WON'T USE THIS INFO AS MY FOUNDATION – GET IT?
Why does he insist on trying to prove what he says he cannot prove?WJ
Typical Mikeboll flip flopping.
In our debate he said that my view that the Father ordained the creation and that Jesus did the actual work “fits well with scripture.” Then he flip flopped in the next rebuttal after that.
Jack
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
