Mandy

[kenrch]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,17:21)

Kenrch you say that I invented the idea that I am a sinner, even though I think that idea is wrong. It seems a bit unfair that I invented the idea I had never heard of it until prostelytised to by a tedious evangelist. Where are my royalties? Should I take it that actually you do not know the answer to the question? Stuart

Stu as I said if I smacked you in the face you WOULD hit back. That's only natural and is a SIN!

But if you were in the Spirit then you would do the unnatural and use LOVE to conquer.

So it is YOUR fault because what is available to me is available to YOU. But you don't want to summit. You want things YOUR way so you strike back which just leads to the other person returning the favor.

[NickHassan]

Hi Professor Stu,
Yes the experts say so.
But you have always ignored them in the past.
Messengers, even a man from heaven got a pretty cool reception.
But you fell for this line?

[Stu]

Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,17:30)

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,17:21) Kenrch you say that I invented the idea that I am a sinner, even though I think that idea is wrong.   It seems a bit unfair that I invented the idea I had never heard of it until prostelytised to by a tedious evangelist.  Where are my royalties? Should I take it that actually you do not know the answer to the question? Stuart Stu as I said if I smacked you in the face you WOULD hit back.  That's only natural and is a SIN!   But if you were in the Spirit then you would do the unnatural and use LOVE to conquer. So it is YOUR fault because what is available to me is available to YOU.  But you don't want to summit.  You want things YOUR way so you strike back which just leads to the other person returning the favor.

OK, let me be clearer. I would not hit back. I have been in similar situations and not done so. I also think that you should take up the point with Is 1:18 who believes in capital punishment, which presumably you would classify as a sin. he thinks scripture justifies some kinds of killing, which I take it you would hold as sinful.

The point remains. You can't name a sin I have definitely committed. Why do you say I need saving? Even if you could why should I adopt the ethical system of the christian with all its inconsistencies and anti-humanities? What if the judicial system adopted the 'guilty until proven innocent' system that you seem to advocate?

Stuart

[Stu]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 12 2008,17:39)

Hi Professor Stu, Yes the experts say so. But you have always ignored them in the past. Messengers, even a man from heaven got a pretty cool reception. But you fell for this line?

Nick it would help me if you could refer to what you are replying to.

Stuart

[kenrch]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,18:05)

Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,17:30) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,17:21) Kenrch you say that I invented the idea that I am a sinner, even though I think that idea is wrong. It seems a bit unfair that I invented the idea I had never heard of it until prostelytised to by a tedious evangelist. Where are my royalties? Should I take it that actually you do not know the answer to the question? Stuart Stu as I said if I smacked you in the face you WOULD hit back. That's only natural and is a SIN! But if you were in the Spirit then you would do the unnatural and use LOVE to conquer. So it is YOUR fault because what is available to me is available to YOU. But you don't want to summit. You want things YOUR way so you strike back which just leads to the other person returning the favor. OK, let me be clearer. I would not hit back. I have been in similar situations and not done so. I also think that you should take up the point with Is 1:18 who believes in capital punishment, which presumably you would classify as a sin. he thinks scripture justifies some kinds of killing, which I take it you would hold as sinful. The point remains. You can't name a sin I have definitely committed. Why do you say I need saving? Even if you could why should I adopt the ethical system of the christian with all its inconsistencies and anti-humanities? What if the judicial system adopted the 'guilty until proven innocent' system that you seem to advocate? Stuart

Because I've been where you are STU. I wasn't born saved! And if I continue to hit you in your face…you would do nothing?

Sorry I can't believe an ape would not “defend himself”. LOVE CONQUERS and nothing else!

DO YOU LOVE? OR is it LUST? Do you Love because you are Loved? God's LOVE is JUST a LITTLE DIFFERENT!

But as I said you reject that LOVE and no not LOVE and therefore are guilty! You can't help but SIN.

[Stu]

Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,18:18)

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,18:05) Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,17:30) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,17:21) Kenrch you say that I invented the idea that I am a sinner, even though I think that idea is wrong.   It seems a bit unfair that I invented the idea I had never heard of it until prostelytised to by a tedious evangelist.  Where are my royalties? Should I take it that actually you do not know the answer to the question? Stuart Stu as I said if I smacked you in the face you WOULD hit back.  That's only natural and is a SIN!   But if you were in the Spirit then you would do the unnatural and use LOVE to conquer. So it is YOUR fault because what is available to me is available to YOU.  But you don't want to summit.  You want things YOUR way so you strike back which just leads to the other person returning the favor. OK, let me be clearer.  I would not hit back.  I have been in similar situations and not done so.  I also think that you should take up the point with Is 1:18 who believes in capital punishment, which presumably you would classify as a sin.  he thinks scripture justifies some kinds of killing, which I take it you would hold as sinful. The point remains.  You can't name a sin I have definitely committed.  Why do you say I need saving?  Even if you could why should I adopt the ethical system of the christian with all its inconsistencies and anti-humanities?  What if the judicial system adopted the 'guilty until proven innocent' system that you seem to advocate? Stuart Because I've been where you are STU.  I wasn't born saved!  And if I continue to hit you in your face…you would do nothing? Sorry I can't believe an ape would not “defend himself”.  LOVE CONQUERS and nothing else! DO YOU LOVE?  OR is it LUST?  Do you Love because you are Loved?  God's LOVE is JUST a LITTLE DIFFERENT! But as I said you reject that LOVE and no not LOVE and therefore are guilty!  You can't help but SIN.

Are you fishing for a sin, now? I don't have any respect for the religio-political concept of sin in any case, but what would you say to Job, who by 'what is written', did not sin? Did he need saving as well?

Stuart

[kenrch]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,18:20)

Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,18:18) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,18:05) Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,17:30) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,17:21) Kenrch you say that I invented the idea that I am a sinner, even though I think that idea is wrong. It seems a bit unfair that I invented the idea I had never heard of it until prostelytised to by a tedious evangelist. Where are my royalties? Should I take it that actually you do not know the answer to the question? Stuart Stu as I said if I smacked you in the face you WOULD hit back. That's only natural and is a SIN! But if you were in the Spirit then you would do the unnatural and use LOVE to conquer. So it is YOUR fault because what is available to me is available to YOU. But you don't want to summit. You want things YOUR way so you strike back which just leads to the other person returning the favor. OK, let me be clearer. I would not hit back. I have been in similar situations and not done so. I also think that you should take up the point with Is 1:18 who believes in capital punishment, which presumably you would classify as a sin. he thinks scripture justifies some kinds of killing, which I take it you would hold as sinful. The point remains. You can't name a sin I have definitely committed. Why do you say I need saving? Even if you could why should I adopt the ethical system of the christian with all its inconsistencies and anti-humanities? What if the judicial system adopted the 'guilty until proven innocent' system that you seem to advocate? Stuart Because I've been where you are STU. I wasn't born saved! And if I continue to hit you in your face…you would do nothing? Sorry I can't believe an ape would not “defend himself”. LOVE CONQUERS and nothing else! DO YOU LOVE? OR is it LUST? Do you Love because you are Loved? God's LOVE is JUST a LITTLE DIFFERENT! But as I said you reject that LOVE and no not LOVE and therefore are guilty! You can't help but SIN. Are you fishing for a sin, now? I don't have any respect for the religio-political concept of sin in any case, but what would you say to Job, who by 'what is written', did not sin? Did he need saving as well? Stuart

Is your name Job who BTW according to you is in a fictional book.

DO YOU LOVE, Stu? You may think you do. But you do not I can tell you because I have been there. Humans are much too self centered to LOVE. That's why if you walk according to the flesh you CANNOT please GOD!

Not until you open your heart and receive His LOVE can YOU LOVE!
But again you reject His LOVE and so sin.

Goodnight

[Stu]

Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,18:36)

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,18:20) Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,18:18) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,18:05) Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 12 2008,17:30) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,17:21) Kenrch you say that I invented the idea that I am a sinner, even though I think that idea is wrong.   It seems a bit unfair that I invented the idea I had never heard of it until prostelytised to by a tedious evangelist.  Where are my royalties? Should I take it that actually you do not know the answer to the question? Stuart Stu as I said if I smacked you in the face you WOULD hit back.  That's only natural and is a SIN!   But if you were in the Spirit then you would do the unnatural and use LOVE to conquer. So it is YOUR fault because what is available to me is available to YOU.  But you don't want to summit.  You want things YOUR way so you strike back which just leads to the other person returning the favor. OK, let me be clearer.  I would not hit back.  I have been in similar situations and not done so.  I also think that you should take up the point with Is 1:18 who believes in capital punishment, which presumably you would classify as a sin.  he thinks scripture justifies some kinds of killing, which I take it you would hold as sinful. The point remains.  You can't name a sin I have definitely committed.  Why do you say I need saving?  Even if you could why should I adopt the ethical system of the christian with all its inconsistencies and anti-humanities?  What if the judicial system adopted the 'guilty until proven innocent' system that you seem to advocate? Stuart Because I've been where you are STU.  I wasn't born saved!  And if I continue to hit you in your face…you would do nothing? Sorry I can't believe an ape would not “defend himself”.  LOVE CONQUERS and nothing else! DO YOU LOVE?  OR is it LUST?  Do you Love because you are Loved?  God's LOVE is JUST a LITTLE DIFFERENT! But as I said you reject that LOVE and no not LOVE and therefore are guilty!  You can't help but SIN. Are you fishing for a sin, now?  I don't have any respect for the religio-political concept of sin in any case, but what would you say to Job, who by 'what is written', did not sin?  Did he need saving as well? Stuart Is your name Job who BTW according to you is in a fictional book. DO YOU LOVE, Stu?  You may think you do.  But you do not I can tell you because I have been there.  Humans are much too self centered to LOVE.  That's why if you walk according to the flesh you CANNOT please GOD! Not until you open your heart and receive His LOVE can YOU LOVE! But again you reject His LOVE and so sin. Goodnight

No answers, just insults to the nature of the love of which we are capable. Yet more reasons to consider christianity anti-human.

Stuart

[NickHassan]

Hi Stu,
You are so dry, so imagining of insults and being patronised.
You need cheering up
with new life.

[Stu]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 12 2008,19:54)

Hi Stu, You are so dry, so imagining of insults and being patronised. You need cheering up with new life.

I would like it for christians to respond with thought to the challenges they are set or the responses they get but sadly what I think are interesting questions are met by Kenrch, you and Is 1:18 with a blank wall with dogma pasted on, usually reactionary stuff at that.

Can you tell me who invented the idea that we are all sinners? Can you justify that judgement, or justify with ethical thinking the scripture that proposes it?

Stuart

[Son of Light]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,20:05)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 12 2008,19:54) Hi Stu, You are so dry, so imagining of insults and being patronised. You need cheering up with new life. I would like it for christians to respond with thought to the challenges they are set or the responses they get but sadly what I think are interesting questions are met by Kenrch, you and Is 1:18 with a blank wall with dogma pasted on, usually reactionary stuff at that. Can you tell me who invented the idea that we are all sinners?  Can you justify that judgement, or justify with ethical thinking the scripture that proposes it? Stuart

Jehovah and his elohim did.

From an atheistic perspective I suppose primitive folk who projected their outrage at being wronged into their deities. Believing they didn't like being wronged either.

The gods obviously made everything and set laws (physical) into motion and therefore they must have social laws as well which are reflected in a persons emotions and conscience.

[Stu]

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 12 2008,20:13)

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,20:05) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 12 2008,19:54) Hi Stu, You are so dry, so imagining of insults and being patronised. You need cheering up with new life. I would like it for christians to respond with thought to the challenges they are set or the responses they get but sadly what I think are interesting questions are met by Kenrch, you and Is 1:18 with a blank wall with dogma pasted on, usually reactionary stuff at that. Can you tell me who invented the idea that we are all sinners?  Can you justify that judgement, or justify with ethical thinking the scripture that proposes it? Stuart Jehovah and his elohim did. From an atheistic perspective I suppose primitive folk who projected their outrage at being wronged into their deities. Believing they didn't like being wronged either.   The gods obviously made everything and set laws (physical) into motion and therefore they must have social laws as well which are reflected in a persons emotions and conscience.

I am used to ‘the Catholics invented it’ as the standard answer here! Is it not that simple?

But wait, I'm looking in Wikipedia under salvation, and I should have known. It was none other than the arch-fundamentalist Paul who invented the idea I asked about, that all are sinners and need saving specifically from that sin, rather than the more general need to be saved, with no specific use of the word sin, as you read in the gospels.

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

This one really trowels it on thickly:
Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

Boy, I can smell the sulfur already!

Stuart

[Son of Light]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,21:08)

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 12 2008,20:13) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 12 2008,20:05) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 12 2008,19:54) Hi Stu, You are so dry, so imagining of insults and being patronised. You need cheering up with new life. I would like it for christians to respond with thought to the challenges they are set or the responses they get but sadly what I think are interesting questions are met by Kenrch, you and Is 1:18 with a blank wall with dogma pasted on, usually reactionary stuff at that. Can you tell me who invented the idea that we are all sinners?  Can you justify that judgement, or justify with ethical thinking the scripture that proposes it? Stuart Jehovah and his elohim did. From an atheistic perspective I suppose primitive folk who projected their outrage at being wronged into their deities. Believing they didn't like being wronged either.   The gods obviously made everything and set laws (physical) into motion and therefore they must have social laws as well which are reflected in a persons emotions and conscience. I am used to ‘the Catholics invented it’ as the standard answer here! Is it not that simple? But wait, I'm looking in Wikipedia under salvation, and I should have known.  It was none other than the arch-fundamentalist Paul who invented the idea I asked about,  that all are sinners and need saving specifically from that sin, rather than the more general need to be saved, with no specific use of the word sin, as you read in the gospels. Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Romans 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned: This one really trowels it on thickly: Romans 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin. Boy, I can smell the sulfur already! Stuart

Well, Paul was quoting the Old Testament with that verse. However, he may have invented “original sin”.

[Towshab]

Which verse?

[Towshab]

Yes, Judaism has no concept of “original sin”.

[kenrch]

Adam and Eve were punished for doing good?

They accepted Satan's spirit ways of get instead of give. Their children inherited that spirit of greed. That's why Jesus said it's better to give than to receive.

God gave! Of all the trees you may eat He GAVE the earth to Adam and Eve. But after Satan, that wasn't enough they wanted MORE.

[Jodi]

Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 11 2008,20:36)

Quote (Jodi @ Jan. 12 2008,15:22) Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 11 2008,18:43) Quote (Jodi @ Jan. 12 2008,13:08) Quote (seek and you will find @ Jan. 11 2008,14:52) Tow That is so redicolous. If you had God's Holy Spirit full strenght, which you will never, Excuse me are you God, or Jesus? I didn't think so. So how is it that you KNOW Tow won't some day come to the knowledge of the truth and recieve the fullness of God's Spirit? Do you really see God as that big of a failure? Yep! Just like Paul! Hi Kenrch, how ya doin? Could you elaborate on that please? Hows my baby girl~Molly Sue~! How do she do that Molly Sue! Just as Paul condemned the Christians as TOW-STU does now. Paul was converted. Tow-Stu have not tasted of the Holy Spirit and reason strictly by human reasoning so they could be saved. Do you think those persecuted by Paul will be surprised to see Paul in heaven AND perhaps above them!

So do you think that Tow and Stu recieved God's Spirit and have rejected it?

Do you think God called them into His truth and that they have denied it?

Thanks for asking, Molly Sue is a great joy. She is such a happy baby, and we have discovered that she is very ticklish. In the past few days she has started to give little giggles. As well, she has started to slobber a lot and she likes to try and chew on her whole hand!

[kenrch]

Quote (Jodi @ Jan. 13 2008,05:11)

Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 11 2008,20:36) Quote (Jodi @ Jan. 12 2008,15:22) Quote (kenrch @ Jan. 11 2008,18:43) Quote (Jodi @ Jan. 12 2008,13:08) Quote (seek and you will find @ Jan. 11 2008,14:52) Tow That is so redicolous. If you had God's Holy Spirit full strenght, which you will never, Excuse me are you God, or Jesus? I didn't think so. So how is it that you KNOW Tow won't some day come to the knowledge of the truth and recieve the fullness of God's Spirit? Do you really see God as that big of a failure? Yep! Just like Paul! Hi Kenrch, how ya doin? Could you elaborate on that please? Hows my baby girl~Molly Sue~! How do she do that Molly Sue! Just as Paul condemned the Christians as TOW-STU does now. Paul was converted. Tow-Stu have not tasted of the Holy Spirit and reason strictly by human reasoning so they could be saved. Do you think those persecuted by Paul will be surprised to see Paul in heaven AND perhaps above them! So do you think that Tow and Stu recieved God's Spirit and have rejected it? Do you think God called them into His truth and that they have denied it? Thanks for asking, Molly Sue is a great joy. She is such a happy baby, and we have discovered that she is very ticklish. In the past few days she has started to give little giggles. As well, she has started to slobber a lot and she likes to try and chew on her whole hand!

NO! I don't think and they have admitted they have not. So as Paul they can in the end receive the Holy Spirit. Doesn't mean they will, but who knows?

So Molly is looking at her body in wonder! I loose track of time, is she teething? Enjoy Jodi it won't be long before the terrible two's.

[Towshab]

Since I see very little difference in Christians that I know and most others, what indication is there that they “have the Holy Spirit”? Because they say they believe in Jesus? Seriously, the idea of a spirit of a god indwelling within you was borrowed from other religions that were around before Christianity.

You have pretty much been shown there is no unity of faith in Christianity so the theory of an indwelling spirit is bogus to the maximus.

[kenrch]

Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 13 2008,05:48)

Since I see very little difference in Christians that I know and most others, what indication is there that they “have the Holy Spirit”? Because they say they believe in Jesus? Seriously, the idea of a spirit of a god indwelling within you was borrowed from other religions that were around before Christianity. You have pretty much been shown there is no unity of faith in Christianity so the theory of an indwelling spirit is bogus to the maximus.

I can see clearly now the rain is gone, I can see all the things that were in the way, gone are the dark clouds that had me blind, It's Now a bright sunshiny day!

Can you see?

[Author]

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