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Quote (t8 @ May 27 2008,22:43) Also is discipleelohim still here, or did he leave? I thought some would leave once the stuff they said would happen didn't come to pass. Maybe I was correct in my assumption about some leaving. If not, then we need an apology please. Or an explanation of some kind please.
Hi T8,
I don't think we should demand and apology from any of these poor souls. I personally feel compassion for, and pity them for being duped by yet another snake oil salesman.I pray that they will come to a better understanding of God.
Tim
Quote (ptr775 @ May 27 2008,21:29) Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 24 2008,01:10) Greetings everyone. I have something that I would like to say. I was decieved by Ron. I realized last week that he had said right before Passover that he would say something that would effect what the Pope would say. Did ANYONE get the notes there? I didn't hear Ron say anything directed at the Pope nor did the Pope say anything whatsoever in response to Ron. I've been following Ron Weinland and his sermons and interviews, and I must say I never heard Ron say anything like that. Do you think it's possible you misinterpreted what he said? Where exactly did you hear him say that? If he did say that, don't you think he would have at least tried to say something directed to the pope to get a response? Also the other points you brought up, I've noticed have been thoroughly addreses by Ron Weinland. Don't get me wrong, we're all free to make up our own mind, but I'd hate to see somebody make a decision based on a mininterpretaion of what they thought somebody said, especially if he turn out to be correct, and with such a short time to wait to see if he is, since he is saying about a nuke attack between 1st June and 16th July or he will admit to being a false prophet. Anyway, just curious as to where you heard him say that about getting a response from the Pope?
Greetings 775ptr……In these times we live in the liklyhood of a catstrophic nuclear strike is something we live with every day…With all due respect to RW and his prognostications and notwithstanding those that were of a spiritual nature and not understood by sinners such as myself….I must say….”If he is a prophet of God and he and his wife are the two witnesses of revelation”….I would think they should be boldly prophesing as well as trumpreting a message of repentance so the world can be forewarned….Perhaps God has not given them the resources to do this simply because,although,the time is near,it is just not now and I am sure things will happen in Gods good time not RWs…I will not apologize as it was your choice to listen or not. I listened and I was wrong. But I will always be grateful as it brought us into the truth.
Quote (ptr775 @ May 28 2008,06:29) Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 24 2008,01:10) Greetings everyone. I have something that I would like to say. I was decieved by Ron. I realized last week that he had said right before Passover that he would say something that would effect what the Pope would say. Did ANYONE get the notes there? I didn't hear Ron say anything directed at the Pope nor did the Pope say anything whatsoever in response to Ron. I've been following Ron Weinland and his sermons and interviews, and I must say I never heard Ron say anything like that. Do you think it's possible you misinterpreted what he said? Where exactly did you hear him say that? If he did say that, don't you think he would have at least tried to say something directed to the pope to get a response? Also the other points you brought up, I've noticed have been thoroughly addreses by Ron Weinland. Don't get me wrong, we're all free to make up our own mind, but I'd hate to see somebody make a decision based on a mininterpretaion of what they thought somebody said, especially if he turn out to be correct, and with such a short time to wait to see if he is, since he is saying about a nuke attack between 1st June and 16th July or he will admit to being a false prophet. Anyway, just curious as to where you heard him say that about getting a response from the Pope?
More then likely you got an edited version. Also, just this last weeks sermon said that there were some who left from the Dakotas and Virginias and that we did it to save our hides. That is false, I don't even understand how leaving would save our hides. I am disappointed by this comment as we did not leave angry, we actually thanked them for bringing us into the truth and that we will be praying for them. I had a few choice things I said about changing doctrine and such of which I have learned over the last month.Stating that we would never repent and such. That is false. We just aren't listening to him anymore. If something went down to prove otherwise, then we would be the first to repent.
Now, please tell me why he is not false. Nothing has happened over here like he said they would. That makes him a false prophet.
Did you also know that only an Apostle has the authority to change doctrine? Ron is not an apostle.
Also, Mrs., HWA was NOT a prophet so therefore he can't be a false one. He was an apostle.
All of this is so clear to me. But I do NOT want to argue.
I pray for everyone to find the truth.
Rephrase – joining to save our hides! Him saying that even after our letters to him proves even more that he is false.
Also, the other couple that we were spending our sabbaths with were told not to talk to us anymore because we might change their minds. Hmm, I thought only God can do that. All of this just completely solidifies everything that I said before – he is false.
I'm done with this conversation.
New topic??? Could the UFO's being seen more and more lately possibly be demons posing as UFO's to throw peoples beliefs off course even more?
Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 28 2008,04:55) Rephrase – joining to save our hides! Him saying that even after our letters to him proves even more that he is false. Also, the other couple that we were spending our sabbaths with were told not to talk to us anymore because we might change their minds. Hmm, I thought only God can do that. All of this just completely solidifies everything that I said before – he is false.
I'm done with this conversation.
New topic??? Could the UFO's being seen more and more lately possibly be demons posing as UFO's to throw peoples beliefs off course even more?
Greetings A…..UFOs could certainly be a sign or a wonder that would be afforded to satan in the limited time alotted to him….Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 24 2008,16:12) Mandy, I would like to further discuss things with you as well! I'm curious to your full beliefs and perhaps we could all swap stories and thoughts.
Hi Angie,I have to chuckle to myself these days when folks ask me what my “full beliefs” are on any given theological subject. I have opinions and ideas, much like you read here on any given thread. I also have many bible verses to back my theories. I even have a few Greek explainations that would support my theories of conception, non-preexistence and the true Sonship of Jesus. These are just a few of my favorite topics that I am currently re-visiting.
But my “full beliefs” are just theories with a bit of so-called proof mixed in. The real proof is in the pudding. My advice: eat lots of pudding (different flavors).
And realize that no man has the answers. We are only given half-answers. With the hope that the other half will be revealed someday.Keep studying and praying. God bless you as you do. I suppose if we love God will all our hearts, and our neighbor's as ourselves – we have a good foundation for a “full belief” system.
Much love to you and your family,
MandyQuote The nukes Ron predicted were to happen within a 45-90 day window after the 17th April. So we still have until July 16th to know for sure. There definately has been a spike in natural disasters since the 17th of April. I wonder what the death toll stands at, must be over 100,000. Sure it may not feel like a time of tribulation in NZ, but ask those around the China quake, or in Burma. Also, isn't the tribulation supposed to be like birth pangs? Slowly getting worse until the final day of the Lord?
OK, July 16th.That is something concrete. All here will know whether Ron's words are right or not.
I don't doubt that at some stage there will be a nuclear exchange/war. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if there was one in India and Pakistan.
But July 16th is a concrete date and most who give dates turn out to be wrong. Also is the supposed attack on the USA according to Ron a part of this supposed nuclear exchange?
Anyway all will know in less than 3 weeks and then the apologies will come thereafter if those who supported Ron care about those whom may have been deceived by him.
Quote (TimothyVI @ May 28 2008,00:24) Quote (t8 @ May 27 2008,22:43) Also is discipleelohim still here, or did he leave? I thought some would leave once the stuff they said would happen didn't come to pass. Maybe I was correct in my assumption about some leaving. If not, then we need an apology please. Or an explanation of some kind please.
Hi T8,
I don't think we should demand and apology from any of these poor souls. I personally feel compassion for, and pity them for being duped by yet another snake oil salesman.I pray that they will come to a better understanding of God.
Tim
An apology is a sure sign of repentance.False teaching and false prophecies are judged harshly.
False teachers and those who preach a false gospel are judged all the more.
I think that if any of them apologize, then that would be really good for them more so than anyone else because I doubt that they convinced anyone here anyway.
An apology shows that they are sorry and that they are willing to confess their sins one to another. If that is the case, then the result will be healing and it will be a victory for the truth.
With every false prophet, lie, or deception …usually comes a little truth mixed in with it.
Discernment of the spirits
Example:
Quote Genesis 2:17 (King James Version) 17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest there of thou shalt surely die.
Genesis 3:4 (King James Version)
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
There is a little more to this story and anyone that has read it knows full what all it entails.
I believe that even if the guy is a false prophet…he has said some things that may very well be true. Mixed in with the lies.
This is the very way that Satan works. He takes the truth and mixes it with Lies and distorts the actual truth.
Do not discard your enemy…but love them.
In other words “Keep your friends close and your enemies closer”
That don't mean you have to listen to these people if you don't feel like your strong enough to withstand it you should not try.But I would advise everyone to be aware of their surroundings.
Know what your enemy is capable of, so that your not blind-sighted by him.Quote (t8 @ May 28 2008,12:23) Quote The nukes Ron predicted were to happen within a 45-90 day window after the 17th April. So we still have until July 16th to know for sure. There definately has been a spike in natural disasters since the 17th of April. I wonder what the death toll stands at, must be over 100,000. Sure it may not feel like a time of tribulation in NZ, but ask those around the China quake, or in Burma. Also, isn't the tribulation supposed to be like birth pangs? Slowly getting worse until the final day of the Lord?
OK, July 16th.That is something concrete. All here will know whether Ron's words are right or not.
I don't doubt that at some stage there will be a nuclear exchange/war. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if there was one in India and Pakistan.
But July 16th is a concrete date and most who give dates turn out to be wrong. Also is the supposed attack on the USA according to Ron a part of this supposed nuclear exchange?
Anyway all will know in less than 3 weeks and then the apologies will come thereafter if those who supported Ron care about those whom may have been deceived by him.
t8 less then 3 Weeks? From May 27 til July 16th I count 7 weeks. I think, your thinking of June 16th.
Prace and Love Mrs.And just because you can call fire down from heaven don't make you a prophet of GOD.
Or if you change your staff to a serpent…
Satan has powers awarded to him that he can empower his henchmen with.
We all need to be very alert in these end days. Weather or not the end days turn out the way this fellow predicts or not…
I do believe that we are super close to the end times.
Its more than just an earth quake that happened, or a tree that bloomed, or a battle that broke out, or a UFO, or any thing else…
To me its something that I seem to feel in my soul. You ever heard the expression “You can almost taste it?”I can almost taste it.
There are a lot of things that have been happening the past couple of years that make me think that its just about harvest time.
Things with the government, and things with people in general. I would not be surprised to see some things come to pass very soon. Of course the magnitude of what has yet to come to pass will probably be enough to startle any one …even if you think you are prepared for it.However, I do believe that for other reason myself that some things will happen.
Mainly because of the dreams and vision that I've had. I'm not making them up…in fact some of them are so outrageous that I wish I was making them up. I'm not going to go in detail on them at this time in this forum.
I have briefly described a few of them. But I don't think anyone payed them too much attention. Most people would say I was insane, anyway. And I have not the ability to fully interpret the dreams at this time either.
But enough of them has been revealed to me to have me shakin' in my boots, I can tell you that much.
I'm not saying this guy is anything, but I would like to say that I've had a vision about this guy long before I ever knew who he was, or what his name was.
I've had dreams that match up to some of what he is saying. Notice I said “Dreams” not just one dream several dreams. Way before I knew this person. These dreams have happened 12 and 15 years ago. And the vision happened more then almost 20 years ago.
I've went my whole life wondering what it was. It's the only vision that I've ever had.I think this person may very well indeed have some part to play in the end times. Weather it be for GOD, or against him…is still very unclear to me at this time.
I want to make something very CLEAR…I'm not a follower of this person, nor am I in any way affiliated with his church or any of his believers. I'm not supporting him in anyway. I'm just saying that I've listened to some of what he has to say and I seen a picture of him and that was enough to make me nervous.
I believe in GOD almighty, his son Jesus Christ that died on the cross for all mans sins, and the infilling of the Holy Spirit…I also believe that you should be baptized such as Jesus was. I believe that Jesus set the example for us…to strive to live by. And I believe that there will not be a doubt in my mind when he sends a prophet of any type. I believe that GOD will make these things known to his children.
He that hath ears, let him hear.
Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 28 2008,04:45)
More then likely you got an edited version.No, I record them live, so if you tell me which one it was in I can actually go back and listen.
Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 28 2008,04:45)
Also, just this last weeks sermon said that there were some who left from the Dakotas and Virginias and that we did it to save our hides. That is false, I don't even understand how leaving would save our hides.From what I gathered, he said it seemed those joined to save their hides, not left to save their hides.
Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 28 2008,04:45)
Now, please tell me why he is not false. Nothing has happened over here like he said they would. That makes him a false prophet.Perhas that would be easier if you let me know what you believe Ron said should have happened by now. From what I've heard him say, I thought he said the first trumpet was an ongoing and increasing thing within the tribes of Israel, that a spike in natural disasters would take place around the world after the April 17th point (an increase in the “thunders”), both of which seem to have taken place mind you with the current bad weather and quakes within the US and the large death toll around the world within a matter of weeks of April 17th, and finaly that the nukes take place within a 45-90 day window (early june to mid July). So from my perspective, there is no actual grounds to call him a flase prophet as of yet, not unless you were expecting something different from what he said would happen. I've actually had to listen to some of theose sermons twice because of things I've thought I'd heard, simply because of what I had in mind when I heard it, which then turned out to be not what I'd thought I'd heard in the first place. But like I said, each to his own, I was just curious about that staement about getting a response from the pope.
Quote (Anticipation of Peace @ May 28 2008,04:45)
Did you also know that only an Apostle has the authority to change doctrine? Ron is not an apostle.Yes, but if you are talking about what Ron says about the pre-existence of Jesus, is that really a change of doctrine, if it was the truth from the start? For instance, if you believed that God was a trinity, and I point out to you through scripture that this is not true, am I changing the doctrine of the church of God? Am I to go on believing something that I know, through scripture, is false, simply because I am not an Apostle? What you are talking about having the Authority to change is things concerning day to day running of the church, not foundational scripture. Foundational doctrine of the church of God is exactly that, and is never changed, we simply stray from it, and when possible, through the spirit of God, return to it. You don't need to be an Apostle to return to the truth of God, and who else would lead a return to truth, but the earthly head of the church of God, led by the spirit of God through Jesus Christ, no matter what rank they happened to be, especially during a time when the leader of the church was to be a prophet, and not an Apostle.
God bless.
If Mr. Weinland is anything were is the prove. He has done nothing, but take peoples money abd travel with it all over Europe with it. I know Mr. Weinland personally and can't really see that He would be a prophet at all. Just 7 Weeks and we will see if He is a false prophet or not.
Peace and Love Mrs.Quote (seek and you will find @ May 28 2008,13:48) Quote (t8 @ May 28 2008,12:23) Quote The nukes Ron predicted were to happen within a 45-90 day window after the 17th April. So we still have until July 16th to know for sure. There definately has been a spike in natural disasters since the 17th of April. I wonder what the death toll stands at, must be over 100,000. Sure it may not feel like a time of tribulation in NZ, but ask those around the China quake, or in Burma. Also, isn't the tribulation supposed to be like birth pangs? Slowly getting worse until the final day of the Lord?
OK, July 16th.That is something concrete. All here will know whether Ron's words are right or not.
I don't doubt that at some stage there will be a nuclear exchange/war. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if there was one in India and Pakistan.
But July 16th is a concrete date and most who give dates turn out to be wrong. Also is the supposed attack on the USA according to Ron a part of this supposed nuclear exchange?
Anyway all will know in less than 3 weeks and then the apologies will come thereafter if those who supported Ron care about those whom may have been deceived by him.
t8 less then 3 Weeks? From May 27 til July 16th I count 7 weeks. I think, your thinking of June 16th.
Prace and Love Mrs.
True. I saw it as June for some reason.7 weeks.
We wait with bated breath.
Page 23 of 2008 – God's Final Witness:
“Yes, I do know the timing of events as the Seals of Revelation are opening. I do know we are in the end-time and that six Seals have already been opened. I know the exact day the First Seal was opened. As will be covered in another chapter, I know the exact day the Sixth Seal was opned, and th world will be shocked and in horror on the day that the Seventh Seal is opened.”
Was the whole world shocked? How could they have been only a few thousand have heard of him.
Other then a select few knowing the day it alledgedly opened, no one was shocked. Especially not the whole world.He is false – this proves it before July 16.
ptr775- There are many doctrine changes that he has made. Changing the preexistence of Jesus is disagreeing with HWA and that alone should not be happening.
Now, lets discuss this last weeks sermon. Ron lied about us. (We were used as examples, we're from the Dakotas). What he said about us is a lie and our emails informed him that we would be holding fast to the truth. I would be more then happy to show you a copy of the actual email. So for him to assume what he did is a down right LIE and God knows his mind too and how he is decieving everyone.
Another thing that has stood out for me is that he spends an awful long time defending himself.
However, the fact remains July 16th we'll know without a doubt.
This is copied from my sent items in my email:
Ron and Laura,
I don't believe you are who you say you are. You said in a sermon prior to Passover that what you said while you were in Jerusalem would effect what the Pope said while he was over here. That didn't happen; therefore that makes you false. There is several other things that was said and written that didn’t come to pass either. The world wasn’t shocked when the 7th Seal was claimed to be opened like your book says. Besides, we aren’t in the 7th seal yet I have since found out.
I was convicted until the day the elders returned from training. When I received the email from Leonard saying he could no longer discuss doctrine with us, it shook me to the core. I believe that the discussion of doctrine is exactly what keeps the flock safe. (Exodus 4:15; 2 Timothy 4:12) I believe that our discussions of these things kept me more convicted and steady then anything else besides the Bible itself. By having people to share with who were an ordained part of the church and had experienced the “Great Falling Away”, 2 Thessalonians 2:3; Psalm 4:2; Psalm 5:10, Matthew 25:5 (Not the Abomination of Desolation), it helped us new comers to be guided in the right direction rather then sending us to find the answers on our own. Although I have to say now, that I am glad this happened as I see that I was being guided in the wrong direction anyway.
Also after further reading of the bible, it came to me that you can't have more knowledge about doctrine then Mr. Armstrong as an Apostle is the highest you can become under God and Jesus (Ephesians 4:11). Therefore by you disagreeing with Mr. Armstrong and saying that he wasn't fully delivered out of the trinity doctrine and adding new truths when God's end time Apostle was sent to “restore ALL things”, that leads me to believe that there is nothing left to restore. Just the fact that you have disagreed with a fellow brethren is wrong according to the bible. Can you show me in scripture where a prophet would follow and change the doctrine that God's Apostle restored?
I have thought and prayed on this a very long time and done much reading of my bible and have found a friend to discuss these things with, and I know that the sleepless nights wondering why I haven't wanted to touch my bible the last 2 weeks and such were because I didn't want to face the truth and throw a wrench into my relationships I have created thanks to God. But for me, God is still number one, and in Matthew it says family will be divided.
I still love you and all the fellow brethren and soon all will know the truth. After all, everything will be revealed in July, right? I'm very grateful to God for showing me the truth of the Holy Days and His plan of salvation to me thru you, but beyond that I’m going to be working on unlearning a lot of what you have taught.
I remember you mentioning to “hold fast to all things”, this does NOT mean people have not grown. It simply means that they held fast to ALL restored things that the end time Apostle brought, just as commanded by God.
It was still wonderful to meet you and I hope you will seek out the honest truth once you retire when nothing happens July 17th. And if for some reason, nukes do go off in July, I too will be repenting.
In Christ and with love,
Angie
I will continue in my search for the truth but will be unlearning what HE taught! In the sermon he implied that we were rejecting God. My husband's email was even more detailed about finding the truth thru the Bible and not from Man.
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