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Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,11:05) Quote (terraricca @ April 20 2013,23:32) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,07:56) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 19 2013,19:52) Quote (Lightenup @ April 18 2013,21:48) Let's not forget that fathers naturally have a position higher than their sons.
And let's not forget that gods naturally have a higher position than those they are the god of.
So Jesus is lesser than his God and Father on at least two counts. And even though Jesus is “a god”, he is not “The Most High God”………. so make that three counts.
I could go on until I reached about 100 counts – but I think you get the point.
Jehovah is the most High. Jehovah is BOTH God of gods AND Lord of lords, Father and Son!
KathyNo ,Christ the son his NOT GOD OF GODS ,IF SO SHOW YOUR SCRIPTURE
?
Ah, but He is Lord of lords. Jehovah is Lord of lords.
yes kathy
the son his lord of lords but God the father his GOD OF GODS AND LORD OF LORDSLIKE I TOLD YOU BEFORE ;IT SHOWS THAT GOD THE FATHER HIS THE ONLY TRUE GOD OVER ALL HIS CREATION ,INCLUDING THE FIRST CREATION WHAT IS HIS SON JESUS CHRIST ,
AGAIN IT SHOW THAT GOD THE FATHER STANDS ALONE IN POWER AND NONE IS HIS EQUAL IN ANYTHING
Hi,
Jer.32:27 “Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh; is anything too difficult for Me?”
Heb12:9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
God of all flesh.
Father of Spirits.
Peace.
Quote (abe @ April 21 2013,11:36) Hi, Jer.32:27 “Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh; is anything too difficult for Me?”
Heb12:9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
God of all flesh.
Father of Spirits.
Peace.
And what that suppose to meanQuote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,07:37) Quote (kerwin @ April 19 2013,08:11) Quote (Lightenup @ April 19 2013,11:03) Kerwin, The belief in the two powers of Yahweh was a teaching of the Jews. Read this:
http://www.twopowersinheaven.com/
LU,Some off the Canaanites, polytheists, believed in two essential powers. Dr. Michael S. Heiser is interpretation the Hebrew bible in its Canaanite setting.
Quote In my dissertation (UW-Madison, 2004) I argued that Segal’s instincts were correct. My own work bridges the gap between his book and the Hebrew Bible understood in its Canaanite religious context. I don't know anything about rabbinical scholar Alan Segal except what Dr. Heiser said about him. I have heard no peer review of Alan Segal's work, though he published it as a book in 1977.
Hi Kerwin,
The OT says “the Holy Elohim are He.” I agree with that.
The NT says the Father and I are one. I agree with that.
The OT says Jehovah is God of gods and Lord of lords. I agree with that.
The NT says for us there is one God, the Father and one Lord, Jesus Christ. I agree with that too.That all supports plurality in unity of God.
LU,Those are words and words can mean many things. I believe all you wrote but not what you mean.
As for the Canaanites, they have two essential powers, of which one sounds like God. The second is his wife, who name is said to mean city. That may just be one sect.
As you see the Canaanites have split off from the truth and are said to make a personification of the city a second God. El Elyon is still the most high God.
Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?Quote (terraricca @ April 20 2013,22:08) Quote (abe @ April 21 2013,11:36) Hi, Jer.32:27 “Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh; is anything too difficult for Me?”
Heb12:9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
God of all flesh.
Father of Spirits.
Peace.
And what that suppose to mean
Hi T,THINK.
Peace brother.
Quote (abe @ April 22 2013,00:51) Quote (terraricca @ April 20 2013,22:08) Quote (abe @ April 21 2013,11:36) Hi, Jer.32:27 “Behold, I am the LORD, the God of all flesh; is anything too difficult for Me?”
Heb12:9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?
God of all flesh.
Father of Spirits.
Peace.
And what that suppose to mean
Hi T,THINK.
Peace brother.
abeI know what it means ,but I want to know what it means in your head and mind
Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:45) Mike,
Jesus is not lessor than God, Jesus is God.
John 3:17
For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him.Who SENT Jesus into the world? It says “God”, right? And who is greater – the one who SENDS, or the one who IS SENT?
That one verse shows that God is greater than Jesus…….. but there are also many more that show the same thing.
Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:45) He is very God of very God.
So is Satan and the other spirit sons of God. They are all “gods”, according to Biblical terminology, and they are all “of God”, since God also brought them forth into existence.Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:48) The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
Luke 13:32
And He said to them, “Go, tell that fox, ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I shall be perfected.’Hebrews 2:10
In bringing many sons and daughters to glory, it was fitting that God……. should make the pioneer of their salvation perfect through what he suffered.Hebrews 5:9
and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation…………..Hebrews 7:28
…but the oath, which came after the law, appointed the Son, who has been made perfect forever.All of these speak about Jesus BEING MADE perfect, Kathi. Do you suppose God was ever “made perfect”?
Hebrews 10:14
For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.Oh, and the verse above tells how many more of us will be made perfect, just as Jesus was.
The real question is: Knowing that those scriptures exist, will you continue to make the claim you've made in the quote box above?
Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,23:01) If the President of the U.S. begat you, he would be your father and your president. Right?
Good point, Kathi. But would the son the President begot be “part of” the President? Would he be “Co-President” or something?In other words, would he be “The Son of POTUS”………….. or “POTUS the Son”? Which one?
Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,23:04) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:40) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:22) Mike,
Do you think God is an angel?
An angel of WHO, Kathi? Who is it that sends Almighty YHWH to deliver his message?
Is that a no?
Correct. I don't think the Most High God is an angel.Quote (terraricca @ April 21 2013,21:09) Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?
T,The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed.
Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,07:09) Quote (terraricca @ April 21 2013,21:09) Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?
T,The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed.
KQuote The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed. NO ,THAT IS NOT THE ANSWER,SO THINK DEEPER YET,
JESUS HIMSELF AS GIVEN THE TRUE ANSWER
Quote (terraricca @ April 23 2013,07:50) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,07:09) Quote (terraricca @ April 21 2013,21:09) Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?
T,The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed.
KQuote The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed. NO ,THAT IS NOT THE ANSWER,SO THINK DEEPER YET,
JESUS HIMSELF AS GIVEN THE TRUE ANSWER
T,Those are the exact words that are written. Why do you think God chose to use them?
Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,10:43) Quote (terraricca @ April 23 2013,07:50) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,07:09) Quote (terraricca @ April 21 2013,21:09) Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?
T,The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed.
KQuote The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed. NO ,THAT IS NOT THE ANSWER,SO THINK DEEPER YET,
JESUS HIMSELF AS GIVEN THE TRUE ANSWER
T,Those are the exact words that are written. Why do you think God chose to use them?
Kthose words are true ,but it is the understanding of those words that are the true mining ;words you do not understand have no live,so think
Quote (terraricca @ April 24 2013,07:57) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,10:43) Quote (terraricca @ April 23 2013,07:50) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,07:09) Quote (terraricca @ April 21 2013,21:09) Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?
T,The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed.
KQuote The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed. NO ,THAT IS NOT THE ANSWER,SO THINK DEEPER YET,
JESUS HIMSELF AS GIVEN THE TRUE ANSWER
T,Those are the exact words that are written. Why do you think God chose to use them?
Kthose words are true ,but it is the understanding of those words that are the true mining ;words you do not understand have no live,so think
T,You don't seem interested in having a conversation about their meaning.
Quote (kerwin @ April 25 2013,07:29) Quote (terraricca @ April 24 2013,07:57) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,10:43) Quote (terraricca @ April 23 2013,07:50) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,07:09) Quote (terraricca @ April 21 2013,21:09) Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?
T,The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed.
KQuote The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed. NO ,THAT IS NOT THE ANSWER,SO THINK DEEPER YET,
JESUS HIMSELF AS GIVEN THE TRUE ANSWER
T,Those are the exact words that are written. Why do you think God chose to use them?
Kthose words are true ,but it is the understanding of those words that are the true mining ;words you do not understand have no live,so think
T,You don't seem interested in having a conversation about their meaning.
KerwinOK, what do you think they mean
Quote (terraricca @ April 25 2013,07:43) Quote (kerwin @ April 25 2013,07:29) Quote (terraricca @ April 24 2013,07:57) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,10:43) Quote (terraricca @ April 23 2013,07:50) Quote (kerwin @ April 23 2013,07:09) Quote (terraricca @ April 21 2013,21:09) Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2013,18:51) Quote (Lightenup @ April 21 2013,10:48) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2013,23:38) Quote (Lightenup @ April 20 2013,22:06) Jesus was a theos being, not an angel being, Mike. Get it straight.
Show me the difference in the scriptures, Kathi. Show me how the angel “Jesus” is a “god BEING”, while the other “gods” in Ps 82 are not “god BEINGS”.What SCRIPTURE tells us that the angel/god Jesus Christ is a different kind of BEING than those other angels/gods.
The others were not perfect, Jesus was. Only God beings are perfect and must be perfect and uncreated.
LU,Jesus was perfected by his sufferings according to Scripture.
Hebrews 5:8-9
King James Version (KJV)8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
Kso what is it that PERFECTION means
?
T,The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed.
KQuote The Scripture teaches us that it is that “learned he obedience by the things which he suffered”. An odd way to speak of one that never disobeyed. NO ,THAT IS NOT THE ANSWER,SO THINK DEEPER YET,
JESUS HIMSELF AS GIVEN THE TRUE ANSWER
T,Those are the exact words that are written. Why do you think God chose to use them?
Kthose words are true ,but it is the understanding of those words that are the true mining ;words you do not understand have no live,so think
T,You don't seem interested in having a conversation about their meaning.
KerwinOK, what do you think they mean
T,That Jesus' righteousness was increased because he treated his trials and tribulations as discipline. For example he learned to persevere by by practicing it during adversity.
What say you?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 17 2013,14:15) T8, I don't get it. Do you seriously believe that there exist only TWO Gods – Jehovah and Satan?
Mike. There are two who are the originators of all that we see. One is Yahweh who is the only one who is good and the other is Satan, who is the Father of lies and a murderer from the beginning.Satan wanted to be like the Most High and he set out to be a God I guess. And he accomplished that. He is the God of this world.
Jesus on the other hand chose to obey God and to do God's will and not his own, even when he preferred to do his own will.
Just because Satan is the God of this age and Jesus is the son of God, this is by no means meant to be taken that Satan is greater than Jesus. The one who is greater is the one who obeys God. The one who is greater is the one who lays his own life down.
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