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Jesus didn't have all the sins on Him when He was sent into the desert (wilderness). They were put on Him after He suffered and hung on the cross, just before He died. Sorry, you are wrong.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 10 2013,06:06) Jesus didn't have all the sins on Him when He was sent into the desert (wilderness). They were put on Him after He suffered and hung on the cross, just before He died. Sorry, you are wrong.
Then why did Jesus say before the cross:John 17:4-5
New International Version (NIV)
4 I have brought you glory on earth by finishing the work you gave me to do. 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.
Jesus was arrested later on. So if he declares here he has finished the work.
That would mean like I said the sins had to already been on him because he was baptized on behalf of the sins of Israel(Not his own because he was sinless) This the only reason Satan wanted to cause him to sin then in the wilderness because he would have failed his mission.
Furthermore, remember Jesus begged God(Father take this cup from me) Most just say it was a moment of just being human but that can't be so because Jesus knew his mission from the beginning and it was to redeem not be sacrificed so when he completed that intercession and redemption he was finished and asked God to come home
John 17:4-5
New International Version (NIV)
4 I have brought you glory on earth by finishing the work you gave me to do. 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began.
He didn't say there's one more thing to do, he was done!
So it would make sense crying in the garden “Father take this cup from me” because he knew thy wanted to kill him, he knew about the plot, he knew about the BETRAYAL and he is already thinking “I Finished the work you gave me to do”
He is not ready and willing to be crucified and why should he, he already did the work already past the test with Satan already overcome the world, he wanted to go home.
And (the unbelievers) plotted and planned, and Allah too planned, and the best of planners is Allah.
Now I don't know about your life but I will tell you that in my life when there is trouble and God gives me emergency guidance and I follow it there is sometimes a period of time when I'm thinking “I did what you told me but it's looking bad for me thingsare closing in and that's when the miracle happens. PRAISE GOD!
Exodus 32:33-34
New International Version (NIV)
33 The Lord replied to Moses, “Whoever has sinned against me I will blot out of my book. 34 Now go, lead the people to the place I spoke of, and my angel will go before you. However, when the time comes for me to punish, I will punish them for their sin.”
Isaiah 52:12
But you will not leave in haste or go in flight; for the Lord will go before you, the God of Israel will be your rear guard.Wll you say God didn't save him from thecrucifixion but Praise God the scriptures say:
Isaiah 45:2
I will go before you and will level the mountains; I will break down gates of bronze and cut through bars of iron.Jesus Christ, Blessings be upon him:
Psalm 57:1
New International Version (NIV)
1 Have mercy on me, my God, have mercy on me,
for in you I take refuge.
I will take refuge in the shadow of your wings
until the disaster has passed.Hebrews 5:7
During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with fervent cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submissionThat's why when he saw the disciples again he said
Luke 24:39
Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.”Bo,
Jesus was ready to suffer and die because He had accomplished all that He was sent to do during His life, His work was done regarding how He was to live. He did not have to do a work in order to die…He did not kill Himself. The killing was the work of those who beat Him and crucified Him, Jesus didn't work to bear the sins either, He received them.Jesus was saved from death because God did not let His body stay in the grave very long to undergo decay but was resurrected, which is proven by Luke 24:39 in that His flesh and bones could still be seen and touched.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 11 2013,01:11) Bo,
Jesus was ready to suffer and die because He had accomplished all that He was sent to do during His life, His work was done regarding how He was to live. He did not have to do a work in order to die…He did not kill Himself. The killing was the work of those who beat Him and crucified Him, Jesus didn't work to bear the sins either, He received them.Jesus was saved from death because God did not let His body stay in the grave very long to undergo decay but was resurrected, which is proven by Luke 24:39 in that His flesh and bones could still be seen and touched.
It say “saved from death” If you die you have not been “saved from death”Is that scripture a mistake?
You say Jesus was ready to suffer and die but he says he was not willing to…”Not my will”
Did he really mean that?
Bo,
Being saved from dying isn't the same as being saved from death.
The scripture is not a mistake. Jesus flesh died but after three days…no longer dead.
Jesus was tempted to avoid the cup yet did not give in to that temptation. Jesus was tempted yet without sin.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 16 2013,06:20) Bo,
Being saved from dying isn't the same as being saved from death.
The scripture is not a mistake. Jesus flesh died but after three days…no longer dead.Jesus was tempted to avoid the cup yet did not give in to that temptation. Jesus was tempted yet without sin.
Hebrews 9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:You believe that Jesus died once, yes?
Therefore you do not believe that he was saved from death.
I believe he God literally saved Jesus from death if he died already that's no different than the rest of us because we will all be resurrected as well. But God saved Jesus from death.
[Mention] when Allah said, “O Jesus, indeed I will take you and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, and I will judge between you concerning that in which you used to differ.
( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #55)
Keep in mind when your heart is opened up to the scriptures the entire bible points to God pulling his chosen messengers out of impossible odds like “lot”, “Noah”, “Jonah”,…etc.
God Bless You!
By the Way I will ask you an extremely important question IS God Sovereign?
In other words is the one you call “The Father” above all others in character, importance, excellence, etc?
Hi Bo,
you said:Quote I believe he God literally saved Jesus from death if he died already that's no different than the rest of us because we will all be resurrected as well. But God saved Jesus from death. If Jesus didn't die and raise from the dead, none of us would be resurrected as well. He was the firstborn from the dead.
Quote Keep in mind when your heart is opened up to the scriptures the entire bible points to God pulling his chosen messengers out of impossible odds like “lot”, “Noah”, “Jonah”,…etc. Lot, Noah, and Jonah have died.
Quote By the Way I will ask you an extremely important question IS God Sovereign? In other words is the one you call “The Father” above all others in character, importance, excellence, etc? Sovereignty is more about reigning and having the final authority rather than on character or excellence. The fact that God Jehovah, who is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, rules over all things and has ultimate authority is true. So, yes God is sovereign over all.
Eph 1:11 In Christ we too have been claimed as God's own possession, since we were predestined according to the one purpose of him who accomplishes all things according to the counsel of his will
Isa 46
9“Remember the former things long past,
For I am God, and there is no other;
I am God, and there is no one like Me,10Declaring the end from the beginning,
And from ancient times things which have not been done,
Saying, ‘My purpose will be established,
And I will accomplish all My good pleasure’;11Calling a bird of prey from the east,
The man of My purpose from a far country.
Truly I have spoken; truly I will bring it to pass.
I have planned it, surely I will do it.Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 17 2013,07:04) If Jesus didn't die and raise from the dead, none of us would be resurrected as well. He was the firstborn from the dead. Quote Keep in mind when your heart is opened up to the scriptures the entire bible points to God pulling his chosen messengers out of impossible odds like “lot”, “Noah”, “Jonah”,…etc. Lot, Noah, and Jonah have died.
Quote By the Way I will ask you an extremely important question IS God Sovereign? In other words is the one you call “The Father” above all others in character, importance, excellence, etc? Sovereignty is more about reigning and having the final authority rather than on character or excellence. The fact that God Jehovah, who is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, rules over all things and has ultimate authority is true. So, yes God is sovereign over all.
Eph 1:11 In Christ we too have been claimed as God's own possession, since we were predestined according to the one purpose of him who accomplishes all things according to the counsel of his will
Isa 46
9“Remember the former things long past,
For I am God, and there is no other;
I am God, and there is no one like Me,10Declaring the end from the beginning,
And from ancient times things which have not been done,
Saying, ‘My purpose will be established,
And I will accomplish all My good pleasure’;11Calling a bird of prey from the east,
The man of My purpose from a far country.
Truly I have spoken; truly I will bring it to pass.
I have planned it, surely I will do it.
Jesus spoke of the resurrection as being something already determined before the plot against him:Matthew 22:31-32
New Revised Standard Version (NRSV)
31 And as for the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was said to you by God, 32 ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is God not of the dead, but of the living.”
When you say Jehovah God areyou referring to the one whom you call “The Father” exclusively? If so we havecome to an agreement
Jehovah is the God of gods and the Lord of lords. Jesus is the Lord of lords. We are not in agreement.
Abraham, Isaac and Jacob have not had a bodily resurrection yet, just their Spirit is with God, from my understanding.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 18 2013,12:55) Jehovah is the God of gods and the Lord of lords. Jesus is the Lord of lords. We are not in agreement. Abraham, Isaac and Jacob have not had a bodily resurrection yet, just their Spirit is with God, from my understanding.
Is Jehovah Jesus?Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 18 2013,18:45) Bo,
See my signature.
You don't believe in God?You believe in a unity called God but not a SINGULAR BEING that is GOD ALMIGHTY, correct?
I believe in God, Bo.
I see the concept of 'God' as having an individual sense and correctly applied to God the Father and our God and Savior Jesus Christ, and also a fuller sense.
The fuller sense is the unity of two individual yet interdependent persons with self-existing nature (One eternal person begotten from the other) together with their united eternal Spirit.
Words have different meanings in different contexts. God, in the fullest sense, is ONE.
Like the word 'Israel' which can mean one person or one nation/group/unity.
The word 'God' can mean one person or one unity, from what I understand.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 22 2013,11:16) I believe in God, Bo. I see the concept of 'God' as having an individual sense and correctly applied to God the Father and our God and Savior Jesus Christ, and also a fuller sense.
The fuller sense is the unity of two individual yet interdependent persons with self-existing nature (One eternal person begotten from the other) together with their united eternal Spirit.
Words have different meanings in different contexts. God, in the fullest sense, is ONE.
Like the word 'Israel' which can mean one person or one nation/group/unity.
The word 'God' can mean one person or one unity, from what I understand.
So now the Father is begotten from the son too?Look, I have seeked nd found the answer and I thank you.
You do not believe in a SINGULAR BEING that is GOD ALONE, you are not a MONOTHEIST you are a POLYTHEIST now we can have better discussions because approaching you like a MONOTHEIST like I am doesn't really compute, so noI can address you like I would a POLYTHEIST. Most people here are Polytheist as I have recently found out. There are only a few here that are Monotheists.
God is not a Concept and Jesus never toldus to Worship a Concept, did he? If so please give me the verse.
Quote So now the Father is begotten from the son too?
One eternal person begotten from the other eternal person.
One Son begotten from the Father.Quote So now the Father is begotten from the son too? God is not a Concept and Jesus never toldus to Worship a Concept, did he? If so please give me the verse.
Please show me where I said God was a concept.
Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 22 2013,11:16) I believe in God, Bo. I see the concept of 'God' as having an individual sense and correctly applied to God the Father and our God and Savior Jesus Christ, and also a fuller sense.
Do you see where you called GOD a concept?Bo,
What I mean about the 'concept of God,' is the understanding of what the word 'God' means. What does the word 'God' mean to you?Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 23 2013,13:45) Bo,
What I mean about the 'concept of God,' is the understanding of what the word 'God' means. What does the word 'God' mean to you?
I am a Monotheist so God I understand that God is our creator and HE is ONLY ONE SOVEREIGN INDIVIDUAL BEING.Quote (bodhitharta @ Aug. 24 2013,14:02) Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 23 2013,13:45) Bo,
What I mean about the 'concept of God,' is the understanding of what the word 'God' means. What does the word 'God' mean to you?
I am a Monotheist so God I understand that God is our creator and HE is ONLY ONE SOVEREIGN INDIVIDUAL BEING.
So not being a Monotheist yourself, I see that y believe “God” is more just a word to explain a phenomenon, right?Bo,
Please don't pretend that the word “God” has only one meaning and is just a proper name.
The word “God” can refer to a hunk of wood by some, a mythological figure by others, even a person that people worship or a thing that a person worships. Entertainment, sports, materialistic things…all of these types of things can be a 'God/Gods' to people.
For me, God in the fullest sense of the term is our creator and the eternal, self-existent Father and Son together with their Spirit belonging to the name of YHVH.Sorry it has been a while.
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