The man of sin

[GeneBalthrop]

To all………..would like to post something i have written on the subject of the man of sin, talked about in 2Ths 2-12 Its quite long and i know long post can get quite tiresome , But in order to get  the points across i feel a need to post it the way I have written it.

THE MAN OF SIN

2Ths 2:1….> Now brethren , concerning the coming of our lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you not to be soon shaken in Mind or to be disturbed, neither by spirit nor by word nor by letter as if from us that has come the Day of Christ, let not anyone deceive you by any means because if not comes the apostasy first, and is revealed the man of Sin;

| (THE FALLING AWAY FROM THE TRUE FAITH IN THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD). PAUL HEAR IS SAYING THE FIRST THING THAT HAD TO HAPPEN WAS THIS FALLING AWAY, BUT WHAT WE CAN OVERLOOK IS THAT THIS FALLING AWAY PROCESS WAS GRADUAL
AND WAS ALREADY STARTING TO FORM EVEN AT THE TIME OF THE ORIGINAL APOSTLES, IT WAS WORKING IN AN IDEOLOGY WHICH WAS FORMING A (IMAGE) OF (ANOTHER) GOD, BY TURNING JESUS WHO WAS A FLESH AND BLOOD MAN INTO VERY GOD HIMSELF WHICH WAS TURNING THE (IMAGE) OF HIM INTO THE MAN OF SIN , NOTICE BOTH THINGS HAPPEN AT THE SAME TIME, THE APOSTASY AND THE REVELATION OF THE MAN OF SIN. THEY ARE CONNECTED EVENTS AS ONE DEVELOPS SO DOES THE OTHER.

| the son of prediction, who is opposing and exalting himself over everything being called god or object of worship, so that he in the temple of GOD (as) GOD to sit down, displaying ( or rather is being displayed) himself that he is GOD.

| QUESTION, WHO IS NOW SETTING IN THE TEMPLE OF GOD? IS IT NOT CHRIST JESUS AND IS HE NOT BEINGS DISPLAYED AS VERY GOD HIMSELF (BY THE FALSE TEACHINGS OF THE APOSTATE CHURCH). TO SHOW THE TRUE GOD WE USE THE UPPER CASE LETTERS. NOTICE WHEN IT COMES TO WHERE HE SITS AND WHAT HE IS BEING DISPLAYED AS ITS ALL UPPER CASE , SO THIS INDICATES THE TRUE PLACE AND TRUE GOD. SO THIS COULD NOT IMPLY ANYONE ELSE BUT JESUS CHRIST. BUT ITS NOT THE REAL JESUS IT'S AN (IMAGE) OF HIM A (LIE) CREATED BY A FALSE FALLEN CHRISTIANITY, (the apostatized churches), WHICH TURNS THE IMAGE OF THE REAL JESUS INTO VERY GOD HIMSELF , NOTICE IT SAY HE IS BEING DISPLAYED AS GOD NOT THAT HE IS (SAYING) HE IS GOD. NO WHERE DOES IT SAY THE MAN OF SIN IS (SAYING) HE IS GOD, BUT BEING DISPLAYED AS GOD.

THIS FALSE IMAGE OF JESUS WAS NOT CREATED BY HIM OR THE APOSTLES OR ANY TRUE SAINT OF GOD. THE APOSTASY IS THE FALLING AWAY FROM THE TRUE GOD AND THAT IS DONE BY CREATING ANOTHER GOD. THIS FALLING AWAY WAS ALREADY AT WORK EVEN AT THE TIME OF THE APOSTLES. THIS IS WHY PAUL SAID THE THE MYSTERY OF LAWLESSNESS WAS ALREADY AT WORK, MAKING ANOTHER GOD IS A WORK OF LAWLESSNESS , MAKING ANOTHER GOD IS THE BREAKING OF GODS COMMANDMENTS , GOD SAID “YOU SHALL HAVE NO OTHER GOD BESIDES ME”. IT IS AND ACT OF IDOLATRY TO CREATE ANOTHER GOD AND IT BREAKS THE LAW OF GOD.  NOW CONTINUING;

{ do you not remember yet being with you these things i was telling you and now the (holding Back) you know,}

HERE PAUL WAS SIMPLY SAYING WHAT HAS NOT HAPPENED YET, THAT THE MAN OF SIN HADN'T APPEARED ON THE SCENE YET, BECAUSE THE APOSTLES WERE HOLDING BACK THE FALSE TEACHING FROM INFECTING THE CHURCH, BUT THE IDEOLOGY WAS ALREADY STARTING TO FORM , THAT WHY THE APOSTLE JOHN SAID THERE WERE ALREADY MAN ANTI-CHRISTS EVEN IN HIS DAY, ACTUALLY IT WOULD NOT FULLY TAKE PLACE FOR ANOTHER 300 YEARS,

{ for to be revealed in his time},

ANOTHER WORDS IT WOULD SHOW UP AT THE ALLOTED TIME.,

{for the mystery is already at work of lawlessness}

HERE AGAIN THE APOSTLE PAUL SHOWS THIS FALSE TEACHING WAS ALREADY FORMING. NOTICE THAT WHAT EVER THIS MYSTERY WAS IT WOULD BE THE BREAKING OF GOD LAWS AND WAS ALREADY STARTING TO FORM,

{only the holding back now until from the (midst) he comes}

PAUL IS SAYING THAT FROM THE MIDST OF FALLEN CHRISTAN (APOSTASY) WOULD APPEAR THE MAN OF SIN. EVEN AT THE TIME OF PAUL THERE WERE SOME WHO WERE TURNING AWAY FROM THE TRUTH AND INTRODUCE FALSE TEACHINGS OF JESUS BEING FLESH AND BLOOD MAN INTO VERY GOD HIMSELF, THIS FALSE TEACHING FINALLY EMERGED AS THE DOCTRINE OF THE TRINITY AND TOOK PLACE AT THE COUNCIL OF NICEA IN 325 AD WHEN CAME FORTH FROM THE (MIDST) OF THE TWO “CHRISTIAN” BELIEFS SYSTEMS (ARIAN'S AND ATHANAIAN'S THE IDEA THAT JESUS WAS (HOMOOUSIOUS), (GOD FROM GOD), A WORD INTRODUCED BY THE PAGAN EMPEROR CONSTANTINE HIMSELF.

{ and then will be revealed, (made known) the lawless one whom the lord will consume with the breath of his mouth and will abolish by the appearing of his coming}

WHY BY THE BREATH OF HIS MOUTH , BECAUSE THIS LAWLESS ONE IS NOT AN (ACTUAL) PERSON, IT IS AN IDEOLOGY WHICH CREATES A FALSE IMAGE (A LIE) ABOUT A PERSON, JESUS CHRIST HIMSELF, THAT IS WHY JESUS WILL (ABOLISH) IT WITH THE BREATHE OF HIS MOUTH, IN OTHER WORD BY HIS WORDS AT HIS COMING. IN 1 JOHN 4, IT SAYS

{every spirit (intellect) which confesses Jesus in the flesh having come is of GOD and every spirit (intellect) which does not confess Jesus
Christ as coming in the flesh is not of GOD, and this is the Spirit (intellect) of Antichrist.}

WHY DOES JOHN TIE JESUS' COMING AS NOT BEING PERCEIVED AS A FLESH EVENT TO THE ANTICHRIST? ITS BECAUSE THERE WERE THOSE WHO WERE SAYING JESUS WAS A GOD INSTEAD OF A MAN OR AS SOME SAY “THE INCARNATE GOD” OR MAN GOD,

{ which you have heard was coming and now is in the world already}

YES THIS IDEOLOGY WAS ALREADY STARTING TO FORM AND THIS BACKS UP WHAT PAUL SAID, THERE WERE ALREADY MANY TRYING TO TURN OUR VIEW OF JESUS FROM A FLESH AND BLOOD MAN TO VERY GOD HIMSELF EVEN AT THAT TIME.

{ he whose coming is according to the working of  Satan.}

THE ADVERSARIES ARE THE WORKER OF DECEPTIONS THIS FALSE (IMAGE) OF JESUS WOULD BE THE WORK OF ADVERSARIES { with all power} EMPEROR CONSTANTINE WAS RULER OF ROME WHICH CONTROLLED ALL THE WORLDS POWER, {and all signs and wonders of falsehood} CONSTANTINE SAID HE HAD A VISION IN THE SKY OF A CROSS AND WAS TOLD BY A LOCAL BISHOP THAT IF HE PUT THE SIGN OF THE CROSS ON HIS ARMY SHIELD HE WOULD WIN THE UP COMING BATTLE  WHICH HE DID AND ALSO WON THE BATTLE MAKING HIS EMPEROR MAXIMUS OF THE WHOLE ROMAN EMPIRE. THE SIGN OF THE CROSS BECAME THEIR SYMBOL AND HE DECLARED CHRISTIANITY AS THE STATE RELIGION.  

{and in all deception of unrighteousness among the ones perishing, WHY?, because love of truth not they recieve for them to be saved. And because of this (GOD will send) to them the working of delusions in order for them to believe (THE LIE)

, NOTICE THE (LIE) NOT A PERSON,

so that they should be judged all the ones not believing the truth, but taking pleasure in unrighteousness }

NOTICE WHAT IT SAYS TO BELIEVE (THE LIE) WHY BECAUSE ITS NOT A PERSON THERE BELIEVING IN ITS A (LIE) ABOUT THE PERSON AND THAT PERSON IS JESUS CHRIST. IT SAYS IN JUDE WE SHOULD CONTEND FOR THE FAITH THAT WAS ONCE AND FOR ALL DELIVERED TO THE SAINTS. AND THAT FAITH IS TO  BELIEVE THAT THERE IS ONLY (ONE) TRUE GOD AND ONE MEDIATOR BETWEEN GOD AND MAN, THE MAN JESUS CHRIST. JUST AS JESUS SAID IN HIS PRAYER “FOR THOU ART THE (ONLY) TRUE GOD. THE PINNACLE OF ALL FAITH IS TO BELIEVE THAT THERE IS (ONLY) ONE TRUE GOD. ISAIAH 45:5

{i am the LORD who has made all things, who (ALONE) stretched out the heavens, who spread out the earth by (MYSELF)

. REMEMBER HOW JOHN ENDED ONE OF HIS LETTERS “LITTLE CHILDREN KEEP YOURSELF FROM IDOLS, JOHN KNOW IT WAS GOING TO BE A MATTER OF IDOLATRY THAT WAS GOING TO INFECT THE CHURCH. WHY WOULD GOD ALLOW THE CLOSEST PERSON TO HIM TO BE PERCEIVED AS A GOD IN THE FIRST PLACE? AND EVEN SEND A DELUDING SPIRIT INTO THE MINDS OF PEOPLE TO BELIEVE IT, THE ANSWER IS SIMPLE, BECAUSE GOD WANTS ALL CREATION TO KNOW THAT HE (ONLY) IS GOD, AND THAT, THAT TRUTH MATTERS, AND WHAT BETTER WAY TO GET THE POINT ACROSS THEN TO LET THE PERSON CLOSEST TO HIM HAVE THAT NAME APPLIED TO HIM AND THAT PERSON HIMSELF DESTROY THE F
ALSE IMAGE OF HIM AT HIS COMING, THAT DRIVES THE POINT HOME THROUGH OUT ALL CREATION THAT THERE IS (ONLY) ONE TRUE GOD.

sorry this is so long but i have wanted to post it for a long time.

Peace and love to you all………………gene

I bumped this back up because i would still like more discussion on it, It is very important to understand this IMO.

peace and love to you all…………….gene

[Cindy]

Gene

If your name had not been on top, I would have guessed it was Texas who wrote this article.
I can appreciate the effort you put in writing this article, unfortunately you are mistaken on several points.

The falling away from the true faith can only happen by true believers; but then you would have to ask, why would they fall away?
You have “Christians” today that switch denomination all the time, and you have those that don't go to any church; is that your falling way? I don't think so.
It wasn't until the Roman persecution stopped in 313 AD, that the, what would become the “Roman Universal Church”, began to prosper, and to dominate.
But only after the death of Justinian in 565 AD, did the church (pope) begin to rule.
It was then, you either excepted the popes doctrine, or die. It was the pope that set himself up as god, or at least as the “Vicar of the son of God”. It was the pope that forced every one to become a Catholic, and to except his doctrine, if you refused, you or your family was tortured and killed. It was during that time that many true believers fell away from the true faith, because they could not see their family suffer.
It was he, who caused this fallen away, that would identify him as the man of sin.

Today you not only have the church that caused all the falling away still going strong, but you have countless daughters that were born from that mother church beginning with the great reformation in 1517 AD.

Frankly I can't see how you tied Jesus into all this.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg……….It's not the real Jesus, it the False (IMAGE) of Him as a GOD created by the doctrine of the TRINITY. The term (HOMOOUSIOUS) (GOD FROM GOD) was put in place . Which Jesus will (ABOLISH) why abolish?, because that's what you do with a LIE , you abolish it. If it were a person Jesus would not abolish it by He appearing by the word of His (MOUTH). I realize George this goes against your belief that the Pope is the man of sin , But the Pope does not sit in the real temple of GOD as spoken of in 2Ths 2. Showing Himself that He is a GOD. People do not bow down to the POPE calling Him GOD. But they do call Jesus a GOD. To me the man of Sin is a (LIE) about Jesus being a GOD. Which creates an image (the man of sin). There is no (REAL) man of SIN, it is a (LIE). IMO

peace and love to you and Irene………………………..gene

[Cindy]

Gene

You say there is no “real” man of sin, Paul says there is.
Him sitting in the temple of God; the temple of God are the saints, also according to Paul, 2 Cor. 6:16.
The only temple of God, made of stone, was in Jerusalem, and it was destroyed in 70 AD.
Sitting in the temple of God is to be understood, sitting over, ruling over, the saints.
Yes he was “a” god, a mighty one, a strong one, a powerful one. He is the little horn in Dan. 7:8, he is the one that made war with the saints Dan. 7:21, for 1260 years Dan. 7:25.
He is the same one spoken of in Rev. 13:5 and 7.
He is the same one referred to as the beast out of the earth Rev. 13:11, that tried to appear as the lamb of God (Christ), same verse; but what he spoke (his doctrines) where from the devil.
He is also referred to as the image of the beast (Rome) verse 14 and 15.
He exercised all the power of the first beast (Rome), after Justinian died in 565 AD.
Any one that would not except his doctrine, “right hand”, and believe it, “forehead”, would be killed, verses 15 and 16.
What you were not allowed to by or sell was a bible, under penalty of death; only those who had the mark of the beast, the “cross”, meaning, the clergy.
The number of the name of a man; a name can also be a title, the pope gave himself this title, “VICARIVS FILII DEI”, vicar of the son of God. You take those Latin letters that have a numerical value, and you come up with 666.

If you think the bible is not real, why read it?

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

George……..so your saying the Pope is the one setting in the temple of the real God , But who are the saint he is ruling over are they decieved Trinitarians, and people who believe in Christmas and Easter and pray to Mary and bow down to a man, are these Saints of GOD that God dwells in?, I hardly think so. Your presentation of the “Vicarivs Filii Dei”, as vicar of the son of GOD, Is not what Paul was saying, He said the person would sit in the temple of God being displayed as A GOD, the Pope to my knowledge has never said He is A GOD. Another Point is that you seem to think that these decieved People (are) Saints, But Paul says because they recieved (NOT) the love of truth (GOD) would send them a Spirit of delusion (in order) for them to believe, (THE LIE), A lie is not a person it is some thing that is said about a person, The pope does not claim to be A GOD, and saying he is, a false assumption on your part. The Lie is whats told about Jesus being GOD Himself, thats the lie Georg, and that LIE creates the “man of sin”. George reread every part of what i posted and think about it, it fits exactly with the ideology of Jesus being changed from our perception of Him as a man, to a GOD. There is no real “man of sin”, it 's a false doctrine started in 325 AD at the council of Necia. Which turned Jesus into a HOMOOUSIOUS ( GOD from GOD). IMO

peace and love to you and Irene………………………………gene

[Cindy]

Gene

I find it ironic that when you get challenged, you start to spin in your excitement, what I have said.
The pope began to rule over what used to be the western part of the Roman empire, and that included the saints.
I never said that these deceived people were saints, just the opposite, they were killed because they would not believe the lie.
Paul is talking about “the man” of sin, “the man” of lawlessness, “the man” of perdition; he is not talking about an idea, that “man” was real, he did rule.
The pope you see today is nothing compared to the popes of the dark and middle ages.
The books of Daniel and Revelation prophesied about him, it was also foretold that the king of the north would take away his power by humiliating him, Dan. 11:36, when his time was up.
Now, would you be surprised if I told you that this king of the north was Napoleon?
He brought the pope down in 1809 when he imprisoned him for three years.

That is history, and those are facts.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg………So in you opinion the man of Sin is who?, is it the pope or not , You on the one hand say it is, then say Napoleon destroyed Him , I think your confusing the Beast Power and the Great Whore, with (THE LIE), concerning the MAN OF SIN. One address the Roman Emperor and the religious system “the great whore church” the other is the (LIE ABOUT SOME ONE BEING DISPLAYED AS A (TRUE) GOD) that is not the pope it is the false IMAGE created by the Apostatized Church concerning Jesus. I or you have never heard anyone say the POPE is A GOD, But i have hear many say Jesus is a GOD. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene

[Cindy]

Gene

When quoting me, quote me correctly.

You mention the “Beast Power”, and the “Great Whore”; who or what are they to you? you didn't make yourself clear.

You be surprised how many god's we have; Jesus is a god, the president is a god, the pope is a god, Napoleon was a god, the Roman emperors were god's, etc.
The word “god” simply means, a “mighty” one, or “strong” one, or “powerful” one, but that does not make them the “All mighty God”.

Tell me if you know, why is the pope and his church referred to as the image? the image of what?
You speak of lies and don't realise you're creating one yourself.
I am aware that the trinitarian think of Jesus as God's equal, but who is it that taught that lie?
If any one leaves a church today, that is not the apostasy; no one is threatened with his life.
People have become church shoppers, some like the building, some like the entertainment, some like the minister.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

georg………You getting scattered here and off subject…………You maintain now that there are all kinds of GOD , but we are told by Jesus there is only (ONE) TRUE GOD. I know and understand that God is a descriptor word for POWERS, However in 2 Thes 2, it is talking about the TRUE GOD . And the only one taking His Seat there in HIS temple is Jesus Himself and no other, and Jesus is the one being worshiped and called (TRUE) GOD , by Catholics and Protestants, not the POPE. The false teaching of the TRINITY, and Preexistence of Jesus creates the (IMAGE) or LIE of the MAN of SIN. A (LIE) which will remain Until Jesus Himself comes and (abolishes it) by his own words from His own mouth, Just as it says. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene………………………gene

[Cindy]

Gene

I think I'm quite clear in what I say.

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

What Paul is explaining is, that the return of Christ would not come before there was a falling away first. And that “man of sin”, the “son of perdition”, be revealed. Paul speaks of an individual, not about an idea or Jesus.

2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

What does worship mean to you? How do you worship, and whom do you worship?
Sports fans worship their athletes, movie goers worship their stars; how do people worship them? By imitating them, by wearing the same cloth, by trying to look like them, act like them, behave like them.
“shewing himself that he is God” Pagans may have believed that, but not the temple of God, the saints.
If you never read any history on the Catholic church, you wouldn't know that the early popes were quite different from today's popes.
There were popes that claimed their decision could not even be changed by God.
There were popes that claimed they had the power to send you to heaven or to hell.
There were popes that claimed for a sum of money they could forgive you your sins.
People feared the pope more than they feared God, including kings and nobles.
From 565 AD the pope practically ruled unopposed, they ruled as they wished, they sold the “pope office”, and even killed for it.
It wasn't until Napoleon, in 1809, showed the world that the pope had no real power by imprisoning the pope for three years. He laughed at the popes threads and curses, finally the pope gave in. That is the humiliation Daniel spoke of in 11:36.
In 1834 the Vatican finally abolished torture.

2Th 2:6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time.
2Th 2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth (restrains) will let, until he (the Roman emperor) be taken out of the way.

The restrainer was none other than the Roman emperor, he was “Pontifex Maximus” -Chief religious ruler-. As long as there was an emperor around, no pope would claim that title.

2Th 2:8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

This wicked one was only revealed, identified, but not destroyed; because he is still being worshiped today. Jesus will deal with him in due time.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg…….You say people who go to movies and athletic events are all worshiping them as a GOD. Right, what ever gave you that Idea. While they may love to go to them and enjoy them it certainly does (NOT) mean the are (WORSHIPING) them as (A GOD). An Idol is one that is representing (A GOD) , not a human event unless there is something representative of a GOD there, No where does it say that GOD forbid anyone from sports events or going to movies or any thing like that, Some people love to walk in  the Park does that mean thats there GOD. What about going fishing or walking in the mountains, there is no end to this kind of specuation. 

The Man of Sin, is a MAN that is being (DISPLAYED) as a GOD, A TRUE GOD. and the (ONLY) ONE Being (DISPLAYED) as TRUE GOD Is JESUS HIMSELF It is ( A LIE) about HIM. Why do you think He will destory (actual word is ABOLISH) it with the SPIRIT of HIS MOUTH >The POPE is NOT and WAS NOT DISPLAYED AS TRUE GOD EVER TO MY KNOWLEDGE and is not today either. That is an assumption on your part.  Who is presented as a TRUE GOD  by the APOSTATE CHURCHES , the Catholic's and Protestants is it not JESUS.  Idolatry is not a sports event or movie unless you are calling it a GOD. If you look at the Scriptures closely and in the Greek text you can easily see it is a (LIE) about a PERSON BEING DISPLAYED AS GOD, no one fits that description except Jesus HIMSELF.  This (LIE) was put in force at the Council of Necia,325 AD, it is the DOCTRINE (TEACHING) That JESUS is A GOD> The Trinity doctrine is (the LIE) And it is about a MAN, the Man Jesus Christ, And he will destory this false teaching (LIE) when He return, by HIS own words from His own Mouth. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene……………………….gene

[Cindy]

Gene

I have to call you a liar, you constantly twist my words around; why do you do that. Don't you think other people read what I say? I never said, “they worship them (athletes and stars) as god's.”
Reading the rest of that paragraph makes my head spin, you couldn't possibly pretend to be so ignorant.

Nowhere in the bible does it say that the man of sin is being displayed as the true God, he claims to be here in the place of God.

Let me give you a quote from the Ferraris Ecclesiastical Dictionary, a standard Roman Catholic authority, it reads as follows:
“The pope is of such dignity and highness that he is not simply a man but, as it were, God, and the vicar (representative) of God….
Hence the pope is crowned with a triple crown, as king of heaven, of earth and of hell. Nay, the pope's excellence and power are not only about heavenly, terrestrial and infernal things, but he is also above angels, and is their superior; so that if it were possible that angels could err from the faith, or entertain sentiments contrary thereto, they could be judged and excommunicated by the pope….
He is of such great dignity and power that he occupies one and the same tribunal with Christ: so that whatsoever the pope does seems to proceed from the mouth of God….
The pope is, as it were, God on earth, the only prince of the faithful of Christ, the greatest king of all kings, possessing the plenitude of power; to whom the government of the earthly and heavenly kingdom is entrusted….
The pope is of so great authority and power that he can modify, declare or interpret the divine law….”

That is what the popes made people think. I don't know how many people still think that, but there are millions that, I believe, worship the pope more than they do God.

That, is your “man” of sin.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg……… your trying to make a point that people who go to sport game and the like are using them as some kind of God worship. I am not twisting what you are saying, now you say the Pope is (AS IT WERE) the only prince of the Faithful of Christ, we are not talking about the faithful of Christ , we are talking about some one being displayed as (VERY GOD) HIMSELF. Not “as it were” but really being preached and worshiped as a true GOD. NO one as far as i know believes the POPE is a GOD. At least i never heard that in my life time.  But i have heard the TRINITARIANS AND PREEXISTENCES SAY AND PREACH JESUS AS VERY GOD HIMSELF. The point  is not about what you believe people might think about the Pope, but is He being (DISPLAYED as VERY GOD) and is He taking HIS Seat in the (temple of GOD), no one to my knowledge has taken their seat there and sits there but Jesus Himself and (HE) is who is being Preached as a GOD, not the POPE. As i said before your confusing the MAN OF SIN, with the ones who created the LIE , the apostate Church.

I restate again, THE MAN OF SIN IS NOT A REAL PERSON, IT IS A (LIE) ABOUT JESUS CHRIST BEING A GOD. A FALSE DOCTRINE, WHICH JESUS WILL (ABOLISH) BY HIS VERY OWN MOUTH AT HIS RETURN. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene………………………gene

[Cindy]

Gene

As far as I am concerned, you can believe what ever you want, I am not trying to correct you for your sake only.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg……..And you have a right to believe what ever you want also, and i am not trying to correct you for you sake either, but others who might be enlightened by this post. In my opinion you have not proved any of your points, other then describing one of the Apostate Churches and its leadership that started the LIE THAT JESUS IS (A GOD). AGAIN THE MAN OF SIN IS NOT A REAL PERSON , IT IS A LIE ABOUT JESUS HIMSELF, and this LIE will be (abolished) at the return of Jesus by his own mouth. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene……………………………gene

[Cindy]

Gene

Do yourself a favor, look up the “HISTORY OF CATHOLIC POPES”.
You will be surprised what you can learn about these so called “Holy Father's”.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg……..Again i am not in doubt who started the LIE, that Jesus is a GOD, I know and have read most of the theories out there including the one you are advancing, which is noting more then the wwcg teaching of Hebert W. Armstrong, Have read and studied all of His teachings and most are inaccurate. The issue I am talking about is not what church pushes the LIE, it is the LIE itself, and that LIE is that JESUS IS GOD HIMSELF. And has nothing to do with the POPE being perceived as GOD by some past History, The only one who i see being falsely presented as a GOD in both Catholic and Protestant organizations is JESUS, NOT the POPE. Again your getting the  source of (THE LIE) the Apostate Churches mixed up with the LIE they teach. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene………………………..gene

[Cindy]

Gene

The fact however is, Paul is talking about “the man of sin”, not an idea, if you deny that, then you're denying the word of God in order to push your own idea.
You are correct when you say, Mr. Armstrong's teachings had many flaws, but so do most other ministries. Did not Jesus say, “many” will come in my name, and deceive many? Do not all these churches call themselves “Christian” churches? And did not Paul say, (Phil. 1:18) regardless the reason Christ is being preached, the important thing is that he is being preached.
But he did caution us to “prove all things”, and to hold on to that “which is good” (1 Thes. 5:21).
Your idea of the man of sin is self made, not biblical.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg………Name one person who takes His seat in the (true) temple of GOD , here on earth, no one does. It can't be the POPE because He does not sit in the (TRUE) temple of GOD, and never did, he is the head of the fallen apostate church not the (TRUE) church. The word (worship) to me does not mean to respect men of special ability God gave them, it has nothing to do with Sports or going to movies and the such. It is when you bow down to something calling it your GOD. The only places in scripture that shows Idolatry is when men are calling what they are doing as a form of worshiping A GOD. Granted some can overdue sport events and so forth, but to say they view these things a a GOD is a stretch, Paul even said that the meat offered to Idols was nothing, to a true saint , but told us not to do such things for the sake of the weak brothers. Idolatry is giving something a GOD status, which is not true GOD.

Why do you think it is said Jesus would (ABOLISH) it with the Breath of His mouth when he returns. A real (man) , would be destroyed not (ABOLISHED) You destory a person you (ABOLISH) a LIE> Georg its a (LIE) not a real person, a LIE about JESUS being (A GOD). You can not disregard that it is a (LIE) we are dealing with, a lie can be about anyone , and in this case it is a LIE about Jesus, which creates the IMAGE of the MAN OF SIN. The MAN of SIN is not a real person it is a LIE about a real MAN , the man Jesus Christ. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene

[Cindy]

Gene

You are in a denial, you know that what ever matter's the most to you, can become your god, whether it is sports, cars, house, movie stars, or what ever. You can worship these things without going down on your knees. And I don't mean that people think of these things as their god, but if they become more important than God, than it becomes their god.
“Sitting” in the temple of God is not meant literal, it is to say that he commands, dictates, and rules over them; he is (was) in charge, and any disobedience ended in death.
When Jesus takes command, he will not only destroy the “man of sin”, he will destroy the whole false Church system, the whore sitting on the beast, (Rev. 17:3), meaning all false religion including Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam, etc.
If you say the the man of sin is not a real person, than you call Paul a liar. The man of sin is not an image, if I'm wrong, show me the scripture that says so.

Georg

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