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Quote (banana @ Dec. 05 2009,13:39) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 05 2009,12:17) Quote (Gene @ Dec. 05 2009,09:10) Nick……….Produce scripture that prove what you claim , i have yet to see any. A soul is simply a Body with Spirit in it, as Georg and i also brought out. Jesus did not say GOD would destory Body, Spirit and Soul , did he. No just body and Soul, could be destroyed in the grave. When we die we parish we have no more memory of anything, (for when a man dies his thoughts parish). If GOD did not give us new bodies and add spirit back into them we would never again exist. Your false teaching of a person containing a BODY and SOUL and SPIRIT> Has (NO) Scriptural base. A living SOUL contains a BODY AND SPIRIT, that is what makes it a living Soul. IMO gene
So you agree that Jesus did not go into hell and teach anyone when he was dead(according to the scriptures)right?
bodWhere does it say Jesus taught any one while he was in hell/grave? show me the scripture.
Georg
Nick,said that Jesus preached to the people of noah's day in hell when he was dead
1 Peter 3:18-19 (King James Version)
18For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
19By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
This is the scripture he quotes
bod
Sorry, I looked at the post wrong, thinking you had said that.
Ya, I know, Nick has some strange believes.
Actually, he believes Jesus preached to the dead in hell when he was in the grave.Georg
Hi,
Jonah died and was given life again.
The sign of Jonah was the prophecy Jesus gave about his return from the grave.The prophecy of Jonah also shows how the prophet himself has HIS OWN will, which is not always in complete alignment with the will of God – just like in the case of John 6:38.
But eventually, in all cases, the prophet ended up placing the will of God over his own will – just like in John 6:38.
Hi MB,
Indeed the Word was the great prophet spoken of by Peter in Acts 3.22
Their prophetic work was not moved by the will of man but they moved by the Holy Spirit of God[2 peter 2.23]
But the ministry of Jesus Christ was not just as a vessel for God but also towards God, in relationship to God and in advocacy for mankind.Quote (david @ Nov. 07 2005,22:29) Does your Bible not say? “Jonah PRAYED to Jehovah his God FROM THE INWARD PARTS OF THE FISH and said: ‘Out of my distress I called out to Jehovah, and he proceeded to answer me. OUT OF THE BELLY OF SHEOL I cried for help. You heard my voice.’” (Jon 2:1, 2)
It is JONAH who called the belly of the fish, the belly of sheol. This obviously does not mean fish=sheol or that the inside of a fish is a firey torment.
I believe I spent several pages in the hades thread showing that sheol/hades means “common grave of mankind.”
Now it's true, that people that aren't alive don't go to the grave. But here, Jonah could poetically say that he was “in the belly of sheol,” because he was already lying in his grave. He wasn't dead yet. He wasn't really in sheol, but it seemed that the belly of the fish was to be his grave. And since sheol/hades over and over and over again means the common grave of mankind in the Bible, what JONAH said makes sence, although he may have been been saying it somewhat poetically.“To the bottoms of the mountains I went down [inside the fish]. As for the earth, its bars [like those of a grave] were upon me for time indefinite. But out of the pit you proceeded to bring up my life [on the third day], O Jehovah my God.”—Jonah 2:6; compare Psalm 30:3.
In the account about Jonah, it is stated that “Jonah prayed to Jehovah his God from the inward parts of the fish and said: ‘Out of my distress I called out to Jehovah, and he proceeded to answer me. Out of the belly of Sheol I cried for help. You heard my voice.’” (Jon 2:1, 2) Therefore, Jonah was comparing the inside of the fish to Sheol. He was as good as dead inside the fish, but Jehovah brought up his life from the pit, or Sheol, by preserving him alive and having him disgorged.—Jon 2:6; compare Ps 30:3.
Jesus compared Jonah’s being in the belly of the fish with what would happen in his own case, saying: “For just as Jonah was in the belly of the huge fish three days and three nights, so the Son of man will be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights.” (Mt 12:40) Although Jesus did not here use the word “Sheol” (Hades), the apostle Peter did use the word “Hades” when referring to Jesus’ death and resurrection.—Ac 2:27.
Regarding the word “Sheol,” Brynmor F. Price and Eugene A. Nida noted: “The word occurs often in the Psalms and in the book of Job to refer to the place to which all dead people go. It is represented as a dark place, in which there is no activity worthy of the name. There are no moral distinctions there, so ‘hell’ (KJV) is not a suitable translation, since that suggests a contrast with ‘heaven’ as the dwelling-place of the righteous after death. In a sense, ‘the grave’ in a generic sense is a near equivalent, except that Sheol is more a mass grave in which all the dead dwell together. . . . The use of this particular imagery may have been considered suitable here [in Jonah 2:2] in view of Jonah’s imprisonment in the interior of the fish.”—A Translators Handbook on the Book of Jonah, 1978, p. 37.
David,
I know its been a long time since you posted this, but I wanted to offer what I believe this scripture means.You had stated above:
“Jonah PRAYED to Jehovah his God FROM THE INWARD PARTS OF THE FISH and said: ‘Out of my distress I called out to Jehovah, and he proceeded to answer me. OUT OF THE BELLY OF SHEOL I cried for help. You heard my voice.’” (Jon 2:1, 2)
Unlike you I believe scripture teaches that Sheol is a realm where God stores the dead's souls until judgment.
Jonah 1:17 And the LORD appointed a great fish to swallow Jonah, and Jonah was in the stomach of the fish three days and three nights.
2:1 Then Jonah prayed to the LORD his God from the stomach of the fish,
This was a declaration AFTER he had been in the stomach for three day and three nights and after being bought back to life, but just before he was vomited onto dry land.2 and he said, “I called out of my distress to the LORD, and He answered me. I cried for help from the depth of Sheol; You heard my voice.
First he summarizes, then he goes into more detail.
3 “For You had cast me into the deep, Into the heart of the seas, And the current engulfed me. All Your breakers and billows passed over me.
4 “So I said, ‘I have been expelled from Your sight. Nevertheless I will look again toward Your holy temple.’
At this point he is recounting that he had determined to turn back to God.5 “Water encompassed me to the point of death. (amp even to [the extinction of] life) The great deep engulfed me, Weeds were wrapped around my head.
This is where he died
6 “I descended to the roots of the mountains. The earth with its bars was around me forever, But You have brought up my life from the pit, O LORD my God.
This is where he descended to Sheol for the three days then was brought back to life.
7 “While I was fainting away, I remembered the LORD, And my prayer came to You, Into Your holy temple.
8 “Those who regard vain idols Forsake their faithfulness,
9 But I will sacrifice to You With the voice of thanksgiving. That which I have vowed I will pay. Salvation is from the LORD.”
Here he is giving thanks to God for his deliverance
10 Then the LORD commanded the fish, and it vomited Jonah up onto the dry land.My opinion – Wm
Hi Wm,
I'm undecided. I can understand it either way. Was “to the point of death” meaning he was inches AWAY from dying? Or does it mean he actually died?
I can see it your way easily enough, but I can also see “Sheol” as metaphoric language from Jonah.
What swung it for me was “I descended to the roots of the mountains. The earth with its bars was around me forever, But You have brought up my life from the pit, O LORD my God.
“Roots of mountain” need to be underground IMO, & “earth bars” indicates that also, as well as my take on the whole of scripture.
Wm
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