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Quote (carmel @ April 25 2013,18:07) jb2u,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote No, because each can only be in that state one at a time. Jbtu,
WRONG!
THE ICE WHILE IN THE FREEZER IS ICE!
BUT AS SOON AS IT IS REMOVED FROM THE ICE BOX AND IT IS IN HIGHER TEMPERATURE,
THE TEMPERATURE (STEEM) THE ICE, AND THE WATER ARE ONE . INSEPRARABLE!
SO THE ICE IS ONE AND THREE,
LIKE WISE
THE WATER AND THE TEMPERATURE,
SINCE THE ICE IS IN THE PROCESS OF BECOMING WATER!
MORE TO COME JUST TO START ANSWERING YOUR POST FULL OF ERRORS!
ALWAYS FOR THE LOVE OF JESUS
Charles
You say the ice is “IN THE PROCESS OF BECOMING” water.So, you agree with what I said!! That same cup of water can be ice OR it can be liquid, but not both at the same time.
I've heard this analogy. It works better for those that believe that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all GOD, but they say GOD exists only as one of the other “personalities” at any given time. Many abandoned this concept of the trinity because it would just be silly to say that Jesus prayed to Himself.
I have “many errors” in my post, and this is the one that you picked to “denounce” first? Surely, you want me to believe in the trinity and not the states in which water can exist?? I will wait your proof. As I have said, I really want to know the truth. If I am wrong, I will accept that fact. I will thank God for showing me the truth through you. Will you do the same? Will you open your heart and mind to what the Bible says as oppose to what is the doctrine of men? Will you put aside the teachings of unGodly men for the chance to read the Word of GOD?
I am working 12 hour night shifts over the next 6 days, but, if I am not too tired, I will try to post some mornings.
Quote (jb2u @ April 24 2013,18:09) Quote (Lightenup @ April 25 2013,06:29) jb2u,
Would you like a one on one discussion of this? It gets hard to find past discussions when many people are posting in the same thread. I have been real busy lately and now I have a head cold, in a few days I leave for San Diego for about a week. After that I will probably be more consistent on here. So, what do you say to a one on one discussion? We can tackle one question at a time…one from you and then one from me.
That is fine with me. I hope you feel better!! Have a safe trip.
Thanks jb2u. I am feeling better every day. I have started a discussion here for us to talk about our concerns:jb2u,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote I am pretty sure that is NOT what John 16 is about. Why would His Father, GOD, need to give Jesus anything if in fact Jesus is GOD??? Jb2u
REFLECT:
J: JESUS' the word, the triune God, God in flesh
B: BODY was
2: TWO full separate persons, son of God and Son of man glorified through the Holy Spirit
U: UNITED himself as one being both spirit and flesh , and became the only true God, and Jesus Christ
THAT'S WHERE YOU ERR!
I AM PRETTY SURE THAT WHATEVER THE FATHER HAS BELONG TO JESUS, WHICH THE FATHER NEVER HAD BEFORE NEVER MIND WERE GIVEN FROM THE FATHER.
THE FATHER IS THE FATHER GOD CREATOR OF THE SPIRITUAL WORLD THROUGH THE SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT.
THE SON IS THE SON GOD MEDIATOR CREATOR OF THE MATERIAL WORLD THROUGH THE FATHER IN THE HOLY SPIRIT
THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE HOLY SPIRIT GOD RECREATOR OF OUR WORLD THROUGH JESUS THE WORLD ON THE CROSS!
Matthew 13:33 Another parable he spoke to them: The kingdom of heaven is like to leaven, which a woman took and hid in three measures of meal, until the whole was leavened.
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
jb2u,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote That same cup of water can be ice OR it can be liquid, but not both at the same time. jb2u,
WRONG AGAIN:
I SAID WHILE THE ICE A SUBSTANCE,IS IN THE FREEZER REMAINS AN ICE. BUT STILL WATER, IN VERY LOW TEMPRETURE!
BUT AS SOON AS YOU TAKE THE ICE OUT OF THE FREEZER:
IT WILL UNITE IN ONE FUNCTION AND ALSO WHILE STILL BEING IN THE ICE STATE, AND MELTS, THEREFORE CONTAINS WATER,SO IT IS ALSO WATER AND YOU CAN DRINK OUT OF IT! NO?
IT IS ALSO PART OF THREE DIFFERENT INSEPARABLE ELEMENTS WHILE IN THAT PARTICULAR FUNCTION!
THE TEMPERATURE THE CAUSE, HOT, INVISIBLE ,AND THE LIGHTEST ATTACHED WITH
THE ICE MEDIUM WEGHT,SOLID, COLD,VISIBLE AND IT MELTS ESTABLISHES
THE WATER THE SOURCE, LIQUID,THE HEAVIEST, AND THE SOURCE OF LIFE.
SO THESE ELEMENTS, ARE THREE INDIVIDUAL ELEMENTS AND IN THE SAME INSTANT THEY ARE ALSO UNITED, IN ONE PARTICULAR FUNCTION IN ESTABLISHING WATER!
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Quote (carmel @ April 26 2013,02:00) jb2u,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote I am pretty sure that is NOT what John 16 is about. Why would His Father, GOD, need to give Jesus anything if in fact Jesus is GOD??? Jb2u
REFLECT:
J: JESUS' the word, the triune God, God in flesh
B: BODY was
2: TWO full separate persons, son of God and Son of man glorified through the Holy Spirit
U: UNITED himself as one being both spirit and flesh , and became the only true God, and Jesus Christ
THAT'S WHERE YOU ERR!
I AM PRETTY SURE THAT WHATEVER THE FATHER HAS BELONG TO JESUS, WHICH THE FATHER NEVER HAD BEFORE NEVER MIND WERE GIVEN FROM THE FATHER.
THE FATHER IS THE FATHER GOD CREATOR OF THE SPIRITUAL WORLD THROUGH THE SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT.
THE SON IS THE SON GOD MEDIATOR CREATOR OF THE MATERIAL WORLD THROUGH THE FATHER IN THE HOLY SPIRIT
THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE HOLY SPIRIT GOD RECREATOR OF OUR WORLD THROUGH JESUS THE WORLD ON THE CROSS!
Matthew 13:33 Another parable he spoke to them: The kingdom of heaven is like to leaven, which a woman took and hid in three measures of meal, until the whole was leavened.
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
Charles,It sounds like you are claiming that there three Yawhehs.
Quote (t8 @ April 25 2013,11:54) Quote (david @ April 23 2013,15:33) Quote So who are these true teachers? Well I don't have a full list of names, but I can assure you that it is not exclusive to any denomination. But granted, it is likely that some denominations will have more true teachers than others. Ultimately though, they are likely scattered around the place. T8, what happened to “get out of Babylon the great”. “Flee from her” if you do not wish to suffer the same fate.
Wouldn't a “true teacher” who belongs to a false religion be guilty of embracing Babylon the great?
It ultimately says, “come out of her my people”. So there must be a line where some of God's people are inside, and when those who remain inside her will be judged along with her.So yes, at some point it will become clearer as to who Babylon is and a person who is true would see that and do the right thing. A person who understands this and stays would be doing that because of the state of their heart.
T8,Wouldn't a true teacher who knows basic truths know that Babylon the great is false religion and they should not be “in” it?
Quote (david @ April 26 2013,10:48) T8, Wouldn't a true teacher who knows basic truths know that (1)Babylon the great is (2)false religion and they should not be “in” it?
Hi David,What EXACTLY are you claiming 'Babylon the great' to be?
The term 'FALSE RELIGION' is too non-specific, as others
may claim it may apply to the JW watchtower society.So please define your use of the phrase 'FALSE RELIGION', OK?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgEd. I was going with what I thought t8 believed Babylon the great to be. (And what I assume most on here believe it is: false religion). I'm examining t8's ideas and using t8's beliefs to do so.
Ed, here is where we are.
T8 (and maybe others on here) believe that “true teachers” (or true Christians for that matter) are scattered among denominations–presumably among and inside of these religions.
Yet, I wonder how such ones can be “true teachers” and yet support false religion. The proclamation to “come out of Babylon” was given. How can they be true teachers while in false religion?
Wouldn't they teach truth?–that they and everyone must flee from Babylon. Yet, if they are in Babylon, how can they be following what they themselves should be teaching?
Quote (Ed J @ April 26 2013,11:04) Hi David, So please define your use of the phrase 'FALSE RELIGION', OK?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
And so 'false religion' is… ?Quote (david @ April 26 2013,07:40) Ed, here is where we are. T8 (and maybe others on here) believe that “true teachers” (or true Christians for that matter) are scattered among denominations–presumably among and inside of these religions.
Yet, I wonder how such ones can be “true teachers” and yet support false religion. The proclamation to “come out of Babylon” was given. How can they be true teachers while in false religion?
Wouldn't they teach truth?–that they and everyone must flee from Babylon. Yet, if they are in Babylon, how can they be following what they themselves should be teaching?
David,Babylon is a consumer of merchant goods. It sounds more like a country than anything else.
So, kerwin thinks Babylon the great is a country. (We are to “flee” from Babylon the great. I wonder which country)
T8, is he right?
And, are you a true teacher or is he?
(This has to be one of those basic things that a true teacher would know and teach. We are given the command to “flee” from Babylon, and not to be a part of her if you don't want to share in her plagues.)
Quote Babylon is a consumer of merchant goods. It sounds more like a country than anything else. Aren't 1/4 of all purchases done for Christmas (a religious holiday).
Quote (carmel @ April 26 2013,07:00) Quote (jb2u @ April 25 2013,11:11) Quote I am pretty sure that is NOT what John 16 is about. Why would His Father, GOD, need to give Jesus anything if in fact Jesus is GOD??? Jb2u
REFLECT:
J: JESUS' the word, the triune God, God in flesh
B: BODY was
2: TWO full separate persons, son of God and Son of man glorified through the Holy Spirit
U: UNITED himself as one being both spirit and flesh , and became the only true God, and Jesus Christ
THAT'S WHERE YOU ERR!
I AM PRETTY SURE THAT WHATEVER THE FATHER HAS BELONG TO JESUS, WHICH THE FATHER NEVER HAD BEFORE NEVER MIND WERE GIVEN FROM THE FATHER.
THE FATHER IS THE FATHER GOD CREATOR OF THE SPIRITUAL WORLD THROUGH THE SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT.
THE SON IS THE SON GOD MEDIATOR CREATOR OF THE MATERIAL WORLD THROUGH THE FATHER IN THE HOLY SPIRIT
THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE HOLY SPIRIT GOD RECREATOR OF OUR WORLD THROUGH JESUS THE WORLD ON THE CROSS!
Matthew 13:33 Another parable he spoke to them: The kingdom of heaven is like to leaven, which a woman took and hid in three measures of meal, until the whole was leavened.
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
What you did to “jb2u” is creative but wrong.Then you said a lot of things that were incorrect about Jesus being God without backing with scripture.
Finally, you gave me a verse, Matthew 13:33.
Well you are still making the mistake of isolating a verse and trying to “prove” the trinity. What does this parable mean?
In Scripture, what is leaven, always?? Leaven is always sin and the false teaching/doctrine.
What is “3” in the Bible? It represents completeness.
Now, we do not want to leave a verse in isolation; so, what has Jesus been talking about, before and after this verse? Let's see.
He gives the parable of the sower. This tells us that there are those that hear, but do not understand. Those that hear, but are lukewarm. Those that hear the word, but choose to follow the world. And finally, those that hear the word, understands, and is fruitful.
Next, Jesus tells the parable of the wheat and tares. Again, this parable tells about one that sows good seed and he that sows the bad seed. Note, both GROW together, but one will be destroyed in the Kingdom of GOD!!! This is important!!
We then have the parable of the mustard seed. Jesus tells us about the least of the seeds that GROWS great!!
We then have the parable of the leaven. This one seems odd, right? Now, my GOD is stable and never changing. And so, He has told me over and over leaven is bad.
Proof??
1 Corinthians 5:6-8
Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.Galatians 5:9
A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.Matthew 16:6
Then Jesus said unto them, Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.Matthew 16:11
How is it that ye do not understand that I spake it not to you concerning bread, that ye should beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees?
Matthew 16:12
Then understood they how that he bade them not beware of the leaven of bread, but of the doctrine of the Pharisees and of the Sadducees.Mark 8:15
And he charged them, saying, Take heed, beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod.Luke 12:1
In the mean time, when there were gathered together an innumerable multitude of people, insomuch that they trode one upon another, he began to say unto his disciples first of all, Beware ye of the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.So, we see that Jesus clearly tells His apostles that the leaven He is talking about is the false teachings of the Pharisees, Herod, and the Sadducees!!! What can we get from all of this Scripture?? The leaven is false teachings. The woman is the Harlot, the false religion of revelations. She hides the false doctrines in the meal, the church. Three being “completeness” tells me that all of the churches will be affected by this false doctrine. The false teachings will GROW until it turns all the churches to false teachings, leaven!! I can see this today!!
Do you see? Just like the good and bad sower, the wheat and the tares, we have the Good that GROWS to bear good herbs , and we have the Bad that GROWS to corrupt the church as a whole.
Jesus furthers this point with the Parable of the net in verse 47, where the good are kept; while the bad are cast away!!
When you understand that these parables ALL go together and that GOD does not change, you will see the meaning of these parables.
Quote (jb2u @ April 27 2013,03:12) Quote (carmel @ April 26 2013,07:00) Jb2u REFLECT:
J: JESUS' the word, the triune God, God in flesh
B: BODY was
2: TWO full separate persons, son of God and Son of man glorified through the Holy Spirit
U: UNITED himself as one being both spirit and flesh , and became the only true God, and Jesus Christ
What you did to “jb2u” is creative but wrong.
Hi JB2U,If you don't mind me asking, what does it stand for?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgjb2u,April wrote:[/quote]
Quote In Scripture, what is leaven, always?? Leaven is always sin and the false teaching/doctrine. Jbtu,
first and formost:
NOT JUST COMMENT BUT CONTRADICT ME WITH SCRIPTURES.
THE ABOVE IS YOUR MENTALITY:
SCRIPTURE HAS AT LEAST FOUR INTERPRTATIONS!
ALSO: JESUS IN MANY INSTANCES AND GENERALLY SPEAKING WAS OPPOSSITE OF THE OT GOD!
HE IS THE TRUTH
JESUS THE WORD GOD,WITH THE LEAVEN IN HIS PARABLE WAS REFERRING TO HIS OWN UNIQUE TASK IN THE KINGDOM OF GOD.
ALL BY HIM, ALL IN HIM, AND ALL FOR HIM
THE KINGDOM OF GOD CONSISTS OF
THREE PROCESSES THESE PROCESSES ARE THE WORK BY
THE FATHER, THE SON ,AND THE HOLY SPIRIT THE TRINITY YOU DO NOT BELIEVE IN!
THE LEAVEN IS A REFERENCE TO HIMSELF! GOD AS THE
WORD
REFLECT:
HOW IN JESUS TIME USED TO DO THE LEAVEN?
WHAT DOES THE LEAVEN DO TO THE BREAD ?
NOW IN THE SAME MANNER THE WORD DID TO THE KINGDOM!
JESUS IN THE LAST SUPPER REPRESENTED ALSO THE LEAVEN ITSELF!
THE REASON THAT IT WAS LEFT OUT IN MOSES PASCH,!
IN FACT IT HAD A DOUBLE MEANING IN ONE INSTANT:
BOTH LIGHT JESUS, THE MESSIAH AND DARKNESS, SATAN:
SO REMOVING THE LEAVEN MEANS BOTH REMOVING SATAN'S SPIRIT FROM OUR CREATION,
AND ALSO INDICATE THAT THE MESSIAH IS MISSING AND STILL TO COME!
NOW FROM THE LAST SUPPER ONWARDS,OUR CREATION WAS LEAVENED WHEN SATAN WAS REPLACED BY JESUS'SPIRIT IN OUR CREATION,AND JESUS CONFIRMED AND SAID :
THIS IS MY FLESH, AND THIS IS MY BLOOD,OBVIOUS HE REMOVED SATAN'S SPIRIT EXACTLY BY THOSE WORDS!
John 16:11And of judgment: because the prince of this world is already judged.
AND BOTH THE FOOD AND THE DRINK WAS LEAVENED BY JESUS' SPIRIT!
John 6:27Labour not for the MEAT which perisheth, but for that which ENDURETH UNTO LIFE EVERLASTING, which the Son of man will give you.
FOR HIM HATH GOD, THE FATHER,SEALED.
JESUS' SPIRIT IS THE LEAVEN OF THE WORLD, HE REPLACED SATAN'S!
55 For my flesh is meat indeed: and my blood is drink indeed. 56He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, abideth in me, and I in him
Mark 8:15 And he charged them, saying: Take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees, and of the leaven of Herod WHICH IS SATAN'S
MORE TO COME
Peace and love in Jesus
Charles
carmel, you represent the Trinity in the usual way. Assumptions based on isolating scriptures and putting these scriptures together to form a picture.
You could prove almost anything from the Bible with that method.
Most people here have heard all these arguments before and perhaps even believed them at some point. But you need to bring something better than this to the table because we have already refuted everything you are saying about the Trinity.
I have taken leaven to mean the Word/doctrine/religion.
Thus we are to partake of the bread from Heaven who is Christ.
But the bread of the Pharisees is not the same bread of course.
But the Pharisees still exist today, not just in Ultra Orthodox Judaism, but Christianity too.The leaven of the Pharisees was about man-made laws by which the Pharisees tried to correct Jesus with. Today, many say that Jesus is one person of the Trinity and by doing this they too try to correct Jesus when he said:
“This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.
Quote (david @ April 26 2013,13:12) So, kerwin thinks Babylon the great is a country. (We are to “flee” from Babylon the great. I wonder which country) T8, is he right?
And, are you a true teacher or is he?
(This has to be one of those basic things that a true teacher would know and teach. We are given the command to “flee” from Babylon, and not to be a part of her if you don't want to share in her plagues.)
David,There are many types of Babylons but I believe the true one will be revealed by a great persecution before its destruction. It may not exist yet but even if it does it has not yet filled up with its sins.
It will be a place where merchants invest their wealth and obtain many customers.
There will be a false prophet as well.
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