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Hi and welcome Ang,
There is no man that compares with the Son of God.
John was the greatest prophet and Jesus was greater than him.
Saul continued the work of Christ by the Spirit of Christ living in him.[gal2]Ang………..Paul was called by GOD to preach the Gospel to the Gentiles as He said he was, Peter and the rest of the apostles gave him the hand of fellowship and Peter even acknowledged Him as an apostle of Christ. why is it so hard for you to except him, is it because of his Past , well then, do you reject King David as the apple of GOD'S Eye. After all he not only was a murder but also an Adulator. If we say who GOD accepts and Rejects we are playing GOD. God does not look on the outward appearance as men do, but on the heart. We have all sin and come short of the glory of GOD scripture says. Paul has brought to light much in his writings for both Jews and Gentiles . IMO
gene
a person like Paul was misguide is hearth was in the right place ,because his seal never changed contrary it intensified,after Christ chowed him the way.
God use Paul to the fullest of his ability,we have to thank God for it .ament……..Paul as far as i am concerned was a great teacher an a apostle of Jesus Christ. I agree with Peter completely, some of Paul's writings are hard to understand and men do twist them to their own destruction, but if we study them with the Spirit of GOD leading us they all make excellent sense, and do establish us in the faith. He even said GOD would Judge the Hearts of Men by HIS Gospel.
Quote (anglhart @ Jan. 05 2010,05:09) Hi,
I need a little help with something concerning Paul. If Yeshua was able to foretell the future as well as he obviously was, why then was he unable to predict something as important as the coming of Saul of Tarsus. I ask this because so much of the Romanized bible is based on Paul’s interpretation of Yeshua’s words. We are asked to swallow, on faith alone, many contradictions based solely on the word of a murderous Jewish Roman citizen named Paul. Why was he given so much power to define (or redefine ), Yeshua’s message? It’s kind of obvious to me that he wanted to lead the emerging Christian church, a job that had already been given to someone else by the master himself. I have a lot of trouble with the KJV because of this. When asked by his disciples, “after you are gone, who shall we follow?”, Yeshua told them that they are to follow his brother James the just. The implications being, at least to me, that after the crucifixion James would lead the church, as indeed he attempted to do. I cannot believe that Yeshua would have failed to inform the people most important to his mission that a man such as Paul was on the way. Why would there have been a need for such friction as there was between Paul and James? We know from historical accounts, as written by Josephus, that the friction was much more pronounced than the KJV’s description of a minor disagreement and might better be described as internecine hostilities. For the sake of sparing the lives of countless Christians I can understand why Yeshua would need to make an appearance to a murderous criminal like Paul. However, that he failed to also inform James and his church knowing of the friction that this was certain to cause, defies logic and speaks to me of deception. Who was Paul that he should feel entitled to correct the mission of the Ebionite Christianities? Perhaps we should ask why Paul felt that this needed to be done.
Hi anglhart:I don't know that I can answer all of your questions, as to why this or why that, but God surely knows what He is doing.
Paul did not call himself into the ministry, but it was Jesus who called, and Paul says the following:
Quote 1Ti 1:11 according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust. 1Ti 1:12 And I thank Christ Jesus our Lord who has enabled me, because He counted me faithful, putting [me] into the ministry,
1Ti 1:13 although I was formerly a blasphemer, a persecutor, and an insolent man; but I obtained mercy because I did [it] ignorantly in unbelief.
1Ti 1:14 And the grace of our Lord was exceedingly abundant, with faith and love which are in Christ Jesus.
1Ti 1:15 This [is] a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptance, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am chief.
1Ti 1:16 However, for this reason I obtained mercy, that in me first Jesus Christ might show all longsuffering, as a pattern to those who are going to believe on Him for everlasting life.
1Ti 1:17 Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, to God who alone is wise, [fn] [be] honor and glory forever and ever. Amen.
And so, God called him because He knew that Paul would be faithful, and because he came to save sinners, and Paul admits that he was the worst. There is another scripture which says something on this order, but I cannot put my finger on it at this time. It says: “he who has little to forgive cannot love much”.
So, what does Josephus say relative to friction between the Apostle Paul and James?
There is no contradiction relative to Paul's stating that we are saved by faith, and James saying that faith without works is dead. Believing is not just a mental assent. The Apostle Paul made that clear, and so, it is just a matter of understanding what the Apostle Paul is saying.
Since the Apostle Paul was a servant of God through Jesus Christ then He has the authority from him to correct he who is in need of correction.
Love in Christ,
Martyhi anglhart
it was predict in the scriptures ,i am looking for it now wen i find it i will let you know,Hello all, and thanks for responding.
First of all let me admit to quoting the gospel of Thomas (as translated from the Coptic version of the Nag Hammadi texts), and allowing the implication that I was referring to cannon or KJV. While the gospel of Thomas is getting a lot of attention from scholars who are now convinced it predates the Greek cannon and may possibly be elevated from the level of apocrypha one day, it is still considered apocryphal and I should have made that clear.
Having said that I’d like to address Marty’s comment…“Since the Apostle Paul was a servant of God through Jesus Christ then He has the authority from him to correct he who is in need of correction.”
“He who is in need of correction!”
So you’re telling me Paul was righteous enough to correct the son of God? I'm to believe that Yeshua was indeed in error or had at the very least failed to define his mission/message properly such that he would need to ask a man like Paul to take over and, in many instances, rewrite his message? Throughout history there has been no shortage of men claiming to be so righteous for the very same reasons Paul sighted. Many of these men have been just as convincing. What makes Paul any different than these charlatans?Quote (anglhart @ Jan. 04 2010,13:09) Hi,
I need a little help with something concerning Paul. If Yeshua was able to foretell the future as well as he obviously was, why then was he unable to predict something as important as the coming of Saul of Tarsus.
How do you know he didn't? Do you think that 66 books could tell us all that Jesus ever did?John said…
And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, “if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written“. Amen. John 21:25
After all the cannon does tell us that Jesus himself appeared to Paul and called him to preach the Gospel, and Jesus lead Apostle Peter, speaks highly of Paul and recommends his writings!
I think that those who question Paul have an agenda with his inspired words!
WJ
Quote (anglhart @ Jan. 09 2010,04:59) Hello all, and thanks for responding.
First of all let me admit to quoting the gospel of Thomas (as translated from the Coptic version of the Nag Hammadi texts), and allowing the implication that I was referring to cannon or KJV. While the gospel of Thomas is getting a lot of attention from scholars who are now convinced it predates the Greek cannon and may possibly be elevated from the level of apocrypha one day, it is still considered apocryphal and I should have made that clear.
Having said that I’d like to address Marty’s comment…“Since the Apostle Paul was a servant of God through Jesus Christ then He has the authority from him to correct he who is in need of correction.”
“He who is in need of correction!”
So you’re telling me Paul was righteous enough to correct the son of God? I'm to believe that Yeshua was indeed in error or had at the very least failed to define his mission/message properly such that he would need to ask a man like Paul to take over and, in many instances, rewrite his message? Throughout history there has been no shortage of men claiming to be so righteous for the very same reasons Paul sighted. Many of these men have been just as convincing. What makes Paul any different than these charlatans?
Hi AnglI would say that its allways better to use just the words of Jesus above anything else, if Paul says one thing, and it doesnt agree with something Jesus said, id go with Jesus! But then on saying that id be considered a heretic and no-one would listen lol. Welcome too.
Hi karmarie, and thanks for commenting. I would agree with you and side with Yeshua where there are contradictions. I'm one of those people who feel that the ideologies of Paul do differ from those of Yeshua on more than a few topics and I feel that differences are more pronounced than the KJV might have you think. I think your comment …..
“But then on saying that id be considered a heretic”
sums up a very disappointing attitude among many Christians. An attitude that shows many Christians are not that far removed from the arrogance and indeed, the ignorance, of those zealots of many other religions. A more or less recent example would be the attitude that many Muslims displayed after Christoph Luxemberg released his book on the possible Aramaic roots of the Koran. In the book Christoph maintains that many of the Koran’s notoriously nebulous and confusing sayings can be better understood if we consider that they may have been translated from an Aramaic source. Through this Christoph implies further that the Koran may have been an attempt by early Syro-Christians to convert the Arabs. As you might expect, this didn’t sit well with the Arabs who maintain the Koran was and has always been a document of Arabic source. This is only one example but it clearly demonstrates how blind faith can blind people to the truth and hinder or even preclude honest attempts to find it.Hi and welcome AH,
Paul said Christ was in him[gal]
Was he telling the truth?If christ was in him were his words inspired by that Spirit?
If they are not what can you believe from his teachings?
if they are are why can you not accept his words?If we seek the Spirit[Lk11] we will find that it was our thoughts that did not align with God's while his did.
Hi Nick, thanks for the response. I'm a bit confused by your post. Much of your retort seems to come from “faith alone”, yet you have an interesting little saying at the bottom of your post. “Test all Things”. Do you test all things? I find most people who accept Saul's version of Yeshua's message must do it on faith alone and are typically afraid to be objective. Perhaps it's because being objective, when it comes to Saul, is impossible.
Quote (anglhart @ Feb. 10 2010,04:35) Hi karmarie, and thanks for commenting. I would agree with you and side with Yeshua where there are contradictions. I'm one of those people who feel that the ideologies of Paul do differ from those of Yeshua on more than a few topics and I feel that differences are more pronounced than the KJV might have you think. I think your comment …..
“But then on saying that id be considered a heretic”
sums up a very disappointing attitude among many Christians. An attitude that shows many Christians are not that far removed from the arrogance and indeed, the ignorance, of those zealots of many other religions. A more or less recent example would be the attitude that many Muslims displayed after Christoph Luxemberg released his book on the possible Aramaic roots of the Koran. In the book Christoph maintains that many of the Koran’s notoriously nebulous and confusing sayings can be better understood if we consider that they may have been translated from an Aramaic source. Through this Christoph implies further that the Koran may have been an attempt by early Syro-Christians to convert the Arabs. As you might expect, this didn’t sit well with the Arabs who maintain the Koran was and has always been a document of Arabic source. This is only one example but it clearly demonstrates how blind faith can blind people to the truth and hinder or even preclude honest attempts to find it.
Hi AngelhartIm still undecided on Paul. Maybe I need to actually read his books (Which is about half of the New Testement) I stopped reading after Acts, and skipped through to I think Hebrews? Then read the Johns, Peter and so on, so iv missed alot.
Its hard to understand alot of what he writes, so I guess at least i cant twist anything hes written cause I havent even read it ! lol.
2nd Peter 3:16
…just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. 16He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.Quote (anglhart @ Feb. 11 2010,16:07) Hi Nick, thanks for the response. I'm a bit confused by your post. Much of your retort seems to come from “faith alone”, yet you have an interesting little saying at the bottom of your post. “Test all Things”. Do you test all things? I find most people who accept Saul's version of Yeshua's message must do it on faith alone and are typically afraid to be objective. Perhaps it's because being objective, when it comes to Saul, is impossible.
Hi and welcome ah,
It is difficult to align Paul with the rest of scripture but only because men lack the Spirit of Christ in Paul.[Gal2.20]Most refuse the door of Christ trying to find other ways into the kingdom and so cannot receive of his Spirit.
Quote (chosenone @ July 02 2008,13:45) Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 01 2008,14:12) Hi CO,
There is one eternal gospel.
Nick.
“eternal gospel”. Show scripture saying that please.Blessings.
We never did get an answer from Nick to show scripture about his mythical “eternal gospel for all”.Hi CO,
Have you yet to hear the gospel?
If not you should get onto seeking the kingdom.
Read your concordant bible alongside another one and it will help you.There is life and peace and grace accessible from God through being reborn into Christ [Gal3.27]and him being born into you[Gal4.19].
hi all
i beleive what nick try to say is ;why you do not look in the scriptures for your self to make the knowledge yours and not someone elses,
in this way you may follow Christ spirit and not ,whatever.
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