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Nick…….So Jesus never said (HIS) words (ARE) Spirit and LIFE, Interesting, what bible are you reading Nick?
gene
G,
His words are from God and indeed are spirit and life.
But the words of carnal men are not so, some being just from what the heart is full of.
The heart and not the vain intellect is what God is interested in but both need to be renewed according to the word.Quote (Gene @ Oct. 07 2009,21:25) Nick…….So Jesus never said (HIS) words (ARE) Spirit and LIFE, Interesting, what bible are you reading Nick? gene
Jesus may use the words you do but I am not sure that what he meant by them and what you are saying they mean are the same.Jesus was teaching that obeying his words lead to living by the spirit and so eternal life.
Is that the point you or Nick were making?
Hi KW,
The bread of life spoken through scripture is what transforms our minds to the mind of Christ.
The vain thoughts of men though are largely unhelpful.KW…..remember Jesus said the words he spoke were (NOT) His words. The were God the FATHERS Words. The issue Here is what is a WORD, (expressed intellect) And it doesn't make any difference if it is GOD Words or Mans Words, they both express there Spirits (intellects) and they Both are Life , one expresses the Life of the Man and the other is the Life of GOD, The Life of GOD is Eternal , the Life of Man is temporary. But Both Spirits are the expressions of LIFE within, one of Man , ONE OF GOD ETERNAL.
That is what is meant by let this MIND be in you that was also in Christ Jesus our Lore, This way of thinking is intellect or SPIRIT of GOD in the man AND it IS ALSO WHAT WAS IN JESUS. These thoughts (Spirits) can be clean or unclean. But are useless if they are not in a BODY , AS Jesus showed by the unclean spirit going about in (ARID) Places looking for rest, You see a Intellect or thought is useless, unless it it in a body to animate by supplying it thought. What humbling is that (ALL THOUGHTS OR INTELLECTS) has (ALWAYS) Existed, WE don't add to anything New , we simply assimilate it into our lives and If the Thought or intellects are of GOD we being to conform to His (GODS) thinking. That is what is called letting this (GODS) mind be in YOU as it was in Christ Jesus our lord. Same mind, same thinking, same intellect, Equal the same Spirit. all the same thing. That God may be in ALL and THROUGH ALL.
Many add some mystery to the Presents of Spirit , Like a beign, or a devil being goin around jumping in and out of People, Spirit intellect can go into and out of people through there thinking, but that does not make a Spirit a Being of it self. Some think the Thought process itself is the being with in a body, that has merit also. Is the being the body or the Spirit within the body. either way spirit is useless outside of a Body to animate, All Spirit is from GOD and never dies because thought can't die, but it can be rendered useless by not being in a body of some kind. A soul consists of a BODY+SPIRIT= a SOUL. Both must be present to have a person. A soul can be destroyed by removing Spirit (intellect) From the body. If God does not resurrect Us after we Die we are in a perished State, “When a man dies his (thoughts) parish, He is no longer a living Soul. That fits what Jesus said by a Soul being destroyed in the GRAVE, because without a BODY a SOUL can not exist. It is paramount that we are resurected and given new bodies with Spirit added back into it
Spirit is simply what a person think with , His intellect. While it (spirit) is not the Physical body it is the thoughts within the Body. That is why i believe a Spirit is not a being by it self (but combined with a body ) you have a SOUL or BEING.
Kerwin this is just the way I understand it at this time, not trying to preach doctrine just expressing my thought on the subject.
peace and love to you and yours………………gene
G,
So spirit is thoughts now?
I thought it was intellect.Why do you need to tell everyone your thoughts a thousand times?
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Oct. 07 2009,19:19) G,
So spirit is thoughts now?
I thought it was intellect.Why do you need to tell everyone your thoughts a thousand times?
Old Testament: Spirit: Hebrew Ruach: Psychological:Spirit: “Mind.” Genesis 26:35. Proverbs 29:11. Ezekiel 11:5; 20:32. Daniel 5:20. Habakkuk 1:11.
Spirit: “Courage.” Joshua 2:11.
Spirit: “Anger.” Judges 8:3.
New Testament: Spirit: Greek Pneuma: Psychological:
THE NEW NATURE in the child of God, because “begotten” in us by God, as in John 3:3 – 7. 1 John 5:1, 4.
MAN (psychologically), pneuma being imparted to man, making him “a living psuche” (= “a living soul”, or being, as in Genesis 2:7. Psalm 104:29, 30. Ecclesiastes 12:7).
When taken back to and by God, man, without pneuma, becomes and is called “a dead soul” in each of the thirteen occurrences rendered in Authorized Version “dead body”, etc.
MAN (physiologically), pneuma being put by Figure of Speech. Synecdoche (Appendix 6) for the whole person; a part for the whole (as in Luke 1:47, “my spirit” = I myself.)
ADVERBIALLY. But this is only once, in the Authorized Version, where it is translated “spiritually” in Romans 8:6.
THE RESURRECTION BODY, as in 1 Corinthians 15:45. 1 Peter 3:18; 4:6.
Sources: From The Companion Bible.
Hi CON,
The Spirit of God is as God Himself.[Ps 139]
Jesus was filled with that Holy Spirit [the finger of God lk11/cf mt12] but told us God was in heaven[Mt6]
God is at work in us to will and to do by that Spirit[Phil2] and can be filled with God [Eph 3.19] we are now temples of the living God.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Oct. 07 2009,19:19) G,
So spirit is thoughts now?
I thought it was intellect.Why do you need to tell everyone your thoughts a thousand times?
Old Testament: Soul: Hebrew Nephesh: Psychological:Soul: “pleasure”. Deuteronomy 23:24.
Soul: “lust”. Psalm 78:18.
Soul: “appetite”. Proverbs 23:2. Ecclesiastes 6:7.
Soul: “greedy”. Isaiah 56:11.
Nephesh is used of Man, as exercising mental faculties, and manifesting certain feelings and affections and passions:
Soul: Genesis 34:3 (clave), 8 (longeth); 42:21 (anguish); 49:6 (come not). Leviticus 26:11 (not abhor), 15 (abhor), 30 (abhor), 43 (abhor). Numbers 21:4 (discouraged). Deuteronomy 4:9 (keep), 29 (seek); 6:5 (love); 10:12 (serve); 11:13 (love), 18 (lay up in); 13:3 (love); 26:16 (keep); 30:2 (return), 6 (love), 10 (turn). Joshua 22:5 (serve); 23:14 (know). Judges 10:16 * (grieved); 16:16 (vexed). 1 Samuel 1:10 (bitterness of), 15 (poured out); 18:1 (knit with), 1 (loved as); 20:4 (desireth); 23:30 (desire); 30:6 (grieved). 2 Samuel 5:8 (hated). 1 Kings 2:4 (walk); 8:48 (return); 11:37 (desired). 2 Kings 4:27 (vexed); 23:3 (keep), 25 (turned). 1 Chronicles 22:19 (seek). 2 Chronicles 6:38 (return); 15:12 (seek); 34:31 (keep). Job 3:20 (bitter); 7:11 (bitterness); 9:21 (know) (Revised Version myself); 10:1 (weary), 1 (bitterness); 14:22 (mourn); 19:2 (vex); 21:25 (bitterness); 23:13 * (desireth); 24:12 (wounded); 27:2 (vexed); 30:16 (poured out), 25 (grieved). Psalm 6:3 (sore vexed); 11:5 * (hateth); 13:2 (take counsel); 19:7 (converting); 24:4 (not lifted up); 25:1 (lifted up), 13 (dwell at ease); 31:7 (in adversities), 9 (consumed with grief); 33:20 (waiteth) 34:2 (boast); 35:9 (be joyful); 42:1 (panteth), 2 (thirsteth), 4 (pour out), 5 (cast down), 6 (cast down), 11 (cast down); 43:5 (cast down); 44:25 (bowed down); 49:18 (blessed); 57:1 (trusteth), 6 (bowed down); 62:1 (waiteth), 5 (wait); 63:1 (thirsteth), 5 (satisfied), 8 (followeth hard); 69:10 (chastened); 77:2 (refused comfort); 84:2 (longeth); 86:4 (rejoiced), 4 (lift up); 88:3 (full of troubles); 94:19 (delight); 103:1, 2, 22; 104:1, 35 (bless); 107:5 (fainted), 9 (satisfied), 9 (filled with goodness), 26 (melted); 116:7 (return to rest); 119:20 (longing), 25 (cleaveth unto the dust) 28 (melteth for heaviness), 81 (fainteth), 129 (keep), 167 (kept); 123:4 (filled with scorning); 130:5 (wait), 6 (waiteth); 131:2 (quieted); 138:3 (strengthened) 139:14 (knoweth); 143:6 (thirsteth), 8 (lifted up), 11 (bring out of trouble), 12 (afflict); 146:1 (praise). Proverbs 2:10 (knowledge pleasant); 3:22 (be life to); 13:4 (desireth), 4 (made fat), 19; 16:24 (sweet to); 19:2 (without knowledge), 18 (spare) (Revised Version heart); 21:10 (desireth); 22:25 (get a snare to); 24:14 (wisdom unto); 25:13 (refresheth); 29:17 (give delight). Ecclesiastes 2:24 (enjoy good); 6:3 (not filled); 7:28 (seeketh). Song 1:7; 3:1, 2, 3, 4 (loveth); 5:6 (failed); 6:12 * (made me like chariots). Isaiah 1:14 (hateth); 26:8 (desire), 9 (desire); 32:6 (made empty); 38:15 (bitterness of); 42:1 * ; 52:2 (delight); 58:10 (drawn out), 10 (afflicted), 11 (satisfied); 61:10 (joyful) 66:3 (delighteth). Jeremiah 4:31 (wearied); 5:9, 29 (avenged); 6:8 (depart), 16 (find rest); 9:9 * (avenged); 12:7 (dearly beloved of); 13:17 (shall weep); 14:19 (lothed); 31:12 (watered), 14, 25 (satiated), 25 (sorrowful); 32:41 * (whole); 50:19 (satisfied). Lamentations 3:17 (removed), 20 (humbled), 24 (saith). Ezekiel 7:19 (satisfied; 24:21 (pitieth). Jonah 2:7 (fainted). Habakkuk 2:4 (not upright). Zechariah 11:8 (lothed), 8 (ahorred).
Soul: “mind”: Genesis 23:8 (your). Deuteronomy 18:6 (desire); 28:65 (sorrow). 1 Samuel 2:35 * 2 Samuel 17:8 (chafed). 2 Kings 9:15. 1 Chronicles 28:9 (willing). Jeremiah 15:1. * Ezekiel 23:17 (Revised Version soul), 18 * (Revised Version soul) 18 * (Revised Version soul), 22 (Revised Version soul) 28 (Revised Version soul) (alienated); 24:25 (Revised Version heart) (set); 36:5 (Revised Version soul) (despiteful).
Soul: “heart”: Exodus 23:9. Leviticus 26:16. Deuteronomy 24:15. 1 Samuel 2:33 (grieve). 2 Samuel 3:21 (desireth). Psalm 10:3 (desire). Proverbs 23:7 (Revised Version himself); 28:25 (proud heart. Revised Version greedy spirit); 31:6 (heavy heart. Revised Version bitter in soul). Jeremiah 42:20 (dissembled. Revised Version souls). Lamentations 3:51 (affected. Revised Version soul). Ezekiel 25:6 (rejoiced. Revised Version soul), 15 (desipteful. Revised Version soul); 27:31 (bitterness). Hosea 4:8 (set).
Soul: “hearty”. Proverbs 27:9 (counsel).
Soul: “will”. Deuteronomy 21:14 (she will). Psalm 27:12; 41:2. Ezekiel 16:27.
Soul: “desire”. Ecclesiastes 6:9. Jeremiah 22:27; 44:14. Micah 7:3 (Revised Version soul). Habakkuk 2:5.
Soul: “pleasure”. Psalm 105:22. Jeremiah 34:16.
Soul: “lust”. Exodus 15:9.
Soul: “angry”. Judges 18:25.
Soul: “discontented”. 1 Samuel 22:2.New Testament: Soul: Hebrew Psuche: Psychological:
Soul: psuche, used with intensive force, to express all the powers of one's being, “heart”: Ephesians 6:6. “mind”: Philippians 1:27. “heartily”: Colossians 3:23.
Sources: From The Companion Bible.
Gene wrote:
Quote Spirit is simply what a person think with , His intellect. While it (spirit) is not the Physical body it is the thoughts within the Body. That is why i believe a Spirit is not a being by it self (but combined with a body ) you have a SOUL or BEING.
I have the sneaking suspicion that your definition of “intellect” is not the same as my definition of “intellect”. I hold that “Intellect” is defined as “intelligence” and we are in no way as intelligent as God. Being of the same mind as Jesus would be more like “mindset” or “how you interpret and respond to situations.” The two are rather different though you seem to be referring to them as synonyms. I agree that the Spirit does give you a mindset like that of Jesus the Anointed One.
Kerwin……….Yes intellect is the aspect of “intelligence”that is in our minds and that causes our mindset, our mindset is the result of our Spirits (intellects) and of curse non of Us has (ALL) the intellect of GOD the FATHER, but we have some of His intellect, in fact (ALL) intellect comes from God and returns to him when we die, “for the Spirit Searches the deep things of GOD” , the spirit itself is the intellect that is in our minds driving our thoughts, Spirit is the engine of thought and it is the intellect in us and is expressed through (WORDS) as Jesus Said . He said the Word he Spoke (ARE) Spirit, and LIFE. (ALL) Spirit is intellect and is expressed in WORDS and IS the LIFE of the one Expressing those word, rather GOD or MAN, it's still the life of who is expressing those words, because those words express his LIFE, it is His intellect or thoughts that are being expressed and he lives according to his thinking His intellect which is the Spirit driving HIM. So by a mans words He can be Judged and tried because his word are who he is they (ARE) from HIS SPIRIT in HIM>
IMO
gene
Kerwin………People have been duped into making Spirit complicated when in fact it is not , it is what composes our minds, it is not beings going around jumping in and out of People, there is not such thing , these ideas are derived from (PAGAN) religious thoughts which causes all kind of Phobias in people these false doctrines of devils and demons are indeed plagues from false religions, and subject people to unseen forces of (BEINGS) that does not exist. However (SPIRIT) INTELLECTS do exists and can go in and out of people as Jesus said in regarding unclean Spirits, being able to transverse in and out of a person.
But that is also the good part because GOD'S GOOD SPIRIT can also come into US, and change our thinking , and If the “HOUSE” Has GOD”S Spirit in it the unclean will be rejected and the man can be cleansed , This is done by Sowing to the (WORDS) of GOD these intellects (Spirits) act a a cleanser in our thoughts and work to perfect us. SPIRIT IS SIMPLY INTELLECTS RECEIVED INTO US, rather from GOD or the WORLD it ALL SPIRIT (INTELLECT)> Change is simply replacing one Spirit (intellect) withe another one mind with another. All can be Changed easily with GOD. We are more than conquerers through Him who loved us and gave himself for us. Yes GOD simply exchanges Spirits, and a man becomes renewed in his mind by new Spirit. IMO
gene
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18, Paul writes, “Brothers, we do not want you to be ignorant about those who fall asleep, or to grieve like the rest of men, who have no hope. We believe that Jesus died and rose again and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him. According to the Lord’s own word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left till the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever. Therefore encourage each other with these words.”
1 Corinthians, “So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body” (verses 42-44).
1 Corinthians, “Just as we have borne the likeness of the earthly man, so shall we bear the likeness of the man from heaven. I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable. Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed—in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality” (verses 49-53).
Et resurrexit tertia die . . . Expecto resurrectionem mortuorum et vitam venturi saeculi!
Immortality of the Soul (Platoist View) or Resurrection of the Dead (Abrahamic View)?
Which one do you believe?
But is it really true that the early Christian resurrection faith is irreconcilable with the Greek concept of the immortality of the soul?
Does not the New Testament, and above all the Gospel of John, teach that we already have eternal life?
Is it really true that death in the New Testament is always conceived as ‘the last enemy’ in a way that is diametrically opposed to Greek thought, which sees in death a friend?
If you have Immortality of the Soul (Platoist View) how can there be a Last Enemy?
Was not Jesus afraid to face death (let this cup pass from me)?
We must take into account what it meant for the Christians when they proclaimed: Christ is risen from the dead!
Romans 7:24, ‘Who shall deliver me from this body of death?’ the whole New Testament answers: The Holy Spirit!
When does this transformation of the body take place?
We wait, and the dead wait.
Immortality of the Soul (Platoist View) or Resurrection of the Dead (Abrahamic View)?
G,
You have told us that spirit is intellect.
Now you say
“..Yes intellect is the aspect of “intelligence”that is in our minds and that causes our mindset, our mindset is the result of our Spirits (intellects)”You make it all up as you go along.
Gnostic nonsense.Hi CON,
The soul is not immortal as Mt 10.28 proves.
Those alive in the Spirit have already passed over from death to life.
The second death is the fire prepared for the devil and his angels and destroys the rebellious residue of mankind.Then God will be all in all.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Oct. 09 2009,01:32) Hi CON,
The soul is not immortal as Mt 10.28 proves.
Those alive in the Spirit have already passed over from death to life.
The second death is the fire prepared for the devil and his angels and destroys the rebellious residue of mankind.Then God will be all in all.
I like that.
Gene,
Don't you think that motivation might be a better representation for spirit than intellect.
entry for motivate at thefreedictionary.com on October 9, 2009 reads
Quote Verb
[-vating, -vated]1. to give a reason or inspiration for a course of action to someone: he was motivated purely by greed
2. to inspire and encourage someone to do something: a good teacher must motivate her pupils
entry for intellect at thefreedictionary.com on October 9, 2009 reads
Quote n.
1.
a. The ability to learn and reason; the capacity for knowledge and understanding.
b. The ability to think abstractly or profoundly. See Synonyms at mind.
2. A person of great intellectual ability.Even then I am not sure you can use it as a synonym.
Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 09 2009,02:25) Gene, Don't you think that motivation might be a better representation for spirit than intellect.
entry for motivate at thefreedictionary.com on October 9, 2009 reads
Quote Verb
[-vating, -vated]1. to give a reason or inspiration for a course of action to someone: he was motivated purely by greed
2. to inspire and encourage someone to do something: a good teacher must motivate her pupils
entry for intellect at thefreedictionary.com on October 9, 2009 reads
Quote n.
1.
a. The ability to learn and reason; the capacity for knowledge and understanding.
b. The ability to think abstractly or profoundly. See Synonyms at mind.
2. A person of great intellectual ability.Even then I am not sure you can use it as a synonym.
Just a thought, without intellect, you would not know greed, without greed there would be no motivation. Just a thought.Quote (Constitutionalist @ Oct. 09 2009,17:54) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 09 2009,02:25) Gene, Don't you think that motivation might be a better representation for spirit than intellect.
entry for motivate at thefreedictionary.com on October 9, 2009 reads
Quote Verb
[-vating, -vated]1. to give a reason or inspiration for a course of action to someone: he was motivated purely by greed
2. to inspire and encourage someone to do something: a good teacher must motivate her pupils
entry for intellect at thefreedictionary.com on October 9, 2009 reads
Quote n.
1.
a. The ability to learn and reason; the capacity for knowledge and understanding.
b. The ability to think abstractly or profoundly. See Synonyms at mind.
2. A person of great intellectual ability.Even then I am not sure you can use it as a synonym.
Just a thought, without intellect, you would not know greed, without greed there would be no motivation. Just a thought.
I will agree that the Spirit gives you the ability to discern good from evil but I still think calling it Intellect goes to far as that idea seems to state you become as intelligent as God.
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