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Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 27 2007,08:07) Nick…. GOD said,”i change (NOT), so if he was God he still is God. you cannot seperate the word from God, just like you can't seperate your words from you . Either the word was God and Still is God or it was not and still is not GOD, which is it. make up your mind so we can see what you are really saying. thanks.. gene
Hi Gene,
I can die but my words remain.
Of course we can be separate from our words.
So was the Word, who was WITH GOD, in the beginning.Hi Gene,
You say
“Nick…..Jesus said God was in Heaven, so whats the difference.”
Hmm.
God is not a synonym for heaven.
Please be accurate.Hi Gene,
You say
“No where does John say the word was Jesus, He only said the word who was GOD the Father was in Him, “
Where is this written??Nick….illogical…. when you die your words die with you, your intellect is gone and all yours with it. “The dead know not anything when they die their throught parish. and your word are the expression of your thoughts Just as Jesus and GOD the Father”s are also. It was GOD the FAther who was in Christ who was reconcilling the world to (HIMSELF), just like it say's. The words were not Jesus words, it's obivious. thanks….gene
Hi Gene,
You are mixing up words with thoughts and plans.
Words are already expressed.
Did the words of Jesus die with him?Likewise you mix up the Word given to Jesus with him being, in another sense the Word.
Nick….What do you think it meant when John said the word (GOD) BECAME, the meaning of became means, (came to be) and we all know God is not flesh and blood, but Spirit, so he obiviously had to come to be (IN FLESH) not be flesh, and this is backed up by Jesus in many places. Didn't he PLAINLY SAY the Father in ME does the works, Not to mention many other times he Referenced GOD the Father as being in Him, if you want i can give you those also. Jesus acknowledge often It was Father in Him doing these things which includes he word God was speaking through his body He was cohabbiting with Jesus sharing His body, or do you think it was Jesus that was saying destory this body and in three days I shall rais it up. That was the Father speaking through him and those words were not Jesus words but the Father Himself. Your robbing the Father of His Glory by allowing Jesus to be accredited with what the Father was doing. The Father was speeking His words through Jesus, not Jesus being the word. But Gid in Him was the Word, not him.
Hi Gene,
Not so.
I have always given the glory to God for the work done through Jesus.
The Word partook of flesh and dwelt among us.
God did not do so but indwelled the vessel of his Son from the Jordan.
Scripture NEVER SAYS that God is the WORD.
Those are your words.Nick ….If God isn't the word then every thing He spoke isn't either, so now we are left with a delima . Lets try to figure this out, let see God is not the word and i cant know God except by his words and his actions, well at least I have his actions even if I don't have his words,i gess the commandments cant be His words either because God isn't the word ,and if you say Jesus was the God who WAS the word then you Must say Jesus is a GOD.this is not the way I believe.
your glorification and defication of Jesus is exaclty what trinitarians do rather you believe or not.Hi Gene,
Is God just expressions of Himself??
Not so.
God is apart from God's Words.
If God never spoke to us He would still be GodQuote (Nick Hassan @ July 27 2007,09:37) Hi Gene,
Is God just expressions of Himself??
Not so.
God is apart from God's Words.
If God never spoke to us He would still be God
Nick….YES that is all God is an expression of Himself, both in WORD”S and DEEDS.
Just like you and me are,we are just an expression of our words and deed's that all also.God the Father expresses His self in WORD”S AND DEEDS.
i really shouldn't have to tell you that.
thanks..geneHi Gene,
You need to believe in God and not just God's expressions.Jn 14
” 1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. “Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 27 2007,10:23) Hi Gene,
You need to believe in God and not just God's expressions.Jn 14
” 1Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. “
Nick…I don't know about you, you may have some mistical link , but as for me I know about God by His words and His deeds. what He has personaly shown me throught HIS words and HIS deeds in my life. YOU can no more seperate God from his word then you can His deeds.
And you talk about My Phylosophy, i am not the one the one taking scriptures out of context , who cant even see the simple meanning that Jesus is no God and Never WAS one either. It amazes me you can't even see these simple truths.I rememeber telling you before, you remmind me of the saying ” you can't see the forest because of the trees.
I beleve thats is even more true now. Like I told worshiping Jesus , theirs no piont in descussing these things with you any further, if Jodi and not3in1 and others can't convince you I wouldn't be able to either. All of this topic has been descussed over and over everyone will have to stand or fall on what they understand. thanks …geneHi Gene.
So God is not just God's word and deeds.
Good.
God is not the Word either.
But
“…the Word was God”Hi Gene,
Your views on these matters as far as the nature of God is concerned are quite unique to you and I think you should review them in the light of scripture.My husband's name is Dan. My son's name is Nathan.
Humor me for a moment:
In the beginning was Nathan, and Nathan was with Dan, and Nathan was Dan. Nathan was with Dan in the beginning.
*******************************************
So we are back to the word, WITH. How was the Word “with” God? I suggest, that as the SON of God….he was a part of God's essence. Just as our human sons are a part of their father's before they are born (they are the seed that is carried – the potential for a son at any time), Jesus was also a part of his father before he was born. In fact, Jesus was born of God. We are born of God through Jesus, and through the incorruptable seed of God. Praise God!
Other themes that follow this theory that are throughout the tenor of the NT: true sonship (Jesus' and ours), inheritence (Jesus' and ours), resurrection (Jesus' and ours) and others………
Brothers and sisters – do not let some discourage you from continuing this discussion. It is not mere pages of confusion and therefore not a profitable discussion. This is the topic of all topics!! I dare say that what you decide here will determine “which Jesus” you follow.
Press on!
Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 27 2007,11:37) Hi Gene,
Your views on these matters as far as the nature of God is concerned are quite unique to you and I think you should review them in the light of scripture.
Nick, and your view on preexistence is quite unique to you and t8.No matter, I believe the discussion is worthwhile and I have seen a lot of truth in Gene's explainations. Meanwhile, I am still waiting for you to produce the scriptures that show God and Jesus “had a meeting” where Jesus decided or chose to come to earth.
We all have theories that should be reviewed in light of the scriptures. But, Nick, you should be one of the last persons to call someone out for being “unique.” I know of no one who believes the preexistent story that you do.
However, I have learned from both of you (Nick and Gene) and I have appreciated your discussion/debate back and forth. Please don't get too descouraged…..we may all agree to disagree at the end of the day….but we all ponder what is offered, and God's holy spirit leads us into all truth. Nothing is in vain when we are seeking truth.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 27 2007,11:47) Hi not3,
Sons are sons not bits of their dads.
You are showing your ignorance of the conception process.
Hi not3,
Really?
Why do you rate the role of mother so low?Jesus is the monogenes son-of God alone as an image, not through Mary.
He was sent into the world.Thus is became also a physical son of God by the Spirit too.
He came to lay down his life for us.
Jn 10
17Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again.18No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
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