The Light

[Lightenup]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 25 2009,17:25)

Hi Kathi Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 11 2009,03:08) .” The connection with the original creation suggests the meaning “originator” for ἀρχή here. BDAG 138 s.v. 3 gives the meaning “the first cause” for the word in Rev 3:14, a term that is too philosophical for the general reader, so the translation “originator” was used instead. BDAG also notes, “but the mng. beginning = ‘first created’ is linguistically probable (s. above 1b and Job 40:19; also CBurney, Christ as the ᾿Αρχή of Creation: JTS 27, 1926, 160-77).” Such a meaning is unlikely here, however, since the connections described above are much more probable. The word “Originator” is a good one for Jesus truly is the “Originator” of all things for without him was not “anything” (including the light of Genesis) made that was made. The scriptures say “In the beginning was the Word” so if the Word was with God in the begining then he was before the beginning. Jesus is the “Word” the “Word” preceeded the light in Genesis! Blessings! WJ

Hi Keith,
I would say that day ONE was the beginning of the week of creation.

Blessings,
Kathi

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 25 2009,17:24)

Hi lU John 1:4 4 In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. So what was IN HIM is the SPIRIT of LIFE, the Spirit which brings true understanding.

True Nick
LU

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 26 2009,09:35)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 25 2009,17:25) Hi Kathi Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 11 2009,03:08) .” The connection with the original creation suggests the meaning “originator” for ἀρχή here. BDAG 138 s.v. 3 gives the meaning “the first cause” for the word in Rev 3:14, a term that is too philosophical for the general reader, so the translation “originator” was used instead. BDAG also notes, “but the mng. beginning = ‘first created’ is linguistically probable (s. above 1b and Job 40:19; also CBurney, Christ as the ᾿Αρχή of Creation: JTS 27, 1926, 160-77).” Such a meaning is unlikely here, however, since the connections described above are much more probable. The word “Originator” is a good one for Jesus truly is the “Originator” of all things for without him was not “anything” (including the light of Genesis) made that was made. The scriptures say “In the beginning was the Word” so if the Word was with God in the begining then he was before the beginning. Jesus is the “Word” the “Word” preceeded the light in Genesis! Blessings! WJ Hi Keith, I would say that day ONE was the beginning of the week of creation. Blessings, Kathi

Hi kathi

But the “Word” was before day one!

Blessings!

Keith

[seekingtruth]

Kathi,
Thanks for the words of encouragment, truly we have encouraged one another. I know I have forced nothing, I fought accepting it for months before the evidence overwhelmed me and I finally had to embrace it. I still struggle at times however now its “who do you tkink you are that God would give you a revelation” but I have to throw up my hands and praise God for His grace and mercy He has chosen the simple to confound the wise.

I believe it was the fall of 2004 could have been 2005 I know I joined this site not too long after and found it very helpful (and still do)

William

[Lightenup]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 25 2009,18:29)

Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 26 2009,09:35) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Feb. 25 2009,17:25) Hi Kathi Quote (Lightenup @ Feb. 11 2009,03:08) .” The connection with the original creation suggests the meaning “originator” for ἀρχή here. BDAG 138 s.v. 3 gives the meaning “the first cause” for the word in Rev 3:14, a term that is too philosophical for the general reader, so the translation “originator” was used instead. BDAG also notes, “but the mng. beginning = ‘first created’ is linguistically probable (s. above 1b and Job 40:19; also CBurney, Christ as the ᾿Αρχή of Creation: JTS 27, 1926, 160-77).” Such a meaning is unlikely here, however, since the connections described above are much more probable. The word “Originator” is a good one for Jesus truly is the “Originator” of all things for without him was not “anything” (including the light of Genesis) made that was made. The scriptures say “In the beginning was the Word” so if the Word was with God in the begining then he was before the beginning. Jesus is the “Word” the “Word” preceeded the light in Genesis! Blessings! WJ Hi Keith, I would say that day ONE was the beginning of the week of creation. Blessings, Kathi Hi kathi But the “Word” was before day one! Blessings! Keith

Hi Keith,
I do not know how you can prove that? All John says is that the word was in the beginning and with (in the active voice) God and was God. No where does it say “In the beginning always was the word .”

In the beginning was the word “Let there be light,” correct? I don't see a problem here. It seems simple.

Even a word has an origin, even a thought has an origin which naturally comes before a word since it is an expression of a thought.

Thanks for looking at this.
Kathi

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Of course the foundations of the Earth had already been laid, watched joyously by the angels, when the book of Genesis starts.

[Lightenup]

Quote (seekingtruth @ Feb. 25 2009,18:33)

Kathi, Thanks for the words of encouragment, truly we have encouraged one another. I know I have forced nothing, I fought accepting it for months before the evidence overwhelmed me and I finally had to embrace it. I still struggle at times however now its “who do you tkink you are that God would give you a revelation” but I have to throw up my hands and praise God for His grace and mercy He has chosen the simple to confound the wise. I believe it was the fall of 2004 could have been 2005 I know I joined this site not too long after and found it very helpful (and still do) William

Hi William,
I know exactly what you mean wondering “why me” and I had those very same thoughts. Satan wants to kill the seed that God plants so we need not be surprised. We must resist that and continually seek the voice of our shepherd as to whatever He has for us to do with what has been given. Coming on this board to mention it (about fifteen years later) was a big leap for me because I rarely spoke about it. I only told a few pastors, a few friends, and a few family members. I then found someone with very similar views on his personal website and can remember shaking inside as I read that He felt the light of day one was the entrance of the Son of God into this world. Since then He has been a friend and encourager and even stopped by on a cross country road trip. It was so fun. We had dinner and lunch and a three hour Bible study together. A treasure!

So, I am glad you are here and that we have made this connection. Remember the power of that time and the clarity it gives, let that give you confidence. I hope to continue to encourage you and pray for you. I know that I could really use your prayers and encouragment too. You already have been a blessing.

Love in Christ,
Kathi

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 26 2009,13:48)

Hi LU, Of course the foundations of the Earth had already been laid, watched joyously by the angels, when the book of Genesis starts.

Hi Nick,
The formed foundations were not yet laid. Perhaps the “sons of God” rejoiced after the formed foundations were laid, which would make more sense anyway.
LU

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Was the earth not already there?

Gen 1
1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters

That is why God can say to any man
Job 38
1Then the LORD answered Job out of the whirlwind, and said,

2Who is this that darkeneth counsel by words without knowledge?

3Gird up now thy loins like a man; for I will demand of thee, and answer thou me.

4Where wast thou when I laid the foundations of the earth? declare, if thou hast understanding.

5Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it?

6Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof;

7When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

[Lightenup]

Hi Nick,

The formed earth was definetly not there before day one. I find it very interesting that scripture purposely states that it was formless and void. I think that it states that for a very specific purpose and makes a definite distinction between the condition of the earth before the light and then after the light. Who really knows what a formless and void earth entails…not me, but it seems to me that the foundation is at the very most not yet completed since it is formless. A formless foundation…is not yet a foundation. IMO

Kathi

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
So the earth was formless and void.
But there was an earth.

[Lightenup]

Yes Nick,
That I can agree with, an earth covered with water, an earth yet unprepared for man or beast and not formed. We can speculate all day and not prove what God specifically means to lay the foundation of the earth or exactly when the sons of God rejoiced because we really haven't got many specifics to go on. I know that God knows. The Bible says that the Son made all things and laid the foundation of the earth. Also, we know that all things are from the Father. God gave me an answer to my search and I know that He can do that for all of us if He chooses. Some things are not for us to know yet.

Kathi

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
So you think the Son of God was begotten after the earth and the angels were made?

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 26 2009,15:41)

Hi LU, So you think the Son of God was begotten after the earth and the angels were made?

Hi Nick,
This verse tells us that it took six days to make the heavens and the earth:

Ex 20:11
11 ” For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.
NASU

That is plain that the earth and the heavens were not considered made in this verse before day one. Although I believe they were begun. Also the angels in heaven were created during this six day period. It says that ALL that is in them was made in six days. That means angels too.

So to answer your question, day one is not AFTER the earth and angels were made it is before, and day one is when I believe that the Son of God was begotten. The earth and the angels were made during those six days after.

LU

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
The earth existed before gen1.

[Lightenup]

Hi Nick,
What Gen.1 is that?  It couldn't be the one in the Bible, for the creation took place in the six days that the Genesis in my Bible speaks of and it does not mention that creation as another or renewed creation.  I don't hang my hat on literal 24 hour days here but just the same, the six days are written in Genesis and do not speak of any other six day period of creation.

Ex 20:11
11 ” For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them, and rested on the seventh day; therefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day and made it holy.
NASU

LU

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
The EARTH WAS FORMLESS AND VOID before anything else is shown in Gen1

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
It was never all about us. Visible creation is just a moment in the timelessness of God.

THE BEGINNING was before Genesis.

That is when the foundations of earth were laid.

[Lightenup]

Nick,
If I said that God spoke the words “let there be light” in the beginning would that be a true statement?
LU

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Yes in the context of VISIBLE CREATION.
But there was a timeless beginning before that in which the world was formless and void.

[Author]

Posts