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Quote (t8 @ Feb. 27 2008,20:37) Quote (WaterAmerican @ Feb. 27 2008,11:21) t8, i agree, we should all settle on some definite prediction. Ron has not said the nuclear attack will happen in April, but nukes will go off as a part of these things (cities affected being at least NYC, Chicago, Houston, Los Angeles). There are some definite predictions though: 1) When the pope comes to the US in April, he will give a speech on or shortly after the 17th that will have tremendous political consequences. He said that “what's going to come out of his [the pope's] mouth will not be the same as it has been before”. 2) Also, probably more specific, Ron has said that great destruction upon the United States will occur IN the month of April (that is, after April 17th). You can get this confirmed by listening to the latest radio interviews on his website, like the one with Daniel Ott in Indianapolis. He has not said in what form exactly this destruction will take place. So, we can agree upon this: If no destructive event has taken place in the US by the end of April, meaning that we all sit here May 1st and nothing has happened – then yes, I would have to say Ron's prophecies have been false.
(And yeah, you would get your apology you so long for
)
But Ron will be right, because these things are coming directly from God to mankind (through Ron as a prophet), and you will all be able to witness it.
Thanks WaterAmerican.OK, so if there is no visible destruction in the US in April, then on the 1st of May everyone who believes Ron will know that they put their trust in a man instead of God.
And then those people who promoted his prophecies as true, can apologize to all who read these forums for promoting false prophecies.
I know that discipleelohim has said he will apologize and you to WaterAmerican. I hope that the others will do that too. Will anybody else promoting these prophecies put their name forward for an apology if there is indeed no destruction of the US in April?
The apologies should be posted in this discussion so future readers will be able to learn to not follow in the same footsteps and also for the benefit of those who promoted these false prophecies as it will help amend any damage that could have been caused. Remember that no lie is of God and so no lie is good.
If you look back I said I would apologize if there was no nuclear war by Feb 1st 2009. I did not say April 1st. That is your assumption.So yes, if by Feb 1st 2009 things have not come to pass, then I will apologize, post my picture, and find an ostrich to share his hole.
But I know I won't need too…
Good day.
Quote (Broncs453 @ Feb. 27 2008,06:03) Oops sorry Water, I meant theodorej my bad….
Greetings Broncs…..Thanks for the opportunity to maybe clear a few things up….I have read both of Rons books twice and are presently involved in the third read…
My point regarding,” believing and knowing why you believe,” would be best conveyed in discussions, which involve understanding the message and conveying that understanding in a way that would encourage the desenter to read the book and engage in meaningfull discourse.
In Closing we are expected to” Prove All Things”In my previous post no one seemed to answer any of my points. I did not examine the idea of the alleged coming European military assault as foretold by Mr. W. through scripture, as there is plenty of point counter-point going on. I look at it as a matter of probability based on my knowledge of industry, economics, politics and military operations. A Russian, Chinese or Pan-Islamic WW III scenario, as per some interpretations of Nostradamus, would make far more sense then a european initiated conflict starting in such a near term as evidently proposed. Even if a charismatic dictator could some how suddenly come to fore, and overule the various constitutional and national issues to wield such political power he would then have to reshape the various economic, industrial and military spheres as well. This in a continent that largely eschews the military (especially since the fall of the Soviet Union) and berates military adventurism on the part of the americans. These changes while possible in the larger scheme of things are nearly impossible in the time frames given. Retooling, retraining, production, command infrastructure would all have to be made or reconstituted at a new level. Remember this is a continent that could barely manage action in their own area (ie. Bosnia) and needed American strategic transport help to manage the meager forces assigned to Afghanistan. The time frame to make these changes is unrealistic in the extreme. As for possible tie in with the Catholic Church, the institution is near an all time low in terms of temporal influence, especially in europe. Yes, I suppose with the divine or the infernal as this case may be, anything can happen, but in terms of normal reality it is exceedingly improbable.
Quote (Cato @ Feb. 27 2008,19:54) In my previous post no one seemed to answer any of my points. I did not examine the idea of the alleged coming European military assault as foretold by Mr. W. through scripture, as there is plenty of point counter-point going on. I look at it as a matter of probability based on my knowledge of industry, economics, politics and military operations. A Russian, Chinese or Pan-Islamic WW III scenario, as per some interpretations of Nostradamus, would make far more sense then a european initiated conflict starting in such a near term as evidently proposed. Even if a charismatic dictator could some how suddenly come to fore, and overule the various constitutional and national issues to wield such political power he would then have to reshape the various economic, industrial and military spheres as well. This in a continent that largely eschews the military (especially since the fall of the Soviet Union) and berates military adventurism on the part of the americans. These changes while possible in the larger scheme of things are nearly impossible in the time frames given. Retooling, retraining, production, command infrastructure would all have to be made or reconstituted at a new level. Remember this is a continent that could barely manage action in their own area (ie. Bosnia) and needed American strategic transport help to manage the meager forces assigned to Afghanistan. The time frame to make these changes is unrealistic in the extreme. As for possible tie in with the Catholic Church, the institution is near an all time low in terms of temporal influence, especially in europe. Yes, I suppose with the divine or the infernal as this case may be, anything can happen, but in terms of normal reality it is exceedingly improbable.
Yup, Cato, you are right, in terms of reality or probability it seems almost impossible. I kind of wonder how exactly it is going to happen as well. But remember: Europe only arises IN RESPONSE to the power vacuum left by the demise of the United States and her closest allies, which is going to take at least 6 months. They won't want to do it, but they feel forced to restore international order. Just imagine the tremendous effect a nuclear terrorist attack is going to have on the psyche on all these countries. Europe will fear they are next.
So how will they do it? In Ron's first book it says the already have the military power in their possession “under the cloak of NATO”. So, I guess we have to assume that Europe is going to take command of and utilize all the NATO military forces stationed in mainland Europe. Now, I'm not sure, but aren't there still about at least 30.000 NATO tanks and other stuff left from the Cold War era? Let alone all the nuclear weapons stationed in Europe. In the case of Germany, they're already there, it's just a matter of who has control over them.But I agree, looking at the world stage right now it really looks improbable. What I wonder most about the “retooling, retraining, production, command infrastructure” you mentioned. Europe would have to transform its economic system in a war economy very quickly. Even if that works, I can't imagine people would volunteer for the military either. Speaking of Germany I can say from experience that people over here do everything to avoid the conscription when they reach the age of 18, and most of the population hates military service. I really don't know how Europe would become a global power capable of conquering half the world and fighting the Chinese and Russian hordes without a sizeable military force.
However, if things start to happen in April, then you can also postively know that things are going to happen with regard to Europe just as prophesied. Either everything is true completely, or nothing is true.
Quote (WaterAmerican @ Feb. 28 2008,08:18) Quote (Cato @ Feb. 27 2008,19:54) In my previous post no one seemed to answer any of my points. I did not examine the idea of the alleged coming European military assault as foretold by Mr. W. through scripture, as there is plenty of point counter-point going on. I look at it as a matter of probability based on my knowledge of industry, economics, politics and military operations. A Russian, Chinese or Pan-Islamic WW III scenario, as per some interpretations of Nostradamus, would make far more sense then a european initiated conflict starting in such a near term as evidently proposed. Even if a charismatic dictator could some how suddenly come to fore, and overule the various constitutional and national issues to wield such political power he would then have to reshape the various economic, industrial and military spheres as well. This in a continent that largely eschews the military (especially since the fall of the Soviet Union) and berates military adventurism on the part of the americans. These changes while possible in the larger scheme of things are nearly impossible in the time frames given. Retooling, retraining, production, command infrastructure would all have to be made or reconstituted at a new level. Remember this is a continent that could barely manage action in their own area (ie. Bosnia) and needed American strategic transport help to manage the meager forces assigned to Afghanistan. The time frame to make these changes is unrealistic in the extreme. As for possible tie in with the Catholic Church, the institution is near an all time low in terms of temporal influence, especially in europe. Yes, I suppose with the divine or the infernal as this case may be, anything can happen, but in terms of normal reality it is exceedingly improbable.
Yup, Cato, you are right, in terms of reality or probability it seems almost impossible. I kind of wonder how exactly it is going to happen as well. But remember: Europe only arises IN RESPONSE to the power vacuum left by the demise of the United States and her closest allies, which is going to take at least 6 months. They won't want to do it, but they feel forced to restore international order. Just imagine the tremendous effect a nuclear terrorist attack is going to have on the psyche on all these countries. Europe will fear they are next.
So how will they do it? In Ron's first book it says the already have the military power in their possession “under the cloak of NATO”. So, I guess we have to assume that Europe is going to take command of and utilize all the NATO military forces stationed in mainland Europe. Now, I'm not sure, but aren't there still about at least 30.000 NATO tanks and other stuff left from the Cold War era? Let alone all the nuclear weapons stationed in Europe. In the case of Germany, they're already there, it's just a matter of who has control over them.But I agree, looking at the world stage right now it really looks improbable. What I wonder most about the “retooling, retraining, production, command infrastructure” you mentioned. Europe would have to transform its economic system in a war economy very quickly. Even if that works, I can't imagine people would volunteer for the military either. Speaking of Germany I can say from experience that people over here do everything to avoid the conscription when they reach the age of 18, and most of the population hates military service. I really don't know how Europe would become a global power capable of conquering half the world and fighting the Chinese and Russian hordes without a sizeable military force.
However, if things start to happen in April, then you can also postively know that things are going to happen with regard to Europe just as prophesied. Either everything is true completely, or nothing is true.
I don't see how it would happen either. but do you remember Hitler. It only takes a few to force others into obeying by force like the S.S. Soldiers did. That would be the only way. I am old enough to remember how it was. The man left and we never seen them again. Even my Grandmother was on that list to be taken, because She had Asthma. My Mother had to sign a paper that She would not have other children. If Hitler would have won, I would not be alive today. That is all History now, but that could happen again, I fear. Time will tell.
One thing that I do know, things do not look good here. The dollar is falling fast, and who knows what will happen will all those Illegal Immigrants from Mexico. A new President is not going to help. The House has closed and just went Home, rather then vote on a bill. It is letting us stand defenceless.
I have put myself in Gods Hand and Jesus will take care of us, on way or another. He promised not to loose us and I for one am taking Him up on that. He also promised to keep us from God's wrath when it will come. We do know that this is the end time, all the signs are there, but when it will happen nobody knows except the Father.Peace and Love Mrs.
Well let's hope that for all the destruction that's gonna take place at least there won't be the kind of atrocities comitted like there were in WW2. At least not by Europe; but, looking at China and those nations – I wouldn't put anything past them.
Quote (david @ Feb. 27 2008,16:44) Quote This verse was in fact fulfilled by Mr. Armstrong, as he did indeed “preach the good news to all nations”. hmmm. I don't remember that. I must have missed it somehow. I certainly don't remember him trying to reach me with the good news….or any of my friends, or family. In fact, I've never heard of him, up until this thread started. If he preached the good news in all the nations, he must be able to speak a lot of different languages. Was it just him, or did he have millions of others which would be required to carry out this great work?
Quote You need to read the books first otherwise you don't know what you are talking about.
While I don't know anything about armstrong, I do know what the Bible says. And I know that Jehovah is a God of Justice. If he has a message, he's going to let everyone here it–people in villages, huts, towns and cities in countries of every language. Armstrong in no way fits the bill. I haven't heard of him, and he didn't come to me or anyone I know with the good news. Nor did anyone who shares his beliefs.
david –How old are you? Cause you post like you are somewhere between 18 and 25. I probably have kids older than you.
Mr. Armstrong was 93 years old when he died in 1986, which was probably before you were even born. Just because YOU have never heard of him doesn't mean anything. He worked as God's witness from 1931 until 1986. It was just him, but he went literally all over the world during that time. God's Church had about 150,000 members at its peak, before the abomination in 1994.
Don't assume that just because YOU didn't hear about something that it didn't happen.
I'm about done with this forum, as it is filled with a bunch that don't get it and probably never will.
Peace,
Quote (Broncs453 @ Feb. 28 2008,13:09) Quote (david @ Feb. 27 2008,16:44) Quote This verse was in fact fulfilled by Mr. Armstrong, as he did indeed “preach the good news to all nations”. hmmm. I don't remember that. I must have missed it somehow. I certainly don't remember him trying to reach me with the good news….or any of my friends, or family. In fact, I've never heard of him, up until this thread started. If he preached the good news in all the nations, he must be able to speak a lot of different languages. Was it just him, or did he have millions of others which would be required to carry out this great work?
Quote You need to read the books first otherwise you don't know what you are talking about.
While I don't know anything about armstrong, I do know what the Bible says. And I know that Jehovah is a God of Justice. If he has a message, he's going to let everyone here it–people in villages, huts, towns and cities in countries of every language. Armstrong in no way fits the bill. I haven't heard of him, and he didn't come to me or anyone I know with the good news. Nor did anyone who shares his beliefs.
david –How old are you? Cause you post like you are somewhere between 18 and 25. I probably have kids older than you.
Mr. Armstrong was 93 years old when he died in 1986, which was probably before you were even born. Just because YOU have never heard of him doesn't mean anything. He worked as God's witness from 1931 until 1986. It was just him, but he went literally all over the world during that time. God's Church had about 150,000 members at its peak, before the abomination in 1994.
Don't assume that just because YOU didn't hear about something that it didn't happen.
I'm about done with this forum, as it is filled with a bunch that don't get it and probably never will.
Peace,
Heh,heh you are not very nice. Let me tell you there are some who did not ever hear of Mr. Armstrong. We were in the Church for 10 years so I do know that He exsisted, now are you satisfied that somebody knows?
Be nice that is more Christain like, and God would want you to too.
Peace and Love Mrs.Quote (discipleelohim @ Feb. 28 2008,01:44) Quote (t8 @ Feb. 27 2008,20:37) Quote (WaterAmerican @ Feb. 27 2008,11:21) t8, i agree, we should all settle on some definite prediction. Ron has not said the nuclear attack will happen in April, but nukes will go off as a part of these things (cities affected being at least NYC, Chicago, Houston, Los Angeles). There are some definite predictions though: 1) When the pope comes to the US in April, he will give a speech on or shortly after the 17th that will have tremendous political consequences. He said that “what's going to come out of his [the pope's] mouth will not be the same as it has been before”. 2) Also, probably more specific, Ron has said that great destruction upon the United States will occur IN the month of April (that is, after April 17th). You can get this confirmed by listening to the latest radio interviews on his website, like the one with Daniel Ott in Indianapolis. He has not said in what form exactly this destruction will take place. So, we can agree upon this: If no destructive event has taken place in the US by the end of April, meaning that we all sit here May 1st and nothing has happened – then yes, I would have to say Ron's prophecies have been false.
(And yeah, you would get your apology you so long for )
But Ron will be right, because these things are coming directly from God to mankind (through Ron as a prophet), and you will all be able to witness it.
Thanks WaterAmerican.OK, so if there is no visible destruction in the US in April, then on the 1st of May everyone who believes Ron will know that they put their trust in a man instead of God.
And then those people who promoted his prophecies as true, can apologize to all who read these forums for promoting false prophecies.
I know that discipleelohim has said he will apologize and you to WaterAmerican. I hope that the others will do that too. Will anybody else promoting these prophecies put their name forward for an apology if there is indeed no destruction of the US in April?
The apologies should be posted in this discussion so future readers will be able to learn to not follow in the same footsteps and also for the benefit of those who promoted these false prophecies as it will help amend any damage that could have been caused. Remember that no lie is of God and so no lie is good.
If you look back I said I would apologize if there was no nuclear war by Feb 1st 2009. I did not say April 1st. That is your assumption.So yes, if by Feb 1st 2009 things have not come to pass, then I will apologize, post my picture, and find an ostrich to share his hole.
But I know I won't need too…
Good day.
Oh no, we have to wait that long for an apology?
I will check his prophecy to see if he gave himself that much space to work in.Here is what the Book of Revelations says about itself:
Revelation 22:18
I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book.Ron is adding to the book of Revelation. What is he adding?
He is adding the seven thunders, his version of it anyway.So he is adding to the book.
These scriptures have been written many times. However, no one pays attention to those. Instead they would rather choose ones that everyone twists into their own words. That is adding to the Word. The things you say Ron is adding to are not adding, they are revealing. Why? Because it is the end-time. Now is the time that God has unsealed these and it is His time to reveal them.
The Catholics and all the denominations that have splintered off of her has added and taken away to meet what is to their liking. They don't follow the true Word of God. They follow their own idols and twist the Word of God as well. Almost every faith out there chooses to be a denomination that were created by man and not God. And several times in the Bible, it has said that the true churh of God is named after God.
Listening to those false prophets mentioned before, can you not tell just by listening to them the HUGE difference between them and Ron? They can't even speak without jumbling things and second guessing themselves. Ron's message comes from God, it is clear everytime. He has conviction and resolve that no other has ever been able to do. I honestly imagine that is how many of the apostles and Christ himself use to speak – with boldness and conviction.
Amos 3:7 Surely the Lord GOD will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets.
Revelations 10:4 And when the seven thunders uttered [their voices], I was about to write: and I heard a voice from heaven saying, Seal up the things which the seven thunders uttered, and write them not.
Daniel 12:4 But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.
And here is another thing to think about for all of those who would rather sit here and argue day in and day out…. if you believe they are false, why are you investing so much time laying out your thoughts over and over and no one listens? Or at least the brethren, which is why we originally started this thread in hopes to learn from each other and to help anyone who is of one mind with us.
Why waste your energy trying to convince? There are many here that we have also tried to help, believing they were asking honest questions but instead they have twisted the Word of God to their liking and decided they are right.
Does it bother you that much that people who are complete strangers to you could be “following a cult”? Well, if this is a cult, you better watch out, we might suck you in. Come on, your energy is wasted!
Brethren, I hope some of you are still out there. May the peace and grace of God be with you. I believe we all have each others emails, so I pray for us all to keep the strength and the excitement high as we are so very Blessed to be living in the most exciting time in the history of man. Us few have a job to do soon, and we don't have time right now to deal with ignorance.
God Bless you all.
AofP
Anticipation of peace you wrote, “Ron's message comes from God, it is clear everytime. He has conviction and resolve that no other has ever been able to do. I honestly imagine that is how many of the apostles and Christ himself use to speak – with boldness and conviction.”
I am glad you think so, personally I do not, but then the flaw can be with myself rather then you for I am skeptical by nature. Yet, remember too that followers of David Koresh and Jim Jones were likewise completely convinced that their prophet was speaking for God while even early followers of Jesus had their doubts.
With God anything is possible but I have found that God tends to work through his creation rather subtly then with overt, direct divine action so to speak, and for very real reasons as someone who has had extensive training in high level military affairs I find Mr. W's scenario extremely unrealistic for the time frame given.
“…we are so very Blessed to be living in the most exciting time in the history of man.”
When I read that I thought of Dicken's Tale of Two Cities – “It was the best of times, it was the worst of times; it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness; it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity; it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness; it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair; we had everything before us, we had nothing before us; we were all going directly to Heaven, we were all going the other way.”
Every generation I think can say the same thing with equal conviction as the most exciting time is the present, whenever that is. Just something to put things in perspective.
Greetings Cato…..I find your question regarding How Europe can become a force to be reckoned with very interesting ,Lets start in the US…The way this country is devided 50/50 they are half way home…All they have to do is take advantage of an opportunity that would give them access to the military might of the United States….This could happen as a result of a monetary colapse and a subsequent depression in conjunction with a weak divided government….
The storm clouds are forming….The US is divided politically,this coming election has all the signs of being miered in litigation over the highest office in the land….We had a prelview in 2000 where the election was determined by the Supreme Court….The constitutionality of the Electoral College will be basis..(The Clintons favor the abolishment of the college) In the process the leadership vacum will be created.
Let us not forget that European influence during our civil war played a part until they realized the level of brutality one american could afflict on another american…Frankly it scared them.
The senario spoken of in RWs book could happen quickly…Not necessarily with nukes..A WALL STREET CRASH…brought on by the colapse of the dollar..
What do you think ??In addition to my last post …We must not forget the GREED of corporate America and its inherent nature to survive…Presently the chinese,russians and the europeans are buying large portions of corporate America through hedge funds..These stock purchases are in technology related industries in the US.
Hi AoP, i don't think i'll be participating in this debate any more. I'd rather stick to my beliefs, and i very strongly believe that RW is RIGHT! I don't know much about the bible, since i was not brought up a catholic or christian, but i have been learning about it for a couple of years now (on / off). Some of it made sense, but a lot of it didn't. After reading RW's books it all makes sense now. Even if RW turns out to be a false prophet, there's nothing he teaches that's against God. I now know what God is all about, and that's thanks to RW for helping me learn. Peace.
Okay, okay. I haven't read the entire thread, but so far it reads like the original ATS thread, but less caustic
and at least we don't have to worry about being banned or the thread being shut down (I hope).I'd just like to say to that brethren need to stop trying to convince people. Only God can do that. Just state your beliefs and move on. Retort and move on. Answer questions and move on. MOST of the people on the earth are deceived and they CANNOT help it. They cannot use reasoning to determine truth. Neither can we. Debating doesn't change that simple and immutable fact.
If a friend or family member had told me about Ron and COG-PKG, I wouldn't even have wasted my time going to his web sites (out of pride in knowing that I already know the truth and everyone else is an idiot). However, God revealed Himself to me in a way that circumvented my pride. I assume that most people are similar. You cannot expect everyone to adhere to what you believe by quoting excerpts from any book or sermon. Did not Christ have relatively few disciples? Was not Satan able to find many angels to follow him? Hey, it is what it is. In fact, it's supposed to be that way.
Don't become self-righteous and upset. For all you know God will open the eyes of some or all of the people here in His time. Beating people over the head with the truth doesn't work. You only end up hurting them (and yourself). I know… I've tried… and that's what happens.
Just keep in mind the many people who are only watching. You'd be surprised how many people only read the thread and do not post (or even register). God may be speaking to these people and you aren't making things any easier for them because they only see you getting upset. They don't understand why. They don't understand that it's frustrating when people refuse to walk in the light because they are accustomed to walking in shadows. Don't forget that these people are forced to deal with the fact that their families, friends, church leaders, rituals, observances, interpretations, etc. are all incorrect. Your “good word” cannot surmount those obstacles. Again, only God can do that.
I remember finding the original thread on ATS because I was looking for answers. It was the words of several gentle people who responded to the mob truthfully and gracefully that got my attention. They didn't debate. As more people were called into the Church, more people found the ATS forum and things got ugly very quickly (I'm no exception). This served no purpose except to build pride on both sides of the line. As Ron stated in a past sermon, “none of us are worthy”. In other words, God gave some of us an opportunity and we accepted it, but we still aren't worthy of it. Pride has no place.
On a separate note, for those who are making assumptions about COG-PKG, know this. I haven't met a more down-to-earth group of people. No one forces you to do anything (ergo: it is not a cult). Everyone is loving even though we are all different in personality, race, geography, experience, etc. We look out for each other, too. I've simply never seen a traditional Christian church exemplify love like COG-PKG. Instead they wrap themselves in rules and rituals for the sake of having rules and rituals. No one wants to learn about God because they think they know it all.
As for prophecy… Man, I don't don't know where to begin. On a practical note, many people will be deceived because they believe too much in the power of man. It doesn't matter how many insiders reveal that the American financial system has been reduced to a house of cards. Most people will still not believe it until it collapses. Furthermore, Joe & and Jane Sixpack are too comfortable. Sure, they might complain about things, but they will still hop into the SUV and go visit grandma for Christmas and load her tree down with gifts. That means they are in denial. Let them be. It will take a 3.5 year tribulation to humble some people. Meanwhile the majority still wont believe. Just be blessed knowing that you do believe.
For those of you who are on the fence, I can't tell you how good it feels. The world's climate doesn't torment me anymore. I have peace of mind. I know my purpose (that is, I know the meaning of life). I finally know God's truth. It's a horrible feeling not knowing which religion or domination professes the truth, but now I can spot a false truth in a fraction of a second and know why it is a lie (not just because someone told me it was). Do you know how awesome that is? That's not something you can do with the brain. Scholars can't “figure it out”. It MUST come from God and God is not a God of confusion.
But those are all things people have to choose to experience for themselves. And I don't mean to sound preachy seeing as I was only just baptized this past weekend
Dear TheodoreJ,
The Americans always appear to be divided, that is until an outside player gets involved then you will see how quickly they close ranks (ie. Pearl harbor). The American political landscape is not as seperated as it appears to outsiders, both of the major political parties are Centrist. Supposing an economic meltdown occurs (here I will not argue for I have no background in macroeconomics) and follows with unheralded natural and terror based disasters it is conceivable chaos could reign. At this point martial law would be declared and it would be more likely that an autocratic leader would arise there then europe because of that chaos. Even if the US/Can/UK are all devestated they would still retain powerful survivable nuclear deterrrents to warn off invaders. Analogus to the Russian state after the end of the Soviet Union. Lastly the one most likely remaining conventional force would be the Anglo-American fleets which could make any seaborne attacks ill advised. Even a vastly reduced US fleet would still be capable of sea denial to an invading europe.
Per Weinland's book, “The beast spoken of here is
a military power that emerges out of Europe for the seventh and
final time in history. Its power and purpose are moved and directed
by the fallen angel Lucifer—Satan, who has power to influence the
minds of men to do his bidding. That same being is the one who
stirred Hitler and others to do his bidding during World War II.
People tend to disregard, ignore, ridicule, or even scorn such
ideas and knowledge because they cannot deal with that which is
36 The Seventh Seal
from a spirit world—that which they have no earthly means to see
or measure with physical, scientific evidence. But that does not
change the reality of the spiritual influences at work in this world…”I won't argue that spiritual evil may influence a future dictator, a new Hitler so to speak, but it took Hitler years after he came to power to consolidate said power and change the Reich into something capable of waging world war. This new Hitler would have little time to do so considering the Weinland time frame. Also the Asian juggernaut would have to arise almost as quickly, China or the new Russia? They are unlikely allies as neither would ever trust the other or leave the other at its back. Also speaking of Asia, Weinland likes to imply Hitler was the 6th seal and led by Satan, he is largely silent on Stalin; now he could be among the “and others” but such an important and evil man as Stalin who was responsible for even more deaths then Hitler would merit mention I think. It would seem cross to Satan's purpose to have his one evil destroy the other, unless of course he meant to lose so he could get to the seventh seal some 60 odd years later. When much younger, I used to sometimes listen to Armstrong on the radio, and all of his then plausible cold war theories, they didn't pan out and they seemed more likely then what is now proposed.
Broncs453,Feb. wrote:[/quote]
Quote
Water –There is something that you fail to pick up on, and it is very important. You are automatically assuming that “terrorism” means coming from a foreign country. Terrorism can come from within one's own country, just like 9/11. I have listened to Ron very carefully, to see if he ever states that 9/11 was caused by “Al-Qaeda” or the like, and he does not. If he did, that would expose him (at least to me) as a false prophet. The reason being because 9/11 was 100%, beyond any shadow of a doubt, an inside job. All you people that think I'm some conspiracy nut, pull your head out of your a$$. The collapse of the twin towers at free-fall speed defies fundamental laws of physics unless the buildings were dynamited. End of story. Ron says that terrorism is behind the nukes, but it will be from within OUR OWN COUNTRY. Remember that when it happens.
I agree. People are stuck in the “terrorism means the other guy” frame of mind. People should realize that the world is comprised of kingdoms with leaders that have mixed known and unknown alliances that are constantly changing. Our government and corporate America have been controlling the public for over 200 years. Each year they have gotten better at it. That's why they can sell us down the river so easily.
So people should stop putting all the blame on Bush. This stage has been set by the policies set by many previous administrations. The Bush administration is the worse, but not the first. Hey, Clinton did some very dastardly deeds too.
America's economy could fail before the bombs drop. Cripple a country's economy and the only thing left is its so-called “resolve”. You know, that “believe in yourself” nonsense. People waving flags and such on TV commercials… stars doing music concerts. Stuff that doesn't mean a darn thing 'cause after the commercial ends and the concert is over, you still can't afford a loaf of bread.
In such a state, a “few” bombs are all you need. In WWII the US dropped atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki and that effectively ended the war. Japan surrendered, but many analyst will tell you that Japan's economy crashed because of the war's expense, so it was on the verge of surrender anyway! So, if you destroy the US economy, the bombs are just clinchers for a chapter in a story that already coming to an end.
So DC (goodbye capitol hill), NYC (goodbye NYSE), Chicago (goodbye commerce), LA (goodbye Hollywood), Seattle, Toronto, Vancouver, etc will probably be hit by bombs. Moving weapons of mass destruction around the US is not easy even if it's an inside job. However, when the economy is destroyed, physically conquering the people will be easier. You don't attack a country that's rich in resources. The Germans learned this in WWII. The Euro isn't stomping the life out of the dollar by accident! The US itself uses economic sanctions for a reason… It works. It will depress a state. And a failed economy will hit us hard because most of us are used to luxuries and have easygoing lifestyles. People will have a rough time if the local stores run out of nothing more than toilet paper. Now imagine the local store being closed permanently because no one works there anymore and the great American supply chain ceases to exist. Drop a few nuclear bombs for good measure, take over what's left of the deployed naval fleets (fairly easy) and game over.
And then there are the 250 million people who are prophesied to die in America. Nuclear destruction/fallout, lack of food/water, and exposure to the elements will be the culprits.
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