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Shimmer ……….The Word who was GOD came to be (IN) Jesus, by the anointing he recieved at the Jordan river. God the Father came and indwelt Him For real., But just as the Father can and Does indwell others who have Spirit recieved into them , none of that makes us or Jesus GOD the Father, remember Jesus said the Father is (IN) Me (HE) Doth the works. Jesus is (NOT) the WORD, GOD the FATHER is the WORD and He came to Earth and dwelt (IN) Jesus and co-habited His Body with him, He considers our Bodies as Temples He cam indwell remember when He said through Jesus' Mouth , “DESTROY THIS TEMPLE AND IN THREE DAY (I) GOD SHALL RAISE IT UP” That was God the Father speaking first Person through Jesus' mouth. God is (omnipresent) both inside his creation and outside of it all at the same time. He literally is everywhere that is why nothing can be done without him taking notice.
peace and love to you and your Shimmer……………………………..gene
Quote (shimmer @ Oct. 09 2010,17:01) Ed, I dont understand what those verses are meant to agree with,
shimmerread all of this,all those sciptures talk about Christ ,the Word(Jn1;1)in other place the word means the scriptures not to mix.
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him (the Word =Jesus) all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.
Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creationJn 17:24 “Father, I want those you have given me to be with me where I am, and to see my glory, the glory you have given me because you loved me before the creation of the world.
Rev 3:14 “To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God’s creationJn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Jn 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.Jas 1:18 He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we might be a kind of firstfruits of all he created
Phil 2:10 that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
but not God he is the one who give this to Jesus. because at the end Jesus turn all things under God even himself.Isa 62:2 The nations will see your righteousness,
and all kings your glory;
you will be called by a new name
that the mouth of the LORD will bestow.
Rev 2:17 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes, I will give some of the hidden manna. I will also give him a white stone with a new name written on it, known only to him who receives it.
Rev 3:12 Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name.so the name Jesus and the word ,also the Lamb ,may change to a new name………….
Rev 5:12 In a loud voice they sang:
“Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain,
to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength
and honor and glory and praise!”Rev 14:4 These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb.
Pierre
Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 09 2010,09:30) Quote (shimmer @ Oct. 09 2010,10:01) Quote (shimmer @ Oct. 09 2010,07:38) Hi Ed, In John 1 it says clearly that the word (Logos) became flesh, became Jesus. Do you see that ?
Hi Shimmer,Acts12:24 …”The Word” ([ο λογος] Hō Lōgôs) of God grew and multiplied.
Mark 13:11 But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought
beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall
be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the HolySpirit.
Luke 12:12 For the HolySpirit shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.
Matt.10:20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Ed, I dont understand what those verses are meant to agree with,
Hi Shimmer,“The Word” becomes flesh is all God's Children. Do you see that?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (shimmer @ Oct. 09 2010,09:56) Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 09 2010,10:13) Shimmer, Do you believe Jesus the spirit being changed into a human being or that God spoke and Jesus came to be?
Hi Kerwin.I know scripture says the word (Logos) became flesh, became Jesus.
But thats where I get stuck.
shimmer, don't get stuck, look at this verses in Rev. It talkes about Jesus who also is Yeshua, The Word o God is title just like God is….Rev 19:13 And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
Rev 19:14 And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Rev 19:16 And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
He was called Jesus when He was on earth, and in the Old Test. He was Yahshua. whether WE WILL CALL Him Jesus OR JUST King, Scriptures does not reveal that, we will have to wait and see…..Peace Irene
Shimmer,
John chooses to use mysticism in order to hide the meaning from those that do not hunger and thirst for righteousness. The devil is using your sinful self to blind you but Jesus can enable the blind to see if they believe in he is the Anointed One.
Scripture clearly states Jesus is a descendant of both Abraham and David and a shape changed spirit being cannot be such as their body and all else that is human would not be descended from any man as man is not a non-corporeal being.
That leaves the possibility that God used genetic material related to David and Abraham to create a human being that would be named Jesus within Mary's womb.
It is also possible that The Spirit of Christ came to occupy the flesh that would be named Jesus.
A third possibility is that a preexitant human soul came down from the Seventh heaven to animate the flesh that would be named Jesus.
A combination of the middle two seem more likely to me though the last is spoken of in some Jewish traditions.
Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 09 2010,18:58) Shimmer, John chooses to use mysticism in order to hide the meaning from those that do not hunger and thirst for righteousness. The devil is using your sinful self to blind you but Jesus can enable the blind to see if they believe in he is the Anointed One.
Scripture clearly states Jesus is a descendant of both Abraham and David and a shape changed spirit being cannot be such as their body and all else that is human would not be descended from any man as man is not a non-corporeal being.
That leaves the possibility that God used genetic material related to David and Abraham to create a human being that would be named Jesus within Mary's womb.
It is also possible that The Spirit of Christ came to occupy the flesh that would be named Jesus.
A third possibility is that a preexitant human soul came down from the Seventh heaven to animate the flesh that would be named Jesus.
A combination of the middle two seem more likely to me though the last is spoken of in some Jewish traditions.
hi kerwinit seems to me you do not beleive in the preexistence of Christ??
Pierre
Woah, all of you, there are many opinions and all of them could be true, I read Gene's and thought yeah I get that, then I read Terrarica's and thought yeah I get that, lol, and so on with the others.
900 pages later, who has it right ?
Gene are you still preaching the Jesus was created 2000 years ago gospel. The one who God made the universe through, you know, the that universe that is suppose to be 13 billion years old, was in actual fact created through someone who was himself created 2000 years ago? So God created Jesus and yet created the universe through him.
This gospel also takes all references to Jesus existing or having glory with the Father previous to his coming in the flesh and turns them all into an allegory that when interpreted by you, has the complete opposite meaning. Am I getting your gospel straight now?
But Gene. Should we take anything we don't like, heap up teachers to teach what our ears want to hear, and who allegorize any scripture that proves them wrong, and then cheekily say that the allegory is saying the complete opposite of what the scripture says at face value and then throw in a few “amen brother” comments to those who espouse the same formula?
I mean, how far do you think you can string anyone along with a gospel that applies such biased rules?
Shimmer Probably 95% of what you hear is from false teachers who have fallen into MYSTERY RELIGIOUS teachings. All who separate Jesus from our (EXACT) Identity are Antichrists they have brought into the pagan iniquity's and are not of GOD. The Truth will set you free from those teachings Shimmer. Go back and read what martian, barely, Jodi, Marty, JA, and I have said and don't fall for these false teachers here who practice and preach false religion of the Fallen Churches. “COME OUT OF HER MY PEOPLE THAT YOU RECEIVE NOT OF (HER) PLAGUES”. MYSTERY BABYLON RELIGION IS WHAT CHRISTIANITY HAS BECOME FULL OF FALSE TEACHINGS. One of the worst is that Jesus is different then we are Shimmer, Do not fall for it Sis.
peace and love to you and yours…………………………..gene
Shimmer. Jesus existed in the form of God/with divine nature, and emptied himself and existed in flesh nature, then humbled himself and died, rose again, and is now seated at the right hand of the majesty on high in the glory that he had with him before the world begun.
That is the truth because it is scripture. My statement above is not my own words but a repeat of that which is written. Don't let anyone talk you out of what scripture teaches. There are no end of volunteers who would love to sway you away from the scripture, but don't let them sway you away from scripture if indeed this is what you believe.
T8…………The truth is it is you who are preaching MYSTERY Religion and are Separating OUR Identity with Jesus not Me. I have posted many scriptures that plainly shows Jesus did not preexist His berth on earth , and that he was indeed the son of Abraham as well as a Son of David, and God plainly said He (Shall BE) my son and (I WILL BE) His Father, all future tense wording . God Back and read that completer post , i am not going to take the time now to repost it all. You saying Jesus created a Billion year old universe is nothing but suppositions on your part, specially when GOD said He (ALONE and BY HIMSELF) Created it all. You have fallen head long into the Mystery Religions of Pagan Christianity. All who separate Jesus From our EXACT Identity are ANTICHRISTS, that is what the Spiirt (intellect) of Antichrist is. You can not say with any surety the Jesus is indeed your Brother because you have separated him from your identity and therefore you have no part with him IMO> You can not say you can come unto the Measure of the (FULLNESS) of the STATURE of Christ now can you?.
T8, Jesus became a son of GOD at the Jordan River by receiving the Spirit of GOD into Him, Just as all true Saints of GOD do by receiving of GOD'S Spirit into themselves. If he were already the Son of God before his berth on earth Why would He even need to be given the Spirit at the Jordan anyway common sense should tell you that. You have locked you mind on a few scriptures that can be taken in many different ways like Mike and other have. While closing your eyes off to all the other scriptures that show differently. God was not dealing with a Preexistent Angle of demigod or Angle of any kind , He was dealing with Man kind by a MAN to was Born of a Women and Who HE (GOD) Perfected by His HOLY Spirit giving us all an example of HIS power to PERFECT and Create Holiness in us all. Your false teachings not only destory the work of GOD in Man , but separate Jesus from Us and that is Antichrist any way you want to look at it. IMO
Peace and Love…………………gene
And by the way make yourself useful and restore my editing rights please.
Quote (kerwin @ Oct. 09 2010,11:58) Scripture clearly states Jesus is a descendant of both Abraham and David and a shape changed spirit being cannot be such as their body and all else that is human would not be descended from any man as man is not a non-corporeal being. That leaves the possibility that God used genetic material related to David and Abraham to create a human being that would be named Jesus within Mary's womb.
It is also possible that The Spirit of Christ came to occupy the flesh that would be named Jesus.
Kerwin ………This is right in your post, except the Spirit of Christ was the Spirit of GOD or the Anointing He recieved at the Jordan. Remember the word Christos means Messiah which means ANOINTED ONE> And indeed Jesus was anointed with the Spirit if GOD At the Jordan river,Peace and Love to you and yours……………………gene
Gene,
If I choose to follow your reasoning to its reasonable I begin by pointing out that in an anointing you pour oil on the intended target not in the intended target. So I will let the Spirit equal oil which is what you implied and look at the scripture you address.
Matthew 3:16 reads:
Quote As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and lighting on him.
Mark 1:10 reads:
Quote As Jesus was coming up out of the water, he saw heaven being torn open and the Spirit descending on him like a dove.
Luke 3:22 reads:
Quote and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: “You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased.”
John 1:32″(NIV) reads:
Quote Then John gave this testimony: “I saw the Spirit come down from heaven as a dove and remain on him.
Several things are clear from these accounts.
1) None call the event an anointing though Jesus would late refer to his death an resurrection as a baptism and we know John just baptized Jesus. Baptism is referred to as an anointing later.
2) The Spirit rested on him, not in him, as a sign to John the Baptist and perhaps to all prescient.
3) That sign was accompanied by God's public acknowledment that Jesus is his Son.
The passage from John 1 that I was interpreting clearly states the Word, i.e. Spirit of God, became, i.e. took on, flesh. My interpretation is that the Spirit came to inhabit Jesus. It inhabits Jesus just as it does with those that have been immersed by the authority of Jesus. The evidence to support this conclusion is that scripture declares one must live by the spirit at all times in order not to sin and it is clear one must have the indwelling, though not the outer sign, of the spirit to walk according to its ways.
So in conclusion even given what you believe is true, it does not contradict my own conclusions.
Pierre,
I do not believe Jesus preexisted his conception though I cannot totally discount the reasonable possibility of a preexistant human soul.
Quote (shimmer @ Oct. 09 2010,20:24) Woah, all of you, there are many opinions and all of them could be true, I read Gene's and thought yeah I get that, then I read Terrarica's and thought yeah I get that, lol, and so on with the others. 900 pages later, who has it right ?
shimmer, it seems that there are some that want you believe the truth, and there ares some who want to take you away from it. It males no sense to me when there are several Scriptures that prove that Jesus existed before He became a
man, and I really don't understand why they do that. Even t8 they want to tell what they believe. Sorry, but when I read Gene's post, I see how wrong He is…… Take all of those Scriptures that Pierre and I gave you and study it against Gene's and kerwin's. We can't all be right, can we? It looks like you want all to agree, however that is not going to happen unless they go by the written word of God and ” The Word of God in John1:1 who became flesh in verse 14 and Rev. 19:13-16 that explaines thatit s Christ…… He has a robe on dipped in blood and called also KING O KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS. When are they going to see this?
? And you for that matter…..
Peace to all IreneQuote (kerwin @ Oct. 10 2010,01:47) Gene, The passage from John 1 that I was interpreting clearly states the Word, i.e. Spirit of God, became, i.e. took on, flesh. My interpretation is that the Spirit came to inhabit Jesus. It inhabits Jesus just as it does with those that have been immersed by the authority of Jesus. The evidence to support this conclusion is that scripture declares one must live by the spirit at all times in order not to sin and it is clear one must have the indwelling, though not the outer sign, of the spirit to walk according to its ways.
So in conclusion even given what you believe is true, it does not contradict my own conclusions.
Hi Kerwin and Gene,We all stand in agreement on this one!
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (kerwin @ Oct. 10 2010,01:51) Pierre, I do not believe Jesus preexisted his conception though I cannot totally discount the reasonable possibility of a preexistant human soul.
Hi Kerwin,If we all preexisted, then how would Jesus be any different than the rest of us?
With the exception of Jesus having no biological Father of course. (Luke 3:23)God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (kerwin @ Oct. 10 2010,01:51) Pierre, I do not believe Jesus preexisted his conception though I cannot totally discount the reasonable possibility of a preexistant human soul.
kerwin! If you see somehow that John 1:1 N VERSE 14 is a person, is it not Jesus? When there is Scriptures like Rev. Rev 19:13 And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.Rev 19:14 And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Rev 19:16 And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
Do you see Jesus in these verses of Rev. 19? I do.
Along withRev 3:14 ¶ And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
And
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all [things] he might have the preeminence.
verse 18 shows us that He not only was the firstborn of all creation, but also the firstborn of the dead.
then we have
Jhn 6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
These last Scriptures is Jesus saying. Now please be very carefule to deny this, because if you do, you will call Jesus a liar, would you not?
All these Scriptures are taken from the Blue Letter Bible available on the Internet…. I copied and paste them…..
Peace and Love to you and I hope you are well, Irene
Irene,
For reasons that Jesus explained to his student both he and his disciples choose to speak in mysticisms. My suspicion is the Hebrew language, which is descriptive, influenced their mind set. Jesus did not mention that.
John uses these mysticisms in most or all of the books attributed to him. For example the word “Word”, which according to its Hebrew equivalent can mean “word, spirit, breath, etc.” If we substitute “Spirit” for “Word” and remember that the Spirit can either be addressed as a person or as a thing then we find it does fit the context. In addition if we remember that Paul teaches us that The Lord is Spirit we find that it is equivalent to stating Jesus is the Word. He is the Word because he is the embodiment of the Spirit of God.
It is true that the Spirit of Christ did come down from heaven.
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