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Hi BD,
No.
The kingdom of God does not come in such a way as can be seen.You argue against the word of God constantly so it is hard to see why you are so bitter and so determinedly uselessly kicking against the goad. To each their own.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 17 2009,14:10) Hi BD,
No.
The kingdom of God does not come in such a way as can be seen.You argue against the word of God constantly so it is hard to see why you are so bitter and so determinedly uselessly kicking against the goad. To each their own.
Do you really believe Jesus said that to Paul?hey nick,
going back to your original post, the following passages have always caught my attention, i can go so far with them, in understanding the sign of Jonah, what message do you think he is giving?
(Mat 12:39) And he answering said to them, `A generation, evil and adulterous, doth seek a sign, and a sign shall not be given to it, except the sign of Jonah the prophet;
(Mat 16:4) `A generation evil and adulterous doth seek a sign, and a sign shall not be given to it, except the sign of Jonah the prophet;' and having left them he went away.
(Luk 11:29) And the multitudes crowding together upon him, he began to say, `This generation is evil, a sign it doth seek after, and a sign shall not be given to it, except the sign of Jonah the prophet,
(Luk 11:30) for as Jonah became a sign to the Ninevites, so also shall the Son of Man be to this generation.
Hi POK,
Dead three days and resurrection to life.
Shown as proof of the mission of Jesus in Acts 2 and Rom1DB……..why do you have a problem with Jesus really dieing, and GOD raising him from the dead as scripture say He did. Jesus himself said he was dead, don't you believe His own words. Does this have something to do with your Muslim Faith?
gene
Quote (Gene @ Nov. 17 2009,17:38) DB……..why do you have a problem with Jesus really dieing, and GOD raising him from the dead as scripture say He did. Jesus himself said he was dead, don't you believe His own words. Does this have something to do with your Muslim Faith? gene
I don't have a problem with Jesus dying if he was killed what a terrible thing but if God intentionally sent Jesus to die(Sacrificed) they wouldn't say he was killed a scrifice is orderly and the offering is not treated brutally. There is no alter unless you make the cross an alter and the body would have been burned these are the rules of Sacrifice.There is no doubt that was written in The Bible was written in good faith and the Quran does not dispute the scriptures it simply says they “thought” they saw but they did not see what they thought.
The scriptures then when looking deeply into this provides the possibilities themselves 1.Jesus was not in the tomb for 3 days and 3 nights infact expressed in Mark he was gone the very next day.
Mark 16
1And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.If 3 days had past they would not becoming to annoint a 3 day old dead body This is proof that they came as soon as they could After the Sabbath
Mark 15
42And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,43Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
44And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.
45And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.
46And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.
47And Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses beheld where he was laid.
The women then went home for 24 hours and came back early Sunday morning and he was not there that is 1 1/2 days
He told mary NOT to touch him, do you have an explanation for that?
Now regarding “Jesus” saying My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?
It has been the view of most everyone here that Jesus voluteered to be sacrificed since before the beginning of the world and then suddenly we are asked to believe that this same person would then think he was being Forsaken?
Psalm 22:1-3 (King James Version)
Psalm 22
1My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?2O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.
3But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.
If this was Jesus would he be asking for help?
Jesus was righteous:
Psalm 37:24-26 (King James Version)
24Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down: for the LORD upholdeth him with his hand.
25I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread.
26He is ever merciful, and lendeth; and his seed is blessed
Now once again it was “reported” what Jesus said or didn't say
So it is much more than what is or is not in the Quran from the time I was taught about Jesus being baptized and so forth after reading about Abraham and God demonstrating that He would not have Abraham kill his own Son, I know God would not choose a better way for Abraham and a lesser way for His son.
God even saying:
And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.
Malachi 3:16-18God hates the shedding of innocent blood yet we are led to believe that in the case of Jesus he changed His position on hating the shedding of innocent blood.
And lastly if this was the crowning achievement why was that not the end of the Mystery of God? Even Jesus thought the end was coming soon and 2000 years later…..Jesus was assuming that the generation he lived in would be the last and I have shown that conclusively on this board many times.
Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 18 2009,07:15) Quote (Gene @ Nov. 17 2009,17:38) DB……..why do you have a problem with Jesus really dieing, and GOD raising him from the dead as scripture say He did. Jesus himself said he was dead, don't you believe His own words. Does this have something to do with your Muslim Faith? gene
I don't have a problem with Jesus dying if he was killed what a terrible thing but if God intentionally sent Jesus to die(Sacrificed) they wouldn't say he was killed a scrifice is orderly and the offering is not treated brutally. There is no alter unless you make the cross an alter and the body would have been burned these are the rules of Sacrifice.There is no doubt that was written in The Bible was written in good faith and the Quran does not dispute the scriptures it simply says they “thought” they saw but they did not see what they thought.
The scriptures then when looking deeply into this provides the possibilities themselves 1.Jesus was not in the tomb for 3 days and 3 nights infact expressed in Mark he was gone the very next day.
Mark 16
1And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him.If 3 days had past they would not becoming to annoint a 3 day old dead body This is proof that they came as soon as they could After the Sabbath
Mark 15
42And now when the even was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath,43Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
44And Pilate marvelled if he were already dead: and calling unto him the centurion, he asked him whether he had been any while dead.
45And when he knew it of the centurion, he gave the body to Joseph.
46And he bought fine linen, and took him down, and wrapped him in the linen, and laid him in a sepulchre which was hewn out of a rock, and rolled a stone unto the door of the sepulchre.
47And Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joses beheld where he was laid.
The women then went home for 24 hours and came back early Sunday morning and he was not there that is 1 1/2 days
He told mary NOT to touch him, do you have an explanation for that?
Now regarding “Jesus” saying My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?
It has been the view of most everyone here that Jesus voluteered to be sacrificed since before the beginning of the world and then suddenly we are asked to believe that this same person would then think he was being Forsaken?
Psalm 22:1-3 (King James Version)
Psalm 22
1My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?2O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.
3But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.
If this was Jesus would he be asking for help?
Jesus was righteous:
Psalm 37:24-26 (King James Version)
24Though he fall, he shall not be utterly cast down: for the LORD upholdeth him with his hand.
25I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread.
26He is ever merciful, and lendeth; and his seed is blessed
Now once again it was “reported” what Jesus said or didn't say
So it is much more than what is or is not in the Quran from the time I was taught about Jesus being baptized and so forth after reading about Abraham and God demonstrating that He would not have Abraham kill his own Son, I know God would not choose a better way for Abraham and a lesser way for His son.
God even saying:
And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.
Malachi 3:16-18God hates the shedding of innocent blood yet we are led to believe that in the case of Jesus he changed His position on hating the shedding of innocent blood.
And lastly if this was the crowning achievement why was that not the end of the Mystery of God? Even Jesus thought the end was coming soon and 2000 years later…..Jesus was assuming that the generation he lived in would be the last and I have shown that conclusively on this board many times.
BD…lets honestly evaluate WHY you are saying these things..I am very familiar with what you believe….You believe that Jesus was NOT the Son of GOd…But he was a prophet…you also believe that the Bible as WE know it…while GOD's word…can not be relied upon as absolute truth because it has been altered and tampered with…you believe the Quran (or the message of Allah as given to Muhammad) was given to us to
1. Give correct what had been altered in the bible
2. Give us the REAL..”WAY” to GOD (allah) as Jesus is not it…
You also believe that there was no “original sin” and that man is inherently good and therefore in NO NEED of redemption…they only need to “look to alllah” as the way..and follow him….amongst other things..
Am I Correct?
Hi BD,
You are convinced of your own conclusions but others are more skeptical.
There is none righteous.Quote (dirtyknections @ Nov. 18 2009,07:37) BD…lets honestly evaluate WHY you are saying these things..I am very familiar with what you believe…. You believe that Jesus was NOT the Son of GOd…But he was a prophet…you also believe that the Bible as WE know it…while GOD's word…can not be relied upon as absolute truth because it has been altered and tampered with…you believe the Quran (or the message of Allah as given to Muhammad) was given to us to
1. Give correct what had been altered in the bible
2. Give us the REAL..”WAY” to GOD (allah) as Jesus is not it…
You also believe that there was no “original sin” and that man is inherently good and therefore in NO NEED of redemption…they only need to “look to alllah” as the way..and follow him….amongst other things..
Am I Correct?
I'm so glad you asked for honesty and I hope you respond in kind.The fact is Jesus is the Son of God in the same way it was commonly used in Jewish culture. So you are wrong I do believe that Jesus is the Son of God, I just understand that it doesn't mean that God reproduces children like a human therefore regarding the way that later Christians twisted the meaning to humanize God, NO, God has no son that came from LOINS, God created ALL MEN so to say God has no Son is to say God does not Procreate. Jesus was called his servant what literal Father do you know that calls his son a servant?
A son honoureth his father, and a servant his master: if then I be a father, where is mine honour? and if I be a master, where is my fear? saith the LORD of hosts unto you, O priests, that despise my name. And ye say, Wherein have we despised thy name?
Malachi 1:5-7Clearly this verse shows that priests were calling God Father and Master was God their literal Father? NO
Jesus was a servant of God, correct? and he was a prophet anointed by God, correct?
Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:
Acts 2:21-23Doesn't this mean that a Man approved of God can be called His son? But would anyone call a literal “Son” a Man approved by God? No, a literal son would always be called “SON” in all circumstances so you have a dilemna there.
As far as the way to God The Holy Bible says that God has always accepted a repentant heart in-fact he told cain:
If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him.
Genesis 4:6-8Jesus said:
Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, which is new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.
Revelation 3:11-13So obviously from the beginning God has taught us we must overcome our impulses to sin.
The Quran is PRO-JESUS, PRO-CHRIST saying that all who follow him shall be placed above those who disbelieve meaning that even those of all the varieties of Christians there are all are superior to those who have no belief at all.
Most Christians however are ready to condemn each other for the different ways they believe.
God(ALLAH) Himself says ALL who call on him will be saved
Jesus says not everyone who says to him lord, lord shall be saved unless that they LOOK to GOD(ALLAH) do you deny this?
Did Jesus look to the one he called “The ONLY TRUE GOD”? then you had better do so as well.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 18 2009,09:26) Hi BD,
Would those approved by God abandon him and His teachings for an idol and false doctrines?
Yes, because you have made Jesus an Idol. May God forgive you.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 17 2009,16:20) Hi POK,
Dead three days and resurrection to life.
Shown as proof of the mission of Jesus in Acts 2 and Rom1
hey nick,thanks for your reply, it was kinda like me saying to you that Hebrews 4 refers to the sabbath.
Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 24 2009,04:05) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,20:09) Hi BD,
He was in Hades, the place of the dead.
Alive?
Is that what the Quran teaches you? The Bible says that He was in Hell three days and three nights. And if you understand what Hell is, a hole in the ground, or grave.
How God kept Jonah alive, is not revealed, but He did, and that is all we have to know. No guessing game.
Peace and Love IreneQuote (banana @ Nov. 24 2009,04:47) Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 24 2009,04:05) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,20:09) Hi BD,
He was in Hades, the place of the dead.
Alive?
Is that what the Quran teaches you? The Bible says that He was in Hell three days and three nights. And if you understand what Hell is, a hole in the ground, or grave.
How God kept Jonah alive, is not revealed, but He did, and that is all we have to know. No guessing game.
Peace and Love Irene
So you agree that Jonah was alive then?
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