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TO ALL:
According to the ESV Jude verse 5 says that Jesus saved the people out of Egypt. The ESV is based in the Novum Testamentum Graece which Constitutionalist is “Latin translation garbage.” But according to Wikipedia the Novum Testamentum Graece is the “Greek language version” of the new testament. In other words, the NTG is not a Latin translation but merely the Latin name for the Greek language version of the new testament.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novum_Testamentum_Graece
Moreover, the NASB which reads that “the Lord” delivered them from Egypt says in it marginal note that “two early manuscripts read Jesus.” This means that the ESV is a literal translation of two early GREEK manuscripts.
So we have two early Greek manuscripts which read that it was Jesus who delivered the people out of Egypt. But does it really matter? Of course not because ALL the manuscripts agree that Jesus is the “ONLY Master and Lord” (verse 4). Therefore, it is “the Lord” JESUS who saved the people out of Egypt.
Really Con, please do your homework before you spout off the word “garbage.”
thinker
Thinker……..Con's, martian, kerwin, post makes real sense , you trinitarians and preexistences make (NO) Sense that is why you have to (try) to takes us around you never ending SO- Called 600 Scholar rabbit trials, Spinning around and around in senseless and meaningless rhetoric. IMO
gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 14 2009,04:49) Hi tt,
Is Jesus the God of the Jews?
Jn8.54
Nick,
Two early Greek manuscripts say that JESUS saved the people out of Egypt. Does this answer your question?thinker
Thinker……..your reliance on Scriptures rather then the Spirit of GOD, causes you much confusion. Let the Spirit (intellect) of GOD lead you and your will see the fallaciously of you beliefs. It not wrong to read scriptures but it takes the Spirit of God to properly understand them. (the spirit of truth) (intellect of truth) given by GOD the FATHER. IMO
gene
G,
Is is plain you do not rely on scripture as you add to it and subtract from it according to your personal revelations.[Col2]
Is that wise?Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 13 2009,09:55) Hi TT,
There are thousands of manuscripts and only one original.
So it answers no questions.
Nick he doesn't grasp that.Just like there are over 300 bible transliteration (versions) out there, if they are ALL in agreement, why do they exist?
The original “manuscript” does not have “Jesus” saving people out of Egypt.
But TT accepts (2) Later Greek manuscripts (Charlie come lately's) praised by the Roman Church (should be warning enough).
See the big picture without me even trying to argue the verse.
Quote (thethinker @ Dec. 13 2009,07:07) TO ALL:
According to the ESV Jude verse 5 says that Jesus saved the people out of Egypt. The ESV is based in the Novum Testamentum Graece which Constitutionalist is “Latin translation garbage.” But according to Wikipedia the Novum Testamentum Graece is the “Greek language version” of the new testament. In other words, the NTG is not a Latin translation but merely the Latin name for the Greek language version of the new testament.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Novum_Testamentum_Graece
Moreover, the NASB which reads that “the Lord” delivered them from Egypt says in it marginal note that “two early manuscripts read Jesus.” This means that the ESV is a literal translation of two early GREEK manuscripts.
So we have two early Greek manuscripts which read that it was Jesus who delivered the people out of Egypt. But does it really matter? Of course not because ALL the manuscripts agree that Jesus is the “ONLY Master and Lord” (verse 4). Therefore, it is “the Lord” JESUS who saved the people out of Egypt.
Really Con, please do your homework before you spout off the word “garbage.”
thinker
Hmn, a Latin name for a Greek book, why would they do that?If the Greeks wrote a Greek translation with Greek thought, with Greek linguistic expertise, why give credit to Latin with a Latin title?
Could it be possible tht there is a Greco/Roman thought process going on here?
Your Greco/Roman Trinatarian beliefs just don't cut the grade.
pritNick………. Relying on the Spirit of GOD is sufficient for me, as Jesus said the spirit (intellect of God) will teach you (ALL) things. It is also plain you do not understand Scriptures that are written , as you have many times shown US, so i would not be calling the kettle black if i were a pot. IMO
gene
G,
You can ignore and abuse the sacred scripts at will now you are sure of your 'inspiration”?
Can you be so sure or do you get doubts when scripture opposes you?G,
You attitude shows that the gentle wind of grace forces nobody and your will can still oppose God.NIck……… Scriptue does not oppose me you do lets get that straight, And your attitude shows you are self opinionated and think you have the sum of all truth , but when questioned you fail to produce you support for you words, I have quoted many, many, many, scriptures to you and you fail to recognize the truth in them. Parroting Scripture and worshiping them , without understanding means nothing to you or anyone we else. IMO
gene
Nick…………AS i told you before You are far more a Gnostic then i ever was, is it not you who believe that Jesus preexisted as some sort of demigod, or super spirit being of some kind, same as the Gnostic's did.
gene
G,
You have told us we do not need to rely on scripture but rather what the Spirit tells us.
But your inspiration is unique and few would agree it is of God.
Test the spirits.(New American Standard Bible)
4For certain persons have (A)crept in unnoticed, those who were long beforehand (B)marked out for this condemnation, ungodly persons who turn Âthe grace of our God into (D)licentiousness and (E)deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.
5Now I desire to (F)remind you, though (G)you know all things once for all, that [a]the Lord, (H)after saving a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.
Footnotes:
a.Jude 1:5 Two early mss read JesusTO ALL: Please note that the footnote says that “two early manuscripts read Jesus.
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage….on=NASB
thinker
Jude 1:4-5 (Wycliffe New Testament)
4 For some unfaithful men privily entered, that sometime were before-written into this doom, and overturn the grace of our God into lechery, and deny him that is only a Lord, our Lord Jesus Christ. [Forsooth some men privily entered, that sometime were before-written into this doom, unpious men, overturning the grace of our God into lechery, and denying the alone lordshipper and our Lord Jesus Christ.]5 But I will admonish you once, that know all things, that Jesus saved his people from the land of Egypt, and the second time destroyed them that believed not. [Forsooth I will together admonish you, witting once all things, for Jesus saving his people of the land of Egypt, the second time lost them that believed not.]
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Jude%204-5&version=WYC
thinker
Jude 1:4-5 (Today's New International Version)
4 For certain individuals whose condemnation was written about [a] long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.5 Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord (b) at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe.
Footnotes:
a.Jude 1:4 Or individuals who were marked out for condemnation
b.Jude 1:5 Some early manuscripts Jesushttp://www.biblegateway.com/passage….on=TNIV
thinker
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